Cascade Classic canceled for 2018

[Bruce K]

Well, that sucks for both US amateur cycling and Oregon cycling.

New organizer says “Plans not coming together.” What the heck?

BK

[sandyrs]

That doesn't seem like much of an explanation. If organizers aren't honest about why their events are falling apart, how can anyone know what needs to be fixed?

[Clean39T]

USA Cycling, I have one word for you. Are you listening?

Yessir.

GRAVEL.

[David Tollefson]

USA Cycling, I have one word for you. Are you listening?

Yessir.

GRAVEL.

No. I say keep USAC out of gravel. Let the underground organizations keep it fun.

[Clean39T]

No. I say keep USAC out of gravel. Let the underground organizations keep it fun.


I was more saying Gravel is the future and/or the draw du jour that’s reducing interest in traditional road racing.

I’d add to that list:

Anti-aging / doping programs w/in amateur ranks

CAT-4/5 races that are too short to make the travel / expense worth it

Reduced risk tolerance among underinsured and underemployed 20/30-somethings

[William]

It was a good one back in my collegiate racing days in the PNW. Too bad.





William

[redir]

Oh God don't get me started on gravel. Suffice to say I hate it. Bike racing is once again going underground in the US. Cyclocross seems to still have a good showing though. Putting on a good bike race is a tremendous amount of work and by far and large it's a thankless act. Most promoters can only go so long before they pass the torch and if no one is there to take it then it's over.

I just attended a local race last Sunday. One that used to literally fill a field of 75 cat 4 riders within 5 minutes the online registration starts. There were maybe 40 that started.

It's really just the normal ebb and flow.

[GregL]

Oh God don't get me started on gravel. Suffice to say I hate it. Bike racing is once again going underground in the US. Cyclocross seems to still have a good showing though. Putting on a good bike race is a tremendous amount of work and by far and large it's a thankless act. Most promoters can only go so long before they pass the torch and if no one is there to take it then it's over.

I just attended a local race last Sunday. One that used to literally fill a field of 75 cat 4 riders within 5 minutes the online registration starts. There were maybe 40 that started.

It's really just the normal ebb and flow.
I'll respectively disagree and say that it's more than the normal ebb and flow. Road racing has become much more difficult to promote. Insurance costs have skyrocketed. In NY state, you need a state permit (which requires the high insurance coverage) along with the approval of each municipality the race crosses. Add in higher USA Cycling fees, law enforcement fees, workers comp costs (for the volunteers!) and the always difficult challenge of getting volunteers and you have the perfect storm that is killing road races.

In contrast, gravel races (if they are held off public highways) and cyclocross require much less in the way of paperwork and volunteers. For cyclocross, a cooperative town park office or school district may be the only civic body that requires permission/permitting. A short distance, closed circuit means fewer volunteers are needed. For my local cycling club, it all adds up to more cross races and (sadly) no annual road race. Promoters are taking the path of least resistance. Here in upstate NY, I can count 17 (soon to be 18...) road races that have died in the past ~15 years.

Greg

[benb]

Stuff like a cross race/gravel race that is not on the road can delete the need for police officers too...

Back when I raced the police officer sitting at the end of the crit course every week basically doing nothing except stopping cars to wait for the riders to pass by probably walked off each week with at least 1/2 of the ticket sales money. Everything else was volunteer and the club would deposit whatever money was left after paying the official, etc.. We were allowed to have club members direct traffic at the parking lot entrances along the course but the actual road entry point we had to have the police detail. We had that every week + a once a year road race. IIRC 2005 was the last year of the road race, I think we had more than one police officer we had to pay for that.

Maybe that's different in other states.. here no one can direct traffic except police officers for the most part.

E.x. say we wanted a tree to get worked on.. $300 for the tree crew and $500 for the officer to watch them, etc..

AFAIK USA Cycling relaxed the race hosting rules for clubs/teams this stuff has gotten so hard to pull off right? I could have sworn back then the teams had to put on a race to be recognized by USCF/USA Cycling.

[n1ey]

USA Cycling, I have one word for you. Are you listening?

Yessir.

GRAVEL.


They need to lower their prices. Membership should be $50 and include ride insurance. I think that they have their breakeven analysis wrong. If they lowered the prices, then more members would sign up and the total yield would increase. The claims expense would not increase significantly. It looks like a simple decision, but they are not making it.

They only pay out $100k per annum to local regionals. Local regionals are supposed to encourage racing, but instead they hire staff. The staff wait for a race promoter to magically appear.

They need to promote events in Metro regions for Cat 4/5 racers. USA Cycling has staff in Colorado. They have scale. They should be able to buy the equipment and organize mass races throughout the country. They have people on the ground. There are F/T/E in local racing organizations!!

Bill

[Mikej]

Mtb -

[oldpotatoe]

Stuff like a cross race/gravel race that is not on the road can delete the need for police officers too...

Some snipped..I think some are mixing 'cross' and 'gravel' race. One(cross), closed course/loop..small as compared to a gravel route, like in a park..great for spectators and varied terrain.

Gravel 'races' are road races on dirt roads(think Boulder Roubaix for people around the republic). Still traffic control(altho much less), people's driveways, houses, parking, start/finish areas.. Still need police, road control, insurance, etc.

AND add in..are these gravel events 'races' or 'rides'...where people get a number and 'race' but it's really just an organized ride..

[redir]

I'll respectively disagree and say that it's more than the normal ebb and flow. Road racing has become much more difficult to promote. Insurance costs have skyrocketed. In NY state, you need a state permit (which requires the high insurance coverage) along with the approval of each municipality the race crosses. Add in higher USA Cycling fees, law enforcement fees, workers comp costs (for the volunteers!) and the always difficult challenge of getting volunteers and you have the perfect storm that is killing road races.

In contrast, gravel races (if they are held off public highways) and cyclocross require much less in the way of paperwork and volunteers. For cyclocross, a cooperative town park office or school district may be the only civic body that requires permission/permitting. A short distance, closed circuit means fewer volunteers are needed. For my local cycling club, it all adds up to more cross races and (sadly) no annual road race. Promoters are taking the path of least resistance. Here in upstate NY, I can count 17 (soon to be 18...) road races that have died in the past ~15 years.

Greg

As a once promoter my self I don't disagree with you at all. We were basically priced out of the annual race that we were putting on as it grew and the state governing body, not USAC but my own state, put demands on us that were ridiculous and just too expensive.

Putting on a cross race? Pffft! No problem. All you need is a location and that's about the hardest part.

[benb]

Some snipped..I think some are mixing 'cross' and 'gravel' race. One(cross), closed course/loop..small as compared to a gravel route, like in a park..great for spectators and varied terrain.

Gravel 'races' are road races on dirt roads(think Boulder Roubaix for people around the republic). Still traffic control(altho much less), people's driveways, houses, parking, start/finish areas.. Still need police, road control, insurance, etc.

AND add in..are these gravel events 'races' or 'rides'...where people get a number and 'race' but it's really just an organized ride..

I didn't mean to imply gravel always meant closed course/private land like a cross race can.

In our region I do think some of the gravel rides have been able to build courses where they use private land though. In particular IIRC in Vermont some of the rides have been able to secure permission to ride on gravel roads on farm land.

The club I used to race with basically killed the road race and has a cross race. If you're talking Boston metro area it'd be hard to make a gravel race. It'd end up being MTB single track linked together with pavement.

Most of my comment was about defraying police costs. They're really high here since nothing can happen anywhere near the road without paying a police officer to sit around and drink coffee. A lot of the time they don't even direct traffic, or they do something like direct traffic with black gloves on in the middle of the night. But you're probably paying them as much as the work crew depending on what's going on.

We have trees in our yard that will require a police detail for any work.. we're budgeting at least 50% of the cost being to pay the police detail versus the work crew based on what the town quoted us. And of course lots of rules like go 1 minute over and you pay for a whole extra shift.