What exactly is a 'powerful' rider?

[sparky33]

Some bikes are described as well suited for larger or powerful riders. I understand what the term larger means. But what does the term powerful mean, specifically?

Does it mean high gross wattage, high w/kg FTP, a sprinter, a pedal masher, what? And what quality does the bike have that responds well to powerful riding.

I figure that as a not-huge 66kg rider, even spinning at 4w/kg does not really make a huge number of watts...so not powerful, even if speedy.

[mtechnica]

They probably mean 180+lb riders that can put out over 1000 watts easily in a sprint, and can crank 300+ watts for more than a few minutes at a time. That’s what I would imagine anyway.

[AngryScientist]

One thing is for sure: whatever “it” is- I do not qualify:)

[MattTuck]

it's a nice way of saying husky.

haha

[fiamme red]

They probably mean 180+lb riders that can put out over 1000 watts easily in a sprint, and can crank 300+ watts for more than a few minutes at a time. That’s what I would imagine anyway.Then none of the pro peloton would qualify, or perhaps one or two very tall riders.

[sparky33]

it's a nice way of saying husky.

haha

Is not husky a euphemism?
Husky
(https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Husk)1 A term mothers often use to say to their overweight son when the son says he is fat.

[MattTuck]

Is not husky a ephamism?
Husky
(https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Husk)1 A term mothers often use to say to their overweight son when the son says he is fat.

snow flakes today cannot even handle the term the husky. :) So they have to be called powerful.

[nobuseri]

You and me, both! :beer:

One thing is for sure: whatever “it” is- I do not qualify:)

[shinomaster]

Cancellara and Tom Boonen were Powerful AF.

[sparky33]

Cancellara and Tom Boonen were Powerful AF.

Superhumans.

And even the sprightliest pro climbers output astounding power that only the huskiest* mortals could aspire to.

*apologies if any snowflakes are offended.

[Clean39T]

I’m gonna say 80+kg and someone who either pushes a higher gear up climbs or gets out of the saddle a lot...ie, lots of torque.

[joosttx]

Tony Martin

[Clean39T]

They probably mean 180+lb riders that can put out over 1000 watts easily in a sprint, and can crank 300+ watts for more than a few minutes at a time. That’s what I would imagine anyway.


175lbs here, can do over ~350W for 5 minutes, and ~ 1000W for 5 sec...but don’t consider myself “powerfull”.

[kppolich]

Most likely a marketing term to make you feel good and check the box in your brain that says "Yeah, I'm powerful, this bike is for me" I haven't heard of a crank arm snapping or frame breaking too often. Humans just aren't powerful enough.

[sparky33]

Tony Martin
Correct.

Shouldn't you be out riding and posting pictures of some crazy spring time Marin hills vista for us?

[fa63]

I am 225 lbs; last time I did a FTP test it was just over 300W. My 175 lbs riding mates use me as a human wind blocker on the flats then drop me once the road tilts uphill :) That is why the important number is W/kg, not just the power.

Looking at the pro peloton, they are all powerful of course, but the classics specialists strike me as having a more powerful build (Boonen, Cancellara, Sagan, Degenkolb, Vanmarcke, etc.). And sprinters like Griepel, Kittel, Demare, Kristoff, etc.

[sitzmark]

I’m gonna say 80+kg and someone who either pushes a higher gear up climbs or gets out of the saddle a lot...ie, lots of torque.

Yes - torque. Either from shear weight of rider or muscular power .. or combination of both.

Marketing term - yes. But also a design goal for a "stiff" frame that isn't a "twisty noodle" when flexed in opposing directions - especially in BB area and laterally throughout frame.

[bigbill]

Sean Yates, Jens, Eros Poli, Jan Ulrich (more so in the winter), Dave Mann, Indurain, Riis (the doped version), etc, and me.

Lots of wattage for a given frontal area on flat to rolling terrain. Big is still big going up a hill.

[joosttx]

Correct.

Shouldn't you be out riding and posting pictures of some crazy spring time Marin hills vista for us?

Sorry, I am such a dolt. I will get back to those salt mines ASAP! :banana:

[mt2u77]

A bike reacts to an applied force in fractions of a second, so the main factor is peak force/torque, not FTP. Even a big strong time trialist doesn't need a very beafy bike riding steady state for an hour.

Big people generally create the biggest peak forces. However, there usually is or should be a distinction between a big man bike and a powerful man bike. A big man bike needs to be big all over to handle things like a 300 lb man on a loaded tour bouncing over a railroad track. A sprinter's race bike has to handle a large amount of torque at the bottom bracket, but it's not necessarily beefy everywhere.

The most powerful rider I've witnessed in person is an ex-college lineman and shot-put champion who goes about 280 lbs. I have replaced a couple bent pedal axles and a sheared crank arm for him. Eats chains for breakfast. Most of it is old junky stuff, but the point still stands, the amount of torque he can apply is off the charts. I'd love to see his 5 second power.

[OtayBW]

ONE definition of powerful? Not gonna happen. :cool:
There's power in a sprint as many have suggested; there's power to sustain over the long-haul or at/above lactate threshold; there's power in climbing. There is also 'powerful' mental toughness. IMHO....

Seldom are these qualities fully realized in one person.

[donevwil]

Sorry, I am such a dolt. I will get back to those salt mines ASAP! :banana:

Yeah, hop to it. The moisture in the air today should make for some spectacular photos.

[Mark McM]

"Powerful Rider": A marketing term applied to whomever they feel that the this label will sell more bikes.

This is similar to Serotta's "High Speed Geometry" (HSG). This term came about when Serotta changed the standard geometry that they used for most of their bikes. Bikes that used the previous standard geometry were then labeled "High Speed Geometry". That option probably seemed better than calling bikes with the old standard geometry "Standard Geometry" and labeling bikes with the new geometry "Slow Speed Geometry".

[FlashUNC]

Cancellara, Boonen, Tony Martin, Stannard. Lots of names that you know when you see.

Guys who put out stupid power but maybe don't have the W/kg to survive in hillier races like LBL, Lombardy or Grand Tours.

[Black Dog]

it's a nice way of saying husky.

haha

Yea, husky is not PC, huskies prefer to be called "big boned". ;)

[Spaghetti Legs]

I think a frame meant for “powerful” riders implies that it is stiffer and would probably feel harsh to a lightweight rider and maybe to one with noodle legs like me.

I used to have a Colnago E1 and while not described as a frame for “powerful” riders it was marketed as a Gran Fondo bike, for the rider who is “a little more than the typical 65 kg pro rider.

[pasadena]

Here is an article on Tony Martin's training for PR, as well as some of his numbers and power map
https://cyclingtips.com/2018/04/cycling-on-a-treadmill-how-tony-martin-is-preparing-for-paris-roubaix/

[Bostic]

Someone 6' 2" or taller who can average 21mph on the flats in a bad headwind on 36 spoke shallow rim wheels. Aka the perfect person for me to draft behind on Foothill expressway where I live since holding 20mph for 7 miles is next to impossible for me if I don't want to be wrecked for the rest of the ride.

[bikinchris]

I guess I USED to qualify. I bought a Cannondale road racing frame because it was the only bike on the floor that wouldn't shift the rear derailleur under frame flex when I accelerated hard. Yes, I am a big rider at that time I was 6 foot and 250 pounds and my (cheap) power meter at that time maxed out at 1200 watts and I could easily hit that for a full minute. Since I was so big, I still wasn't very fast, unfortunately. My best kilo was over 1:08.

[mtechnica]

175lbs here, can do over ~350W for 5 minutes, and ~ 1000W for 5 sec...but don’t consider myself “powerfull”.

Relatively powerful as far as being able to flex a frame maybe, compared to most lighter riders. I think the main issue for frame flex here is when you can put out a lot of watts AND you're heavy. It's hard to imagine a super strong 200+lb guy reefing on my calfee out of the saddle up a hill, I really don't know if the bike could take it or not.

[joosttx]

Tony Martin should be the only person ever considered to be a powerful rider. I think the paceline mis-read my post.

If someone else gets a nick as cool as panzerwagen then we can talk.

[cadence90]

Tony Martin should be the only person ever considered to be a powerful rider. I think the paceline mis-read my post.

If someone else gets a nick as cool as panzerwagen then we can talk.

But if nicks play a role wouldn't "Der Kaiser" be the boss of "Der Panzerwagen"?
.

[jgarrett]

Then none of the pro peloton would qualify, or perhaps one or two very tall riders.



Not familiar with Marcel Kittel?


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[ceolwulf]

Is not husky a euphemism?
Husky
(https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Husk)1 A term mothers often use to say to their overweight son when the son says he is fat.

I'm not fat, I'm fluffy!

[colker]

A powerfull rider would be a cyclist w/ strong connections in politics or finances.:banana:

[colker]

If someone else gets a nick as cool as panzerwagen then we can talk.

I like it too.

[aingeru]

Vasil Kiryienka??

[Spaghetti Legs]

Tony Martin should be the only person ever considered to be a powerful rider. I think the paceline mis-read my post.

If someone else gets a nick as cool as panzerwagen then we can talk.

I don’t know, Spartacus is pretty cool.

[benb]

I don't know that the power #s mean that much all these bikes have to be useful to pros and they all have stratospheric power/strength.

It seems there are tons of 150lb guys with FTP > 400w in the Pro Tour.

You can go watch someone like Phil Gamin do his KOM videos.. he's a skeleton and he's still doing 800w for 5 minutes or something.

Bigger/heavier riders flex the frame/fork more in cornering too.. maybe that is a factor. I'm 6'1" and ride in the 170-180lbs range and I've certainly had bikes that didn't feel stiff enough in cornering. Most have been totally fine though.

[54ny77]

A powerful rider will be able to influence a governing body of sport, oversee a colossal systematic doping program, win several big races, make gazillions, and.....oh wait....nevermind.

:p