A basso ti on the flea....thoughts?

[VoyTirando]

So, scoping for something I don't 'need' but possibly might enjoy, I encountered this basso titanium frame made by litespeed many years ago, in my size. https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F25 3528493381
I contacted the seller, he's very nice and willing to ship. My only hesitations are two: can I get my h plus son archetypes with 27c open paves in there, and can I find a fork that will fit, preferably carbon, for not so much scratch as to make this pointless.

Thoughts? Beers? Is this just dumb? I had the passing idea of sending it to bilenky or someone to chop and coupler, but only if it fits throne wheels/tires....

[StephenCL]

Great buy if it fits... buy GNGroups Max fork and you will have yourself one hell of a riding bike for peanuts...if you don't want to pay that coin for a really nice steel forks, I have some 1 inch options that should fit you can have for the price of postage.

Hell, ship the parts and frame to me and I will build it for you free!

you wont get 27's on the back though....

Stephen

[VoyTirando]

I'd have to ship it somewhere my excellent but "N-1=better" wife won't discover it.... Stephen, seriously, thanks for taking the time to write. I wonder if would even fit 25c's.... if I go for this, I'll reach out to you about a fork. I may have something you want in addition to postage. I'm glad to hear it will ride well. That's the only thing that really matters in the end.

[JasonF]

I’m with Stephen on this - my Litespeed Classic from that era was a great riding bike with superb build quality.

Actually liked it more than my Vamoots.

Yup, I said better than my Vamoots.

[StephenCL]

I'd have to ship it somewhere my excellent but "N-1=better" wife won't discover it.... Stephen, seriously, thanks for taking the time to write. I wonder if would even fit 25c's.... if I go for this, I'll reach out to you about a fork. I may have something you want in addition to postage. I'm glad to hear it will ride well. That's the only thing that really matters in the end.

It wont fit me, so you are lucky...if this frame fit me, it would be mine already..

I remember these frames very well. A teamate raced on one. They have basso geometry which was very different to litespeed at the time...

Seriously, the best riding ti bikes I have owned have had steel forks...

Buy the frame, GNGroups steel max fork, and I have a gorgeous condition 9 speed carbon record group we can slap on it...

Stephen

[cadence90]

StephenCL's gngroup Max fork idea is a great one, if the 43 rake works.

I'm curious: how does one determine with some assurance that a frame of a certain geo and a fork of a certain rake will work well together? Are there rake to frame size ratios/charts?

I have no experience with these Basso frames but also have heard excellent reviews. It would be a really nice ti/steel combo for very rational $.
.

[StephenCL]

These were imported/sold through gita. I likely have the catalog with these frames... in fact my sons first bike was a basso graftek that was produced at the same time...I will dig around for the geo..

Stephen

[colker]

Bassos are very good, cool bikes.
Litespeed also built the Merckx majestics.
I would go w/ a steel or aluminium Basso.

[cadence90]

These were imported/sold through gita. I likely have the catalog with these frames... in fact my sons first bike was a basso graftek that was produced at the same time...I will dig around for the geo..

StephenThat would definitely help VoyTirando.

Is there any way to know in general, or without a geo chart?
.

[cadence90]

Bassos are very good, cool bikes.
Litespeed also built the Merckx majestics.
I would go w/ a steel or aluminium Basso.

Forgot about those. Were those Majestics the 6/4 with huge dts?
.

[VoyTirando]

That would definitely help VoyTirando.

Is there any way to know in general, or without a geo chart?
.

Hear hear! My three built up bikes (by me) and my son's and my wife's (also by me) all began as frame SETS. Except for the bilenky travel bike (which frankly tracks like crap with no hands), none are newer than 1993, albeit with modern 10- or 11spd campy. They all handle great. And each fork was presumably designed for its frame. This would be new territory.... sounds like he consensus is 'buy.' Oh man....

[cadence90]

Hear hear! My three built up bikes (by me) and my son's and my wife's (also by me) all began as frame SETS. Except for the bilenky travel bike (which frankly tracks like crap with no hands), none are newer than 1993, albeit with modern 10- or 11spd campy. They all handle great. And each fork was presumably designed for its frame. This would be new territory.... sounds like he consensus is 'buy.' Oh man....
Yes, as much as I love gngroup's Moots and that Hampsten fork, you don't want to find yourself in the same situation he finds himself in: a beautiful frame with a less-than-optimal fork rake.

But, I know nothing about how to "match" different frame geos with different fork rakes. If there is some formula, I presume you received the Basso geo from the seller (or you might receive it from StephenCl). We know that gngroup's Max fork is a 43mm rake, with endless 1" steerer, but not the axle-crown (but gngroup or Steve Hampsten can surely provide that).

Hopefully it all works out.
.

[oliver1850]

I checked 4 Basso catalogs but none of them had a geo chart. Only thing I found was in a 1996 Excelsports catalog for the Loto and Gap. It said that both 58 cm frames had a 74.5* HTA, but no fork rake was given. Not sure how much faith I'd have in that spec, as it showed the 54 as 73*, the 62 as 74*, and the sizes in between as 74.5*. My guess is the HTA of a 58 was 74*, and that the Ti frames were very close to the steel ones. Serottas of the same vintage as the Ti frame had 73.5* HTA and 43 mm rake for every size from 55 cm up. That results in a trail of 5.59 cm. Even if the Basso HTA is actually 74.5, a 43 rake fork would result in trail of 4.97 cm. That amounts to about 6mm less trail. I checked the geo on my '97 Road Logic and found that it has a trail of 5.17 cm. A 41 mm rake fork with a 74.5* HTA would give exactly the same trail as the Ritchey has. The upshot is that a 40 mm rake fork would probably be great, but you will likely be fine with one that has 43 mm. I'd just get one of the threaded Nashbar carbon forks for $90 shipped, or even wait for the next 25% off sale.

I have a NOS steel threadless Basso fork here. I could attempt to measure the rake, but there's no way to know what size frame it was intended for as the steerer is uncut.

[colker]

Forgot about those. Were those Majestics the 6/4 with huge dts?
.
I don´t think those bikes had 6-4 ti neither big tubes. It was the merckx geo done by Litespeed. I hear it´s not the best Merckx ever made.
Basso has some iconic bikes made in Italy. The steel tigged Viper was popular w/ the road crowd here. It looked fast and was fast.
Geo in those italian road bikes is usually the usual (hehe).. It´s the execution that tells them apart: tube choice. Lugged or tigged. Even paint makes the difference. Of course material is a big deal.... but if i am going for an italian road bike i rather have a made in italy.

[colker]

Yes, as much as I love gngroup's Moots and that Hampsten fork, you don't want to find yourself in the same situation he finds himself in: a beautiful frame with a less-than-optimal fork rake.

But, I know nothing about how to "match" different frame geos with different fork rakes. If there is some formula, I presume you received the Basso geo from the seller (or you might receive it from StephenCl). We know that gngroup's Max fork is a 43mm rake, with endless 1" steerer, but not the axle-crown (but gngroup or Steve Hampsten can surely provide that).

Hopefully it all works out.
.

43mm is almost a standard on the italian stage race geometry. Only Colnago differs w/ a shallow head angle and different rake fork ( i may be wrong about the precisa fork number though). Pinarello has 43mm.

[VoyTirando]

I checked 4 Basso catalogs but none of them had a geo chart. Only thing I found was in a 1996 Excelsports catalog for the Loto and Gap. It said that both 58 cm frames had a 74.5* HTA, but no fork rake was given. Not sure how much faith I'd have in that spec, as it showed the 54 as 73*, the 62 as 74*, and the sizes in between as 74.5*. My guess is the HTA of a 58 was 74*, and that the Ti frames were very close to the steel ones. Serottas of the same vintage as the Ti frame had 73.5* HTA and 43 mm rake for every size from 55 cm up. That results in a trail of 5.59 cm. Even if the Basso HTA is actually 74.5, a 43 rake fork would result in trail of 4.97 cm. That amounts to about 6mm less trail. I checked the geo on my '97 Road Logic and found that it has a trail of 5.17 cm. A 41 mm rake fork with a 74.5* HTA would give exactly the same trail as the Ritchey has. The upshot is that a 40 mm rake fork would probably be great, but you will likely be fine with one that has 43 mm. I'd just get one of the threaded Nashbar carbon forks for $90 shipped, or even wait for the next 25% off sale.

I have a NOS steel threadless Basso fork here. I could attempt to measure the rake, but there's no way to know what size frame it was intended for as the steerer is uncut.

Thank you for looking! And for analyzing the fork plus frame problem. I looked, too, and the bulgier.net site had a '92 Basso catalog with no chart, but a pretty picture that didn't help. My most-ridden bike is a '91 Pinarello (@colker, it has amazing lugs, tubes, details, and rides like a dream), and I wonder if this will have similar angles. At any rate, it sounds like less(rake) is more, here. If I do spring for this frame, I will most definitely pair it with a threaded fork. Love the look of a nice quill stem. Nashbar is a good option, but maybe lacks that je ne sais quoi....

[bigbill]

I think that's my old bike. I sold it on consignment in San Diego in 1998. It has the same damage to the seat tube decals and everything. I sold it with a white threaded Kestral EMS fork with a Stronglite headset. It was an uninspiring bike, I sold it to buy a Merckx MX Leader. I won some races on it including a handful of state medals, but it was meh as a race bike. Probably good for all day rides.