Educate me: Keith Anderson frame & Campy 7 speed

[mcallen]

Background: I was poking around the attic of my local shop and found this Keith Anderson bike. It was a perfect fit for me, both in terms of size (58cm frame) and type of bike I was looking for (I had a fixed gear, Cross/Gravel bike, mountain bike, and touring bike, but no road bike). Guys at the shop didn't know much about it, but owner traded me straight for the touring rig.

What I know and want to learn: I don't have much experience with handmade frames or Campy, so I'd love to learn more about what I have here. Looking around the forum and online shows that Keith Anderson has been in the game for a long time and is well respected. Sticker says Colombus. Drivetrain is indexed DT shifter and seven-speed rear cog. Anything else you can tell me about the builder and the group would be much appreciated.

Photos here: https://photos.app.goo.gl/Vziv3eVnRivNvr5i1

[oldpotatoe]

Background: I was poking around the attic of my local shop and found this Keith Anderson bike. It was a perfect fit for me, both in terms of size (58cm frame) and type of bike I was looking for (I had a fixed gear, Cross/Gravel bike, mountain bike, and touring bike, but no road bike). Guys at the shop didn't know much about it, but owner traded me straight for the touring rig.

What I know and want to learn: I don't have much experience with handmade frames or Campy, so I'd love to learn more about what I have here. Looking around the forum and online shows that Keith Anderson has been in the game for a long time and is well respected. Sticker says Colombus. Drivetrain is indexed DT shifter and seven-speed rear cog. Anything else you can tell me about the builder and the group would be much appreciated.

Photos here: https://photos.app.goo.gl/Vziv3eVnRivNvr5i1


https://photos.app.goo.gl/ZGW4Nqlta4JH8poI3

https://photos.app.goo.gl/moeuzaWCEtWY4ZQz2

https://photos.app.goo.gl/f9Tr6wiPwH4YayYo1

https://photos.app.goo.gl/0PT6FRloN0NAvN0c2

https://photos.app.goo.gl/zfvtvXlZLyV0nXpx1

https://photos.app.goo.gl/WOIB6qEWgQVKu8Zr1

https://photos.app.goo.gl/9IMPTw7yCNQvcYXF2

Group is ‘A-B’ Chorus, shifters are ‘Syncro2’...Campag had a variety of shifter inserts to match speed, chain and freewheel type. Made from about 1986 thru very early 90s....didn’t really shift very well.

[Cicli]

I got nothing other than to say thets a really cool bike.

[choke]

That's a really nice bike....congrats.

Campy 7sp and 8sp spacing are the same, so any 8sp Campy shifter will work fine...you can even use Ergos if you want. If you want to stay with DT shifters there are later index ones which are better or you can of course go friction.

The 7sp cogs are the same as 8sp ones so that's not a problem....buy an 8sp cassette and leave one cog out, they aren't pinned.

[oldpotatoe]

That's a really nice bike....congrats.

Campy 7sp and 8sp spacing are the same, so any 8sp Campy shifter will work fine...you can even use Ergos if you want. If you want to stay with DT shifters there are later index ones which are better or you can of course go friction.

The 7sp cogs are the same as 8sp ones so that's not a problem....buy an 8sp cassette and leave one cog out, they aren't pinned.

Not really with that rear der. Get any Campag 8 shifter, Syncro 3, ERGO and a 1992+ rear der, even 9/10s ones....that’ll work well.

[AngryScientist]

i think you scored mcallen.

frame looks pretty mint.

depending on how you want to use the bike really will decide on what to do about the drivetrain.

for better or worse, drivetrains of that era were much more "race" oriented with high gear ratios. the market has shifted (for the better IMO) to more relaxed gearing, and most casual cyclists would be more comfortable riding with lower gearing than was available at the time.

if it were me, i would swap in a new centaur or potenza silver group on that bike and ride it happily.

either way - enjoy, it's a looker!

[thwart]

I would say you've scored a very nice bike.

If you like the vintage Campy stuff, stick with it. If not the aforementioned silver Potenza stuff would work out well, and with a wider range cassette it would be a nice replacement for your touring bike.

You will do well on eBay for those Campy parts.

And... it is St. Patty's Day green... :banana:

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/Xv0I3idGiZ5EMBaPLbo32pKdwRu-q-Nd4oKf_v4xXSC8q_jaXNlheUvvoZ8bYEDWpX6UZxL_I83Furvh Vz1vpW3gqypoSugHm1oPUQST-SGBHlXsLkPgvSIoqFHUdaiJxIBgeetQMqYZO2hipAqILPhc_Hs DxR68RUkMCCtMyw1YNgQn-X0PzWxAwzfNDDKpt_J994eni1_nPjOHg4t5jqTM-TLgbX3zP97aeW5lqvi-IKuCdlL91JvJ_qPFE8otodn8P-rdcc_0oZdrERXlr4xKcJKmNg_DGmEZpBfYjLXLXVkbzx0Mchj2 rlZSqiw6fYsTaD2aTI998ers6FCkOXtse2xKmfckwK3I0D-8tHzkrQ19oFJvoO0KkZ_13BQ-SoN6mG1cmr4BmMqnOWj7McjDjAh5H2n0dvr64h394W865rmvl9 5izt-L4bUfThhQp4ijifiu1zmwH_iq3ooINFouKZbsgbdXpWQwzmDdI 8qINdrFSWBPQUlgpO5CxV-bS2eWrVCF2XyGe73bzpanfoPwFBdEq4YJJ4qrzvpOW_MuRSeI-YZz4tqmNrLtyVA1ov1aNG-a4Ts2wQ4W9Co9zP8WRd68xe9TnvtpjzwslFWmd60-9GBPwdgQcoT6ojvPP_fuZrd-KqzU42ZK5nH0eJd9ElhRAueS=w1265-h794-no

[Spaghetti Legs]

Unless your touring rig was a very special bike, you scored on that trade! Beautiful frame by a respected builder. Sticker suggests Columbus SL, although Columbus SP (thicker walled) was mixed in on larger frames. My guess, if group is original to bike is that it is from 1989-91. If set up right the Syncro 2 shifters work fine. I have it on 6 speed C-Record, two 7 speed Athena/Chorus bikes and an 8 speed Record/Chorus bike. I've found that using a modern 8 speed chain like a KMC Z72 or SRAM helps out. I think some people use 9 speed chains.

[skiezo]

Im loving the dual colored/different shades of green.

[Mzilliox]

Wow, you got a good one there. Keith used mainly high end columbus tubes. That stay/seat cluster treatment is my favorite from him too. Great work with the fork and paint as well.

It almost looks like it could have been his bike at one point!

[soulspinner]

That's nice.:hello:

[mcallen]

Thanks for the info. It was a St. Patty’s Day miracle! Touring bike was nothing special, but it was shop owner’s previously so he had a soft spot for it.

I am taking it out for a ride today and I am hugely happy with the ride quality. Seems to glide over these rough Indiana roads much better than my other bikes. I will probably swap out drive train to modernize it a bit, especially to get more range in back. Looking forward to many happy miles.

[oliver1850]

Great find Matt. I'd leave it pretty much as is. If you want wider range gearing, that derailleur in B position will handle up to a 32 large cog. If you have a cassette hub the cogs will be hard to find but if it has a freewheel finding one won't be hard. You can file down 9 speed cogs to fit the C7/C8 freehub. You can buy individual Miche 9 speed cogs up to 29 teeth. If 26 is large enough, keep your eye on ebay for a Campagnolo 8 speed 13-26 cassette. They still turn up new occasionally.

[Clean39T]

Great find Matt. I'd leave it pretty much as is. If you want wider range gearing, that derailleur in B position will handle up to a 32 large cog. If you have a cassette hub the cogs will be hard to find but if it has a freewheel finding one won't be hard. You can file down 9 speed cogs to fit the C7/C8 freehub. You can buy individual Miche 9 speed cogs up to 29 teeth. If 26 is large enough, keep your eye on ebay for a Campagnolo 8 speed 13-26 cassette. They still turn up new occasionally.


Seems to be most Keith Andersen frames live in IN these days - that’s where mine came from. I thought the craftsmanship and ride quality of the one I had was superb - just a touch small for me though. I’d grab another in a second if I had room and the sizing was right. Congrats!

[EricEstlund]

Keith was originally and Indiana guy. He also built bikes in Utah and Oregon. He's since moved on from the bike industry, but he was a talented builder and world class painter.

[msl819]

Im loving the dual colored/different shades of green.

Agreed

[Ralph]

Most 7 and 8 speed freewheels and cassettes were 5 MM center to center on the cog. Cog thickness and space between were sometimes different, but as long as they were 5 mm center to center on cog...was fine. So Sachs, Most Shimano, 7 and 8 Campy, Sunrace, and perhaps a few others will all work with the same shifter and rear derailleur....if it has enough travel. Whether the rear is spread for 8 (130 MM) and has room, is another matter. I know I shifted successfully a bunch of Sachs 7 speed freewheels (had a cog board with about all the cogs) with 8 speed campy Ergo shifters (one shift blocked off), with a rear that was spread less than 130 MM, but had room for 7. Love that frame.

[Kontact]

Campy indexing in that era had several problems, but that doesn't mean Chorus will shift badly on index. Unlike C-Record, Chorus is pretty well designed as an index derailleur (as was Croce D'Aune and Athena).

The Chorus derailleur can be adjusted for one of two slopes in its parallelogram - one for up to 27T low cogs, the other for up to 32T. Max capacity for the shallow slope was 31 and 33 for the steep setting. To change the slope from A to B you need to change the Syncro Insert from Green to Black.

Should you choose to get some lower gearing, current Shimano and Sunrace 7 speed freewheels will shift better than anything available in the 1980s.

You may also get some improvement in shifting by using SIS housing, which Campy didn't use back then.

The other thing that seems to help with Syncro II shifting is playing with the shifter tension on the D-ring. Some folks like more tension to muffle the clicks, others liked having less tension so the overshift was more pronounced.

You can switch to friction shifting by going to high gear and then pulling the knurled ring out and rotating it 90°, followed by tightening the D-ring. My Athena shifting has always been so reliable that I only did this once in 28 years.


But please don't strip off any of these wonderful components. They can work very well and are a pleasure to own. That bike is gorgeous.

[josephr]

Keith was originally and Indiana guy. He also built bikes in Utah and Oregon. He's since moved on from the bike industry, but he was a talented builder and world class painter.

oh man...that's terrible news...I guess the Rogue Cycles thing wasn't quite what he wanted to be??? All I know was he did an awesome job on a restoration/repaint! Maybe we need gather in southern Oregon for an intervention (or a retirement party)?

[mcallen]

Great find Matt. I'd leave it pretty much as is. If you want wider range gearing, that derailleur in B position will handle up to a 32 large cog. If you have a cassette hub the cogs will be hard to find but if it has a freewheel finding one won't be hard. You can file down 9 speed cogs to fit the C7/C8 freehub. You can buy individual Miche 9 speed cogs up to 29 teeth. If 26 is large enough, keep your eye on ebay for a Campagnolo 8 speed 13-26 cassette. They still turn up new occasionally.

I do think I will leave it set up like this, if for no other reason than no one on the Sunday group ride could believe I was riding steel ("How can you climb hills on that thing?").

It is a freehub, currently a Regina 11-23 or thereabouts. Looks like there are lots of options for 7 speed freehubs available, especially with this derailleur.

I'll need to figure out how to set up the rear shifting better. I ended up with some ghost shifting.

[mcallen]

Campy indexing in that era had several problems, but that doesn't mean Chorus will shift badly on index. Unlike C-Record, Chorus is pretty well designed as an index derailleur (as was Croce D'Aune and Athena).

The Chorus derailleur can be adjusted for one of two slopes in its parallelogram - one for up to 27T low cogs, the other for up to 32T. Max capacity for the shallow slope was 31 and 33 for the steep setting. To change the slope from A to B you need to change the Syncro Insert from Green to Black.

Should you choose to get some lower gearing, current Shimano and Sunrace 7 speed freewheels will shift better than anything available in the 1980s.

You may also get some improvement in shifting by using SIS housing, which Campy didn't use back then.

The other thing that seems to help with Syncro II shifting is playing with the shifter tension on the D-ring. Some folks like more tension to muffle the clicks, others liked having less tension so the overshift was more pronounced.

You can switch to friction shifting by going to high gear and then pulling the knurled ring out and rotating it 90°, followed by tightening the D-ring. My Athena shifting has always been so reliable that I only did this once in 28 years.


But please don't strip off any of these wonderful components. They can work very well and are a pleasure to own. That bike is gorgeous.

Thanks for the technical and aesthetic advice. I plan to follow both.

[dddd]

If it's 7-speed, then I will assume it has a freewheel.

I've used 7s Sunrace freewheels with Synchro II levers and it worked really well even for hilly/sporting riding once I put on a 9s Shimano chain. They offer a 13-25t and 13-28t in 7s versions and 13-32t in an 8s version iir.
Note that A and B derailer settings require different indexing rings as the actuation ratio changes.

[Kontact]

I'll need to figure out how to set up the rear shifting better. I ended up with some ghost shifting.

That's generally BB cable guide friction. Sometimes lube will fix it, increased tension on the shifter D-ring or using housing liner under the BB.

[crankles]

You can switch to friction shifting by going to high gear and then pulling the knurled ring out and rotating it 90°, followed by tightening the D-ring.


But please don't strip off any of these wonderful components. They can work very well and are a pleasure to own. That bike is gorgeous.

This...I had first gen c-record. Worst indexing ever. Over a summer, I think Campy USA sent me three different internal indexing cogs. Go friction and run whatever 7sp cogs your heart desires.

In addition, you scored quite the nice frame. I was living in Indy at the time Keith was building and working at BGI. He was/is meticulous and I enjoyed his sense of humor. You've all seen this beauty, right. https://www.flickr.com/photos/27880623@N05/4445878271/

[oldpotatoe]

This...I had first gen c-record. Worst indexing ever. Over a summer, I think Campy USA sent me three different internal indexing cogs. Go friction and run whatever 7sp cogs your heart desires.

In addition, you scored quite the nice frame. I was living in Indy at the time Keith was building and working at BGI. He was/is meticulous and I enjoyed his sense of humor. You've all seen this beauty, right. https://www.flickr.com/photos/27880623@N05/4445878271/

Not being a slant parallogram rear der like Athena, A-B Chorus or CDA, it wasn't really designed for index/click shifting. BUT, like a lot of things of this era, they were beautiful(CDA rear der!!), had lots of 'flexibility'(inserts/speeds/freewheels, etc), but compared to shimano of the era, didn't work nearly as well..why they dumped all this stuff in the early 90s when ERGO was introduced.

Valentino actually thought 'enthusiasts' would still use friction/C-Record and click shifting was the stuff of cyclo-tourists and 'nurses'..he was wrong...:eek:

[pbarry]

Great find! What a gem! :beer:

Iirc, Sun Tour Ultra-7 freewheels did not have even spacing between all of the cogs, making index shifting problematic.