I guess the patent on quick links is expired

[bikinchris]

I guess the patent on quick links to connect chains is expired. The recent about face from Shimano is amazing. Now their chains come with qucikk links.

[sales guy]

Yeah, it has. KMC is supplying Shimano with them now. They are non-reusable types also.

Shimano really hates to pay license rights to anyone. Like REALLY HATES it!!!

[FriarQuade]

They did quick links with 7900 Dura Ace for about 3 months before they pulled them off the market.

Personally I don't get the appeal of a reusable quick link or the install links that we're seeing with 11spd and up chains. A chain goes on a bike and stays there until it's ready for the trash, end of story.

[ColonelJLloyd]

I guess KMC is making them for YBN too. I recently told a friend about the YBN ones (https://moltenspeedwax.com/products/ybn-11-speed-master-link-qrs-11) after he had a KMC link fail after modding it to make it reusable per a YouTube tutorial. He did buy them and reported back that they are identical to the KMC branded ones. :confused:

https://online2.qbp.com/6SPsvm45/prodl/CH9705.jpg

I have a new YBN chain in the package with a single link that is claimed to be reusable. I haven't needed to install it yet.

The Connex ones are supposed to be reusable as well.

https://online2.qbp.com/6SPsvm45/p350x350m/CH1875.jpg

[chiasticon]

Personally I don't get the appeal of a reusable quick link or the install links that we're seeing with 11spd and up chains. A chain goes on a bike and stays there until it's ready for the trash, end of story.lots of people do this voodoo to clean/lube their chain where they pull it from the bike, soak it in paraffin wax, boil it in mineral spirits, hang it from a hook in their garage for three days to dry, say a small prayer to the Ghost of Merckx, then reinstall it. the reusable quick link makes that super easy.

me, I just wipe the chain down with a rag and put a few drops of NFS on it.

[eBAUMANN]

They did quick links with 7900 Dura Ace for about 3 months before they pulled them off the market.

Personally I don't get the appeal of a reusable quick link or the install links that we're seeing with 11spd and up chains. A chain goes on a bike and stays there until it's ready for the trash, end of story.

- its way easier to clean a chain off a bike.

- sometimes you get a new bike before your chain wears out.

- sometimes you need to pack your bike for travel, much less mess/chance of damage to remove chain and pack separately.

- some people have bikes that can be used with a wide range of rear drivetrain options, including normal-range cassettes, wide-range cassettes, and even (GASP) single speed. all of these options require different length chains and it would not be weird to have 3 different chains for 3 different cassette arrangements for 1 single bike.

so yea...there are reasons for quick links, i personally have never used anything BUT quick links on every bike ive ever owned.
i even (GASP) re-use the non-reusable ones because guess what (GASP), thats mostly marketing BS.

[oldpotatoe]

They did quick links with 7900 Dura Ace for about 3 months before they pulled them off the market.

Personally I don't get the appeal of a reusable quick link or the install links that we're seeing with 11spd and up chains. A chain goes on a bike and stays there until it's ready for the trash, end of story.

Not my story. A dirty chain wears stuff out. A link makes it easy to do that 30 minute job.

[Louis]

I've been re-using SRAM quick-links for quite a while with no problems. I don't know if they make their own or re-brand someone else's.

[loxx0050]

A quick link bailed me out while on a TT race. Mis-shifted from big to small, dropped the chain and then had chain suck on top of it (was going up a steep short hill standing so couldn't immediately stop pedaling....dumb mistake). Only way I could get it out on the road without proper tools was to pop out the quick link to pull the chain out (it was stuck between the small chainring and chainstay cavity).

Messy endeavor but I finished my ride (was a short distance TT, ended up losing about 8 minutes on that one). Sucks because I was on pace for a PR that race. Made me more mindful to not be sloppy about my shifting.

[AngryScientist]

i wonder if campy will consider doing the same?

the reason i buy kmc chains over campy ones is because they come with a quick link.

one of the real benefits to quick links is that they are virtually idiot proof. many chains that wind up failing do so where the user joined them. of course if done properly they are fine, but the reality is that you stand a better chance of an end user joining a chain properly with a quick link than needing to press a pin.

[ColonelJLloyd]

i even (GASP) re-use the non-reusable ones because guess what (GASP), thats mostly marketing BS.

I am currently using an Ultegra 11s chain that I have not once, but THREE times*, pushed-out and pushed-in a pin using an old Nashbar multi-tool. It also has a quick link in it. I'm Molly Hatchet like a mofo every time I throw a leg over that bike. ;)






*road side repair in the midst of full on bonk and connected it on the outside of the chainstay once and not routed through RD another time. I was determined not to call the SAG wagon with a newborn at home.

[saab2000]

I use a quick link from KMC on my S&S travel bike. Bought the tool and it's a super simple and painless way to travel. Hard to imagine resistance to a product that improves the experience.

[foo_fighter]

Same here with the YBN 11 speed link.

I use a quick link from KMC on my S&S travel bike. Bought the tool and it's a super simple and painless way to travel. Hard to imagine resistance to a product that improves the experience.

[FlashUNC]

They're great. Use them on all my bikes, including the ones with Campy chains.

[Gummee]

Personally I don't get the appeal of a reusable quick link or the install links that we're seeing with 11spd and up chains. A chain goes on a bike and stays there until it's ready for the trash, end of story.

I'm with you. Chain goes on. Chain stays on.

Spray it with lube. Wipe it off. Ride. Repeat as needed.

M

[stien]

A great trick I found to remove a quick link involves a rubber mallet, you put the link on the big ring, pull up 1 extra link so the link is pointing up, then lightly tap the correct single side with the mallet. It's off.

[45K10]

I guess the patent on quick links to connect chains is expired. The recent about face from Shimano is amazing. Now their chains come with qucikk links.

Did it still come with a pin? or do you have to use the quick link? I always preferred using the shimano pin over anything else.

[ColonelJLloyd]

A great trick I found to remove a quick link involves a rubber mallet, you put the link on the big ring, pull up 1 extra link so the link is pointing up, then lightly tap the correct single side with the mallet. It's off.

I have zero regrets purchasing my Park master link pliers.

[kurto]

I get cleaning a chain with it on the bike, and that's generally good enough, but it's soooo much easier to fully degrease it off the bike in a mason jar or whatever while you scrub and detail the rest of the business.

Quick links are dope, and baumann is right - they can be re-used. You all should give them a chance.

[tumbler]

I like them. It's a much nicer experience to snap one of those on/off vs. pushing pins in and out (which always left me second guessing if I got them just right). Despite being "one-time use", you can generally reinstall a few times. I keep the same link until I get a new chain.

[chiasticon]

fwiw, I was just being snarky/silly with my previous comment. I do think quick links are great and on the contrary, I basically refuse to buy any chains without them. they're just way simpler and they provide you with options. nine times out of ten for me, chain goes on bike, chain stays on bike until it's dead. but not always...

I still think it's ridiculous the lengths some people go to clean their chains, though.

[eBAUMANN]

I still think it's ridiculous the lengths some people go to clean their chains, though.

i definitely dont clean my chain much, if ever, off the bike...but i can see why someone with the time to kill would...chains get dirty, quick, and are the main spreader of grime/grit across the rest of your drivetrain. if youre gonna keep one thing on your bike clean, the chain should probably be it.

[bikinchris]

Did it still come with a pin? or do you have to use the quick link? I always preferred using the shimano pin over anything else.

Sorry, I completely disagree. Those pins are incredibly dangerous. The quick links are about ten million ties safer, quicker and more efficient. The fact that Shimano continued to pack them with chains says everything about how stubborn they are not to pay royalties or buy from someone else.

[45K10]

Sorry, I completely disagree. Those pins are incredibly dangerous. The quick links are about ten million ties safer, quicker and more efficient. The fact that Shimano continued to pack them with chains says everything about how stubborn they are not to pay royalties or buy from someone else.

So, did they include a pin or not? That is all I was asking

[sales guy]

Did it still come with a pin? or do you have to use the quick link? I always preferred using the shimano pin over anything else.


No. You either buy them with a quick link OR the Shimano pin. Not both.

[45K10]

No. You either buy them with a quick link OR the Shimano pin. Not both.

Cool, thanks

[sales guy]

The one and only time I have ever had a chain fail, was on an 8 speed chain with a Shimano master pin. That's it. That pin, it is fatter on the ends and if done properly is supposed to push the outer plate inward. BUT, you are still shoving a fatter pin thru a smaller hole. And chain steel is pretty flexy and light. Easy to mess up that outer plate. Which is why you aren't supposed to push a master pin out. Cause it can super screw up the outer plates.

As for just leave the chain on and when done, replace, heck no! I'm with OldPotatoe on this one. Pop the link, pull it, a few minutes of scrubbing. Rinse with water(if using a water soluble degreaser), dry it with an air hose. reinstall and lube. 20, 30 minutes at most and the chains perfect. It makes the drivetrain last longer. Better shifting. Quieter drivetrain. So much better than just leaving it. And you can see problems better.

[djg21]

I guess KMC is making them for YBN too. I recently told a friend about the YBN ones (https://moltenspeedwax.com/products/ybn-11-speed-master-link-qrs-11) after he had a KMC link fail after modding it to make it reusable per a YouTube tutorial. He did buy them and reported back that they are identical to the KMC branded ones. :confused:

https://online2.qbp.com/6SPsvm45/prodl/CH9705.jpg

I have a new YBN chain in the package with a single link that is claimed to be reusable. I haven't needed to install it yet.

The Connex ones are supposed to be reusable as well.

https://online2.qbp.com/6SPsvm45/p350x350m/CH1875.jpg

Connex says they are not; but I reuse them for 3 chains or more, and I replace my chains at 1,500 miles or so.

[sales guy]

I guess KMC is making them for YBN too. I recently told a friend about the YBN ones (https://moltenspeedwax.com/products/ybn-11-speed-master-link-qrs-11) after he had a KMC link fail after modding it to make it reusable per a YouTube tutorial. He did buy them and reported back that they are identical to the KMC branded ones. :confused:

https://online2.qbp.com/6SPsvm45/prodl/CH9705.jpg

I have a new YBN chain in the package with a single link that is claimed to be reusable. I haven't needed to install it yet.

The Connex ones are supposed to be reusable as well.

https://online2.qbp.com/6SPsvm45/p350x350m/CH1875.jpg


Actually, Yaban does have their own patent. A slightly different design. The one in the picture, it is a reusable link. The KMC one is not. It's missing the lip that stops it being "reusable".

Yaban also has a different patent for a compression link design where you flex it together and it springs back out to tighten and keep it together. I use those for my Park Chainwhip. They have flaws tho.

Wipperman have their own patent for their link.

Oddly some dude in the US has a patent that kind of combines KMC and Wippermans design before Wipperman BUT after KMC. I actually have a couple of his links.

[icepick_trotsky]

i wonder if campy will consider doing the same?

the reason i buy kmc chains over campy ones is because they come with a quick link.

one of the real benefits to quick links is that they are virtually idiot proof. many chains that wind up failing do so where the user joined them. of course if done properly they are fine, but the reality is that you stand a better chance of an end user joining a chain properly with a quick link than needing to press a pin.

I always use a SRAM quick link with campy chains. Don't tell anyone.

[oldpotatoe]

Actually, Yaban does have their own patent. A slightly different design. The one in the picture, it is a reusable link. The KMC one is not. It's missing the lip that stops it being "reusable".

Yaban also has a different patent for a compression link design where you flex it together and it springs back out to tighten and keep it together. I use those for my Park Chainwhip. They have flaws tho.

Wipperman have their own patent for their link.

Oddly some dude in the US has a patent that kind of combines KMC and Wippermans design before Wipperman BUT after KMC. I actually have a couple of his links.

Yaban with a flex to connect link...did it used to be under a different brand, in the 90s?

[sales guy]

I always use a SRAM quick link with campy chains. Don't tell anyone.

I use a KMC or Yaban one with my Campagnolo chain. No issues.

The Wipperman ones, they are designed to be reusable. that was one of their selling features as well as the chain wear indicator on it.

[sales guy]

Yaban with a flex to connect link...did it used to be under a different brand, in the 90s?

Yeah, it did. I would have to look at it but it doesn't have the Yaban name. I know a couple people used it with their own names. Yaban didn't start pushing their name until like the late 90's early 2000's. They still make chains for other people but now also under their name. Just like KMC. Except KMC jumped into the self branded chain game much earlier.

[oldpotatoe]

Yeah, it did. I would have to look at it but it doesn't have the Yaban name. I know a couple people used it with their own names. Yaban didn't start pushing their name until like the late 90's early 2000's. They still make chains for other people but now also under their name. Just like KMC. Except KMC jumped into the self branded chain game much earlier.

Used to sell ‘em until started seeing them break....can’t remember the name.

[sales guy]

Used to sell ‘em until started seeing them break....can’t remember the name.

I never had one break, but I did have them pop open. Under load they work. No load and they can pop open. Happens on my chain whip too. And that's a chain whip!

I'll look tomorrow and post it. I can't remember it.

[Ralph]

I had some "clicking" wih a Connex. Also....and I may be wrong about this....but I believe the Connex only goes a certain way. You have to read the directions before installation. Many don't.

Never have any issues with KMC. I will reuse on same chain. My chain checker doesn't show wear any faster than a regular link. I have been known to put some grease on the Quick Link before I snap them together.

[oldpotatoe]

I never had one break, but I did have them pop open. Under load they work. No load and they can pop open. Happens on my chain whip too. And that's a chain whip!

I'll look tomorrow and post it. I can't remember it.

Taya....same chain?

[PaulE]

I have zero regrets purchasing my Park master link pliers.

Same here. You can also use those master link pliers to install the link, just spread it over the outer ends of the link ends with the fixed pins diagonally across the link and squeeze.

[sales guy]

Taya....same chain?

Yeah, it's Taya. I forgot about them. Not really in the states as much anymore. They are different companies. BUT, Taya does have a patent on a chain that others have used in similar ways. Not the master link tho.

Good brain sir. Totally forgot about them. There is someone else who had master links in the 90's tho. A US company or US name.

[sales guy]

I had some "clicking" wih a Connex. Also....and I may be wrong about this....but I believe the Connex only goes a certain way. You have to read the directions before installation. Many don't.

Never have any issues with KMC. I will reuse on same chain. My chain checker doesn't show wear any faster than a regular link. I have been known to put some grease on the Quick Link before I snap them together.


Yes, the Connex link does have a certain direction on it.

[sales guy]

Taya....same chain?

They still offer it....The Sigma Connector. They make a nice looking 12 speed chain. Wouldn't mind that on an 11 speed system. Nice and quiet. I don't even think Taya was at interbike.

[oldpotatoe]

Yeah, it's Taya. I forgot about them. Not really in the states as much anymore. They are different companies. BUT, Taya does have a patent on a chain that others have used in similar ways. Not the master link tho.

Good brain sir. Totally forgot about them. There is someone else who had master links in the 90's tho. A US company or US name.

Had to ask the guy who now owns Vecchios, I couldn’t remember.

[sales guy]

Had to ask the guy who now owns Vecchios, I couldn’t remember.

Gotcha. I forgot about them. Never see them in the US anymore. They were huge for awhile tho.

[GregL]

There is someone else who had master links in the 90's tho. A US company or US name.
Perhaps you're thinking about the Forster Superlink (http://www.forstertool.com/Products/Bike-Chain-Link)? Still available through Licktons (http://lickbike.com/productpage.php?PART_NUM_SUB=0338-10). I've used Superlinks for years on Shimano 9 and 10-speed chains with great results. Now using KMC links on Shimano 11-speed chains with good results as well.

Greg

[sales guy]

Perhaps you're thinking about the Forster Superlink (http://www.forstertool.com/Products/Bike-Chain-Link)? Still available through Licktons (http://lickbike.com/productpage.php?PART_NUM_SUB=0338-10). I've used Superlinks for years on Shimano 9 and 10-speed chains with great results. Now using KMC links on Shimano 11-speed chains with good results as well.

Greg

That's the one. But it wasn't under the Forster brand name. Someone else licensed it from them if they own the patent. But yep, Superlink. That's the other master link style one from the 90's till now.

I didn't even realize it was still around. Haven't seen it for years. Nice brain there sir.

[sales guy]

Perhaps you're thinking about the Forster Superlink (http://www.forstertool.com/Products/Bike-Chain-Link)? Still available through Licktons (http://lickbike.com/productpage.php?PART_NUM_SUB=0338-10). I've used Superlinks for years on Shimano 9 and 10-speed chains with great results. Now using KMC links on Shimano 11-speed chains with good results as well.

Greg


Actually, He owns it. Robert Lickton owns the super link design. He also owns the air caddy bike box design. Hence why he still sells them.

But it was sold under a different name back in the 90's. Forster might actually make them, but he patented the design in 1993. And now that I looked at the Forster site, they are in Illinois. So they make it for Lickton.

[jruhlen1980]

Other nice thing about a quick link: When you rip your RD off 50 miles from home and you have to do an emergency SS conversion to get home (because you'll die of starvation before you make the call of shame), it sure is nice to have a spare quick link in your tool kit.

[muz]

Other nice thing about a quick link: When you rip your RD off 50 miles from home and you have to do an emergency SS conversion to get home (because you'll die of starvation before you make the call of shame), it sure is nice to have a spare quick link in your tool kit.

Actually, you don't need a quick link in that case. The chain is toast anyway, just push in a pin with the chain tool and pedal gingerly.

[jruhlen1980]

Actually, you don't need a quick link in that case. The chain is toast anyway, just push in a pin with the chain tool and pedal gingerly.

Actually I've done it my way several times and it's been fine. But thanks.

[john segal]

Wasn't it the Craig Superlink back-in-the-day?

[sales guy]

Wasn't it the Craig Superlink back-in-the-day?

THAT'S IT!!! Craig! Couldn't remember it. I have them back in the drawer. I would've posted it tomorrow with the Taya one. Eventually. ;)

[Frankwurst]

I have zero regrets purchasing my Park master link pliers.

I'm with you. One of those tools that doesn't get alot of use but I'm glad I have one when I need it.:beer:

[bikinchris]

I'm with you. One of those tools that doesn't get alot of use but I'm glad I have one when I need it.:beer:

The Park master link pliers are great and I use them very often in my little shop.

[FriarQuade]

- its way easier to clean a chain off a bike.

- some people have bikes that can be used with a wide range of rear drivetrain options, including normal-range cassettes, wide-range cassettes, and even (GASP) single speed. all of these options require different length chains and it would not be weird to have 3 different chains for 3 different cassette arrangements for 1 single bike.


I beg to differ that chains are easier to clean off a bike than on. I can get a chain pretty damn spotless while it's on the bike.

I'll concede that some bikes have the versatility to run wide ranges of gearing and this is perhaps the only reason to take a perfectly good chain off the bike. But in that case you're swapping the cassette and RD as well.

Sorry, I completely disagree. Those pins are incredibly dangerous. The quick links are about ten million ties safer, quicker and more efficient. The fact that Shimano continued to pack them with chains says everything about how stubborn they are not to pay royalties or buy from someone else.

Stop spreading bad information. There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with Shimano's install pins. They aren't any more prone to failure than any other pin in the chain provided they are installed correctly, which doesn't take an engineering degree. I've seen a bunch of quick links fail at races, way more than Shimano install pins.

Not my story. A dirty chain wears stuff out. A link makes it easy to do that 30 minute job.

Are you stopping for espresso during your bike wash?

[morrisericd]

As I was reading through this I thought to myself - am I cleaning my chain correctly (the best way)? I have always just wiped it down on the bike, reapplied lube, run it through the gears and then wiped it off. I had a friend that used to take his chain off after every ride and soak it in degreaser. I was told that was a no-no. It removes all of the grease/lube from inside the links.

If you take your chain off, do you soak it? I'd love to hear some of the different methods.

[bikinchris]

I beg to differ that chains are easier to clean off a bike than on. I can get a chain pretty damn spotless while it's on the bike.

Stop spreading bad information. There is absolutely NOTHING wrong with Shimano's install pins. They aren't any more prone to failure than any other pin in the chain provided they are installed correctly, which doesn't take an engineering degree. I've seen a bunch of quick links fail at races, way more than Shimano install pins.



I have seen exactly the opposite. I have seen exactly one link fail in all the time they existed. I have seen pins fail over and over. The finicky method of assembly is what the problem is.

Shimano has passively admitted this by abandoning that assembly method.

[Ralph]

If a chain shows minimal wear and is very dirty, I like to clean it off the bike so I can also clean and lube the derailleur pulleys same time. it's also easier (for me) to clean and lube (pivot areas) the front and rear derailleurs with chain off...I think. No matter....once you get your system for doing these maintenance things, it all works. Quick Links make my work easier.

[oldpotatoe]

Are you stopping for espresso during your bike wash?

Nope, drinking a beer..I'll bet you can get your chain real clean on the bike:eek:..pretty tough to do things like clean the mudded up pulleys.

DOH!!

[Mikej]

fOUND IT

[Mikej]

1697947130http://si.shimano.com/pdfs/dm/DM-CN0001-05-ENG.pdf

For anybody curious, SEE PAGE 5.

[chiasticon]

cleaning a chain on the bike is really not that difficult or time consuming. they even make devices to make it faster/easier. I get that some people like to be super thorough or make a whole process out of it, but doing it on the bike is just as good.

[Bob Ross]

5 pages about this?!?!

[Mikej]

cleaning a chain on the bike is really not that difficult or time consuming. they even make devices to make it faster/easier. I get that some people like to be super thorough or make a whole process out of it, but doing it on the bike is just as good.

I agree, I use WD-40 HEAVY DEGREASER and the WD-40 spray foam now a days and it works pretty good. Finish Line Citrus works dang good, but hurts my lungs. Then I scrub it down and wash it down with some soapy Dawn water until clear water only comes out- I clean my MTB chains after every dirt ride - so I'm pretty efficient at it.

[oldpotatoe]

5 pages about this?!?!

Yup, weird..

Once a month I take chain off, pulleys off, CRs off and cogset off..scrub clean all, reassemble. Much tougher with chain on bike. IMHO, of course.

But I do it with skinny jeans on, a wrinkled plaid shirt and my name is nancy....

DOH...not much sense of humor this AM..IMHO...:):confused::eek:

[Mikej]

Yup, weird..

Once a month I take chain off, pulleys off, CRs off and cogset off..scrub clean all, reassemble. Much tougher with chain on bike. IMHO, of course.

But I do it with skinny jeans on, a wrinkled plaid shirt and my name is nancy....

DOH...not much sense of humor this AM..IMHO...:):confused::eek:

Hope that shirt is one size too small...

[bobswire]

They did quick links with 7900 Dura Ace for about 3 months before they pulled them off the market.

Personally I don't get the appeal of a reusable quick link or the install links that we're seeing with 11spd and up chains. A chain goes on a bike and stays there until it's ready for the trash, end of story.

Maybe for the average bike owner but us wrenches like fiddling around with our bikes as well as cleaning them off the bike, Quick link was a godsend.

[makoti]

Yup, weird..

Once a month I take chain off, pulleys off, CRs off and cogset off..scrub clean all, reassemble. Much tougher with chain on bike. IMHO, of course.

But I do it with skinny jeans on, a wrinkled plaid shirt and my name is nancy....

DOH...not much sense of humor this AM..IMHO...:):confused::eek:

Friend of Mr Raccoon?

[weiwentg]

http://si.shimano.com/pdfs/dm/DM-CN0001-05-ENG.pdf

For anybody curious, SEE PAGE 5.

Last month, I stopped to help someone who was noticing her chain sticking on every revolution. The problem was that that master pin hadn't been installed properly, and it was sticking out.

I said to her, unfortunately, this would be the fault of the guy who installed the chain. In this case, it was her husband.

For me, the moral of the story is that quick links are more idiot proof than master pins. They don't make a difference if you're a good mechanic (or you pay a good mechanic), and if you don't remove your chain. Personally, I like them even though I don't take my chain off very often. I'm glad that Shimano is including them with their own chains.

[Mark McM]

Wasn't it the Craig Superlink back-in-the-day?

I used to use the Craig Superlink III on my 8spd chains in the late '90s/early '00s, before chain manufacturers included quick links with their chains. Although they generally worked okay, they had a problem with wear - the Superlink would wear out faster than the chain, and when it was worn, it would produce a noticeable "clunk" and vibration in the drivetrain as the worn link got taken up by the chainring teeth under load. I haven't notices this problem with SRAM or KMC quick links.

[chiasticon]

Once a month I take chain off, pulleys off, CRs off and cogset off..scrub clean all, reassemble. Much tougher with chain on bike.eh, different strokes. I clean all that stuff regularly (to the level of taking sh*t about how clean my bike is versus my friends') but never saw the need to pull the chain for it. ever seen a pro tour mechanic clean a bike? as long as you do it often enough, nothing gnarly builds up to where you need to do a Sheldon Brown level chain cleaning (https://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainclean.html).

[sales guy]

I don't take my chain off every single time. Like everyday 10 or 12 rides. But I do wipe my chain down and clean after every ride.

[Gummee]

eh, different strokes. I clean all that stuff regularly (to the level of taking sh*t about how clean my bike is versus my friends') but never saw the need to pull the chain for it. ever seen a pro tour mechanic clean a bike? as long as you do it often enough, nothing gnarly builds up to where you need to do a Sheldon Brown level chain cleaning (https://www.sheldonbrown.com/chainclean.html).

If you haven't used the Morgan Blue degreaser, you're missing out on some of the best stuff in the world.

HIGHLY recommended

M