Candidates for a lightweight road frame that handles 32's, non-disc?

[mhespenheide]

So I thought I had this figured out for my own purposes, but the Felt F1pr that I bought and built up just isn't quite right for my fit.

I'm reluctant to make the shift to disc brakes. I like the simplicity (and being able to do my own wrenching) of rim brakes. The Felt fits 700x32 or 33, and I'd like to keep that width; I assume that means using medium-reach brakes. If there's something astonishing that would handle 700x30, I'd consider it. If there's something out there that ticks the rest of the boxes but has cantis, I'd consider it, but I never had a great experience with an older LeMond Poprad with cantis or mini-v's (but I didn't try the Paul MiniMoto; perhaps those are worth going "backward"?)

I want "road" geometry, not "gravel/adventure" geometry. For me, in an XL or XXL size, that means ~73 degrees for the head tube angle, and chainstays that are relatively short. I also prefer a bottom bracket drop of 70mm or so (72, 75); not looking for the higher bottom brackets of 'cross bikes.

I'd like to get relatively light (The Poprad felt heavy, compared to my other bikes), so I'm thinking that modern Al, Ti, or carbon might be the way to go. I have a mild preference towards sloping top tubes. I prefer straight tubes, not the hunchback look.

//edit: Nothing too exotic, please. I have some budget to play with, but not semi-infinite. I'm guessing that rules out custom for now.


I know this has been discussed a lot, and I'm asking for some pretty specific requirements. Thanks for any input.

[Vientomas]

https://www.totalcycling.com/en/Genesis-Equilibrium-725-Steel-Frame-and-Fork---2017-White/m-22668.aspx

[John H.]

Yes- mid reach brakes.

Are you considering a custom, or looking for a stock bike with clearance?

[mhespenheide]

https://www.totalcycling.com/en/Genesis-Equilibrium-725-Steel-Frame-and-Fork---2017-White/m-22668.aspx

I've definitely pointed that one out to other people. I'm thinking it would be a little lighter to go for modern Al, Ti, or carbon, but it's one that's on my list. And certainly affordable.

[mhespenheide]

Yes- mid reach brakes.

Are you considering a custom, or looking for a stock bike with clearance?

Added a budget limitation. I could maybe stretch for Curtlo in steel, or Carver in Ti, but for the moment I'm primarily asking for stock (or someone else's custom, second-hand. For that matter, second-hand is preferable all around.)

[jtbadge]

Hard to go wrong with an All-City Mr. Pink. Pretty well equipped with Columbus Zona tubing, a Whisky carbon fork, Rival 22, and Zipp Service Course cockpit.

I spent about 60 miles on the newest model when they came out in January. Great ride.

https://i.redd.it/2hej3bzj7zay.png

Prior iterations had a lugged steel fork:

https://store.bluelug.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/catalog-large/800x/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/_/2/_20161004-dsc09107.jpg

[bicycletricycle]

That motorola paint job is great. I would get one of those, built with lightweight parts it could be great.

Hard to go wrong with an All-City Mr. Pink. Pretty well equipped with Columbus Zona tubing, a Whisky carbon fork, Rival 22, and Zipp Service Course cockpit.

I spent about 60 miles on the newest model when they came out in January. Great ride.

https://i.redd.it/2hej3bzj7zay.png

Prior iterations had a lugged steel fork:

https://store.bluelug.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/catalog-large/800x/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/_/2/_20161004-dsc09107.jpg

[jtbadge]

That motorola paint job is great. I would get one of those, built with lightweight parts it could be great.

The stock 55cm I rode weighed about 20lbs. With Ultegra/Force and decent handbuilt wheels, could be 18 easy.

[bicycletricycle]

The stock 55cm I rode weighed about 20lbs. With Ultegra/Force and decent handbuilt wheels, could be 18 easy.

it would be awesome with mechanical record or da 9000. Heck a used 7900 group and some fancy wheels would be awesome.

[sandyrs]

it would be awesome with mechanical record or da 9000. Heck a used 7900 group and some fancy wheels would be awesome.

I have one. It rides well and was inexpensive to build up. I'd guess mine with rival 11s and nice wheels is around 19 lbs but it might be less. My bikes are all kind of heavy (>20lbs except my mr pink and maybe my cross bike) and it's the lightest for sure.

[rnhood]

A new Specialized Tarmac should check all the right boxes for you, including being spec'd for 30mm tires - which means it might take a 32 also. But it will safely take a 30.

The new Roubaix will take 32 with ease, although it does have a little longer chainstay length at 41.8mm. Not sure where your limit is on this.

The upper end models are expensive (north of $6k complete), but both will be suitably lightweight, even in the largest sizes. The Tarmac might break the 15lb barrier on the largest size.

[EDS]

Could try to find a used Felt F-1 PR (forget the exact name but it was what they made for their sponsored pro team at the time and sold for a bit).

I think the Trek Domane and the Emonda (in certain iterations) are also able to handle bigger tires.

[fishwhisperer]

Have ridden the new All-City and it is quite nice. If you are looking for truly nice, I think the Trek Domane is worth a look —*awesome, awesome ride and definitely light.

[eddief]

most anything that fits you will feel plush-o.

My Curtlo feels like that with mid reach brakes and 28 Conit 4000 sii tires and so does my Carver with normal reach brakes. Easier fit on the Curtlo. A bit tighter on the Carver...and the Domane. Not sure about getting genuine 32mm tires between mid reach calipers.

[bmeryman]

The individual components have been dispersed among the community here, but my Mr. Pink was about 18 lbs built up with pedals. It was a fun bike.

http://i.imgur.com/YVK8b5v.png (https://imgur.com/YVK8b5v)

[R3awak3n]

I have been loving my hampsten strada bianca (with whisky fork)

http://i.imgur.com/rLdTlJm.jpg

really has become my #1 bike for the last month, its fantastic. I know you are on a budget but look around because I got this thing for a crazy good deal (way less than then the all city), great geo, built by IF so you know its some of the best, awesome steel and crazy amazing paint.


the whisky fork is fantastic and imo looks better on this bike then the wound up it came with. And bike fits 35s. who needs discs

[mhespenheide]

Could try to find a used Felt F-1 PR (forget the exact name but it was what they made for their sponsored pro team at the time and sold for a bit).

I think the Trek Domane and the Emonda (in certain iterations) are also able to handle bigger tires.

:) I have a Felt F1 PR right now and thought it was going to be my "forever" bike (which, truthfully, never works out that way--but at least for the next few years), but the fit isn't quite right. I fit okay, but not 100%. I'll certainly keep riding it and enjoying it while I consider others.

I've heard that some of the 2017 Treks take 30's. I'll have to check those out.

[mhespenheide]

most anything that fits you will feel plush-o.

My Curtlo feels like that with mid reach brakes and 28 Conit 4000 sii tires and so does my Carver with normal reach brakes. Easier fit on the Curtlo. A bit tighter on the Carver...and the Domane. Not sure about getting genuine 32mm tires between mid reach calipers.

I'm running 32mm GravelKings on 19mm-internal wide rims in combination with TRP mid-reach calipers and I have to force them past the brake pads. It doesn't make for the fastest wheel changes, but it works. I think 700x30 or 700x32 is the sweet spot for the atrocious roads around here.

[mhespenheide]

I have been loving my hampsten strada bianca (with whisky fork)

http://i.imgur.com/rLdTlJm.jpg

really has become my #1 bike for the last month, its fantastic. I know you are on a budget but look around because I got this thing for a crazy good deal (way less than then the all city), great geo, built by IF so you know its some of the best, awesome steel and crazy amazing paint.


the whisky fork is fantastic and imo looks better on this bike then the wound up it came with. And bike fits 35s. who needs discs

I haven't yet heard any suggestions that would make me run out and buy a new bike/frame, so I'll almost certainly keep riding the F1pr while keeping my eyes open. Luckily, there's a lot of tall paceliners; there's a decent chance one of them might look to move on what I'm looking for if they make the change to discs.

Unless someone out there wants to convince me that I should stop mucking around with rim brakes. I live and ride in dry conditions, though, like being able to wrench on rim brakes myself, and have nice wheels. Unless an Open UP drops in my lap, I'm likely to stick with rim brakes.

[Zee]

https://www.totalcycling.com/en/Genesis-Equilibrium-725-Steel-Frame-and-Fork---2017-White/m-22668.aspx

I see this mentioned and suggested every so often, but does anyone have any direct experience with these?

!ALSO! Has anyone successfully done 35's on a Mr Pink?

[Mzilliox]

I have been loving my hampsten strada bianca (with whisky fork)

http://i.imgur.com/rLdTlJm.jpg

really has become my #1 bike for the last month, its fantastic. I know you are on a budget but look around because I got this thing for a crazy good deal (way less than then the all city), great geo, built by IF so you know its some of the best, awesome steel and crazy amazing paint.


the whisky fork is fantastic and imo looks better on this bike then the wound up it came with. And bike fits 35s. who needs discs

I just got a little chubby, is that normal? this bike is dead sexy man, im envious. One more for the list.

[oliver]

I see this mentioned and suggested every so often, but does anyone have any direct experience with these?

!ALSO! Has anyone successfully done 35's on a Mr Pink?

Luwabra has fit GK 35/38 with BR-R600 brakes: http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=205734

I've also fit GK 35/38 with the VO brakes.

[mhespenheide]

I see this mentioned and suggested every so often, but does anyone have any direct experience with these?

In this thread: http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=196419, users "rileystylee" and "Vientomas" mention that they each have (had?) one.

[mhespenheide]

A few more candidates beyond what's been mentioned so far, for anyone else who's looking:

Kona Esatto Ti was made for rim brakes for a year (or two?) before transitioning to discs.

Soma Pescadero, Tange Prestige steel for the main triangle.

Zancanato Road32 -- not sure if this is essentially custom, or if there are stock sizes. (It's also pricier than custom from Curtlo or Carver, but that's another issue.)

Independent Fabrications Club Racer used to be for rim brakes, I think; not sure about that.

[mhespenheide]

I had originally thought to stay "modern" and to stay away from steel, just for the "lightweight" criteria. But does anyone want to suggest any vintage classics? I'm hearing rumors of some early 80's Puegeots with Vitus 980 tubing that might be candidates.

I've already got a 1992 lugged steel Trek that fits 35's (really similar to their 1980's bikes, down to a nutted rear brake arch), but the chainstays and wheelbase are a little long for it to fit what I'm explicitly looking for here. And it's a few pounds heavier than I'd like.

[sandyrs]

Zancanato Road32 -- not sure if this is essentially custom, or if there are stock sizes. (It's also pricier than custom from Curtlo or Carver, but that's another issue.)


Zanconatos are all full custom.

[Vientomas]

I see this mentioned and suggested every so often, but does anyone have any direct experience with these?

!ALSO! Has anyone successfully done 35's on a Mr Pink?

Yes, I own one. Please feel free to PM if you want to discuss. :banana:

[mt2u77]

I had originally thought to stay "modern" and to stay away from steel, just for the "lightweight" criteria. But does anyone want to suggest any vintage classics? I'm hearing rumors of some early 80's Puegeots with Vitus 980 tubing that might be candidates.

I've already got a lugged steel Trek that fits 35's, but the chainstays and wheelbase are a little long for it to fit what I'm explicitly looking for here. And it's a few pounds heavier than I'd like.

I was just going to suggest an early 80s Trek converted to 700c. Not exactly lightweight, but they do make really nice gravel beaters. I've got a 2011 (first gen) Domane Classics that I've fit w/ 32mm cross tires, but the rear was awfully tight unless you have a really laterally stiff wheel-- 30 mm would be fine. It definitely has more clearance than the regular production Domane from the same era. That said, I'm not really a fan of cramming tires any more. For pure utility I'd personally go with a modern cross bike-- they're more like road geometry nowdays, plenty light, and you can probably get a rim brake frame cheap since everyone seems to be going disc. On the other hand, boutique steel with large tire clearance speaks to the heart!

[Luwabra]

I see this mentioned and suggested every so often, but does anyone have any direct experience with these?

!ALSO! Has anyone successfully done 35's on a Mr Pink?

funny you mention this.. i just mounted some brand new bon jons to a set of belgium+ this morning (tubeless).. park caliper reads right around 35.85mm at 55 psi.. I leave the air up for a while right after mounting.. i usually run these at 45r 40f
regardless.. plenty of clearance with the br-r600.

The gravel kings mentioned above^ measure 37.46mm on an 18mm internal rim as well.

I dont' have a ton of time on the mr pink but it feels damn good with the carbon fork.. i had the pink one, and ended up sizing down and bought bmeryman's frame. Its a practical bike that can handle a big tire and feels great at speed and getting to speed. I ride 95% gravel so keep that in mind as far as my review is concerned. may not translate to roadie life idk. One thing that sucks is airing the tires down to pull the wheel but thats the only negative ive experienced. good luck with your search

[velofinds]

does anyone want to suggest any vintage classics? I'm hearing rumors of some early 80's Puegeots with Vitus 980 tubing that might be candidates.

My ears perked up at this as I have exactly what you describe:

https://www.pedalroom.com/p/1986-peugeot-psn-10-34706_10.jpg

Good bike, does what I ask it to do nicely, but only has room (barely) for 700x30 alas.

[Gummee]

I'm not sure if they'll fit 32s, but check the Domane series from Trek. Or the Scott Addict series

If you open up to discs, then it's an easier question to answer

M

[mhespenheide]

I'm not sure if they'll fit 32s, but check the Domane series from Trek. Or the Scott Addict series

If you open up to discs, then it's an easier question to answer

M

Agreed. I'm liking the idea of being able to switch between 700x32-ish and 650(b)x47-ish. I'm still enough of a retrogrouch to hold off for the time being, but I wouldn't rule it out for the future.

[zennmotion]

funny you mention this.. i just mounted some brand new bon jons to a set of belgium+ this morning (tubeless).. park caliper reads right around 35.85mm at 55 psi.. I leave the air up for a while right after mounting.. i usually run these at 45r 40f
regardless.. plenty of clearance with the br-r600.

The gravel kings mentioned above^ measure 37.46mm on an 18mm internal rim as well.

I dont' have a ton of time on the mr pink but it feels damn good with the carbon fork.. i had the pink one, and ended up sizing down and bought bmeryman's frame. Its a practical bike that can handle a big tire and feels great at speed and getting to speed. I ride 95% gravel so keep that in mind as far as my review is concerned. may not translate to roadie life idk. One thing that sucks is airing the tires down to pull the wheel but thats the only negative ive experienced. good luck with your search

Paul Racer brakes > calipers for that reason. Plus better power and modulation than calipers. My all-road bike has 2 sets of (alu rim) wheels/tires for pavement and gravel, I love the Pauls with both. They're expensive, but the one component that you'll move to the next bike when you move on, assuming you don't drink the disc Koolaid in the meantime. As long as I'm using alu rims, I don't see a need for discs on a gravel bike, no complaints about the Pauls. Opinions vary :fight:

[classtimesailer]

If steel is ok with you, consider a Milwaukee Road (Ben's Cycle) made by Waterford. Slightly sloping long in the back 73 x 73 pretty light, mid reach brakes, 35s fit fine, 28s with fenders. Mine has been a CX racer, commuter, placeholder while waiting for a custom, and lately a trailer puller.

[mhespenheide]

My ears perked up at this as I have exactly what you describe:

https://www.pedalroom.com/p/1986-peugeot-psn-10-34706_10.jpg

Good bike, does what I ask it to do nicely, but only has room (barely) for 700x30 alas.

Awfully pretty bike, there.

I'd run across the reference on the iBob list, but now can't find it... Perhaps another model, perhaps I'm just misremembering.

[echelon_john]

Black Mountain Cycles road.

Ticks all your boxes.

http://blackmtncycles.com/tech-info/road-frames/

[mhespenheide]

Black Mountain Cycles road.

Ticks all your boxes.

http://blackmtncycles.com/tech-info/road-frames/

D'oh!

Can't believe I forgot that one. I've looked at them many times and rode with Mike Varley at the end of last year's Eroica California. Thanks for the reminder.

[R3awak3n]

I just got a little chubby, is that normal? this bike is dead sexy man, im envious. One more for the list.

lol I just saw this. thanks buddy!

[Vientomas]

D'oh!

Can't believe I forgot that one. I've looked at them many times and rode with Mike Varley at the end of last year's Eroica California. Thanks for the reminder.

Had one. Kinda heavy and dead feeling to me. Your results may vary. The Genesis replaced it. Like the Genesis better. But, currently have my eye on a Gunnar Sport. Made in the USA and all. Damn I'm fickle...:)

[Ken C]

I have a Gunnar Sport with the steel fork and love it. I have two sets of wheels, one with mavic GP4 and Vitorria 25mm Corsa Elites and another with DT 440s with Hutchinson 32mm Sectors set up tubeless. I have fit Jack Browns 33mm with ease so most 35mm that are true to size should fit.

Have had the bike since 2007 and love it enough i am going to send it in for a respray.

[GunnarDude]

I absolutely love my Gunnar Crosshairs. Think you can run up to 40mm tires, but it's as responsive and fast as a road bike.


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[GunnarDude]

I have a Gunnar Sport with the steel fork and love it. I have two sets of wheels, one with mavic GP4 and Vitorria 25mm Corsa Elites and another with DT 440s with Hutchinson 32mm Sectors set up tubeless. I have fit Jack Browns 33mm with ease so most 35mm that are true to size should fit.

Have had the bike since 2007 and love it enough i am going to send it in for a respray.



Hey Ken, would love to see a pic of your Gunnar Sport!


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[Pastashop]

https://www.rivbike.com/products/roadini

[mhespenheide]

More steel option: Salsa Casseroll, Rawland Nordavinden, Honey Winterando, Rivendell Roadeo, Cielo Sportif

And the mythic Cervelo R3 "mud", if you can ever find one.
Trek Domane RSL and Colnago EPS are possible candidates, as per this thread: https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=201843
Giant OCR circa '06-'08
Trek Pilot

Still curious about other options that are lighter weight than steel, if you think of any.

[rnhood]

More steel option: Salsa Casseroll, Rawland Nordavinden, Honey Winterando, Rivendell Roadeo, Cielo Sportif

And the mythic Cervelo R3 "mud", if you can ever find one.
Trek Domane RSL and Colnago EPS are possible candidates, as per this thread: https://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=201843
Giant OCR circa '06-'08
Trek Pilot

Still curious about other options that are lighter weight than steel, if you think of any.

Check out the Specialized Roubaix. Its a true do-it-all bike, and is suitably lightweight. Pretty much the same for the Domane, and Giant has their version too. But I like the Roubaix the best.

[mhespenheide]

Check out the Specialized Roubaix. Its a true do-it-all bike, and is suitably lightweight. Pretty much the same for the Domane, and Giant has their version too. But I like the Roubaix the best.

All the Roubaix's that I've seen or heard of max out at 28mm tire clearance and even 28's are pushing it on most of the older models. Do the new ones handle 30's or 32's without resorting to discs?

[rnhood]

The new Roubaix is spec'd to 32 on the tires, but on discs. I don't think it's made with calipers anymore. So if you don't want discs, this one won't fit the bill.

[Morningstar]

Singular Osprey. I believe the frame has been discontinued, but there may still be old new stock available in XL. I had similar requirements for my commuter (rim, 28s w/fenders, ability to tension a chain w/o a derailleur). My build is a single speed (47:18), and I keep my PDW fenders on full time. It will clear 32s easily w/o the mud guards. Good looking frameset, economical, and super fun to ride. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170913/1a67f0d54f5e3712750026d7f6614587.jpg


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[RFC]

On the vintage front, you might consider a Cannondale ST series. I have a 90' ST600. Ya, it's a little heavy (over engineered in good ways), But it has roadish geometry and rides like it. Here is mine with 38mm Panaracers.

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4379/36809376170_1a822c38c9_b.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/Y5HF7J)IMG_0052r (https://flic.kr/p/Y5HF7J) by Robert Copple (https://www.flickr.com/photos/150689726@N06/), on Flickr

[Ken Robb]

What size (in Centimeters) do you need?

[mhespenheide]

What size (in Centimeters) do you need?

62-ish by 59.5-ish, reach right around 40.5cm. Strong preference for a BB drop of 70-72mm; possibly okay with 68mm or down to 75mm. "Road" geometry from there.

[mhespenheide]

Singular Osprey. I believe the frame has been discontinued, but there may still be old new stock available in XL. I had similar requirements for my commuter (rim, 28s w/fenders, ability to tension a chain w/o a derailleur). My build is a single speed (47:18), and I keep my PDW fenders on full time. It will clear 32s easily w/o the mud guards. Good looking frameset, economical, and super fun to ride.

Good for the "database"; for me, a little too close to the '92 Trek 400 that I have.

[mhespenheide]

On the vintage front, you might consider a Cannondale ST series. I have a 90' ST600. Ya, it's a little heavy (over engineered in good ways), But it has roadish geometry and rides like it. Here is mine with 38mm Panaracers.

That is a great picture.

[RFC]

That is a great picture.

Thanks!

[Ken C]

I absolutely love my Gunnar Crosshairs. Think you can run up to 40mm tires, but it's as responsive and fast as a road bike.


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Missed your post. Here it is.

[GunnarDude]

Missed your post. Here it is.



Love the paint job, that fade looks great!


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