Let's be careful out there - eBay scams are more active

[smontanaro]

(Sent multiple places. My apologies if you are reading my drivel multiple times.)

The fraudulent knock-offs of Barry Scott's listings (and presumably other vendors) are back in a big way. My search only matches those of pb*bikes because Barry's listings include distinctive text which is easy to hang a search on.

The significant change which makes the new listings particularly insidious is that they are for lower priced items. Previously, it seemed they would list (for example) a vintage Deore group which Barry had listed for $300 or so, for a ridiculously low price, like $17.48. Now, most of the listings seem to be for much lower priced items. For example, a listing for a VAR 406 Atom freewheel remover is priced at $25.72, while Barry has it listed for $71.20. That smaller difference puts the listing more in the realm of, "hey this looks like a good deal," than "this looks too good to be true - what's the catch?". While I have a specific search which looks for fragments of Barry's descriptions, I have seen one or two other scam listings turn up in some of my other eBay searches. I have no doubt they are seeding other parts of eBay with fraudulent listings.

I have gone to report a few listings only to find them already sold, so the scammers are clearly getting some nibbles on their listings. EBay has a serious problem, and as far as I can see, they don't have a handle on it. I wonder if they truly know how bad things are getting.

[Cicli]

The kicker is, the links in the description still go to the original sellers store.
Scammers suck.

[oliver1850]

Seems like eBay must know this is going on, as they have to pay up when nothing is delivered. Don't know what recourse they have getting anything back from the scammers, so they must be losing money to them. I'd think they'd be finding a way to limit or verify new accounts from foreign countries.

[bobswire]

The kicker is, the links in the description still go to the original sellers store.
Scammers suck.

If it goes back to he original sellers store to pay how do they scam any money out of it?
I've been with Ebay since Apr. 2000 and have never been scammed with over 1300 transaction buying and selling (scammers are very easy to recognize).If you go through ebay and paypal to pay or buy an item you're covered so I don't see how you can be scammed unless you don't go through Ebay/PP and go offline to pay then you're an idiot.

[oliver1850]

If it goes back to he original sellers store to pay how do they scam any money out of it?
I've been with Ebay since Apr. 2000 and have never been scammed with over 1300 transaction buying and selling (scammers are very easy to recognize).If you go through ebay and paypal to pay or buy an item you're covered so I don't see how you can be scammed unless you don't go through Ebay/PP and go offline to pay then you're an idiot.

He just means that the scammers are leaving links to the original seller in the scam listing, not that anyone goes to them to pay. Buyer pays scammer, no product arrives, eBay has to refund buyer.

[Cicli]

He just means that the scammers are leaving links to the original seller in the scam listing, not that anyone goes to them to pay. Buyer pays scammer, no product arrives, eBay has to refund buyer.

Exactly. Not very smart scammers.

[smontanaro]

The prices are low enough that some fraction of the scammed buyers must not request refunds. The scammers wouldn't do it if they didn't make money.

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[jds108]

I'm assuming the scammers move the payment out of paypal and then close/disconnect their paypal accounts, thus making's ebay's clawback attempts unsuccessful.

Just a guess, but I once bought an item from China where the receipt date for me was past the ebay refund window. So no item and out the money on my end.

[loxx0050]

The prices are low enough that some fraction of the scammed buyers must not request refunds. The scammers wouldn't do it if they didn't make money.

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It's more they are gaming it a certain way. Get as many to pay for it, take the money and run before buyers can claim a refund. Then eBay is stuck paying the bill. Same is going on Amazon with 3rd party sellers. I fell victim to Amazon twice but suspected so. Item was $3 and everywhere else it was $8. Did this 2x taking a risk. Got my money back both times and sellers disappeared from Amazon.

That is why I suspect new accounts on eBay funds are withheld for a trial period.

[Bentley]

I'm assuming the scammers move the payment out of paypal and then close/disconnect their paypal accounts, thus making's ebay's clawback attempts unsuccessful.

Just a guess, but I once bought an item from China where the receipt date for me was past the ebay refund window. So no item and out the money on my end.

I've had this happen before. Just contact EBay and they work with you.

Ray

[smontanaro]

Seems like eBay must know this is going on, as they have to pay up when nothing is delivered.

Yes, they know it's going on. I believe their approach is to try and claw back the funds after the fact. It's not at all clear to me that eBay is doing anything to prevent the fraudulent listings in the first place. Seems like a perfect place for a Bayesian classifier.

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[tuscanyswe]

Afaik new sellers do not get the money they earn from sale on ebay until after the goods have been reported as delivered or 21 days or something like that. Until then ebay still holds it via paypal.

So dont see that part as the scam. They do probably get a lot of information from the sales tho, such as emails and paypal info + shipping addresses etc. That info seems a more likely target with these "scams" than getting away with the money.

[jds108]

I've had this happen before. Just contact EBay and they work with you.

Ray

I'm going to guess that it depends on who you talk to at eBay and what kind of mood that they're in, as I didn't get refunded. They said it was because the original purchase was more than 60 days prior. This was 2 years ago, if your experience was more recent, then maybe they've updated their policies.

[oliver1850]

Yes, they know it's going on. I believe their approach is to try and claw back the funds after the fact. It's not at all clear to me that eBay is doing anything to prevent the fraudulent listings in the first place. Seems like a perfect place for a Bayesian classifier.

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Unclear to me how eBay can get anything back from the scam listings once the seller has the funds. I don't know anything about Chinese banking, but I'm guessing the banks aren't going to help eBay out, and just give the seller another account number for his next fraudulent listing. Seems like a lot of work for the scammer when you think about it, for the $20 or $30 he nets on each listing. Of course it's not unheard of for folks to work harder to get money dishonestly than honestly.

[quickfeet]

What's most frustrating is that eBay could simply prevent most of this by not allowing you to list a buy it now for X% lower than whatever the "Trending" selling price is currently. eBay willfully chooses to ignore many issues on their site intentially.

[Bentley]

I'm going to guess that it depends on who you talk to at eBay and what kind of mood that they're in, as I didn't get refunded. They said it was because the original purchase was more than 60 days prior. This was 2 years ago, if your experience was more recent, then maybe they've updated their policies.

Its been at least 2 years. I pointed out to the person that there was no way I could file a claim given the length of time for delivery and they agreed. It was not that hard.

I've seen these bogus posts for months on SRAM groups, clearly its a recurring pattern. New seller from China selling at "good deal" or better prices. I've "bought" a couple of times, obviously no delivery and PayPal "used" my money for a few weeks, but I got a refund.

I see a lot of these posts "scams" and similar number of "grey market" and counterfeit items.

I also see folks posting items using key words to subevert the search.

Really screws things up for legit sellers, who are the majority.

Ray