Recovery drink query

[rousseau]

For these best five months of the year we're currently in I'm riding every day if I can, otherwise 5 or 6 days a week. Some days hard, some days not. I'm not too systematic about it, but I do intervals sometimes, and hard efforts sometimes, and on days when I wake up "feeling it" I take it easy.

This has served me well. I'm 51. And after a lifetime of eating crap food like a teenager, this January I gave up all junk food and extraneous liquids, and concentrated on having good home-cooked meals. It's amazing what whole, healthy food will do for your day-to-day sense of well-being! I don't miss Doritos or Wendy's at all. I've lost two notches on the belt.

I think I'm lucky, actually. Because I had no cravings when I quit smoking ten years ago, and I have no cravings for junk food now. It's a new stage of life for me, and I just feel a sense of detached curiosity at how I used to eat.

But I do enjoy the reward of a recovery drink after riding. Here's what I've currently been doing:

http://i.imgur.com/9r1b9aM.jpg

Thing is, I want to fine tune this. I'm thinking I'd like to try a smoothie like this:

http://i.imgur.com/F1500Et.jpg

This is pretty much a slam dunk, isn't it? Less sugar, bit more protein, closer to a 4:1 ratio of carbs to protein? I mean, is there any possible reason why I shouldn't go from the first option to the second one?

[mtechnica]

Ever thought of chocolate milk? 1 - 1.5 glass of chocolate milk actually breaks down pretty close to your current options and it doesn't take any time to prepare. Could save money as well.

[rousseau]

Ever thought of chocolate milk? 1 - 1.5 glass of chocolate milk actually breaks down pretty close to your current options and it doesn't take any time to prepare. Could save money as well.
I've done chocolate milk, but I've always been sensitive to dairy, and now in my old age I've found that I can't tolerate chocolate at all (acid reflux, probably low-level irritable bowel syndrome), so after a few days chocolate milk throws my guts out of whack.

So that's out. My understanding is that whey protein, while dairy, doesn't tend to be so bad for some people who are otherwise lactose intolerant. Plus it gets absorbed more quickly than milk.

[mtechnica]

Fair enough. Your second drink sounds really tasty though, the berries are a nice touch.

[weisan]

Costco Specials.

[MagicHour]

I make a similar recovery shake, no formal recipe but is basically this blended and adjusted to desired thickness:

Almond milk unsweetened (~1/2 cup)
1 Scoop vanilla whey (I use Tera's pretty low sugar)
Yogurt plain (~1/2 cup)
Frozen pineapple chunks
1 Banana

Delicious and tastes like a Pina colada.

If I do a really hard session or long ride, I add 2500mg of L-glutamine powder. No exact science behind this but same amount is in a serving of a commercial brand recovery mix that seems to work for me, so I add it too.

[ptourkin]

Unless there is a reason that you can't, registered dieticians will tell you that you (and your wallet) are better off just eating food. There's nothing in there that food cannot provide and it will have the additional benefit of satiating you. After shakes and smoothies you are usually hungry right after. If you really want to do protein mix, whey or other dairy products are no longer in the mix for high level endurance athletes. There are plenty of inexpensive plant-based powders that you can get anywhere.

[rousseau]

Unless there is a reason that you can't, registered dieticians will tell you that you (and your wallet) are better off just eating food. There's nothing in there that food cannot provide and it will have the additional benefit of satiating you. After shakes and smoothies you are usually hungry right after.
In my second option bananas and berries are food. Though whey powder and almond milk are both highly processed. Do they still count as food?

I personally haven't experienced hunger after my recovery drink, though.

If you really want to do protein mix, whey or other dairy products are no longer in the mix for high level endurance athletes.
I wouldn't call myself a "high level endurance athlete," though I'm not tootling along an MUP on a hybrid, either. But I really do find that I feel better the next day if I have a recovery drink.

So you're saying that cyclists are not recommended to have whey protein for recovery? Got any links for further reading on this?

[ptourkin]

In my second option bananas and berries are food. Though whey powder and almond milk are both highly processed. Do they still count as food?

I personally haven't experienced hunger after my recovery drink, though.


I wouldn't call myself a "high level endurance athlete," though I'm not tootling along an MUP on a hybrid, either. But I really do find that I feel better the next day if I have a recovery drink.

So you're saying that cyclists are not recommended to have whey protein for recovery? Got any links for further reading on this?

I find and the literature confirms that shakes and smoothies are not as satiating as food you chew. YMMV

Whey is a dairy product and many endurance athletes believe it produces phlegm. While this may or may not be true, they avoid it during intense training. The chocolate milk as a recovery drink trope was started by the dairy industry to boost flagging sales. It has way more fat and sugar than a professional would recommend. If you read the actual study that the industry paid for to support these commercials, you'll see that a fluid recovery drink that was basically Gatorade was actually more effective. What the study said was that chocolate milk was almost as good as drinking fluid with electrolytes.

[rousseau]

Going out on a ride now, so no further replies from me for a while. Not meaning to be contentious or argumentative at all, as my knowledge about these things is extremely basic, but isn't the recovery drink supposed to give you some carbs and protein, optimally in a 4:1 ratio, in order to replenish glycogen?

I'd always thought that Gatorade was essentially for electrolyte recovery while on a ride, not after?

[OtayBW]

Going out on a ride now, so no further replies from me for a while. Not meaning to be contentious or argumentative at all, as my knowledge about these things is extremely basic, but isn't the recovery drink supposed to give you some carbs and protein, optimally in a 4:1 ratio, in order to replenish glycogen?
Yes. That, and food. :rolleyes:

[peanutgallery]

Every 1.5 hours on the MTB => 1 beer, but 2 hours => 2 beers

For 4 hours => 3 beers and I eat whatever I want

[joosttx]

Liter of beer. Now that I am living the beta-lifestyle.

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4309/36143326581_8d1f24d32b_b.jpg

[nmrt]

you're still hung up on that beta crap? :D
heck, if it makes someone feel better, i'm a delta. which is below theta, which is itself below beta. and we all know that beta is below the king -- alpha.
:beer:

btw, my post ride food is a good meal.

Liter of beer. Now that I am living the beta-lifestyle.

https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4309/36143326581_8d1f24d32b_b.jpg

[joosttx]

you're still hung up on that beta crap? :D
heck, if it makes someone feel better, i'm a delta. which is below theta, which is itself below beta. and we all know that beta is below the king -- alpha.
:beer:

btw, my post ride food is a good meal.

No. I am living my dream. In that thread someone said don't start day drinking. It was a poke at that.

[nonprophet]

I don't claim to be any sort of expert in cycling nutrition but if you're looking for a non dairy alternative to chocolate milk with a decent amount of protein, check out Ripple, it's a pea protein based milk, available in chocolate vanilla and 'original' flavors (but you can only get the chocolate at Target for some reason). It's the creamiest vegan chocolate milk I've tried and pea protein is good for people with food sensitivities as very few people have any sort of reaction to it (as opposed to soy, or dairy).

[peanutgallery]

Ripple, like on Sanford and Son:)

http://www.ghettowine.com/pics/ripple/red2.jpg

I don't claim to be any sort of expert in cycling nutrition but if you're looking for a non dairy alternative to chocolate milk with a decent amount of protein, check out Ripple, it's a pea protein based milk, available in chocolate vanilla and 'original' flavors (but you can only get the chocolate at Target for some reason). It's the creamiest vegan chocolate milk I've tried and pea protein is good for people with food sensitivities as very few people have any sort of reaction to it (as opposed to soy, or dairy).

[rousseau]

Well, it's early days, but I had my new concoction last night after a ride and I'm rather pleased with it so far. I'm thinking that the higher protein and lower sugar counts are going to be good for me. We'll see.

Just out of curiosity, would anyone have any suggestions for tweaks to this? Does it look out of whack in any way?

http://i.imgur.com/F1500Et.jpg

[rousseau]

I find and the literature confirms that shakes and smoothies are not as satiating as food you chew. YMMV

Whey is a dairy product and many endurance athletes believe it produces phlegm. While this may or may not be true, they avoid it during intense training. The chocolate milk as a recovery drink trope was started by the dairy industry to boost flagging sales. It has way more fat and sugar than a professional would recommend. If you read the actual study that the industry paid for to support these commercials, you'll see that a fluid recovery drink that was basically Gatorade was actually more effective. What the study said was that chocolate milk was almost as good as drinking fluid with electrolytes.
Revisiting this: I think I now see what you mean about the phlegm part. I experienced some of that after using the whey protein for a couple days. So that's now out.

I'm also struggling to get my acid reflux under control, and I think the frozen berries probably made that worse. Not to mention the banana, which apparently has a very high "fermentation potential" (I'm trying to eliminate foods like that, at least for a couple of weeks, and the initial results seem promising, knock on wood).

I'm now wracking my brains trying to figure out something to have after a hard effort on the bike that doesn't include any dairy or fruit. Pretty much the only thing I can handle out of the four things in my recovery drink above is the almond milk.

Any ideas?

[mvnsnd]

Well, it's early days, but I had my new concoction last night after a ride and I'm rather pleased with it so far. I'm thinking that the higher protein and lower sugar counts are going to be good for me. We'll see.

Just out of curiosity, would anyone have any suggestions for tweaks to this? Does it look out of whack in any way?

http://i.imgur.com/F1500Et.jpg

You should try a few less carbs in your mix. Try for only 3 times the grams of protein. Then add in a couple grams of l-glutamine. It may take a few days of using to see the benefits.

[Fatty]

Revisiting this: I think I now see what you mean about the phlegm part. I experienced some of that after using the whey protein for a couple days. So that's now out.

I'm also struggling to get my acid reflux under control, and I think the frozen berries probably made that worse. Not to mention the banana, which apparently has a very high "fermentation potential" (I'm trying to eliminate foods like that, at least for a couple of weeks, and the initial results seem promising, knock on wood).

I'm now wracking my brains trying to figure out something to have after a hard effort on the bike that doesn't include any dairy or fruit. Pretty much the only thing I can handle out of the four things in my recovery drink above is the almond milk.

Any ideas?

A giant steak burrito? You could always ship the cheese but hey life is short, I say pile it on.

[rousseau]

A giant steak burrito? You could always ship the cheese but hey life is short, I say pile it on.
I love burritos, they're totally verboten for me at the moment. What seems to be giving me some hope with the acid reflux/gas is a dietary restriction on gluten and beans (among many other things).

I'm starting to look into a recovery drink made up of a vegan protein and a carbohydrate powder without sugar. It would be 200 calories with 11 g protein and 35 g carbohydrates. Seems like it would hit the spot, plus it wouldn't be so detrimental to my current state of gastrointestinal distress.

[jumphigher]

For these best five months of the year we're currently in I'm riding every day if I can, otherwise 5 or 6 days a week. Some days hard, some days not. I'm not too systematic about it, but I do intervals sometimes, and hard efforts sometimes, and on days when I wake up "feeling it" I take it easy.

This has served me well. I'm 51. And after a lifetime of eating crap food like a teenager, this January I gave up all junk food and extraneous liquids, and concentrated on having good home-cooked meals. It's amazing what whole, healthy food will do for your day-to-day sense of well-being! I don't miss Doritos or Wendy's at all. I've lost two notches on the belt.

I think I'm lucky, actually. Because I had no cravings when I quit smoking ten years ago, and I have no cravings for junk food now. It's a new stage of life for me, and I just feel a sense of detached curiosity at how I used to eat.

But I do enjoy the reward of a recovery drink after riding. Here's what I've currently been doing:

http://i.imgur.com/9r1b9aM.jpg

Thing is, I want to fine tune this. I'm thinking I'd like to try a smoothie like this:

http://i.imgur.com/F1500Et.jpg

This is pretty much a slam dunk, isn't it? Less sugar, bit more protein, closer to a 4:1 ratio of carbs to protein? I mean, is there any possible reason why I shouldn't go from the first option to the second one?

Your shakes sound fine to me, OP. In fact I make a similar one for my wife and I every morning when we get up - which is our breakfast I suppose. I basically fill each of our bullet-type blender cups with: half a banana, a tbsp PB, quarter to half cup uncooked oats, some type of fresh or frozen berries - whatever I have on hand, also some cinnamon, some splenda or saccharin or stevia, ice, and water. I vary it up sometimes with pineapple, or add some kale, or a scoop of whey protein, or whatever.

I like shakes a lot in general, because you can combine a lot of good-for-you ingredients into a compact, easy to drink, low calorie meal. I use these same shakes after long rides too sometimes - usually 40 miles or more.

Your new lifestyle sounds like a great change. Just make sure you watch your diet - which you seem to be doing - and you'll make great, positive changes in your life. I do all our cooking for my wife and I, and I'm careful about caloric intake, and of course what we eat. We're mostly vegetarian, and I make sure we eat a lot of salads and veggies, fish a couple times a week too, and I limit our simple carb intake - desserts, that type of thing.

I'm in my mid 50's and am still carded when I buy alcohol, and am routinely told by people I meet that I look like I'm in my 30's. My wife who's in her mid 40's gets the same type of comments. We also get stellar physicals every year, and are not on any prescription medications. This wouldnt be the case if we ate the normal crap diet many Americans eat. Diet is just SO important.

Hope this wasnt more info than you wanted, lol. But yeah, keep up what your doing, and good luck! :)

[Ralph]

Don't see how ingredients taken from real food are better than the food itself. So I just eat a meal after a hard ride.

[asimons]

I drink a powdered recovery drink from Skratch. It takes 30 seconds to make so I can get some calories as soon as I finish a ride.

Andrew

[93KgBike]

Your recovery shake could have more protein, try quinoa seed, wheat germ or hemp seed. And if you can schedule a 20 minute nap immediately after your ride you'll get additional benefits. I would avoid factory produced nutritive powders and pablums, other than yogurt.

[Ralph]

Dr Mirkin says about any thing will do. Coke and salty pea nuts fine toward end of ride....just no coke after heart rate down. You ride on sugar. And probably need to replace some salt, with protein to build muscle fiber....wouldn't over think it. Some studies show a fast food meal as good for recovery as anything. May cause heart disease and other issues if used as a steady diet....but you asked about recovery.

[Ralph]

I tend to listen to Dr Mirkin....and here in Florida....every long hard ride is a sweat fest.

BTW....I applaud your lifestyle changes. Hope it leads to a longer healthier life.

Here he talks about recovery. https://www.drmirkin.com/fitness/recovery-the-key-to-improvement-in-your-sport.html

[rousseau]

Your recovery shake could have more protein, try quinoa seed, wheat germ or hemp seed.
My understanding is that a 3:1 or 4:1 protein-carb ratio is optimal. Are people saying something different now?

And if you can schedule a 20 minute nap immediately after your ride you'll get additional benefits.
This sounds intriguing. Can you define "immediately after"? What I tend to do is have my recovery drink and then relax at my computer for about half an hour, then take a shower (10 minutes). Would it be too late to do the nap afterward?

I would avoid factory produced nutritive powders and pablums, other than yogurt.
What negative aspects are associated with protein and carb powders?

[rousseau]

I tend to listen to Dr Mirkin....and here in Florida....every long hard ride is a sweat fest.

BTW....I applaud your lifestyle changes. Hope it leads to a longer healthier life.

Here he talks about recovery. https://www.drmirkin.com/fitness/recovery-the-key-to-improvement-in-your-sport.html

Thanks for the kind words. From your link:

"Fast foods such as French fries, hash browns and hamburgers helped athletes recover just as quickly from hard workouts as sports nutrition products such as Gatorade, PowerBars or Clif Bars (International Journal of Sport Nutrition and Exercise Metabolism, March 26, 2015)."

I'd love to grab a burger and fries after a hard ride, and indeed I've actually done that before, but right now I'm dealing with an acid reflux situation gone haywire (been on a PPI for a year, trying to wean myself off it, lots of fun), so I'm restricting all sorts of things in my diet for the time being.

Including everything in my first post in this thread save for almond milk. Sigh...

[stien]

So we are pretty big on the vegan thing, so if that's not for you then disregard.

One data point: We are young, strong and lean. I don't use protein powder for recovery. It's just fruits and veggies all day long. I usually do a higher carb meal or two a day depending on activity level. After a ride I'm reaching for strawberries and bananas. Maybe some lightly salted peanuts if I'm craving salt. I don't even bother mixing it up in a shake. On the bike I'm experimenting with drink mixes to get some electrolytes. I've been doing this for three years and have gotten quite lean without losing muscle mass.