What's an "All Road"?

[weisan]

Just read this in a cycling magazine, it goes like this...

"Not a gravel grinder. Not a cross bike. Not an adventure bike.
An All-Road bike is a high-performance road bike that you can ride damn near anywhere."

So I looked at the picture of the bike and tried to discern what makes it so special...

disc brakes - ok...checked
can take a fatter tire - ok...checked

That's it??!
Other than that, I don't see anything else that stands out.

Is that all it takes to make a bike that Captain America would ride on?
:D

Comments, thoughts?
:p

[jtakeda]

An allroad bike IMO is a fat tire road bike.

Basically road bike geometry but designed to handle larger tires to ride on any surface.

[soulspinner]

Its the bike Im riding in any and all conditions.

[Black Dog]

We used to call them road bikes. Then the marketing folks started getting creative.

[AngryScientist]

Just read this in a cycling magazine, it goes like this...

"Not a gravel grinder. Not a cross bike. Not an adventure bike.
..."



creative marketing failure!

what if you wanted to "grind gravel" or "adventure" on this bike ??

[.RJ]

creative marketing failure!

what if you wanted to "grind gravel" or "adventure" on this bike ??

Gonna need a different bike then, duh!

[oldpotatoe]

Just read this in a cycling magazine, it goes like this...

"Not a gravel grinder. Not a cross bike. Not an adventure bike.
An All-Road bike is a high-performance road bike that you can ride damn near anywhere."

So I looked at the picture of the bike and tried to discern what makes it so special...

disc brakes - ok...checked
can take a fatter tire - ok...checked

That's it??!
Other than that, I don't see anything else that stands out.

Is that all it takes to make a bike that Captain America would ride on?
:D

Comments, thoughts?
:p

Like a guy from shimano once said at interbike when I looked at some goofy part on a bike, 'what's that for?'..

'For selling', was the response.

Like WSB..'pink it and shrink it'....

[happycampyer]

We used to call them road bikes. Then the marketing folks started getting creative.
This is basically it. But it's not just marketing, it's what has happened to road bikes over the last 30 to 40 years. Steve and Andy Hampsten have offered their Strada Bianca model for over a decade, and from the beginning have said that it isn't anything really new, but rather reviving the features of racing bikes they rode when they were growing up. Take brakes as an example: most people think of and refer to short-reach brakes as "standard," and think of standard or mid-reach brakes as "long-reach." Very few people even know that there are long-reach brakes that are even longer than standard or mid-reach brakes.

So what has happened is the notion of a "road bike" has evolved to something that was designed for 23 - 25mm tires and short-reach brakes, and performs relatively poorly on anything but paved roads. And so when someone comes along and designs a bike for 32 - 35mm tires, like road racing bikes from the '60's and earlier, what to call it?

Personally, I prefer the term "all road" to "gravel grinder," which I think of as synonymous. I'm not sure what an "adventure" bike is, but for me, the name conjures up something with racks, dynamo lighting, etc., with the extreme example being an Iditabike type of bike.

[Shoeman]

Didn't the industry back in the day call these Sport Touring Bikes. Bikes you could race but yet use fenders, racks etc. I own a mid 70's Club Series Serotta that sorta fits this profile.

[MattTuck]

So what has happened is the notion of a "road bike" has evolved to something that was designed for 23 - 25mm tires and short-reach brakes, and performs relatively poorly on anything but smooth good condition paved roads.

If I may...

[Luwabra]

Adventure bike to me is like a drop bar 29'r. I hate the terms Groad and gravel grinder and 98% of my rides are gravel.

[rccardr]

It's this:
http://i797.photobucket.com/albums/yy254/rccardr/88%20Cannondale%20yellow%20ST%202015/88CannondaleST2015rightside_zps7591834e.jpg (http://s797.photobucket.com/user/rccardr/media/88%20Cannondale%20yellow%20ST%202015/88CannondaleST2015rightside_zps7591834e.jpg.html)

Or, in more extreme cases, this:
http://i797.photobucket.com/albums/yy254/rccardr/Voyageur%20650B%20project/650B%20Voyageur%20Project%20first%20build%20comple te/650b%20Voy%20right%20side_zpshu5jd1zp.jpg (http://s797.photobucket.com/user/rccardr/media/Voyageur%20650B%20project/650B%20Voyageur%20Project%20first%20build%20comple te/650b%20Voy%20right%20side_zpshu5jd1zp.jpg.html)

Big tire options, fender options, wheel size options, sturdy, reliable, reasonably fast, go-anywhere-with-a-drop-bar.

[adrien]

One of my bikes was shown at NAHBS before I saw it. In the write-ups, someone had listed it as a "lovely all road bike".

Never thought of it that way, but I do use it that way, and that's what I had asked for.

It's a steel frame, longish wheelbase, quick, stable, relatively compliant from end. Has room for 40s. It's fantastic on dirt.

[Elefantino]

I only ride on roads; therefore, my bikes are all road.

:D

[Dead Man]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/32/Audi_A4_allroad_quattro_Phantomschwarz.JPG/1024px-Audi_A4_allroad_quattro_Phantomschwarz.JPG

They're pretty dope... don't really see too many of them anymore, for some reason.

[marsh]

Didn't the industry back in the day call these Sport Touring Bikes. Bikes you could race but yet use fenders, racks etc. I own a mid 70's Club Series Serotta that sorta fits this profile.

Exactly. Whatever it's called, I like the move in this direction.

[Mr. Pink]

This was the marketing holy grail in skiing, oh, about ten years ago, but, didn't really work, although you'll still hear it a bit. The target audience is the low day count skier who really doesn't want to spend for two or three or more pair of skis for various conditions and then store/maintain them. Nope, much easier to convince oneself that one ski does all things well, which, can't happen. Oh, and then the rental infrastructure near most big ski hills grew and developed, so that a lot of skiers who only ski maybe ten days a year, (which I think is close to average) don't even have to own a pair. Too bad road/gravel bikes aren't as easy to rent.

[.RJ]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/32/Audi_A4_allroad_quattro_Phantomschwarz.JPG/1024px-Audi_A4_allroad_quattro_Phantomschwarz.JPG

They're pretty dope... don't really see too many of them anymore, for some reason.

Because america hates wagons

[Mr. Pink]

If I had a lot of money to waste, I'd buy the new AllRoad. It's an all wheel wagon with clearance, and a low roof that makes it easy to get bikes on and off, and skis into the box. But, I don't spend 50 grand on cars. Too bad.

[oldpotatoe]

If I had a lot of money to waste, I'd buy the new AllRoad. It's an all wheel wagon with clearance, and a low roof that makes it easy to get bikes on and off, and skis into the box. But, I don't spend 50 grand on cars. Too bad.

VW Golf AllTrack...very similar to Audi for a lot less $.

[R3awak3n]

VW Golf AllTrack...very similar to Audi for a lot less $.

was about to mention this. Just drove one a month ago. Manual too. Very nice. Ended up ordering a sportswagen instead though

[mbrtool]

Three years ago I bought this bike to ride on the bike trail in the winter. It has clearance for 54mm Nokians. Luckily Dave Wages supplied 32mm Vittoria Hyper Voyagers so I could ride when I took delivery. I still enjoy the Ottrott but I love riding the Ellis.

Ray

[FlashUNC]

Because america hates wagons

America hates horribly unreliable and expensive air suspensions.

[pncguy]

was about to mention this. Just drove one a month ago. Manual too. Very nice. Ended up ordering a sportswagen instead though

My vote would go to the Subaru Outback. But it isn't an AllRoad then.

[Black Dog]

This is basically it. But it's not just marketing, it's what has happened to road bikes over the last 30 to 40 years. Steve and Andy Hampsten have offered their Strada Bianca model for over a decade, and from the beginning have said that it isn't anything really new, but rather reviving the features of racing bikes they rode when they were growing up. Take brakes as an example: most people think of and refer to short-reach brakes as "standard," and think of standard or mid-reach brakes as "long-reach." Very few people even know that there are long-reach brakes that are even longer than standard or mid-reach brakes.

So what has happened is the notion of a "road bike" has evolved to something that was designed for 23 - 25mm tires and short-reach brakes, and performs relatively poorly on anything but paved roads. And so when someone comes along and designs a bike for 32 - 35mm tires, like road racing bikes from the '60's and earlier, what to call it?

Personally, I prefer the term "all road" to "gravel grinder," which I think of as synonymous. I'm not sure what an "adventure" bike is, but for me, the name conjures up something with racks, dynamo lighting, etc., with the extreme example being an Iditabike type of bike.

This is exactly what I did not have time to write. Well said!

[Mr. Pink]

VW Golf AllTrack...very similar to Audi for a lot less $.

Two issues: Is it reliable, and, I really have a hard time supporting that criminal company at the moment.

[54ny77]

Groovy, baby!

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/2c/92/bb/2c92bb867e361ff538e0fcc9cdc62300.jpg

And so when someone comes along and designs a bike for 32 - 35mm tires, like road racing bikes from the '60's and earlier, what to call it?

[Mr. Pink]

My vote would go to the Subaru Outback. But it isn't an AllRoad then.

I've driven Subaru since 93. Two Outbacks, two Foresters. I will not consider an Outback because of that stupid proprietary roof rack they still insist on putting on top of it, instead of two, solid rails for my Thule stuff to attach to. And, roof height. The Japanese have been raising the roofs and bloating their cars every year since, like, 2000. The Outback is almost the same height as the Forester, which is way too high these days. I'm 6ft, and maxed out on getting bikes and skis up there. The Audi/VW height is much lower.

[crankles]

Just read this in a cycling magazine, it goes like this...

"Not a gravel grinder. Not a cross bike. Not an adventure bike.
An All-Road bike is a high-performance road bike that you can ride damn near anywhere."

So I looked at the picture of the bike and tried to discern what makes it so special...

disc brakes - ok...checked
can take a fatter tire - ok...checked

That's it??!
Other than that, I don't see anything else that stands out.

Is that all it takes to make a bike that Captain America would ride on?
:D

Comments, thoughts?
:p

back in 2005-2006, before the drought, I was training a lot in wet weather. I decided I wanted a wet weather training bike. Something with road handling that could have full fenders and still take 25mm-27mm tires. That meant lengthening the stays just enough, but keeping the trail in the "reasonably nimble" realm. I came across Erik Rolfs Full-Fendered Alliance for sale across the hall and couldn't believe my luck. It was as if he had my geo sheet in hand. He called in an All-Road back then so I'm going with that.

[fbhidy]

Two issues: Is it reliable, and, I really have a hard time supporting that criminal company at the moment.
My experience with the buy back program for my TDI Sportwagen was piss poor until the actual day I returned it, that actually went smoothly. The fact it took more than 6 months to get there, was unacceptable to the point I deliberately chose not to purchase another Volkswagen/Audi to replace it and I likely won't for some time. Currently driving a Mazda CX-5 and looking forward to test driving the diesel version due out this fall.

As far as bikes go, the typical road bikes we see for sale are racing look alike bikes, not really suitable for much other than smooth paved roads.

There are a few exceptions from the big companies, but their responding to their loss of sales to all the little guys building very nice bikes you can ride on ANY road, paved or not.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

[oldpotatoe]

Two issues: Is it reliable, and, I really have a hard time supporting that criminal company at the moment.

You mean GM and their diesels? Or Subaru and their engines or GM again and ignition switches or Ford and the exploding Pinto or Firestone and their shredding tires or... :eek::o

[rccardr]

Hey now, let's not forget Chrysler Fiat...

[Dead Man]

Und yota's unfortunate sticky accelerator

You cash- or credit-flush guys and your off-the-lot cars...

I've got a Passat GLX wagon 4Motion that's a hell of a lot of fun to drive in manual mode, handles snow and mud great. if not as much ground clearance as the Allroad, and obviously no adjustable suspension... but I paid next to nothing for it (compared to the Audi varieties) and its NICE - GLX trimline is full leather, nice sound system, wood and chrome splashes all over, heated seats, hyper adjustability,

Criminal or not, I think VW is highly underrated

It's currently sitting in front of my bro's house with a blowed up motor..... cuz it's a little too fun to drive maybe (or I'm just the type that does stuff like that) but it'll be badass again as soon as I plus a new'un in there.

[toytech]

The Toyota sticking unintended acceleration never actually happened though. I worked for Toyota and Lexus as a tech. Miss application of pedals and too many floor mats.

[menschita]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/32/Audi_A4_allroad_quattro_Phantomschwarz.JPG/1024px-Audi_A4_allroad_quattro_Phantomschwarz.JPG



They're pretty dope... don't really see too many of them anymore, for some reason.



I had one of those. It was a fantastic car in snow and off road, plus it drove like a sports car on pavement. Loved it. Less than stellar gas mileage, my only complaint. It also lifted 4" off the base - like old Citroens- and I could drive out of a snow drift after a day of powder skiing. Awesome.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Mr. Pink]

You mean GM and their diesels? Or Subaru and their engines or GM again and ignition switches or Ford and the exploding Pinto or Firestone and their shredding tires or... :eek::o

None approach the level of criminal conspiracy from the top executives that this VW thing does, although the GM switch thing maybe compares. Maybe. And none did such damage to everyone's environment, not just that brand's customers.

[roguedog]

I dig this bike. Looks so versatile. And dang, I love the fork. Wow. Look at that clearance!

Three years ago I bought this bike to ride on the bike trail in the winter. It has clearance for 54mm Nokians. Luckily Dave Wages supplied 32mm Vittoria Hyper Voyagers so I could ride when I took delivery. I still enjoy the Ottrott but I love riding the Ellis.

Ray

[93KgBike]

This was raced on cow paths in the 19th century.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d5/SIL-029-017-10b.jpg

[bikingshearer]

So what has happened is the notion of a "road bike" has evolved to something that was designed for 23 - 25mm tires and short-reach brakes, and performs relatively poorly on anything but paved roads. And so when someone comes along and designs a bike for 32 - 35mm tires, like road racing bikes from the '60's and earlier, what to call it?


Rivendell.

Grant Petersen has been singing this song for 30 years, give or take. Apparently, folks are starting to harmonize with him.

[93KgBike]

My 1968 Peugeot PX10 will run 32/35 F/R.

[happycampyer]

Rivendell.

Grant Petersen has been singing this song for 30 years, give or take. Apparently, folks are starting to harmonize with him.When I posted what I posted above, I thought about including a reference to Grant Peterson. The reason I focused on the Hampstens and the Strada Bianca is that the Strada Bianca harkened back to earlier racing bicycles (and I added that adjective in deliberately). Grant eschews the whole racing culture. But I agree he was way ahead of the curve with the notion of an "all road" bicycle (which Grant would just call a "bicycle"), and arguably without Rivendell quality tires would not have existed to put on a Strada Bianca when the model was introduced (the Jack Brown was the tire in the 32-33mm range for a long time).

[ColonelJLloyd]

Rivendell.

Grant Petersen has been singing this song for 30 years, give or take. Apparently, folks are starting to harmonize with him.

Unless you care about the particulars. Don't Rivendells all have high BBs and long chainstays?

and arguably without Rivendell quality tires would not have existed to put on a Strada Bianca when the model was introduced (the Jack Brown was the tire in the 32-33mm range for a long time).

I would argue that the Ruffy Tuffy and Jack Brown tires are only slightly better than Gatorskins. Aka, they won't flat on you but supple and lightweight they are not. I was not a fan of either tire in either colored label. But, your point that there weren't many tires better at the time is valid, yes. But, times have changed.

[weisan]

Rivendell.

Grant Petersen has been singing this song for 30 years, give or take. Apparently, folks are starting to harmonize with him.

Took my "all road" bike out this morning...Rivendell Standard Road, 32 Compass

[bikingshearer]

Unless you care about the particulars. Don't Rivendells all have high BBs and long chainstays?

Comparatively long chainstays, yes. High BBs, no. I just double-checked the Riv geometry chart. In the sizes I would be on (62cm+), a few have 75mm or 77mm drops, most have 80mm drops. Those are not "high bottom bracket" numbers.

The BB drop numbers are smaller for smaller frames, and I have no clue how they compare to other smaller-sized frames out there; I am a big boy and thus have never really paid very close attention to smaller frame dimensions.

One of GP's mantras has always been for lower BBs for better handling and road manners, along with longer chainstays for more comfort and control. Before the Rivendell badged frames became full-custom, they came as a Road Standard or a Long & Low. The Long & Low had - wait for it - a longer wheelbase (including longer chainstays) and a lower bottom bracket compared to the Road Standard.

[ColonelJLloyd]

Good to know on the BB height. Though, I don't see myself ever buying a modern frame with a quill stem.