Shimano Hydraulic Brakes

[R3awak3n]

I currently have Spyres on my elephant NFE. I am a campy guy and so I installed some athena with spyres. Athena performs admirably, powershift actually has not bothered me much. They look great (silver levers and black RD).

The Spyres however, are just not up to snuff. Sure they brake fine (on par with BB7, maybe a bit worst actually but they are worth it over BB7 since they are actually easy to setup, I will give them that). But to me they brake just a little bit better than my EE brakes (and by better I mean they have more bite but I actually prefer the EE brakes which are fantastic), but you have the disc weight penalty. If I am going to run discs I want to at least have a reason for it.

I told myself, lets wait till campy releases their disc brakes... lets be honest here, they should be out already, its time campagnolo... people are waiting ready to buy and you are doing God knows what.

So now I am thinking, maybe I just got shimano on this bike and get some shimano hydraulic brakes and a mid cage ultegra RD. I am looking at the Shimano RS685.

Please convince me that these will change my life and I need them and that it is worth the upgrade from what I currently have. If I go this way I would sell my athena which would probably cover a 3rd or so of the new brakes/calipers and RD. My front derailleur is already a shimano CX70 and I am on a 105 11 speed cassette so that should work just fine.

Also post some pictures of your bikes with them. I normally don't care of the look of shimano but these looks pretty good to me (and much better than srams version with the 3 feet hoods)

[dogrange]

I currently have Spyres on my elephant NFE. I am a campy guy and so I installed some athena with spyres. Athena performs admirably, powershift actually has not bothered me much. They look great (silver levers and black RD).



The Spyres however, are just not up to snuff. Sure they brake fine (on par with BB7, maybe a bit worst actually but they are worth it over BB7 since they are actually easy to setup, I will give them that). But to me they brake just a little bit better than my EE brakes (and by better I mean they have more bite but I actually prefer the EE brakes which are fantastic), but you have the disc weight penalty. If I am going to run discs I want to at least have a reason for it.



I told myself, lets wait till campy releases their disc brakes... lets be honest here, they should be out already, its time campagnolo... people are waiting ready to buy and you are doing God knows what.



So now I am thinking, maybe I just got shimano on this bike and get some shimano hydraulic brakes and a mid cage ultegra RD. I am looking at the Shimano RS685.



Please convince me that these will change my life and I need them and that it is worth the upgrade from what I currently have. If I go this way I would sell my athena which would probably cover a 3rd or so of the new brakes/calipers and RD. My front derailleur is already a shimano CX70 and I am on a 105 11 speed cassette so that should work just fine.



Also post some pictures of your bikes with them. I normally don't care of the look of shimano but these looks pretty good to me (and much better than srams version with the 3 feet hoods)



I have SR on my road bike and the 685 stuff on my rando. Make sure to check the levers out in person before buying - they are huge and much less pleasant to hold than the Campy shape. The brakes are fine, but only really shine in gnarly braking like steep downhills. For flat riding they are pretty numb. I would suggest trying a 180 rotor on the Front Spyre first. Random reports seem to say that helps them with power and modulation. Report back, pls! If this worked, I would consider going to the mechanical setup to replace the 685 levers on my bike.


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[R3awak3n]

I have SR on my road bike and the 685 stuff on my rando. Make sure to check the levers out in person before buying - they are huge and much less pleasant to hold than the Campy shape. The brakes are fine, but only really shine in gnarly braking like steep downhills. For flat riding they are pretty numb. I would suggest trying a 180 rotor on the Front Spyre first. Random reports seem to say that helps them with power and modulation. Report back, pls! If this worked, I would consider going to the mechanical setup to replace the 685 levers on my bike.


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Maybe 180mm would help and I may try it but to be honest I also feel the levers are very mushy and with campy apparently even worst (you have to really keep the pads close to caliper or your brake lever almost touches the handlebar).

I definitely need to check out the levers but I am sure I will have problems with them since I really like the campy shape. Now to find someone with the levers. They don't look crazy big in some pictures and why I felt they might be ok but I take it from your experience that this is not the case.

Also thought about hy/rd but they are expensive, work meh with campy and if I am going to commit might as well go full hydraulic.

oh another reason I want to do it is because of self adjusting. With the spyres you have to constantly adjust them because otherwise the pads run down and your lever definitely hits the handlebar.

[bikerboy337]

I'm curious to see where this discussion goes as well. I'm a full on Campy guy, built my Warbird with record and spyres. Back on a mountain bike now with hydro and they are so so much nicer than the mechanical discs... been thinking the same, possibly letting the campy go on this bike and switching over or shimano..... don't want to but on some of the long downhill gravel roads, the spyres are lacking....


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[.RJ]

Have you tried compressionless brake housing on those Spyres?

[R3awak3n]

Have you tried compressionless brake housing on those Spyres?

yes, been running compression less on them from the beginning. Also had compression less on BB7 and they worked about the same.

Don't get me wrong, they are fine but just not exceptional which is the point of disc brakes. If you are going to add 3 lbs to your bike you might as well have amazing braking imho

[.RJ]

Don't get me wrong, they are fine but just not exceptional which is the point of disc brakes.

I have Spyres on my new-to-me Crux carbon, and I agree for the most part - they are good but nothing amazing or game changing in stopping power, but I do like them for the braking in the wet & dusty gravel riding, plus they are super consistent every time. I'm happy with the performance of them for now.

[R3awak3n]

I have Spyres on my new-to-me Crux carbon, and I agree for the most part - they are good but nothing amazing or game changing in stopping power, but I do like them for the braking in the wet & dusty gravel riding, plus they are super consistent every time. I'm happy with the performance of them for now.

totally, they are very consistent and you now what to expect everytime and in the wet they are much superior to rim brakes and even in the dry, they perform better for the most part.

I am ok with them, don't get me wrong but I just have an itch to try hydro

[Duende]

Definitely NOT thrilled with my Spyres either. :(

People say the Hy/RD are better, and I was going to switch over this last weekend. But instead, I spent some more time tweaking the Spyres.

My .02... Keep messing with the Spyres... And hold out for Campy Hydros.. It's gonna happen soon enough, and this will all just be a bad memory.

[R3awak3n]

Definitely NOT thrilled with my Spyres either. :(

People say the Hy/RD are better, and I was going to switch over this last weekend. But instead, I spent some more time tweaking the Spyres.

My .02... Keep messing with the Spyres... And hold out for Campy Hydros.. It's gonna happen soon enough, and this will all just be a bad memory.

the thing too is, knowing campy, the release the damn hydros and they are an exorbitant amount of money since they will probably release a super record version to start.

[bmeryman]

It's not hydro, but I like the Hayes CX Pro mechanical calipers quite a bit. They set up well and they look good. I ran them on one of my mountain bikes for the season and found that they had adequate braking power (not quite hydro).

Wasn't there some teaser regarding the Campy hydraulic group recently? It can't be all that far off if you're willing to wait.

[R3awak3n]

It's not hydro, but I like the Hayes CX Pro mechanical calipers quite a bit. They set up well and they look good. I ran them on one of my mountain bikes for the season and found that they had adequate braking power (not quite hydro).

Wasn't there some teaser regarding the Campy hydraulic group recently? It can't be all that far off if you're willing to wait.

they were announced but no release date yet.

[CiclistiCliff]

Get some metallic swiss stop pads and centerline rotors. Switch housingto compressionless Odyssey Linear Slick K and you'll love em. Stock pads and rotors are not worth using.

[.RJ]

Definitely NOT thrilled with my Spyres either. :(

People say the Hy/RD are better, and I was going to switch over this last weekend. But instead, I spent some more time tweaking the Spyres.


http://redkiteprayer.com/2016/12/just-one-finger/

[R3awak3n]

Get some metallic swiss stop pads and centerline rotors. Switch housingto compressionless Odyssey Linear Slick K and you'll love em. Stock pads and rotors are not worth using.

already using compressionless and not running stock pads. Also using icetech rotors which are suppose to be the best. :(

[adub]

Night and day difference. Do it!

[Sparshall]

I've got Spyres on my Coffee Grinder running SRAM X1. I've been on SRAM for 5-6 years and definitely prefer it. However, I picked up a Cannondale Synapse disc Ultegra with Shimano Hydro recently. I was perfectly happy with the Spyres until my first ride on the Synapse. Hydro is just better.

I always preferred the grip on SRAM as well, but have been very comfortable with the Ultegra. (Note: I also had the first SRAM Hydro that was recalled and thought it was good.)

http://i63.tinypic.com/2lkbbjk.jpg

http://i65.tinypic.com/2hqvtdc.jpg

[R3awak3n]

I've got Spyres on my Coffee Grinder running SRAM X1. I've been on SRAM for 5-6 years and definitely prefer it. However, I picked up a Cannondale Synapse disc Ultegra with Shimano Hydro recently. I was perfectly happy with the Spyres until my first ride on the Synapse. Hydro is just better.

I always preferred the grip on SRAM as well, but have been very comfortable with the Ultegra. (Note: I also had the first SRAM Hydro that was recalled and thought it was good.)

http://i63.tinypic.com/2lkbbjk.jpg

http://i65.tinypic.com/2hqvtdc.jpg

dang both those bikes are great. Good to hear the shifters are ok, I know sram shifters are smaller, closer to campy.

[dogrange]

dang both those bikes are great. Good to hear the shifters are ok, I know sram shifters are smaller, closer to campy.



I have the SRAM hydro on another bike. Don't fool yourself, they are only a smidge smaller in the hand than the shimanos, nowhere near Campy ergonomics. I like the sram a little better, the brakes have a little more feel and the 685 levers have a lot if slop in the shifting compared to the DA9000 levers on my other bike, the double tap is better than the sloppy 685. I am hoping that the new 9100 series levers take care of the slop and are smaller, but we'll see.


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[R3awak3n]

I have the SRAM hydro on another bike. Don't fool yourself, they are only a smidge smaller in the hand than the shimanos, nowhere near Campy ergonomics. I like the sram a little better, the brakes have a little more feel and the 685 levers have a lot if slop in the shifting compared to the DA9000 levers on my other bike, the double tap is better than the sloppy 685. I am hoping that the new 9100 series levers take care of the slop and are smaller, but we'll see.


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the DA 9100 hydro levers look great. Maybe more than I want to spend though. I would also have to buy the levers and calipers separately because it seems that the only caliper that comes with the 9100 is flat mount and I need post mount

[Kirk007]

I'm a campy guy (but arthritis in my right thumb might force a change, damn). I put Shimano Hydro on a Niner Rlt. Good brakes. Strongly dislike the hoods/shifters; they increased my reach a good centimeter maybe more over the Sram Force 10 speed shifters (which I thought were ok, not as good ergonomically as Campy but acceptable). Anyway I'm sure I could learn to live with the Shimano but I'm selling that bike and will be watching to see what Campy does and to check out the Sram etap hydro when that comes out.

My bottom line: try to find some before you buy, and if you buy be prepared to adjust your reach - stem or bars.

[R3awak3n]

I'm a campy guy (but arthritis in my right thumb might force a change, damn). I put Shimano Hydro on a Niner Rlt. Good brakes. Strongly dislike the hoods/shifters; they increased my reach a good centimeter maybe more over the Sram Force 10 speed shifters (which I thought were ok, not as good ergonomically as Campy but acceptable). Anyway I'm sure I could learn to live with the Shimano but I'm selling that bike and will be watching to see what Campy does and to check out the Sram etap hydro when that comes out.

My bottom line: try to find some before you buy, and if you buy be prepared to adjust your reach - stem or bars.

That is a good point, they do look rather long compared to campy, campy has got to have the shortest reach from the big 3. I am on a 110mm stem so I could go down to a 100 but this is the bike I am least stretched out on so I could probably be fine with a little more reach

[coylifut]

I'm currently on my second winter using Hy/RD with Campy shifters on the rain bike. Although they work excellent, there's not much wear movement in the calipers which means you either have to add fluid, or change pads before they are worn out. After a few months of wet weather riding, they need a 1/2 hour of attention. I can get a set of Spyers to work just as well. The HY/RDs are not worth the extra cost and complexity in my opinion.

All hydro brakes eventually need attention. Especially if they are ridden very hard in the heat. learning how to get a good bleed is an essential skill for a hydro disk brake owner. if you are not committed to mastering this skill, I'd stick with the Spyers, if you already have this knowledge, I'd move to the Shimano product.

I have 3 Shimano disk brake bikes and find them to be the least problematic, but they do indeed require servicing.

[oldpotatoe]

I currently have Spyres on my elephant NFE. I am a campy guy and so I installed some athena with spyres. Athena performs admirably, powershift actually has not bothered me much. They look great (silver levers and black RD).

The Spyres however, are just not up to snuff. Sure they brake fine (on par with BB7, maybe a bit worst actually but they are worth it over BB7 since they are actually easy to setup, I will give them that). But to me they brake just a little bit better than my EE brakes (and by better I mean they have more bite but I actually prefer the EE brakes which are fantastic), but you have the disc weight penalty. If I am going to run discs I want to at least have a reason for it.

I told myself, lets wait till campy releases their disc brakes... lets be honest here, they should be out already, its time campagnolo... people are waiting ready to buy and you are doing God knows what.

So now I am thinking, maybe I just got shimano on this bike and get some shimano hydraulic brakes and a mid cage ultegra RD. I am looking at the Shimano RS685.

Please convince me that these will change my life and I need them and that it is worth the upgrade from what I currently have. If I go this way I would sell my athena which would probably cover a 3rd or so of the new brakes/calipers and RD. My front derailleur is already a shimano CX70 and I am on a 105 11 speed cassette so that should work just fine.

Also post some pictures of your bikes with them. I normally don't care of the look of shimano but these looks pretty good to me (and much better than srams version with the 3 feet hoods)

Go ride a shimano/hydro disc bike. The levers are bulbous(IMHO-the BIG reason for Campag is the ergo-nomics of the levers are superior, IMHO). Depending on where/what you ride, the power and modulation of wet discs may or may not 'wow' you. Around here, even on descents, they are more powerful and better modulation but JRA..how much do you really use yer brakes, and need the 'advantage' of wet discs?

[guido]

The Elephant NFE is a disc bike. So the question is simply which one is best...

[PaMtbRider]

I am really hoping that the new 9100 series of wet discs from Shimano is a big improvement over current offerings. My wife's Kirk has 6870 Di2 wet discs, and while she loves their performance the do have some drawbacks. They are ugly, heavy, not very ergonomic compared to non-disk hoods, and the biggest negative, too much lever free stroke.

I saw a thread on weight weenies that the release of the Shimano 9120 and 9170 have been delayed until June. Don't know if it's true but wouldn't be surprised.

Sram supposedly has good lever feel and ergonomics. I had a Sram equipped bike and didn't care for the shift action, so that's out for me.

I love the idea of Campy wet discs, but wonder what the cost will be.

Hopefully by summer the new groups will be out with some positive reviews. Until then I'm going to keep saving my money.

[ColonelJLloyd]

I'm guessing your issue is in large part one with your levers. It's well documented that Campy's lever throw isn't as good as SRAM (or Shimano, I guess) regarding cable actuated discs.

My experience with Spyres was great, but it was my first experience with disc brakes period. I used stock pads and rotors (180/140) with Rival 22 levers and Jagwire Elite Link housing.

That said, the Campy lever is the part you're happiest with. Perhaps you could swap your calipers for HY/RD or Yokozuna Motoku and see what that gets you. If it's not much better you won't be out all that much after selling your Spyres and you can continue to wait for Campy's hydraulic offering, but one that will already be years behind Shimano and SRAM.

I have pretty large hands and prefer the shape of SRAM mechanical to Ergos, which I find small and I don't like the thumb button. I really like DoubleTap. FWIW, I'm a rider not a racer.

[coylifut]

I've been able to get both Spyer and HD/RD adjusted with very short lever throw using Campy.

I don't run disks for their stopping power, more so as to not go through a set of rims every other winter from grinding the sidewalls down.

[alembical]

I love my 685s but not a lot to compare them too. I had old Mechanical Hayes and various mtb disc brakes, but nothing else on road. I like them, but I was already using Ultegra. I will say that the hoods are long and I did have to run a shorter stem and I don't really love the distance between the tops and hoods, but I am managing okay and have not even considered moving away from these.

[Duende]

Shimano levers definitely add reach to those fitted for campy levers. That and feel are my primary reasons for preferring campy.

In regards to the mechanical operation of the spyres. After some serious effort tweaking them to work better, I still have to say the spyres deliver only 70-80% of the stopping power of my record caliper brakes. Just my .02

[brockd15]

And I thought it was just me. I'm glad I'm not the only one with Spyres that have mushy levers and nothing-special performance. I have the pads just far enough from the rotors to avoid rub and the lever pull is surprisingly long, almost all the way to the bar. And the performance feels no better (maybe worse) than rim brake calipers.

Because of that I've also been considering an upgrade to r685, but I'd have to move up to 11 speed and get a new wheel. I've ridden one mountain bike with hydraulic discs and it was super nice...really "crisp." If I could get that braking on my road bike then I think the upgrade would be worthwhile. otherwise, I'm not so sure.

[rkhatibi]

I built a new bike last month with Ultegra Shimano hydraulic. Massively better than the HY/RD with yokozuna compression-less. I may spend some time trying to tune the HY/RD set in based on some of the responses here to see if they'll get better, but the Shimano were just fantastic out of the box. Same rotors and stock pads in each case.

[R3awak3n]

I have decided to give the spyres another try. Going to order some swiss stop pads for the front, reset them up and try them again.

A very nice member also messaged me and told me he has some hayes brakes he would lend to me to try so I might take him on the offer, what do I have to loose. I do love how easy to set up the spyres were but the BB7 had less mushy lever feel (I presume this is all because of campy, just what colonelloyd was saying)

[merlinmurph]

FWIW, I got a new Seven Evergreen last spring built up with Ultegra hydro discs. I didn't get discs because I needed more brake, but simply so I could fit fat tires on it. So, why not go hydro? The Shimanos are excellent. Apparently, some people don't like the levers/hoods, so find a demo bike somewhere to see what you think. I have no problem with them.

Good luck,
Murph

[mbrtool]

I've had Shimano hydraulic discs with DI2 since July 2014; about 12K miles. So far I've charged the battery twice and the LBS replaced the brake pads once a couple of months ago. The rims are still pristine. They might last 100K miles!
I live in Chicago and this bike is used about 50% of the time in the summer and exclusively in the salty environs of winter. Typically rims with rim brakes last one to two winters due to the fact that road salt is so corrosive to aluminum even with hardcoat anodizing.

Ray

[binouye]

This is a repeat from older threads on Campy w/ discs, but I like the Juin Tech R1, also being sold as Yokozuna disc brakes. I'm running them on a Salsa Colossal with Chorus, and a CX bike with Athena. They are similar to the Hy/Rds in being cable actuated hydros, but differ in other ways. I've had Hy/Rds too, and the R1/Yokozuna work better with Campy's shorter cable pull.
I've test ridden a CX bike with R685 and didn't like the ergonomics and didn't feel the braking was that different from what I've got.

I'm also saving up for Campy discs, and wishing they were available already.....

[R3awak3n]

This is a repeat from older threads on Campy w/ discs, but I like the Juin Tech R1, also being sold as Yokozuna disc brakes. I'm running them on a Salsa Colossal with Chorus, and a CX bike with Athena. They are similar to the Hy/Rds in being cable actuated hydros, but differ in other ways. I've had Hy/Rds too, and the R1/Yokozuna work better with Campy's shorter cable pull.
I've test ridden a CX bike with R685 and didn't like the ergonomics and didn't feel the braking was that different from what I've got.

I'm also saving up for Campy discs, and wishing they were available already.....

those are definitely interesting. My only concern is that they don't self adjust, kind of pointless being hydraulic and not self adjusting no? I do like that you said they work better with campy pull. It is just tough for me to spend $150 on brakes and have them not work that well either.

[PaMtbRider]

And I thought it was just me. I'm glad I'm not the only one with Spyres that have mushy levers and nothing-special performance.
I rode a friends Cannondale CAADX setup with Spyres and compression-less housing and felt the same way. Very unimpressed.

[ColonelJLloyd]

I rode a friends Cannondale CAADX setup with Spyres and compression-less housing and felt the same way. Very unimpressed.

Not a very useful anecdote until you tell us what levers. And I'm not convinced all compressionless housing is equal. Seems well accepted that the lever pull with Campagnolo leaves a lot to be desired of many calipers' performance.

[R3awak3n]

Not a very useful anecdote until you tell us what levers. And I'm not convinced all compressionless housing is equal. Seems well accepted that the lever pull with Campagnolo leaves a lot to be desired of many calipers' performance.

Im using jagwire compressionless, what do you use/what do you think is superior?

[ColonelJLloyd]

My only concern is that they don't self adjust, kind of pointless being hydraulic and not self adjusting no?

Personally, I bought them because of the assumed better modulation and light weight. The only reason I moved on from Spyres was the interference between that front caliper and SP dynamo.

Im using jagwire compressionless, what do you use/what do you think is superior?

I have only used Elite Link, but have installed Jagwire compressionless and Yokozuna on bikes for others. They're just completely different designs so I wouldn't think they'd be exactly equal. Biggest advantage of the Elite Link, I'd think, is how it handles tight bends. That and the housing itself is more or less permanent; just replace cables and maybe liner when needed.

[PaMtbRider]

Not a very useful anecdote until you tell us what levers. And I'm not convinced all compressionless housing is equal. Seems well accepted that the lever pull with Campagnolo leaves a lot to be desired of many calipers' performance.

Sram levers with Jagwire housing.

[yummygooey]

I have been running the RS685s for about 9 months. They're great. Yes, the hoods are huge... but on the flip side they offer a bunch of hand positions which I've come to appreciate. Set up and service are easy.

All my riding buddies are either using some variation of the Spyres or Hy/Rds, and all of them have comparatively mushy lever feel. I've also noticed that the rear usually feels drastically more mushy than the front; no such problem with the RS685s.

Another option would be the TRP Hylex with bar end shifters...

[R3awak3n]

I have been running the RS685s for about 9 months. They're great. Yes, the hoods are huge... but on the flip side they offer a bunch of hand positions which I've come to appreciate. Set up and service are easy.

All my riding buddies are either using some variation of the Spyres or Hy/Rds, and all of them have comparatively mushy lever feel. I've also noticed that the rear usually feels drastically more mushy than the front; no such problem with the RS685s.

Another option would be the TRP Hylex with bar end shifters...

my rear is much more mushy than the front as well.

[brockd15]

my rear is much more mushy than the front as well.

Same here. Just checked this morning to be sure the lever isn't actually hitting the bar, but there's still about a 1cm gap. I may need to adjust the pads in a little, I haven't done that lately.

I sure with the Spyres had detents on the adjustment wheels the way BB7s do.

[ColonelJLloyd]

Yeah, all evidence points to a positive correlation between rotor size and lever feel. That's a shame as I plan to use 160/140 on my custom. It's worth noting that my positive experience with Spyres was using the TRP-40 rotors in 180/160 configuration.

[tigoat]

Spyre calipers must be installed properly in order for them to work correctly. The key is to have a correct cable tension so the level pull is tight and positive. The cable should be pulled tight to anchor onto the actuator with the barrel adjuster all the way in. Then the cable tension can be fine-tuned further by backing out the barrel adjuster. Pads are adjustable on both sides and they need to be adjusted properly obviously. It has been for quite a while but one thing that I asked them to improve upon with these mechanical disc brakes was simply to install a stronger spring on the dual actuator but not sure if they took my advice or not. I actually did the mod myself on a set and got a greatly improved braking over the stock configuration but I DO NOT recommend messing with yours though. Stock pads are not very good so I would replace them with some inexpensive compatible Shimano pads, there is no need to get those high dollar ones. If these dual actuated mechanical disc brakes are installed and adjusted properly out of the box, they should provide better braking than rim braking but obviously they are not as great as hydraulic braking.

[guido]

Just to further complicate things, another approach that would let you keep the Campy shifting compatibility would be to go the Paul Klampers route. I see them turning up and more and more cool builds...

http://theradavist.com/2017/01/benedicts-crust-bikes-romanceur-26-touring-bike/#1

[donevwil]

Any update here? Have you tried the Swiss Stop pads and/or a 180 rotor in front?

[bismo37]

Adding my point of reference: I built up a bike with Campy Chorus 2016 levers and Spyres. Too much mush at the Campy lever. The Spyres were super easy to install and adjust but the lever feel was crappy.

I replaced them with Yokozuna Motoko cable-actuated hydro disc brakes that come with 160mm rotors and Yokozuna's compression-less Reaction cableset. This include some hardcore cable housing end ferrules. The ferrules didn't fit in the Campy lever slot so I didn't use them there, but didn't need them. The install is as easy as the Spyres. The lever feel is great. The more lever you pull, the more the stopping power. The calipers have more cable pull adjustments that allow you to adjust the pads and lever feel.

The price was great considering the rotors and compressionless housing were included. I think these are the same as Juin Tech brakes but include the extra bits. I ordered from Yokozuna's US website. I think Universal Cycles tries to stock them as well.

[R3awak3n]

That is all great to know, you are not the first person I hear that is happy with those.

Also, no ferrules at the shifter on 11 speed campy so you did it right.

I actually got the spyres working good with campy. Still not awesome but working well. I just tinkered with them till I got a tight distance between the pads and the caliper. Also bedded the pads better this time, really spent time doing that. Switch to a 180 in the front and I think that also really helped.

That said I would probably the the yokozunas if I was buying a new system

[donevwil]

Adding my point of reference: I built up a bike with Campy Chorus 2016 levers and Spyres. Too much mush at the Campy lever. The Spyres were super easy to install and adjust but the lever feel was crappy.

I replaced them with Yokozuna Motoko cable-actuated hydro disc brakes that come with 160mm rotors and Yokozuna's compression-less Reaction cableset. This include some hardcore cable housing end ferrules. The ferrules didn't fit in the Campy lever slot so I didn't use them there, but didn't need them. The install is as easy as the Spyres. The lever feel is great. The more lever you pull, the more the stopping power. The calipers have more cable pull adjustments that allow you to adjust the pads and lever feel.

The price was great considering the rotors and compressionless housing were included. I think these are the same as Juin Tech brakes but include the extra bits. I ordered from Yokozuna's US website. I think Universal Cycles tries to stock them as well.

Great info, thanks. I've wondered about those and the non-re-branded version. I'll be using gen 2 Campy 10 levers so might be a bit worse off than y'all.