Re-doing clearcoat on a frame?

[texbike]

I recently picked up a C40 frameset that has numerous chips in the clearcoat. The underlying paint looks great for the most part and is a nice Art Decor AD10 scheme.

Is it possible to strip the clearcoat and reapply without damaging the underlying paint? Have any of you guys done this or know of someone such as Calfee or Joe's that has done it successfully. Again, the goal is to remove the clearcoat blemishes and maintain the underlying AD10 paint.

Thanks!

Texbike

[wallymann]

you can get it looking pretty good -- i've done this with a couple bikes. it's all about prep and patience.

i think it's impossible to get the clear off w/o damaging the underlying paint and decals. so i just just knock down the high/rough spots with some fine sandpaper, then rough up everything lightly to receive the new clear, then apply the clear to the best of your ability.

suggest getting high quality clear, not crap like rustoleum.

I recently picked up a C40 frameset that has numerous chips in the clearcoat. The underlying paint looks great for the most part and is a nice Art Decor AD10 scheme.

Is it possible to strip the clearcoat and reapply without damaging the underlying paint? Have any of you guys done this or know of someone such as Calfee or Joe's that has done it successfully. Again, the goal is to remove the clearcoat blemishes and maintain the underlying AD10 paint.

Thanks!

Texbike

[texbike]

you can get it looking pretty good -- i've done this with a couple bikes. it's all about prep and patience.

i think it's impossible to get the clear off w/o damaging the underlying paint and decals. so i just just knock down the high/rough spots with some fine sandpaper, then rough up everything lightly to receive the new clear, then apply the clear to the best of your ability.

suggest getting high quality clear, not crap like rustoleum.

Thanks Walter. Have you done this on any of your C40s or 50s? What did you do use for your clear?

Texbike

[LegendRider]

I have a C50 with the Pro00 paint scheme. The frame is approximately 10 years old and the clear coat is showing signs of age - a few chips here and there with the cable stops being the primary problem areas.

Tom Kellogg said that he'd heavily sand but would not go to bare carbon - that is, he'd preserve the graphics.

On the other hand, Allan Wanta said getting rid of all the old clear coat was important and he'd need to sand thoroughly then redo the graphics.

[wallymann]

Thanks Walter. Have you done this on any of your C40s or 50s? What did you do use for your clear?

Texbike

ive done it a couple old steel bikes.

i used some crappy clear that was terribly weak. honestly, compared to that rustoleum would have been a big step up!

if i had to do over again, i would get some quality 2K clear from eastwood -- it's 2 part epoxy in a can.

http://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-s-2k-aerospray-high-gloss-clear.html

http://www.eastwood.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/412x/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/p/1/p14148Z.jpg

[rePhil]

I exchanged e mails with Allan Wanta. He can do it.It's another alternative for you.

http://www.wantaframes.com/firstpage.html

[cadence90]

ive done it a couple old steel bikes.

i used some crappy clear that was terribly weak. honestly, compared to that rustoleum would have been a big step up!

if i had to do over again, i would get some quality 2K clear from eastwood -- it's 2 part epoxy in a can.

Does anyone know: are clears (esp. high-quality ones like wallymann posted) generally compatible, chemically, with the clears that were used originally, when the frame was first painted?

[GParkes]

If you are looking to do this yourself with "rattle can" clear, this is simply the very best product you can get. It has an activator that you release by depressing a button on the bottom of the can. The activator increases hardness and is essentially the same as any clear you mix and use in a spray gun. Pot life is only 24 hours, so you should do it on Saturday morning, let clear dry and sand out any sags you might get. You'll have all day to do a second or third coat if you need. By the way, use 600 grit paper to smooth rough pots, then go to 1500 - 2000 grit for rest. Use a respirator, and make sure you have ventilation. It contains isocyanate (nasty sh-t)

This clear would only be available in a good automotive paint store, or maybe on line. I bought the last six cans in my local store - they said it was either being discontinued, or weren't carrying anymore. Was about $20/can. If you need more details, PM me.

[ultraman6970]

That spray max is high grade clear coat, professional stuff thats why is so expensive. No idea if the one in the picture is the one with two parts... the clear and the activator, the can has a pin thingy at the bottom, you move it and the clear with the activator starts mixing. U have like 24 hours to clear with that thing because, after that time is not good any more.

My experience, yes you can do it, clean the frame with soap and water 1st, then sand with 600 grit. Then clean with rubbing alcohol before appliying the clear.

As for how much to sand that is the question that everybody has, actually clear coat is really sticky, you can clear w/o sanding but it will start peeling if you dont sand the surface. Just sand slightly is more like a scuff, that will get the surface ready and will remove all the junk that is stuck in the clear, like dust and stuff.

As wally said dont use rustoleum under any circumstances, even if they swear to you it will work, rustoleum is a lacquer and right out of the bat I can tell you that you risk the finish to start bubbling (hot paint over cold paint equals burning), just telling you why you dont have to use it.

If you have a small compresor just get a 12 bucks detail spray gun at habour freight, get polyurethane car paint (quarts cans, if the guy doesnt have go somwhere else... quart size can), the activator that match that paint (guy will ask you about the temperature, medium temp, if too cold will take longer to dry thats all) and half gallon of reducer (thats the smaller I ever seen).

Brands??? shopline jc620 comes in quarts, do not get a gallon because with a quart u might have easy like for 10 bikes... there's other brands but this is the one I have been using lately just because of the price and quality, I have used nason aswell and between the two shopline flows way better than nason. Sometimes at ebay you find weird brands that people swear for them... as in bikes with car paint the cheaper and good reviews it means that the product is good.

BTW clear, activator and reducer goes hand to hand ok? sometimes u can mix them like using another brand of reducer but activator and clear must bedesigned to work together. That doesnt mean u cant get away with stuff too.. ive mixed brands w no problem but is a risk.

In case you ask what the activator is,... urethane/polyurethane car paint dries and cure chemically. the activator pretty much makes the solvents to evaporate super quick, thats why pretty much after a few hours (8 or 12 to play safe) probably u will be able to put the bike together w/o any problems.

Lacquer like rustoleum cant do that and no matter what they say (IMO) that stuff wont cure maybe in months because needs air to cure... people swear for it, i dont.

After you have the thing already cleared you sand with 600.. 1000 and up for the last time to remove all the surface problems (this is optional) and then you have to polish it with paint polisher, do not get the 3M crap they sell at wallmart, you have to get like meguiars ultra cut compound it comes with a red arrow going all the way to 12, that will get you the finish you might be looking for. Then tech-wax from meguiars and good to go, mirror finish.

Hope this helps not only to the op.

[cadence90]

^
Good stuff, ultraman. Thanks.

So, once the existing clear coat is prepped/scuffed, etc., there is no real issue (chemical reaction) applying these high-quality clears over it?

[ultraman6970]

No... this is the thing, you have like 2 types of paints, hot and cold ones.

Rusoleum is hot (lacquers), if the surface you are painting over is relatively new the lacquer basically will try to melt whatever is under it (paint start bubbling), if the paint is old it wont have pretty much anything inside then probably nothing should happens, personally I have used laqcuer over relatively fresh polyurethane and the whole thing turned like gummy, took forever to dry, this was a test piece I had moving around. From what I heard the problem besides solvents is that lacquer paint is not porous, so what ever is under it if it has solvents still to gas out, then the whole thing starts like lifting out.

U can paint urethane acrylic over rustoleum if the lacquer is well dry or cured, many guys that make plastic car models use urethane because the shine is better and last longer, so they use urethane clear coats over laquer paints.

Coming back to urethane over urethane... no nothing should happen specially with clear that has been in a bike for several years, it gassed out long time ago, the other thing is that from what a jobber (paint car mixer guy) told me time ago was that urethane is purous so you have a lot lest risk of problems with paint underneath still trying to gas out, it should not do it (should.... but sometimes $hit happens).

Remember a carbon frame I had, open mold stuff i bought just to try, was painted with white and some black. Sanded it... put my color and in some areas the urethane paint started like lifting and super soft, melting, had to clean and do it again... at the 3rd time worked fine. I think the problem was the primer I was using, it was reacting with something that was in the carbon tubes, maybe the gel, who knows. I was not using acrylic primer for plastic so that could had been the problem, i was using primer for metal. Learn my lesson... acrylic primer for plastic next time I want to have fun with an asianish open mold frame.

[texbike]

Walter, Gparkes, and Ultra,

Thanks for the suggestions. Gparkes, that looks like a good product. It sounds like it may be a good solution to use.

Texbike

[franswa]

I've used that Spray Max 2k with a pretty great degree of success.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/648/30764826634_2fe6d1835d_o.jpg


https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/556/31233790990_6aed1c3020_o.jpg

[GParkes]

Walter, Gparkes, and Ultra,

Thanks for the suggestions. Gparkes, that looks like a good product. It sounds like it may be a good solution to use.

Texbike

If you can find it, get it. You won't be disappointed.

[Seramount]

product is easily available online...

[wasfast]

You can find all the colors here online:

http://www.66autocolor.com/touch-up-car-paint-s/320.htm

and clears:

http://www.66autocolor.com/spraymax-automotive-clear-coat-spray-s/51.htm