Keeping Weight Lifting Gains

[Chris]

I'm 46. Started lifting with any consistency for the first time this year. I've spent 30 years in the endurance game and neglected any real strength training. I've put on a few pounds of muscle I think. I do a full body routine (4-5 lifts) three days a week. I've perused a lot of the weightlifting/body building forums, but a lot of them seem to primarily be focused on what juice cycle to take. I've read about bulking, cutting, etc, but there is next to nothing about lifting and training for cycling at the same time. I'm starting base. When the harder stuff arrives, my current plan is to focus on upper body primarily and then do squats or other leg stuff once a week for maintenance. I would like to maintain some of the gains. I'm 6'2" 177 now. I'm done starving myself to weigh 163 because I've come to the realization that 90% of my races are crits or courses with climbs less than a mile long so I just don't think that being fragile is worth it anymore.

Anyone with experience lifting and racing? I would appreciate any thoughts.

[John H.]

You keep lifting gains by continuing to lift.
You are 46 years old- so you want to keep all the muscle that you can keep.
For in season I suggest lifting twice per week- still full body.
You just need to time the sessions so that they do not detract from your bike training.
I suggest one weekday session after a hard bike workout- and one weekend session- also after training.

[Matthew]

I am 49 and lift year round. I don't do any leg work during the riding season, but will do squats and lunges during the colder months. Calf raises as well. I typically only do my body weight for lots of reps. I may do this as many as five days per week. Probably more than I should do them but I let my body tell me I'm doing too much. Same goes for upper body. No real heavy weights, lots of reps. Push ups, bench press, arm curls, and pull downs are my usual exercises. I don't care how much I can lift but go for proper technique. Diet is my biggest issue. I need to improve that for sure. Currently weigh 188. Would love to get into the low to mid 170's.

[JasonF]

I'm 47 and have been lifting off and on for 30 years. Generally, it's tough to serve two masters: lift heavy consistently while working on cycling endurance.

Lately I've come to the realization that my own body is the best tool for fitness. For upper body I do chins/pull-ups (which works forearms, biceps, back, traps, etc..) dips (amazing for chest, shoulders, triceps) and simple push-ups. If I can bang out more than 15 reps then I'll put a belt on and do weighted dips or chins. A 25lb plate in a backpack slung over your back while you do push-ups is pretty hard. In short, I only do exercises that recruit multiple muscle groups in one move.

Cycling is a great lower body workout, but I will do squats & lunges as well as core work.

[BigDaddySmooth]

Lads,
Listen to an elder here, I'm 55. It's difficult to try and manage aerobic sports w/anaerobic sports. What makes it more of a challenge is when you try to add rowing and running to the mix. Weight-lifting is very important as we age because of the natural loss in muscle mass. It's also important to try and maintain cardiovascular fitness as long as you can. In the winter push heavier weight so you have power and lower your risk of injury/overuse. Cyclists are notorious for having weak upper body musculature. Multi-joint movements are the best bang for the buck. Pull-ups, chest press, dips, squats and deadlifts will cover most muscles. If you really want to suck wind, do this after any exercise session. Kettlebell swings followed by old-fashioned squat thrusts. Do 15/15, 14/14, etc down to 1/1 and you'll be heaving chest before you know it. Cheers.

[Peter P.]

I recommend three books:

Weight Training for Cyclists, by Eric Schmitz and Ken Doyle

Weight Training for Cyclists, from the Editors of Velonews, Contributors Fred Matheny and Stephen Grabe

Beginning Bicycle Racing, By Fred Matheny

If you read these books, and Joe Friel's "The Cyclist's Training Bible; and Thomas Chapple's "Base Building for Cyclist's", you'll see a lot of agreement on how cyclists should continue their weightlifting during the cycling season in terms of volume and intensity.

YOU will have to decide how much you can integrate weight training into your in-season cycling program without detracting from your cycling performance, recovery, and maintenance of your weight lifting gains.

I think your self-assessment is spot-on; you've recognized your limitations as well as the events you participate in and you're ready to tailor your training to accommodate both.

"When the harder stuff arrives, my current plan is to focus on upper body primarily and then do squats or other leg stuff once a week for maintenance. I would like to maintain some of the gains."

I'm not sure what you mean by "When the harder stuff arrives..." - you mean harder weightlifting or harder cycling? All the books lean toward a focus on legs with certainly core and upper body, but again the focus is on legs. Your statement above seems to say the opposite.

In-season maintenance varies with the programs; they vary from 1-3 days/week and the routines are more brief. Studies show that you can MAINTAIN your gains with considerably less work than you think.

"I've perused a lot of the weightlifting/body building forums, but a lot of them seem to primarily be focused on what juice cycle to take."

Really?! Is it that bad?

[stephenmarklay]

In-season maintenance varies with the programs; they vary from 1-3 days/week and the routines are more brief. Studies show that you can MAINTAIN your gains with considerably less work than you think.

This is it. You have only so much energy to give. Periodization on a yearly period makes good sense. You can focus strength training more for the off season and then maintain during the racing season.

The key here is still doing what made you progess in the off season but just do it less frequently. With reduced volume you will tend to lose some muscle size but you will keep most of the strength by doing these less frequent (but intense) sessions.

[John H.]

Keep lifting- no need to cut back.
You are a 46 year old- not a pro racer.
Muscle rules.

[nooneline]

I’ve lifted for a few years to supplement track cycling. For a little while I was steadily on 3x/week with linear progression in the fall and winter - but now I’m down to 1x/week as a supplemental workout.

I agree with JasonF - it’s hard to serve two masters. If you make strength gains, great - but there will come a time in the season where you’ll have to choose between lifting time and riding time. At that point, you’ll lose some of the strength gains you’ve made. Plenty of people advocate lifting 1x/week to limit your losses. If that works for you, fine.

Another thing you can do is accept periodization: once the season starts in earnest, you focus on power on the bike instead of strength under the bar.

[adub]

I lift weights, yoga, and intensive stretching to keep (increase?) bone density, flexibility, and posture.

Pretty tough to put any kind of cycling miles on and expect to keep muscle mass you put on in the off season from a weight program. Weight lifting and cycling are pretty much on the opposite ends of the spectrum when it comes to aesthetic results.

[malcolm]

I'm 57. I no longer ride road, just mtn. I think resistance training becomes more important as you age.

If you are a gym member look into (google) super set workouts with dumbells. If not buy one of the dumbell sets like power blocks.

Super sets with minimal rest interval lets you use lighter weight and still get an intense work out with some cardio benefit.

If you like a planned program where you just follow instructions check out athlean X. It's a monthly format that requires little equipment done in a sort of HIIT fashion. Good work out, targets whole body with lots of core. I think good for anyone just wanting to be stronger and fitter.

[JStonebarger]

I don't get it. Why anyone would lift weights for fitness or for cycling performance baffles me.

Bone density? Run (much more effective the weightlifting). Like feeling a bit buff above the waist? Swim (upper body cardio and functional strength at the same time). Flexibility? Strength? Balance? Yoga or pilates, maybe.

But weightlifting? Isolating muscle groups with unnatural motions is supposed to serve what purpose?

(Full disclosure: I did a lot of weightlifting 40 years ago. Never again.)

[Chris]

I don't get it. Why anyone would lift weights for fitness or for cycling performance baffles me.

Bone density? Run (much more effective the weightlifting). Like feeling a bit buff above the waist? Swim (upper body cardio and functional strength at the same time). Flexibility? Strength? Balance? Yoga or pilates, maybe.

But weightlifting? Isolating muscle groups with unnatural motions is supposed to serve what purpose?

(Full disclosure: I did a lot of weightlifting 40 years ago. Never again.)

I'm lifting for human performance. Not necessarily on the bike. More cardio isn't what I'm looking for and there is a ton of research out there that shows that more cardio may actually be harmful due to the elevated cortisol levels that result. If pressing something away from you, lifting something off the ground, curling something toward your head, or squatting is unnatural, then I've been doing things wrong for a very very long time.

[carpediemracing]

As far as lifting/racing goes, I tried going pretty heavy on weights for maybe 5 years and didn't see any significant change in performance. In fact for me losing weight is more important than gaining strength. Of course I'm about 6 lbs lighter than the OP and 7 inches shorter. So, as I like to tell the nurses, I'm very dense.

It's very possible that the lifting might been slowing down the rate of deterioration.

At some point, toward the end of my lifting, I realized I was down about 20% top speed in my sprints, generally speaking. At the time I had to work really hard to break 40 mph which used to be a non-issue. Now, about 8 years later, I struggle to hit 38-39 mph; even 40 mph is a dream. I'm no longer a fast Cat 3, I'm definitely much lower down the totem pole. I'm still a fast-ish M45.

I haven't done a full on jump in a long time but in 2008 I was hitting 1500+ watts and 1400w peak showed up maybe half a dozen times a year. I don't think I've broken 1300w for a bit, maybe a couple-few years.

I almost always do some shoulder area lifting work - flys, shoulder press, curls, some other stuff. I have 20 lbs of plates on a 3? lbs bar and I leave it next to the bike, do it before or after I ride. I also do pushups at random in the living room where I leave a set of pushup bars. I want to put up a handlebar as a pull up bar, I hope to do it in the bike room shortly. Then I'll do pull ups whenever I ride. My brother has a bar in the kitchen and everyone will go and do a few while talking, hanging out, etc.

I read somewhere a long time ago that shoulder area lifting can help prevent collarbone injuries. I don't know if that's true but it's something I've always done. Honestly I think knowing how to roll in a fall is much more important - in the pre-helmet days I hit the deck at about 50 mph, slid/tumbled about 150 feet, and never hit my head. I attribute that to the Judo lessons I took when I was a kid.

[nooneline]

I don't get it. Why anyone would lift weights for fitness or for cycling performance baffles me.

Bone density? Run (much more effective the weightlifting). Like feeling a bit buff above the waist? Swim (upper body cardio and functional strength at the same time). Flexibility? Strength? Balance? Yoga or pilates, maybe.

But weightlifting? Isolating muscle groups with unnatural motions is supposed to serve what purpose?

(Full disclosure: I did a lot of weightlifting 40 years ago. Never again.)

Good weightlifting doesn't isolate muscle groups, it works systems of muscles that can benefit cycling. Squats and deads work the whole posterior chain, develop great core support, and build strength. Strength helps you push on the pedals.

Weightlifting helped me crack through to another level of performance in track cycling. And it's a very common component of many bike racers' routines - particularly those who race in disciplines characterized by explosive efforts.

I don't think it's necessary for everybody. But it sure can help some people.

[Matthew]

I lift weights because I enjoy it. I do curls because that is actually how my arms do bend. Same with squats. My legs work like that. Running sucks, and likely causes more harm to bodies than moderate lifting does. Not a big fan of swimming either and even if I was I don't belong to a club so I don't have access to a pool. Getting stronger is a bad thing? Do I weigh more now? Sure. Does that hurt me during climbs? Maybe. Guess I just don't see how getting stronger is a bad thing.

[Ralph]

I'm 75. And I still go to gym and lift weights. Especially work on balance and flexibility. Maybe more often now than ever. It's true I'm not as strong as years ago. But for me.....it's not optional. It's part of how I stay healthy and strong enough to continue with my normal activities as long as I can. Also work hard to be thin and have a healthy diet.

I still average about 125 miles per week on my bike year around....some weeks a tad more, some a tad less, riding 3-4 days per week. That means I'm exercising almost every day at some level. If I feel tired....I don't do so much....just go thru the motions. I also don't ride with anyone I don't know their experience and skill level, and avoid most large groups. Good health can mean not getting hurt.

Does my gym work hurt my cycling.....probably....but at my age I have some fitness goals other than being strong on the bike. Cycling is still my favorite sport.....it's just I need more than just hours on the bike.

Some of you guys responding on here are also approaching the age where you will need to look at the big fitness picture.....not just at cycling. Balance and flexibility get very important....especially balance (yoga anyone?). So many of my riding buddies....maybe some on BP meds.....are falling and breaking bones.....that don't heal very fast. Sorry to bore you with the painful facts about getting old. But hey....I can still ride with C+ groups and maybe B- if they don't climb much LOL.

To answer your question....I bet you could maintain at one thought out weight lifting session per week....for a while.

[11.4]

Good weightlifting doesn't isolate muscle groups, it works systems of muscles that can benefit cycling. Squats and deads work the whole posterior chain, develop great core support, and build strength. Strength helps you push on the pedals.

Weightlifting helped me crack through to another level of performance in track cycling. And it's a very common component of many bike racers' routines - particularly those who race in disciplines characterized by explosive efforts.

I don't think it's necessary for everybody. But it sure can help some people.

Absolutely concur.

And yes, as one gets older, one faces the double threat of (a) circulatory or pulmonary deterioration and (b) bone and muscle deterioration. Cycling doesn't do anything significant for bone density and not much for rebuilding muscle mass, and weightlifting doesn't do much for pulmonary or cardiac performance. One needs both.

The OP was asking about keeping weightlifting gains. Here's the issue. If you want to bulk up, you can lift a bit less than your maximal capacity, do plenty of reps, and gain muscle bulk and weight. You may or may not become stronger. If you want to become stronger and not bulk up significantly, and want to lift so you can see more benefit on the bike, lift maximal weights, do fewer repeats, and keep doing it. Maximal weights build power more effectively, build less muscle bulk, and the strength that's built lasts longer than extra muscle bulk would offer. However, if you want to lift and also ride and get better with both, the two workouts basically fight each other -- you can't lift hard and then ride, or vice versa. So I'd suggest you periodicize your workouts on a longer scale: lift for 3 months, then ride for 3 months, and repeat. Only ride a limited amount, at easy levels, when you are lifting. Only lift a bit, perhaps no more than once a week, when you're supposed to be riding. That way your workouts build on each other and take you to a higher fitness level in one sport, and you carry it over through the next period devoted to the other sport, and back again. If you try to do both concurrently, you can't lift as hard or ride as hard because you are still tired from the other workout, plus you'll find yourself tight or whatever because you were on one sport and then trying to swap (if I do lifting for a while, my shoulders are tight on a bike, and when I'm on a bike for a while, my hamstrings and hips are tight when I lift, for example). Your muscles are pretty dumb. They do what you tell them to do in training and that's about it. If you keep giving them conflicting orders (spin fast and don't put out excessive power, then lift slow and heavy), they won't do either very well.

[r_mutt]

Absolutely concur.

And yes, as one gets older, one faces the double threat of (a) circulatory or pulmonary deterioration and (b) bone and muscle deterioration. Cycling doesn't do anything significant for bone density and not much for rebuilding muscle mass, and weightlifting doesn't do much for pulmonary or cardiac performance. One needs both.

The OP was asking about keeping weightlifting gains. Here's the issue. If you want to bulk up, you can lift a bit less than your maximal capacity, do plenty of reps, and gain muscle bulk and weight. You may or may not become stronger. If you want to become stronger and not bulk up significantly, and want to lift so you can see more benefit on the bike, lift maximal weights, do fewer repeats, and keep doing it. Maximal weights build power more effectively, build less muscle bulk, and the strength that's built lasts longer than extra muscle bulk would offer. However, if you want to lift and also ride and get better with both, the two workouts basically fight each other -- you can't lift hard and then ride, or vice versa. So I'd suggest you periodicize your workouts on a longer scale: lift for 3 months, then ride for 3 months, and repeat. Only ride a limited amount, at easy levels, when you are lifting. Only lift a bit, perhaps no more than once a week, when you're supposed to be riding. That way your workouts build on each other and take you to a higher fitness level in one sport, and you carry it over through the next period devoted to the other sport, and back again. If you try to do both concurrently, you can't lift as hard or ride as hard because you are still tired from the other workout, plus you'll find yourself tight or whatever because you were on one sport and then trying to swap (if I do lifting for a while, my shoulders are tight on a bike, and when I'm on a bike for a while, my hamstrings and hips are tight when I lift, for example). Your muscles are pretty dumb. They do what you tell them to do in training and that's about it. If you keep giving them conflicting orders (spin fast and don't put out excessive power, then lift slow and heavy), they won't do either very well.


thanks for that advice 11.4. i am presently at the gym for preseason as i haven't used weights in 3 years while race. i felt that my body was much stronger when i did a preseason heavy weight workout and then tapered to almost none during the racing season. do you think it's ok to stop completely from march onward and still maintain that strength? or do you think i will lose everything if i stop completely? i find it hard to recover from heavy gym days and i do lot's of racing- (tuesday night, sat club races, etc)

[11.4]

i felt that my body was much stronger when i did a preseason heavy weight workout and then tapered to almost none during the racing season. do you think it's ok to stop completely from march onward and still maintain that strength? or do you think i will lose everything if i stop completely? i find it hard to recover from heavy gym days and i do lot's of racing- (tuesday night, sat club races, etc)

You won't lose everything. What may work best for you is not to race for seven months and then get back into the weight room, but race (or prioritize racing) for a couple months -- which is likely all you can really be in peak form for anyway -- and then go back to the gym for a couple months, then a couple months more racing focused time, then the winter in the gym. If you don't do maximal lifts (whatever that happens to be for you, and by that I mean a mix of 1x and 3-4X efforts), you aren't going to be training strength and power as well. Your body responds very specifically to the kind of training you impose on it -- train at the limit of your strength and you'll induce greater strength, but train at much less than your strength limit and you may bulk or otherwise change but won't necessarily add power.

You may personally find you can keep, say, 30% of your weightlifting gains over a 7 month racing season. If so, that may be good for you because cumulative 30% annual improvement may do what you need. You really need to figure out this part for yourself because it is so individual. I can tell you that mixing the workouts within a week basically tends to compromise one or the other. You want that 2-3 days of soreness after a hard workout because your body will be responding to that level of stress with greater strength. However, you also want to think about how well you preserve speed in your strength as well. Do you have a faster sprint after a period of weightlifting. If you don't, you may only be training slow speeds and again, your body is very specific about how it responds to training. That's where just doing squats and deadlifts alone isn't as effective as adding snatches and cleans -- faster movements that are more in line with the muscle contraction speed you need for cycling