Don't mess with Texas

[LegendRider]

From VeloNews:

Early Wednesday, we received the following e-mailed statement from Frankie Andreu, the director sportif of the Toyota-United Pro Cycling Team.

"On July 25th, 2006, the day after I returned home from the Tour de France, I was informed that my contract was being terminated by the Toyota-United Pro Cycling Team. I was very surprised and disappointed to be told to leave especially after all the hard work of putting together this first year team. I know the team will continue their winning ways because it's a great group of riders. I wish them success."

Attempts to reach a team spokesman have proven to be unsuccessful and we will follow-up with a complete story as soon as further details become available.

[SpaceOdyssey]

Boy that really stinks.

It's hard to think that LA has that kind of influence in domestic racing.

It all seems to "Oliver Stoney", but if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck.....

B

[LegendRider]

It all seems to "Oliver Stoney", but if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck.....

B

Agreed. Of course, I have no evidence that Lance had anything to do with it, but it's awfully suspicious....

[atmo]

this happened similarly when he was at postal. can it be attributed
to someone spending too much time in the attitude tent atmo?

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . VERY interesting!

BBD

[Big Dan]

Cyclism???????????

:eek:

[Archibald]

I read Armstrong had those two Israeli soldiers kidnapped and started the latest conflict in the ME, that he personally caused the crash that resulted in Landis' injured hip, and he tipped the Spanish to Operación Puerto to better Hincapie's chances for yellow. Can you believe that guy? :D

[coylifut]

this happened similarly when he was at postal. can it be attributed
to someone spending too much time in the attitude tent atmo?

a question I asked my self was "why would Frankie and Betsy say what they said knowing it would likely kill his broadcast and DS careers?"

[atmo]

a question I asked my self was "why would Frankie and Betsy say what they said knowing it would likely kill his broadcast and DS careers?"
howard beale atmo

[Birddog]

can it be attributed to someone spending too much time in the attitude tent atmo?

Or maybe not enough time. Chicken or the egg?

Birddog

[atmo]

I read Armstrong had those two Israeli soldiers kidnapped and started the latest conflict in the ME, that he personally caused the crash that resulted in Landis' injured hip, and he tipped the Spanish to Operación Puerto to better Hincapie's chances for yellow. Can you believe that guy? :D

word has it that armstrong is his own grandpa (http://www.onlyinternet.net/preceptor/rm118/grandpa.htm) atmo.

[Bill Bove]

Lance Armstrong does not make the sun come up in the morning! Everything that happens in cycling is not attributale to Lance Armstrong. Sheesh, maybe Frankie's broadcasting career is tanking because he's not very good at it, maybe he was let go by Toyota because it costs so much to put a team together that maybe they thought their money was better spent elsewhere. like on a rider.

[atmo]

Lance Armstrong does not make the sun come up in the morning! Everything that happens in cycling is not attributale to Lance .
yeah.
this couldn't happen on his watch atmo.

[yeehawfactor]

i understand frankie is a bit nutty..........

[Bill Bove]

yeah.
this couldn't happen on his watch atmo.
Really, talk about hubris.

[coylifut]

i understand frankie is a bit nutty..........

that would explain it, because it would take a real nut case to tangle with the boss.

[93legendti]

yeah.
this couldn't happen on his watch atmo.

Even if it is a sun dial?

[atmo]

Really, talk about hubris.
who brought up armstrong anyway atmo?

[oracle]

i think it was his mom's doing..

[Archibald]

a question I asked my self was "why would Frankie and Betsy say what they said knowing it would likely kill his broadcast and DS careers?"
It may be because Frankie didn't say it originally. His wife originally claimed it, it made it into Walsh's book and once she was supenoed, she had to testify to it and he did not counter with his wife's testimony.

[coylifut]

the most interesting fact about the Andreus testimony is that they were subpoenaed by the Texas arbitration panel and their response was they would not willingly comply. A Michigan Court said they had to comply or face the penalty of contempt of court. So, they went to Texas un willingly and testified under oath with the understanding that the transcripts would be sealed. looking at the Adreus motivation, they had nothing to gain and could only lose.

That guy sure has a lot of people accusing him over the years. Being that he's a clean rider, cast in a sea of filth, I wonder what he did to piss em all off?

[Big Dan]

Let me get a sandwinch, this here thread is getting good................ :D
Go get 'em Frankie Go.................!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:banana:

[Jason E]

Let me get a sandwinch, this here thread is getting good................ :D
Go get 'em Frankie Go.................!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:banana:

You may wanna grab a coke, we're going on the next post!

[coylifut]

Let me get a sandwinch, this here thread is getting good................ :D
Go get 'em Frankie Go.................!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:banana:

I just went and got some e-therapy by re reading swoop's post from yesterday. I'm all better now. that swoop is an amazing mental health professional. hope he doesn't bill me.

[Big Dan]

I got a snack and a coke..now if everyone would read that post.......... :crap:

:bike:

[Needs Help]

Lance Armstrong does not make the sun come up in the morning! Everything that happens in cycling is not attributale to Lance Armstrong. Sheesh, maybe Frankie's broadcasting career is tanking because he's not very good at it
Maybe? He is the worst announcer I've ever seen on TV. He has no talent at ad libing, so it was obvious he started memorizing everything he was going to say, which still got him into trouble. What do you do when you are interviewing Floyd Landis and he answers your second question during your first question? Frankie's answer: stammer out your second question anyway.

[swoop]

everyone i know that is involved with the team LOVES frankie. he's been a great leader in the car.. even breaking-in harm in as a ds.. and is awesome to the staff soignuers (sic) and everyone. i've never heard a bad thing said about him.. and frankly.. have seen people kind of light up around him.

i wonder what's up?

[atmo]

i wonder what's up?
pure speculation atmo -
someone messed with texas?

[Frog Hair]

too many roosters...

[davids]

everyone i know that is involved with the team LOVES frankie. he's been a great leader in the car.. even breaking-in harm in as a ds.. and is awesome to the staff soignuers (sic) and everyone. i've never heard a bad thing said about him.. and frankly.. have seen people kind of light up around him.

i wonder what's up?
Your tongue's in your cheek, atmo. Right? Or have you had an attitude adjustment?

[harlond]

Velonews has updated their story. My first impression is that the team's explanation seems not quite adequate, and that if the reason they give for termination is the real reason, they acted precipitately. Whatever the reason, I'm sorry for Frankie and hope he lands quickly on his feet. His TdF diaries were the best.

[Russell]

pure speculation atmo -
someone messed with texas?

But what kind of pull does Lance have with another team? In what direct way can he hurt them financially?

Not saying he isn't involved, but it does seem unlikely. Then again I don't know the ins and outs of pro racing.

[Fixed]

I read he tainted some blood when he was over there

[atmo]

Originally Posted by atmo
pure speculation atmo -
someone messed with texas?
But what kind of pull does Lance have with another team? In what direct way can he hurt them financially?

Not saying he isn't involved, but it does seem unlikely. Then again I don't know the ins and outs of pro racing.

uh it was the thread title.

[93legendti]

It may be because Frankie didn't say it originally. His wife originally claimed it, it made it into Walsh's book and once she was supenoed, she had to testify to it and he did not counter with his wife's testimony.

I hope she got Emma O'Reilly money! :D

http://outside.away.com/outside/features/200512/lance-armstrong-6.html

"...As for O'Reilly, her allegations also seem at least once removed from being proof. Walsh says in the book that she told him she had never personally administered doping products at Postal, nor had she seen Armstrong take any known banned substances. And, the book goes on to say, she never inquired about the nature of the pills she drove across the Spanish-French border in 1999.

It's also a fact that Walsh has said in the past that he did not pay Emma O'Reilly, when he actually did. Walsh recently admitted in an interview with Outside that he had paid O'Reilly for her story, despite assuring VeloNews in June 2004 that he had not. His explanation for telling this falsehood is that "I felt at the time if I'd said yes, she would have been absolutely screwed."

Walsh claims that two months after O'Reilly completed the unpaid interview with him in early July 2003, she called to protest that the book would be a success based largely on her interview, while her only reward would be Armstrong's wrath. (Walsh says he's made around $55,000 from the book.) According to Walsh, he told Ballester about the situation and then paid O'Reilly approximately $8,850 on September 19, 2003..."

[Big Dan]

I'm sure the posse took care of it..................... :cool:

http://outside.away.com/outside/features/200606/champions-club-1.html

[Archibald]

I hope she got Emma O'Reilly money! :D

http://outside.away.com/outside/features/200512/lance-armstrong-6.html

"...As for O'Reilly, her allegations also seem at least once removed from being proof. Walsh says in the book that she told him she had never personally administered doping products at Postal, nor had she seen Armstrong take any known banned substances. And, the book goes on to say, she never inquired about the nature of the pills she drove across the Spanish-French border in 1999.

It's also a fact that Walsh has said in the past that he did not pay Emma O'Reilly, when he actually did. Walsh recently admitted in an interview with Outside that he had paid O'Reilly for her story, despite assuring VeloNews in June 2004 that he had not. His explanation for telling this falsehood is that "I felt at the time if I'd said yes, she would have been absolutely screwed."

Walsh claims that two months after O'Reilly completed the unpaid interview with him in early July 2003, she called to protest that the book would be a success based largely on her interview, while her only reward would be Armstrong's wrath. (Walsh says he's made around $55,000 from the book.) According to Walsh, he told Ballester about the situation and then paid O'Reilly approximately $8,850 on September 19, 2003..."
How wonderful. He lied about paying for sources when directly asked. I wonder what else he has lied about to make his book.

For me, after seven years of constant accusations and conspiracy theories against Armstrong, it has gotten to the point were it reminds me of UFO abductions or Loch Ness or Bigfoot or Crop Circles or WMDs. There are always these well formed and presented theories and "proofs" put forth, hundreds of hours of psuedo-scientific documentaries, made for TV movies, top selling novels, the creation of urban myths and legend and no lack of true believers. Never any real evidence, just a blurry picture or shaky home movie, the tainted plaster cast and the eyewitness away from the others in his group who is never sure of exactly what he saw but desperately wants us to believe. Ultimately when confronted with the holes in their claims, they grow silent or revert back to demanding you prove a negative, to "prove they don't exist" or fallacies of composition "Heras doped so Armstrong has to be doping!" or arguments from authority, "Of course Armstrong dopes, didn't Lemond say he did?" Make no mistake, these claims and conspiracy theories have power over peoples belief systems even if proven blatantly false, witness Welles' "War of the Worlds" as the least politically sensitive example.

I wonder when exactly that article was written and how much he (or O'Reilly) have made from it to date. Did they ever release Walsh's book for sale in the States?

[Serpico]

I'm sure the posse took care of it..................... :cool:

http://outside.away.com/outside/features/200606/champions-club-1.html


cycling is the new golf

anyways--I'm Audi 5000, my Gulfstream just hit the tarmac

:cool:

[Kevan]

negotiate a 3 week leave.

[atmo]

don't mess with connecticut girls atmo -


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[GoJavs]

This has the distinct smell of the boys at the Champions Club....aka The Billionaire Bike Club....aka the biggest source of income for USA Cycling....aka The owners of Team Disco...

It is a world of consequences....eh...I mean coincidences! :crap:

[obtuse]

well it's great to see that armstrong's watch isn't over yet.

i have one piece of advice for that conniving lunatic; get back on the bike and start racing again or stay the hell out of this soiled sport. you want to prevent cancer lance? should have thought of that before you started putting testosterone and hgh patches on your testicles bub.

this is so infuriating that it warrants no response; the spring and the champion's club are so effed; they make the days of gewiss and the peloton riding in a straight line for five hours at 28mph look like the good old days. at least there were plenty of alarm clocks and enough "shut the hell up" to go around for everyone.

lance sucks.

obtuse

[GoJavs]

Holy! That was good. Thank you. :beer:

[JohnS]

well it's great to see that armstrong's watch isn't over yet.

i have one piece of advice for that conniving lunatic; get back on the bike and start racing again or stay the hell out of this soiled sport. you want to prevent cancer lance? should have thought of that before you started putting testosterone and hgh patches on your testicles bub.

lance sucks.

obtuse
Velonews 7-27-2006. A well known and respected Boston area bike shop employee lost his job today after posting material critical of Lance Armstrong on the Serotta forum. When asked if it was true, Armstrong replied, "Yep, he was a Jerk!" :D

[obtuse]

Velonews 7-27-2006. A well known and respected Boston area bike shop employee lost his job today after posting material critical of Lance Armstrong on the Serotta forum. When asked if it was true, Armstrong replied, "Yep, he was a Jerk!" :D


yup frankie and i are going to join up with greg lemond and two ex-fast guys and a jerk promotions will be born. watch out.

obtuse

[e-RICHIE]

well it's great to see that armstrong's watch isn't over yet.

i have one piece of advice for that conniving lunatic; get back on the bike and start racing again or stay the hell out of this soiled sport. you want to prevent cancer lance? should have thought of that before you started putting testosterone and hgh patches on your testicles bub.

this is so infuriating that it warrants no response; the spring and the champion's club are so effed; they make the days of gewiss and the peloton riding in a straight line for five hours at 28mph look like the good old days. at least there were plenty of alarm clocks and enough "shut the hell up" to go around for everyone.

lance sucks.

obtuse

strong words. lotsa emotion.
but i'm down with what you're puttin' up with atmo.

[Big Dan]

You guys are going to get in trouble with 93L, Adam , Archibald or whatever name he is using now.
Too bad he didn't defend his beloved Disco boys, GH and the genius DS when they were getting pounded in the Tour..... :no:

[Saxon]

Foolish mortals! You dare to tempt fate and raise the Kraken?!! :bike:
"Probably no legendary monster was as horrifying as the Kraken. According to stories this huge, many armed, creature could reach as high as the top of a sailing ship's main mast. Kraken's would attack a ship, wrap their arms around the hull and capsize it. The crew would drown or be eaten by the monster. What's amazing about the Kraken stories is that, of all the sea monster tales we have, we have the best evidence that these are REAL."

You betcha! :D

[Archibald]

well it's great to see that armstrong's watch isn't over yet.

i have one piece of advice for that conniving lunatic; get back on the bike and start racing again or stay the hell out of this soiled sport. you want to prevent cancer lance? should have thought of that before you started putting testosterone and hgh patches on your testicles bub.

this is so infuriating that it warrants no response; the spring and the champion's club are so effed; they make the days of gewiss and the peloton riding in a straight line for five hours at 28mph look like the good old days. at least there were plenty of alarm clocks and enough "shut the hell up" to go around for everyone.

lance sucks.

obtuse
http://www.sexhamster.com/weblog/macropics/tinfoil-hat.jpg

[Avispa]

....you want to prevent cancer lance? should have thought of that before you started putting testosterone and hgh patches on your testicles bub.

I finally get to know the real reason LA got cancer!!! Too bad they didn't cover that on the Chronicles! :D

[Marcusaurelius]

a question I asked my self was "why would Frankie and Betsy say what they said knowing it would likely kill his broadcast and DS careers?"

Because he had a grudge against Lance--or just maybe he's just a little jealous like a few other people.

[LegendRider]

Because he had a grudge against Lance--or just maybe he's just a little jealous like a few other people.

With all due respect, that makes no sense. As has been stated before, Frankie and Betsy did not want to testify in the arbitration - they were subpoenaed. If Frankie held a grudge against Lance AND wanted to bring him down, why would he have to be FORCED to testify? Frankie has never once voluntarily and publicly criticized or accused Lance of anything. What you're saying is not consistent with the facts. [NOTE: I would not at all be surprised if privately Frankie hates Lance...]

[Elefantino]

Pehaps, just perhaps, Andreu was not a good DS. The team has done remarkably well this year, but good teams have been known to overcome bad managers. Perhaps this little team that could suddenly realizes it's a powerhouse and needs the appropriate firepower in the DS position, not a "name."

I think this Lance conspiracy theory is, like the "Lance is going to the Tour to stop Landis" theory, far-fetched. It would, however, make a great Oliver Stone movie.

Just last night I heard Oliver Stone blame the movie Patton for the slaughter of millions of Cambodians by the Khmer Rouge.

Makes about as much sense.

[stevep]

i take hincapie to win the tour this year.
last year he sat in for 180k on a mt stage and beat the guy who did every inch of work in the sprint.
i do not see how he could fail to win.
when does it start anyway?
geroge is the new lance

[stevep]

Velonews 7-27-2006. A well known and respected Boston area bike shop employee lost his job today after posting material critical of Lance Armstrong on the Serotta forum. When asked if it was true, Armstrong replied, "Yep, he was a Jerk!" :D

well known and respected? i thought i knew who it was.
anyone have any clue?

[JohnS]

well known and respected? i thought i knew who it was.
anyone have any clue?Okay, okay, will you settle for "well known"? :)

[GoJavs]

It's a Conspiracy!

Real cute, Archi aka 93L. Unfortunately, the only guy who has been tossing around the 'C' word lately has been the man himself:

"The report confirms my innocence but also finds that Mr. Pound along with the French lab and the French ministry have ignored the rules and broken the law," Armstrong said, going as far as to accuse them of conspiracy.

[Archibald]

Real cute, Archi aka 93L. Unfortunately, the only guy who has been tossing around the 'C' word lately has been the man himself:

"The report confirms my innocence but also finds that Mr. Pound along with the French lab and the French ministry have ignored the rules and broken the law," Armstrong said, going as far as to accuse them of conspiracy.
I have no idea who 93L is, but have you read the claims and inferences in this thread or on the forum itself for the past few days? My heavens man, if it's a cloudy day, Armstrong is blamed.

[Archibald]

With all due respect, that makes no sense. As has been stated before, Frankie and Betsy did not want to testify in the arbitration - they were subpoenaed. If Frankie held a grudge against Lance AND wanted to bring him down, why would he have to be FORCED to testify? Frankie has never once volunatarily and publicly criticized or accused Lance of anything. What you're saying is not consistent with the facts. [NOTE: I would not at all be surprised if privately Frankie hates Lance...]I am not 100 percent clear on the timeline of when and how the Andreu's became directly involved but my understanding is that they were supenoed because they were included in Walsh's book as sources possibly supplying doping allegations against Armstrong. There was a link provided earlier to an Outside magazine article that indicated this, but again, I am unsure this is indeed the case.

[e-RICHIE]

There was a link provided earlier to an Outside magazine article that indicated this, but again, I am unsure this is indeed the case.

speaking of the the 'zine, what are your
thoughts on the other (http://outside.away.com/outside/features/200606/champions-club-1.html) article from june 06?

[Big Dan]

I am not 100 percent clear on the timeline of when and how the Andreu's became directly involved but my understanding is that they were supenoed because they were included in Walsh's book as sources possibly supplying doping allegations against Armstrong. There was a link provided earlier to an Outside magazine article that indicated this, but again, I am unsure this is indeed the case.


The question is , why post if you are not sure?........... :confused:

[Jason E]

i take hincapie to win the tour this year.
last year he sat in for 180k on a mt stage and beat the guy who did every inch of work in the sprint.
i do not see how he could fail to win.
when does it start anyway?
geroge is the new lance

That's not nice. George is a nice guy.

A climbers job is to drop the sprinters on the climb. A sprinters job is to not get dropped on the climb. That's racing.

[William]

http://blogs.warwick.ac.uk/images/ccarter/2005/09/12/hartman.jpg

ONLY TWO THINGS COME FROM TEXAS.....!!!!!!



William ;) ;)

[Archibald]

The question is , why post if you are not sure?........... :confused:
The question was asked about how they became involved. I answered with what I understood but was careful to note that it may not be entirely accurate. One article indicated that was the case but I could find no other sources to confirm it. Hopefully someone who knows and who can provide a reference will address it.

[William]

http://blogs.warwick.ac.uk/images/ccarter/2005/09/12/hartman.jpg

ONLY TWO THINGS COME FROM TEXAS.....!!!!!!



William ;) ;)

http://i.a.cnn.net/si/2005/writers/austin_murphy/08/19/lance.bush/p1_dubya_0819.jpg

Oh, and Molly22......DOH!! That makes three. :crap:



William ;)

[Archibald]

speaking of the the 'zine, what are your
thoughts on the other (http://outside.away.com/outside/features/200606/champions-club-1.html) article from june 06?
I am unable to access the Outside links at the moment. I'm receiving a "Failure To Connect To Web Server" reponse from the website. In the meantime, what are your thoughts on it? If you wish me to respond seriously, please do not answer with a one liner unless it is a link to an earlier discussion.

[JohnS]

I am unable to access the Outside links at the moment. I'm receiving a "Failure To Connect To Web Server" reponse from the website. In the meantime, what are your thoughts on it? If you wish me to respond seriously, please do not answer with a one liner unless it is a link to an earlier discussion.
Basically, it's a story about a bunch of really rich wannabes who live their cycling dream vicariously. They pony up big bucks to ride with Disco and have taken over , with TW, the USCF. It's been a few months since I read the article, so my facts may be slightly off.

[e-RICHIE]

I am unable to access the Outside links at the moment. I'm receiving a "Failure To Connect To Web Server" reponse from the website. In the meantime, what are your thoughts on it? If you wish me to respond seriously, please do not answer with a one liner unless it is a link to an earlier discussion.
well you're new here - but access the search feature
and see all of my points of view about it, because i was
talking about it mor than 3 years ago, and all through
to the present. as a lifelong cycling fan, one who has an
interest at the regional and national level, it bug-the-shet-
outa'-me to see a bunch ofentitled acting cats decide that golf
tournaments and america's cup campaigns should take a back
seat to buying a sport and co-opting its success. atmo, their
intercession has done much more harm than any good that has
come from it. that is why - again, if you're not tired of it yet - i
liken it to a the boys from brazil meets the manchurian
candidate combined with the skull and bones club situation.
some of these folks are very nice and incredibly sincere, but as
an energy force that wants to take over cycling, they creep me out.
are you feelin' me?

[Roy E. Munson]

A climbers job is to drop the sprinters on the climb. A sprinters job is to not get dropped on the climb

What's the point here? George really can't do either anymore.

[PanTerra]

well you're new here - but access the search feature
and see all of my points of view about it, because i was
talking about it mor than 3 years ago, and all through
to the present. as a lifelong cycling fan, one who has an
interest at the regional and national level, it bug-the-shet-
outa'-me to see a bunch ofentitled acting cats decide that golf
tournaments and america's cup campaigns should take a back
seat to buying a sport and co-opting its success. atmo, their
intercession has done much more harm than any good that has
come from it. that is why - again, if you're not tired of it yet - i
liken it to a the boys from brazil meets the manchurian
candidate combined with the skull and bones club situation.
some of these folks are very nice and incredibly sincere, but as
an energy force that wants to take over cycling, they creep me out.
are you feelin' me?All right, where's Atmo, and what have you done to him?

[93legendti]

the most interesting fact about the Andreus testimony is that they were subpoenaed by the Texas arbitration panel and their response was they would not willingly comply. A Michigan Court said they had to comply or face the penalty of contempt of court. So, they went to Texas un willingly and testified under oath with the understanding that the transcripts would be sealed. looking at the Adreus motivation, they had nothing to gain and could only lose...

I wonder what the penalty for perjury is in Texas? :)

[Lifelover]

The question is , why post if you are not sure?........... :confused:


If everyone lived up to this standard the baord would have been very, very quiet over the last few days.

This I know for sure!

P.s.

Archi seems a little over the top with his defense of people he knows nothing of.

[GoJavs]

I wonder what the penalty for perjury is in Texas? :)

93L - what exactly are you implying with that? Nice, real nice. :butt:

[Archibald]

Archi seems a little over the top with his defense of people he knows nothing of.I don't see how this can be possible when considering the statements made by those condemning people they know nothing about. I don't recall having made any outrageous or unreasonable claims concerning anyone, but we are all blind to our own vanities.

[GoJavs]

It's been reported elsewhere that Toyota-United's team owner has a relationship with LA.....

"...From 1994 -1995 while racing as a professional cyclist, Mr. Tucker served as President of MG Sports Marketing where he created and implemented various sports marketing programs for companies. In addition, he secured sponsorship deals and speaking engagements for a variety of athletes, such as Indy Car Champion Scott Pruett and then newly crowned World Road Cycling Champion Lance Armstrong..."

Sweet.

[quaintjh]

I am unable to access the Outside links at the moment. I'm receiving a "Failure To Connect To Web Server" reponse from the website. In the meantime, what are your thoughts on it? If you wish me to respond seriously, please do not answer with a one liner unless it is a link to an earlier discussion.

The question is: Did you take the photos included in the article? :D

[J.Greene]

I wonder what the penalty for perjury is in Texas? :)

it's probably too steep for a pretty boy with shaved legs to pay. That's why I'm inclined to believe Frankie.

JG

[93legendti]

it's probably too steep for a pretty boy with shaved legs to pay. That's why I'm inclined to believe Frankie.

JG

You missed my point. If this is true: http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=235791&postcount=21, the Andreus were willing to say some thing about Lance OUTSIDE of court, which they did not want to repeat IN court while under oath. There are MANY ways to testify in a proceeding without actually travelling to the jurisdiction--particlurly if it is an arbitration--telephone, video, written questions, deposition under oath in Michigan, etc. To actually go to a Michigan Court and try to quash a subpeona--which is an order of a court, because you did not want to "voluntarily comply" makes no sense. By definition, responding to a subpeona means you are not voluntarily complying. The logical conclusion is that testifying under oath, with the penalty of perjury, somehow frightened them.

Or, put another way, good Samaritans like the Andreus, who are interested in the truth and the Rule of Law, generally do not try to dodge subpoenas about matters which they have already divulged.

[NAHBS]

It's been reported elsewhere that Toyota-United's team owner has a relationship with LA.....

"...From 1994 -1995 while racing as a professional cyclist, Mr. Tucker served as President of MG Sports Marketing where he created and implemented various sports marketing programs for companies. In addition, he secured sponsorship deals and speaking engagements for a variety of athletes, such as Indy Car Champion Scott Pruett and then newly crowned World Road Cycling Champion Lance Armstrong..."

Sweet.

Hmmmm, i used to race Juniors with Tuck...I had no clue he got this big in the Biz...

DW

[harlond]

To actually go to a Michigan Court and try to quash a subpeona--which is an order of a court, because you did not want to "voluntarily comply" makes no sense. By definition, responding to a subpeona means you are not voluntarily complying. The logical conclusion is that testifying under oath, with the penalty of perjury, somehow frightened them.

Or, put another way, good Samaritans like the Andreus, who are interested in the truth and the Rule of Law, generally do not try to dodge subpoenas about matters which they have already divulged.In my experience as a lawyer, most people try to dodge subpoenas, even those with no fear of perjury prosecution. I do not believe that the Andreu's efforts to quash the subpoena can reasonably be construed as an indication that they feared prosecution for perjury, when there are so many other good reasons to try to avoid testifying--inconvenience, business, stage fright, fear of cross-examination, desire to avoid having to disclose personal details, etc.

[J.Greene]

93,
I think you missed my point. it was a lame attmept at making a funny. Do you think frankie's shaved legs or hairstyle could ever influence his decision to tell the truth?

for the record I think they took a gut check when they realized what was about to happen, and decided that telling the truth was the best route.

JG


You missed my point. If this is true: http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=235791&postcount=21, the Andreus were willing to say some thing about Lance OUTSIDE of court, which they did not want to repeat IN court while under oath. There are MANY ways to testify in a proceeding without actually travelling to the jurisdiction--particlurly if it is an arbitration--telephone, video, written questions, deposition under oath in Michigan, etc. To actually go to a Michigan Court and try to quash a subpeona--which is an order of a court, because you did not want to "voluntarily comply" makes no sense. By definition, responding to a subpeona means you are not voluntarily complying. The logical conclusion is that testifying under oath, with the penalty of perjury, somehow frightened them.

Or, put another way, good Samaritans like the Andreus, who are interested in the truth and the Rule of Law, generally do not try to dodge subpoenas about matters which they have already divulged.

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . there's still a question hanging here for Archibald . . .

Are you the photographer in question for this story in OUTSIDE?

BBD

[MartyE]

ONLY TWO THINGS COME FROM TEXAS.....!!!!!!



William ;) ;)

PanTerra and NAHBS?

and is Kraken going to be the name of the new disco team?

marty

[stevep]

That's not nice. George is a nice guy.

A climbers job is to drop the sprinters on the climb. A sprinters job is to not get dropped on the climb. That's racing.

my belated point was that somehow george had worked his way up the list of gc contenders when i believe he did not belong on that list because he cannot climb ( spoken by one who cannot climb either... i recognize the symptoms ).
this is no slam on george who may be a nice guy and a poor climber.
george made a fateful decision 5-6 years ago to tie his career to an unnamed former rider from a southern state and thereby effectively gave up his own chance to excel in the classics...which he is pretty much built for.
he gave it up. too bad in my view.

[Archibald]

. . . there's still a question hanging here for Archibald . . .

Are you the photographer in question for this story in OUTSIDE?

BBD
To the best of my knowledge I have never had any photograph I have ever taken used in any type of publication.

[Tom]

Oh boy our Cary Grant of the bicycle's back!