Bar end shifters compatability

[john903]

Hello there,
So I am thinking of trying bar end shifters and just wondering what everyone's collective wisdom is on the compatibility's on mixing manufactures. I will be using new style Campy veloce derailleurs front and rear shifting a 34-50 compact up front and a 10 speed 13-29 in the rear. Can I use Shimano 9 or 10speed bar end shifter? What about old Suntour bar ends? Are they all friction or do they have a index mode, does it matter? Does it really matter if they are 8,9,or 10 speed if I only run them in the friction mode I wouldn't think the derailleur would care what shiftier I am using.
Thanks in advance

[Hindmost]

10 speed in friction mode is finicky to shift. I tried it on a bike: didn't like it.

I would recommend Campy 10 barends.

[oldpotatoe]

Hello there,
So I am thinking of trying bar end shifters and just wondering what everyone's collective wisdom is on the compatibility's on mixing manufactures. I will be using new style Campy veloce derailleurs front and rear shifting a 34-50 compact up front and a 10 speed 13-29 in the rear. Can I use Shimano 9 or 10speed bar end shifter? What about old Suntour bar ends? Are they all friction or do they have a index mode, does it matter? Does it really matter if they are 8,9,or 10 speed if I only run them in the friction mode I wouldn't think the derailleur would care what shiftier I am using.
Thanks in advance

No if indexed/clicking..friction, sure.

Nope again.

Friction, sure altho the RH shifter is going to have to travel a LONG way to get to the 29t cog. May run out of travel before you get there. Adjust cable TIGHT for 13t.

[RFC]

No if indexed/clicking..friction, sure.

Nope again.

Friction, sure altho the RH shifter is going to have to travel a LONG way to get to the 29t cog. May run out of travel before you get there. Adjust cable TIGHT for 13t.

+1 I like barend shifters and have them on several bikes. In friction, they work fine, just takes a little practice to get the feel. The nice thing about the old Suntours is that they are ratcheted, not indexed. You will quickly get the feel of how many clicks are necessary to make the shift.

[oliver1850]

I set a bike up for a friend with Shimano 9 cassette, RD, and SunTour bar ends. I was a bit dubious about the idea initially but it worked really well. Since a Shimano 9 cassette is nearly as wide as a C10, I'd suspect what you're talking about might work OK with a Shimano RD. I don't know about using a C10 RD. If the Campagnolo RD requires more cable pull than S9, you might run out of shifter travel.

Given some time, I can test the SunTour/C10 setup out if you want.

[john903]

Thanks for the responses folks "the pros closet" has some dura ace and ultegra bar ends if they are friction maybe I'll by them and see what happens.

Oliver 1850: Sure I would be interested in your research on the suntour/C10combo. Seattle bike swap is in February so I will probailly dig around then too looking for shifters.

SeeYa

[Geeheeb]

Ultegra SL-BS78 is 10 speed indexed and friction, but the SL-BS79 is index only. If I recall correctly most of the 8/9 speed models did both, but at 10 speed shimano started to be friction only. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

[72gmc]

I've run a Campagnolo RD and cassettte with Shimano 8 speed and 9 speed barends. Veloce loose cog 9 speed cassettes in both cases.

8 speed index worked great with cassette spacers that match the width of Shimano 8 speed spacers, purchased at the LBS. 9 speed worked best with a Jtek shiftmate--couldn't get the spacer trick to work across the cassette.

Friction, a set of Silver shifters was the best by a mile. But Shimano friction setting is OK in a pinch.

[oliver1850]

Ultegra SL-BS78 is 10 speed indexed and friction, but the SL-BS79 is index only. If I recall correctly most of the 8/9 speed models did both, but at 10 speed shimano started to be friction only. Please correct me if I'm wrong.


You have the right idea, but I think you contradicted yourself when you said friction only. I think you meant to say index only. Pretty sure 7900 was index only and all previous 7/8/9/10 shifters had friction option. That said, the Shimano SIS shifters are not nearly as nice in friction mode as several options of friction-only shifters.

[belopsky]

Something I read said go all Campy for it to work very well, otherwise it may work but not great. Wish I knew more as I like my bar ends and was thinking of doing downtube on my new build..

These work for Shimano up to 11s, maybe they can work w Campy too?
http://store.velo-orange.com/index.php/components/shifting-freewheels-cassettes/shifters/dia-compe-ene-11s-dt-shifters.html

[icepick_trotsky]

In my experience, Suntour barcons have very limited throw. I couldn't get a barcon to shift a Shimano RD across an 8 speed Shimano cassette reliably. Just ran out of shifter.

YMMV.

[ColonelJLloyd]

In my experience, Suntour barcons have very limited throw. I couldn't get a barcon to shift a Shimano RD across an 8 speed Shimano cassette reliably. Just ran out of shifter.

YMMV.

+1 Those people who say "I use these old friction shifters (DT or bar end) to shift across a 10s cassette and it's great!" are lying to themselves or have low standards. It takes like 180d of throw to shift across all cogs. We're talking about that Suntour BarCon sticking straight up perpendicular to the ground when you're in the largest cog.

There is now a friction shifter (http://store.velo-orange.com/index.php/components/shifting-freewheels-cassettes/shifters/dia-compe-ene-11s-dt-shifters.html) with a large enough barrel to shift well. But, I would either use a Campagnolo 10s bar end or Shimano or SRAM indexing bar end shifter with the appropriate Jtek Shiftmate.

[palincss]

In my experience, Suntour barcons have very limited throw. I couldn't get a barcon to shift a Shimano RD across an 8 speed Shimano cassette reliably. Just ran out of shifter.

YMMV.

When you say "Suntour barcons" do you mean the original 1st gen that Suntour actually called a barcon or are you speaking generically? The later generation Suntour Sprint shifter, that Rivendell had resurrected as the "Silver" (also available under the Dia Compe brand name) works fine across an 8 speed cassette.

http://harriscyclery.net/merchant/370/images/zoom/LD102.jpg

[icepick_trotsky]

I was referring to the original first generation barcon. Later suntour bar ends that I've used have had longer throw.

[john903]

Oh I like those silver Rivendell versions i'll drop them an e-mail.
Thank You for the help.

[oliver1850]

So I set up a C10 bike with the SunTour (Raleigh branded) Power Ratchet barcons. Used a 2005 ish Centaur 10 short cage RD, KMC X10 chain, 14-23 Campagnolo cassette. It shifts across all 10 gears with no chattering or hesitation at either end. Just shifting on the stand it's hard to get a feel for how well it would work on the road, but there seems to be enough lever movement (2-4 clicks) in single cog shifts that it would be workable. Seems to take a bit more lever movement at the large cog end of the cassette.

I couldn't find a current production Veloce RD here. Check with Oldpotatoe to see if there's any difference in geometry between it and the one I used. You could always use an alternate cable clamp position (other side of the bolt) to make the RD move more with a given amount of cable pulled. The problem with doing that is that it would make it even more sensitive to small lever movements. Might make it hard to find the gear you want.

I think you could do some filing on the portions of the shifter that limit travel and gain a bit more lever movement. The top of the housing is where I'd start. It looks like several degrees could be gained by removing a small amount of material.

I'll switch it over to Shimano for the naysayers when I have time to mess with it.