OT: Hoboken train crash

[AngryScientist]

I was in this damned station yesterday. Hope all oof our NJ/NYC paceliners are safe out there!

http://media.breitbart.com/media/2016/09/GettyImages-611263426-640x480.jpg

[weisan]

Wow!

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/09/29/nyregion/hoboken-nj-transit-train-crash-maps.html

https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/2016/09/29/hoboken-traincrash/5d9c26a70505ee1592b33a001d723e43b3a73690/diagram-Artboard_1.png

[christian]

Trump is having a good week! He's only the 2nd biggest train wreck in America.

[fellowpicker]

No need for that.

[OtayBW]

Trump is having a good week! He's only the 2nd biggest train wreck in America.
I'm going to disagree with that statement and comment no further.....:bike:

[beeatnik]

No need for that.
aka politics and religion

wait, is trump a politician (preacher)?

[Tony T]

"The Debate"

https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14462859_1312005398830210_6659635798062769795_n.jp g?oh=e2582d2965cce5183930cc2993debe05&oe=5863EB0E

[weisan]

Is this the time and the place to crack jokes or make political statements?

https://www.google.com/amp/nypost.com/2016/09/29/cops-identify-woman-killed-in-hoboken-train-crash/amp/?client=ms-android-sprint-mvno-us

[gasman]

Is this the time and the place to crack jokes or make political statements?

https://www.google.com/amp/nypost.com/2016/09/29/cops-identify-woman-killed-in-hoboken-train-crash/amp/?client=ms-android-sprint-mvno-us

Nope

[AngryScientist]

Is this the time and the place to crack jokes or make political statements?

https://www.google.com/amp/nypost.com/2016/09/29/cops-identify-woman-killed-in-hoboken-train-crash/amp/?client=ms-android-sprint-mvno-us

agreed. lots of people were hurt and someone lost their life today. very sad, especially for that young woman and her very young family.

[Louis]

Is this the time and the place to crack jokes or make political statements?

For the record, this is also a political issue because both federal and state politicians have over the last generation or so woefully underfunded our transportation infrastructure.

As our bridges corrode away public transportation languishes and safety improvement projects are left undone. When is the right time to discuss the issues at hand, before or after more tragedies like this happen? Or should we just ignore the whole thing and continue as we have been?

How about if we just say some prayers for the injured and the dead. Will that be enough? It certainly will be cheaper as far as the tax bill goes April 15th. Whether it's final cost to our consciences is as good a deal is for each of us to determine in our own hearts.

[veloduffer]

I walk right by that part of the station every day, including today but an hour earlier. The train came onto the concourse right near the stairway to the PATH train - many more fatalities could have occurred, but one is already too many.

I was also on a NJ Train that derailed earlier this year. Luckily, we were just pulling out of a station in Montclair and the passenger car went off the track at low speed. The car remained upright and no one was hurt.

And back in 2001, I walked out of the World Trade Center about 15 minutes before the first plane hit.

Let's leave the heated political rhetoric out of this. It's always more complicated than the simple rants.

Someone died today doing a simple thing like getting to work. Bad things can happen to good people. So try to be happy, helpful and hug your family every day.

[shovelhd]

I have a question. I've ridden the PATH from Hoboken to Manhattan. This train came from the north, though. It wasn't Metro North. Was it the light rail system, or does the PATH also go up to parts of Westchester?

Some people think the Hoboken station is a dump, others, like me, see it as a leap back in time, when the rails ruled transportation. It's not an architectural marvel, but it's interesting to observe. I wonder if they're going to fix it or raze it.

Thoughts to that poor woman's family.

[ltwtsculler91]

I have a question. I've ridden the PATH from Hoboken to Manhattan. This train came from the north, though. It wasn't Metro North. Was it the light rail system, or does the PATH also go up to parts of Westchester?

Some people think the Hoboken station is a dump, others, like me, see it as a leap back in time, when the rails ruled transportation. It's not an architectural marvel, but it's interesting to observe. I wonder if they're going to fix it or raze it.

Thoughts to that poor woman's family.


It was the NJ Transit commuter rail that runs on the traditional tracks and links into NY's Metro North. The train was on the Pascack Valley line which runs from Spring Valley, NY (Rockland County, near Nyack) down through Bergen County, NJ into Hoboken.

My dad is usually on that train but was working from home, and several friends were on it. Thankfully they were all alright, but the whole thing was a tragedy especially for the woman killed and those severely injured

[ANAO]

I have a question. I've ridden the PATH from Hoboken to Manhattan. This train came from the north, though. It wasn't Metro North. Was it the light rail system, or does the PATH also go up to parts of Westchester?

Some people think the Hoboken station is a dump, others, like me, see it as a leap back in time, when the rails ruled transportation. It's not an architectural marvel, but it's interesting to observe. I wonder if they're going to fix it or raze it.

Thoughts to that poor woman's family.

I agree with you. When I head to the in-laws in Suffern for some weekending, I take the Path into Hoboken from WTC and then take the NJ Transit up there. I appreciate the waiting room, and try to get there 15 minutes before the train is scheduled to leave to give me time to enjoy a snack in the station.

Terrible news, I might be leaving work an hour earlier when weekending next, and just take the bike up there as I've been wont to do from time to time.

[Mr. Pink]

I have a question. I've ridden the PATH from Hoboken to Manhattan. This train came from the north, though. It wasn't Metro North. Was it the light rail system, or does the PATH also go up to parts of Westchester?

Some people think the Hoboken station is a dump, others, like me, see it as a leap back in time, when the rails ruled transportation. It's not an architectural marvel, but it's interesting to observe. I wonder if they're going to fix it or raze it.

Thoughts to that poor woman's family.


You'd be surprised how many times that waiting room has been used as a film location. You've seen it a lot.
Beware of politicians telling you they are going to "fix" a landmark by "razing" it. Prime example is across the river. Grand Central vs Penn Station. Fortunately, that Penn Station debacle convinced many mayors and councils across the country how smart it is to renovate their downtown legacy train stations, instead of tearing it down and putting up another "multi use" complex.

[ANAO]

You'd be surprised how many times that waiting room has been used as a film location. You've seen it a lot.
Beware of politicians telling you they are going to "fix" a landmark by "razing" it. Prime example is across the river. Grand Central vs Penn Station. Fortunately, that Penn Station debacle convinced many mayors and councils across the country how smart it is to renovate their downtown legacy train stations, instead of tearing it down and putting up another "multi use" complex.

I don't care for the PATH station @ WTC with the whole shopping mall going on now. I don't know where they got their ideas (although I imagine google could tell me, if I really cared).

[AngryScientist]

I don't care for the PATH station @ WTC with the whole shopping mall going on now. I don't know where they got their ideas (although I imagine google could tell me, if I really cared).

i commute through WTC almost daily. i dont "get" the whole mall thing with a bunch of high end stores. seems misplaced to me. most of the people moving through there are commuter drones who have little or no interest in buying a rolex on their way home from work.

the coffee shops arent even open yet!

[ANAO]

i commute through WTC almost daily. i dont "get" the whole mall thing with a bunch of high end stores. seems misplaced to me. most of the people moving through there are commuter drones who have little or no interest in buying a rolex on their way home from work.

the coffee shops arent even open yet!

To contrast, I do like the Fulton "Oracle" I go through when I don't ride. (A,C,E,J,Z,2,3,4,5). And they even have kosher bread in one of the cafes. But some of the other stores do seem misplaced. Chocolatier? Who's stopping for chocolate on their way home?

[MattTuck]

To contrast, I do like the Fulton "Oracle" I go through when I don't ride. (A,C,E,J,Z,2,3,4,5). And they even have kosher bread in one of the cafes. But some of the other stores do seem misplaced. Chocolatier? Who's stopping for chocolate on their way home?

I would. It's why I climb hills like a walrus :(

[veloduffer]

i commute through WTC almost daily. i dont "get" the whole mall thing with a bunch of high end stores. seems misplaced to me. most of the people moving through there are commuter drones who have little or no interest in buying a rolex on their way home from work.

the coffee shops arent even open yet!

Well there were shops in the old WTC before 9/11, but is was a mixture of shops the were not high end. I think the high-end retail concept is similar to the shops in Heathrow Airport.

No bikes shops there (although a shop selling Pinarellos would fit in).:p

[veloduffer]

You'd be surprised how many times that waiting room has been used as a film location. You've seen it a lot.
Beware of politicians telling you they are going to "fix" a landmark by "razing" it. Prime example is across the river. Grand Central vs Penn Station. Fortunately, that Penn Station debacle convinced many mayors and councils across the country how smart it is to renovate their downtown legacy train stations, instead of tearing it down and putting up another "multi use" complex.

I don't think the Waiting Room was damaged. Mostly the canopy roof around the tracks, which was in poor shape anyway (it leaks when it rains).

Unfortunately, the station had nearly completed its repair work from Sandy and now its back to square one.

[fiamme red]

I don't care for the PATH station @ WTC with the whole shopping mall going on now. I don't know where they got their ideas (although I imagine google could tell me, if I really cared).I really dislike the new $4 billion PATH station. It seems to have been built as a shopping mall primarily (with public money), its function as a train station being an afterthought.

And maybe it's just me, but if I have to wait for a train more than 5 minutes, the constant loud recorded escalator announcements drive me crazy: "Stand forward; don’t run or walk on escalators; keep children in your sight; hold the handrail when using escalators; don’t use the escalators for oversized luggage; stand forward, etc."

[AngryScientist]

"We are working hard to keep you safe on PATH everyday..."

I agree, the pre recorded messages are maddening !

[paredown]

My lovely wife's train (out of Suffern) was the next one in. They stopped them at Secaucus instead of continuing on to Hoboken.

Today was a disaster--Sunday schedule, so no express trains from out here in the hinterland... a lot of folks stayed home today, judging by the parking lot.

Word is the engineer is one of the good guys--by the book, no alcohol, drugs, or cell phones. So they are thinking that it was a health issue--stroke or?

Repairs in Hoboken are going to be complicated--apparently there is structural damage as well as pipes that are covered in asbestos, so that will take a while....

If you have complaints about the Path station, blame the Port Authority. My building partner worked on the mall side--and has never been on a worse-run construction project in her life.

i commute through WTC almost daily. i dont "get" the whole mall thing with a bunch of high end stores. seems misplaced to me. most of the people moving through there are commuter drones who have little or no interest in buying a rolex on their way home from work.

the coffee shops arent even open yet!

There is a funny story involving the 'no coffee shop' problem--certain construction folks did not get their cores done in a timely manner to provide drainage, water etc, and they waited until it is going to be extremely expensive and slow to get them done. A giant cluster **** to be sure.

[gemship]

I haven't read the entire discussion here thus far but I think it's an amazing tragic event. I mean it makes one wonder why they don't have technology to avoid something like this. You would think the brain of the train or the railway would take over and automatically put on the brakes. Maybe it's not that simple?

[Mr. Pink]

I really dislike the new $4 billion PATH station. It seems to have been built as a shopping mall primarily (with public money), its function as a train station being an afterthought.

And maybe it's just me, but if I have to wait for a train more than 5 minutes, the constant loud recorded escalator announcements drive me crazy: "Stand forward; don’t run or walk on escalators; keep children in your sight; hold the handrail when using escalators; don’t use the escalators for oversized luggage; stand forward, etc."

Where did they find the architect? Good lord, the only time I went to the 911 museum, I was forced to stare at the exterior of that thing for five minutes in a ticket line. It looks like something the art director of Aliens would come up with.

[BobO]

I haven't read the entire discussion here thus far but I think it's an amazing tragic event. I mean it makes one wonder why they don't have technology to avoid something like this. You would think the brain of the train or the railway would take over and automatically put on the brakes. Maybe it's not that simple?

The technology exists. It was not in place on this train. I suspect that the systems on this particular train were too old to accept such systems as an upgrade.

[oldpotatoe]

I haven't read the entire discussion here thus far but I think it's an amazing tragic event. I mean it makes one wonder why they don't have technology to avoid something like this. You would think the brain of the train or the railway would take over and automatically put on the brakes. Maybe it's not that simple?

They do but only 20% of trains in the US have it.

https://www.aar.org/policy/positive-train-control

[binxnyrwarrsoul]

The technology exists. It was not in place on this train. I suspect that the systems on this particular train were too old to accept such systems as an upgrade.

Technology is here and in use, but it's not cheap. As it always seems to be, it's about political infighting and money. And the most powerful Governor in the country, who historically is a my way or the highway type of person.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/30/nyregion/nj-transit-executive-director.html?_r=0

[jemoryl]

"We are working hard to keep you safe on PATH everyday..."

I agree, the pre recorded messages are maddening !

If you think it is maddening as a commuter, you should experience it on a weekend at night, when the frequency of trains is less. Vile thoughts of taking an icepick to the speakers went through some people's minds. And I think they must have had a lot of complaints, as the frequency and volume of the announcements seems less.

I agree with others about the ridiculous mall they built instead of a station. Wonder how many of those luxury shops will survive the next economic bust cycle?

[gemship]

They do but only 20% of trains in the US have it.

https://www.aar.org/policy/positive-train-control

It's amazing, here in Ma. our transit system is very outdated technology wise. It struggles to stay on schedule during the winter months and they are barely running a business. Always crying poor mouth. I'm surprised our taxes don't go up more for all the railways not to mention bridges and roads.

[Mr. Pink]

Go to Europe and experience their train system. You'll just shake your head at ours. And, it's not as though the highway system has been sacrificed for investment in rails. I drove all over northern Italy last year, highways and byways, and was really impressed. Also impressed at the quality of highway driving, but, that's going off topic.......

[BobO]

Technology is here and in use, but it's not cheap. As it always seems to be, it's about political infighting and money. And the most powerful Governor's in the country, who historically is a my way or the highway type of person.

I wonder how those books look now? :rolleyes:

Go to Europe and experience their train system. You'll just shake your head at ours. And, it's not as though the highway system has been sacrificed for investment in rails. I drove all over northern Italy last year, highways and byways, and was really impressed. Also impressed at the quality of highway driving, but, that's going off topic.......

Overall it probably is on topic as this incident may be directly related to failed infrastructure. For the most part the people we have elected over the past several decades have not prioritized the maintenance of infrastructure. Highways and trains are actually the least of that as they are the toughest to hide from public view. Some of our dams, sewers and water systems are in such a state of disrepair that its a miracle they're still working at all.