Today's Tour Stage SPOILER: ***? . . .

[BumbleBeeDave]

I thought today was when things were really supposed to start happening with some people we hoped to be favorites . . .

So Whuh Hoppened???

Neither Mercado nor Dessel seems to be what I thought would be a "favorite," though it certainly is nice to have these two teams get some glory . . .

BBD

[atmo]

I thought today was when things were really supposed to start happening with some people we hoped to be favorites . . .

So Whuh Hoppened???

Neither Mercado nor Dessel seems to be what I thought would be a "favorite," though it certainly is nice to have these two teams get some glory . . .

BBD
hold the mayo atmo

[max_powers]

who wants to fry out on first Mtn stage. or perhaps top dudes aching for a fix of hot sauce :)

[coylifut]

the first mountain top finish is where the big attacks happen. wasn't it like 40k from the top of the last climb? the group coming to the line was huge. the big guns knew it would be.

[Jason E]

Wow I had Mayo picked for tomorow, but he lost 24 minutes today....

Guess he'll be fresh for tomorrow! :rolleyes:

I have to wonder about T-Mobile. No big deal if Gonchaar or Kesslar are doing pulls, but at one point I saw Kloden doing a pull. Shouldn't he be out of the wind?

Not to impressed with them controling the front and giving away all that time. They did not have to defend the jersey, but then they should have moved off the front.

[saab2000]

The story of today is the losers, not the winners. And since there is no dominant favorite like in the past years, there is no team willing to ride with the same authority and dominance as US Postal and Discovery of the past year, wearing everyone out.

This is how the race is in transition times, like 1987 and 1988 and 1996.

[sspielman]

ATMO, there were a couple of surprises today.....One of the big ones was the disintegration of Iban Mayo. After Dauphine, he suposedly was going well...but he failed to show today. The other was the great ride by Dessel and Mercado. I had Mercado on my list as a top 20 finisher, but he may be able to hold on for better than that. Dessel's ride puts AG2R in a good position. it is a great card for them to play against T-Mobile to advance Moreau up the standings. I still think that he will finish on the podium. I was really surprised to see Discovery ride such a passive race..with their best rider in 15th now, time is running out...to quote one of our local county councilmen, " You can't never miss out on no opportunities......"

[goonster]

Not to impressed with them controling the front and giving away all that time. They did not have to defend the jersey, but then they should have moved off the front.

+1

Why spend the whole day riding tempo when you are neither eliminating rivals nor reducing the gap to the break? They should have let Discovery, Phonak et al do some work.

Mayo is effed but good, and you've got to think that the team's morale is now in the toilet. I was surprised to see Garate in the grupetto too.

Did Levi really crack near the summit of the last col? He seems to back on form somewhat, but maybe he's not quite there. Totschnig is now eight minutes back on GC (2 min. ahead of Levi), which may let him get into a break at some point. (Damn, I still want one of those Austrian champ jerseys from a couple of years ago, but I don't think they were ever sold anywhere)

[Jason E]

ATMO, there were a couple of surprises today.....One of the big ones was the disintegration of Iban Mayo. After Dauphine, he suposedly was going well...but he failed to show today. The other was the great ride by Dessel and Mercado. I had Mercado on my list as a top 20 finisher, but he may be able to hold on for better than that. Dessel's ride puts AG2R in a good position. it is a great card for them to play against T-Mobile to advance Moreau up the standings. I still think that he will finish on the podium. I was really surprised to see Discovery ride such a passive race..with their best rider in 15th now, time is running out...to quote one of our local county councilmen, " You can't never miss out on no opportunities......"

Quite a few of the top 15-20 will be nowhere near the top after tomorrow. I think we should wait to see how tomorrow plays out before we start thinking time is running short.

[saab2000]

Time is not running out. The race has only just begun. It will be a race of attrition. Some favorites lost time today. Others didn't.

To paraphrase a story, ".... and then there were nine.... and then there were eight...."

[Fat Robert]

what coy said

the key is the stage profile, bbd. its not 1958, and bahamontes isn't going to attack on the first climb and solo 45k after the last climb. since the 70s, time gaps are opened up on summit finishes and time trials, unless something unusual happens like the st. etienne stage in 90 or the mende stage in 95.

the peloton gave the french teams a chance at a stage win. and ag2r has no cards to play for the overall, and they know it....

the key today is to watch who was smooth and handled the last climb well -- when you watch the stage, look for little signs of fatigue amongst the overall contenders -- who looks fluid, who is pushing the gears a little, or who shoots backward when rasmussen goes for mountains points (uh...levi). that will tell you a bit about who is going to lose time tomorrow and who is really in for this thing.

[jeffg]

Levi & Cunego looked to be in big trouble, too, though they did reintergrate the group, no?

[Fat Robert]

well

if a gc "contender" can't get back into the group on the descent, or over 45k, they should a) get a new doctor, b) go back to the mattress factory, or c) start fiddling with something on their bike and tell everyone they had a mechanical.

[spiderlake]

It was all downhill after Marie Blanque which gave everyone a chance to regroup and get ready for a sprint finish.

[Keith A]

I watched an interview with Floyd before the start of the race today and he wasn't too concerned about today's stage, he said that tomorrow will be one of the crucial stages in this years TdF. There is one HC climb at the beginning and the four cat 1 climbs with the last one coming at the finish. There will certainly be some fireworks tomorrow.

http://www.awesomebackgrounds.com/templates/as-fireworks-anim-1.GIF

[sspielman]

the peloton gave the french teams a chance at a stage win. and ag2r has no cards to play for the overall, and they know it....




I'll say it again.... Moreau, bro, ATMO

[Fat Robert]

I'll say it again.... Moreau, bro, ATMO

his island was mad funky, so is his hair, so is that dog-tongue thing he does

(self-experimentation after the isle, imho)

but

he's not doing anything in this tour

(well, being fantasy-fodder for some slightly frumpy, Right Said Fred-listening, alluring-yet-matronly single 32-year-old checkout girl at super u is something, but that doesn't count....)

[sspielman]

his island was mad funky, so is his hair, so is that dog-tongue thing he does

(self-experimentation after the isle, imho)

but

he's not doing anything in this tour

(well, being fantasy-fodder for some slightly frumpy, Right Said Fred-listening, alluring-yet-matronly single 32-year-old checkout girl at super u is something, but that doesn't count....)

Big man, you just leave that edit button alone after tomorrow when my man does his thing in on the three cat 1's....with or without his styling mousse*

*French for mousse

[goonster]

I'll say it again.... Moreau

he's not doing anything in this tour


Not that I normally goad people into this kind of thing, but since I'm currently on track to treat someone to a very nice bottle . . .

Let's see you guys put some money on the table! :beer:

[Fat Robert]

Not that I normally goad people into this kind of thing, but since I'm currently on track to treat someone to a very nice bottle . . .

Let's see you guys put some money on the table! :beer:

no way...keno will tell you that i do pay up, but i also do things like leave the stamped envelope in my truck for two months, forget about it, and then mail it.

anyway, yeehaw and i already have the cheeseburger wager. that's enough for my budget.

i will bet one set of 44cm ritchey wcs dork bars that one of us is right, and send those bars to the loser of the bet, just because i want them off my bench

[sspielman]

It should be noted that Vladimir Karpets consolidated his lead in the mullet competition today. He now stands in 10th place at 5:37. In other mullet news, all-time great Laurent Brochard was a non starter....

(You think I make this crap up?)

[Fat Robert]

is the mullet competition won on time, length, or number of autographs requested by french urban white trash chicks?

[93legendti]

...i will bet one set of 44cm ritchey wcs dork bars that one of us is right, and send those bars to the loser of the bet, just because i want them off my bench

Why not just trade them to me for my once ridden, 44cm ritchey poseur(*) bars, I mean, wcs classic bend bars? :)



*French Canadian for Poser.

[jeffg]

well

if a gc "contender" can't get back into the group on the descent, or over 45k, they should a) get a new doctor, b) go back to the mattress factory, or c) start fiddling with something on their bike and tell everyone they had a mechanical.

Exactly. So you going to tell Mayo or should I?

[Fat Robert]

Why not just trade them to me for my once ridden, 44cm ritchey poseur(*) bars, I mean, wcs classic bend bars? :)



*French Canadian for Poser.

i'm riding the oval concepts parvenu* model now. the ritcheys are so 2005.


*patois for par just got here

[Fat Robert]

Exactly. So you going to tell Mayo or should I?

mayo is working up a good brifter story as we type

[93legendti]

i'm riding the oval concepts parvenu* model now. the ritcheys are so 2005.


*patois for par just got here


Is that Southern speak for:"I do not want your Ritchey WCS Classic Bend 44cm bars?" :)

[Fat Robert]

Is that Southern speak for:"I do not want your Ritchey WCS Classic Bend 44cm bars?" :)

well...yeah...because i'm looking to move two pairs myself

ovals have deeper drops...more room for the flippers

[Ray]

Levi and Mayo were the strong men in the Dauphine. Both of them have given back boatloads of time already and the fireworks haven't even started yet. Mayo must have been sick today - he looked like ME on that first climb and we never saw him again after that. Levi said he's feeling much better but didn't eat enough and bonked. But they're both effectively cooked at this point. Most of the guys who kept their powder dry in the Dauphine are still looking comfortable, waiting for the racing to begin. I guess Moreau is hanging in there so far and he was good in the DL, but he's not gonna finish on the podium of the Tour again.

Is it a given that if you ride hard in the Dauphine that you're gonna be cooked by the Tour? Wasn't always like that, was it?

-Ray

[sspielman]

is the mullet competition won on time, length, or number of autographs requested by french urban white trash chicks?

It is on time, but bonuses are awarded for the other named categories....

[Fixed]

bro watch the spiderman thurs.
cheers
bro I taking the week off from training for this stuff . just doing the 30 mile day gig . we might not have a winner till paris. cool

[harlond]

Is it a given that if you ride hard in the Dauphine that you're gonna be cooked by the Tour? Wasn't always like that, was it?It wasn't in 1995, 2002, or 2003, when Indurain, Armstrong, and Armstrong did the Dauphine-TdF double.

[Fat Robert]

the dauphine is a fickle mistress

if a guy wins it because he's a notch above everyone else, and just starting his final training cycle for the tour, he can win both (hinault indurain, armstrong, mottet was good at being in the hunt at both races, as was robert millar at one time, i think zimmerman won it in his good year at the tour in 86)

if a guy wins it because he's just hitting his peak, then he's cooked at the tour.

the trouble is, for a guy like levi or charly -- who is close to being a tour winner, but not quite there -- it can be very difficult to tell during the training process whether he's finally made the jump to being a notch above everyone else or whether he's hitting a peak. that's why sometimes a dauphine winner (mayo, dufaux) can get spanked in the tour.

[Jason E]

Agreed, burning so brightly so soon.... yadda yadda.

I do hope Levi has a few good days though. I've never rooted for him, but I've never rooted against him either.

[Ray]

It wasn't in 1995, 2002, or 2003, when Indurain, Armstrong, and Armstrong did the Dauphine-TdF double.
Right, but in 2003, he pretty much credited the effort he put out in the Dauphine for almost costing him the Tour. And I guess a LOT of things were easier if your name was Indurain or Armstrong :beer:

-Ray

[Grant McLean]

Last year, stage 9, the Disco boys let Rasmussen and Moreau go in the break and
they finished up over 6 minutes on the Armstrong group. Today in the OLN
coverage, they kept going on and on how they couldn't remember a time
when the teams let "so many riders up the road". Considering those two
finished 7th and 11th, they were pretty well placed, and still not considered
an overall threat. I didn't think today was anything to worry about, it should
have been totally expected.

Tomorrow could be awesome, but what if Thor is the only rider to finish in
Paris, does he get all the jerseys?

[manet]

Tomorrow could be awesome, but what if Thor is the only rider to finish in
Paris, does he get all the jerseys?

does'nt he still have 2k to go in the TT?!

[pdxmech13]

While contemplating the race today I started to wonder if it would have been a good idea to let Il Falco spread his wings and gain just a little time. There have been few to manage his wheel and even taking just 30 seconds of his deficit would be a start of something for Disco.

[taz-t]

Last year, stage 9, the Disco boys let Rasmussen and Moreau go in the break and
they finished up over 6 minutes on the Armstrong group. Today in the OLN
coverage, they kept going on and on how they couldn't remember a time
when the teams let "so many riders up the road". Considering those two
finished 7th and 11th, they were pretty well placed, and still not considered
an overall threat. I didn't think today was anything to worry about, it should
have been totally expected.

Tomorrow could be awesome, but what if Thor is the only rider to finish in
Paris, does he get all the jerseys?

2001 Stage 8 had a huge break (15 riders?) that ended 35 mins up on the peloton. It wasn't a mtn stage so maybe not an apples to apples comparison, but it put O'Grady in yellow for about a week. Guess the OLN guys have a short memory.

Oh yeah - sticks in my mind 'cause I was at the start. A sh*tty, rainy day in Alsace watching the Tour is better than any day sitting in a cubicle. Although the day before was pretty scary - some delusional Frenchie drove his car into the crowd watching the jersey presentation because officials wouldn't let him talk to his hero, Jalabert. Anybody remember that?

- Taz

[BBB]

Agreed, it has happened before and I think any time gains made by the break will be wiped away pretty quickly over the Tourmalet et al. What surprised me was not that the break was let go (or some fancied riders wilted on the climbs), but that T-Mobile persisted in chasing for so long. At the base of the second climb when it was obvious the jersey was lost, I'm surprised they weren't told to sit up to force some of the other contender's teams to help chase. Phonak and Discovery were given an armchair ride and if T-Mobile, strong though they may be, blow completely tonight then no doubt the various members of this forum will again be questioning their tactical wisdom.

There will be some fire works tonight and I doubt any one team is strong enough to control the racing. Hopefully this will lead to a bit of a free for all and entertainment for us punters.

[Ray]

While contemplating the race today I started to wonder if it would have been a good idea to let Il Falco spread his wings and gain just a little time. There have been few to manage his wheel and even taking just 30 seconds of his deficit would be a start of something for Disco.
If the finish was at the bottom of a technical descent off of the last mountain, sure - give him some rope. That's where he shines and there's little if any payback the next day in terms of energy expenditure. But the stage 10 finish was 40K from the last summit with lots and lots of flat riding and a little bit of uphill involved. Paulo would have used way too much energy for probably nothing and certainly not much and would have been in trouble today. He'd have been chased if he got any kind of gap at all.

Stage 17 ends with a 12 km descent from the Joux Plane down to Morzine. If he's in contention and goes over the top with the other contenders, THAT would be the place to turn him loose. There are a couple of stages with smaller descents at the end, but I think it has to be pretty fast and technical before he has a real advantage going downhill.

-Ray

[yeehawfactor]

cyclingnews is reporting that mayo says that he has a sore throat from the air conditioner at the hotel. perhaps he is a dauphine peaker, not a notch about everyone at the dauphine tour winner

[BumbleBeeDave]

I've never won a Tour stage after sleeping in a motel, either. :rolleyes:

We should start an excuse list for these guys. It would make interesting reading . . .

BBD

[BumbleBeeDave]

From today's Cyclingnews.com . . .

BBD

___________________________________

Ludwig defends tactics

By Hedwig Kröner in Tarbes

T-Mobile team manager Olaf Ludwig has defended his team's tactics yesterday, which saw T-Mobile lose the yellow jersey to AG2R, but still ride on the front all day. "Yes, but did we defend the jersey? No," he told Cyclingnews in Tarbes before the start of stage 11.

At the end of the stage, the gap between the peloton and Cyril Dessel was 7'23. "I think it is small enough," said Ludwig. "We tried to make the other teams to ride, too, but they decided not to. So we just limited the time difference. And we did try to have somebody in the break - the group that left was the first one where we unfortunately weren't represented."

[Fat Robert]

tonight:

mayo will go home

boonen will be beat the crap out of that money-grabbing midget rujano, as per lefevre's orders

disco will sit around waiting for lance to yell at everyone to motivate them