OT: '09 VW Beetle 5-spd Clutch slave/master cyl

[Red Tornado]

Bought this car for the wife last spring, mileage was mid-60's. In short, this week will be the third time about 1 1/2 years we have had to replace the clutch master & slave cylinders. There is no VW dealer ion the city where we live, but there is a "foreign car only" shop that works mostly on Euro cars and has a very good reputation in town. Always use VW parts.
Symptoms we have now: difficult to shift when running, shifts easy when not running & if you start it in 1st or Rev with the clutch pedal pressed all the way down the car wants to creep forward/backward when you crank the motor. Same symptoms as the last two times. First time it happened, they found one of the two cables or links from the shifter were broken, so replaced it but last time nothing broken and as far as I can tell still OK now.
With all the VW owners on this forum, I thought maybe ya'll could tell me if VW makes crappy clutch cylinders, is there a different brand we could try, is this a wide-spread problem with late 90's VW's w/manual trans in general? Just looking for some general input. Wife loves to drive the car, gets decent mileage, but this is starting to really annoy me. At several hundred dollars a pop, I don't want to replace these on the average of 2X a year.
Another smaller, but annoying, thing is the passenger side headlight pod or can. Over the past year I've noticed it moves just far enough to unplug itself from the "socket", and of course none of the bulbs will light up. When I see it happening (approx every 4-6 weeks), I unlock the can push it back into p;ace - about 1/8" or so - and lock it down again. I'm guessing the lock is worn maybe? Anyone else experience this with the "new" Beetles?
Thanks.

[Red Tornado]

Wow, no replies. Figured with all the VW owners here there would be at least a couple Beetle owners that might have had the same experience. Oh well, I guess not.
Anyhoo....
A friend who has a mobile auto/truck repair business took a look at it and he recommended a shop in town that has worked on a lot of foreign cars and supposedly does a good job. I hadn't heard of this place before but I thought, OK I'm striking out with this car anyway what's the harm in letting them have a look at the brake/clutch system?
After they had it for a couple days, they told me it needed a new clutch and the master & slave cylinders were working properly; car has 77K on it. So, I really was skeptical that the clutch was the issue, since in between repairs, the tranny shift great. But I'm not a mechanic, so I gave them permission to replace the clutch.
$2K later, I go to drive it home. Paid earlier in the day & came back to get later that eve w/the wife. Shifts great from 1st to 2nd and all other gears through 5th. Kinda hard to get into 1st gear. Also goes in reverse easily, but difficult to take out of reverse. Overall the shifting is slightly better than before, but now have two gears that still give me trouble. Prob will take it back to see if there's something that can be adjusted maybe/hopefully?
So basically everything, except the transmission itself, has been replaced and the problem is still there. I'm starting to wonder if a new tranny is next. Tranny is quiet and seems to be really smooth when driving the car.
Suffice it to say this is both my first and my last VW Beetle. Car has been nothing but a headache since the first couple months we owned it.
My buddy & the shop that replaced the clutch told me they thought I should sell it and get something else. Told me they're designed & built "cheaply". I'm starting to agree. problem is, until I get the shifting issues taken care of, I can't even sell it. And by the time I do, I'll have so much money invested in this car I won't be able to get it back selling/trading at a fair market price.
Anyone experience anything similar with other VW models? Is the Beetle the only piece of crap they make?

[shovelhd]

I don't want to jinx my car that's currently in the shop but I've not had any issues with VW manual transmissions. The hydraulic issues don't make sense to me. I'd be looking at the flywheel, output shaft, stuff like that. Good luck.

[josephr]

posting a response to let you know someone is reading and sympathizing, however, not really knowledgeable on new beetles...my last VW was a 1998 Golf and had linkage problems with a busted plastic bushing thing....still shifting into 1st/reverse gave some trouble. Figured the synchronizer was binding up and would let out the clutch a bit to move the tranny a hair and then it'd behave correctly.

could be linkage, could be a worn out synchronizer (since 1st/reverse are the same)...hard to say being an internet away.

[staggerwing]

While not speaking directly to your Beetle, I just had to have the clutch in my '05 Mazda3 replaced at ~77,000miles. I saw what they pulled out, and it was well and truly "toast" with the friction material completely shredded on the pressure plate side, and very little left on the flywheel side. The new Exedy (Japanese OEM) clutch didn't seem like it had much material either.

The guy I used for mine is a certified cheapskate, but insisted he would only warranty the work if we replaced the flywheel too. Said the tolerances were too tight to risk grinding the original flywheel.

I've had 4 manual transmission cars previously, including a '94 VR6 Passat, that all made it past 100,000 miles on their original clutches, so I don't think it is my shifting ability.

Unlikely the clutch in your '09 would likely be any different than what VW put in either the Golf or Jetta of that year. Push the garage to work out the kinks, and keep driving.

[Ken Robb]

Some of the symptoms you describe (creeping) COULD be caused by air bubbles in the fluid between clutch master and slave cylinders but that would probably affect all gears rather than just a couple. Some BMW models are notorious for being difficult for mechanics to get all the bubbles out of the clutch lines. I think dealers have expensive "special" tools to get it done right. VW dealers might also have similar tools that independent shops don't.

Why not call the nearest VW dealer, explain the problem and see what their service people have to say? If the service writer/advisor doesn't know what you are talking about ask for the service manager. If they can fix it a drive of a few hundred miles would be worth it to me.

[Red Tornado]

Replies to a couple posts on here...

Staggerwing/Shovelhd: They replaced the flywheel along with the clutch, hence the $2K+ bill. Changed from a dual mass flywheel to a single mass. Told me they've done this before on other VW's and worked out fine. I would think that "while they're in there" they would maybe take a look at the other parts they could see or get to, if nothing else to eliminate them from consideration. But that would take extra time, so maybe not.

Ken Robb: Suspected that after the 1st repair, which was to replace a broken master cylinder. Took back to shop, they re-bled the system, worked great after that - for a while. This latest go around, shop bled the system several times as they initially thought that could be the problem.

josephr: Found out driving it this morning that if I double clutch it when stopped, it goes into 1st gear perfectly. Last time I double clutched a vehicle it was a grain truck! After I made my 2nd post, I got to thinking about the synchronizer but wouldn't that affect all gears? There are two parts that I can only describe as "linkage cables" that were replaced about 6-8 months ago. Basically looks like a bicycle brake cable on steroids with a thick sheath or jacket over it and fittings on the ends. One was broken the other intact but looked worn, so changed out both on repair #2 IIRC.

Shop owner told me to give it a couple more days to finish the break-in period and then let him know how it's going. If it still acts up by the end of the week, and he can't get it going properly, I'm afraid I'll have to go to the VW Dealer in the next city (~1 hour drive) and see if they can sort it out - at a premium cost, I'm sure.

Appreciate the input from ya'll. Not so much looking for advice, but I will accept it - you never know, as much as kinda fishing to see if I bought a lemon for my wife or if these issues occur with other VW's as well.

[bobswire]

Replies to a couple posts on here...

Staggerwing: They replaced the flywheel along with the clutch, hence the $2K+ bill. Changed from a dual mass flywheel to a single mass. Told me they've done this before on other VW's and worked out fine.

Ken Robb: Suspected that after the 1st repair, which was to replace a broken master cylinder. Took back to shop, they re-bled the system, worked great after that - for a while. This latest go around, shop bled the system several times as they initially thought that could be the problem.

josephr: Found out driving it this morning that if I double clutch it when stopped, it goes into 1st gear perfectly. Last time I double clutched a vehicle it was a grain truck! After I made my 2nd post, I got to thinking about the synchronizer but wouldn't that affect all gears? There are two parts that I can only describe as "linkage cables" that were replaced about 6-8 months ago. Basically looks like a bicycle brake cable on steroids with a thick sheath or jacket over it and fittings on the ends. One was broken the other intact but looked worn, so changed out both on repair #2 IIRC.

Shop owner told me to give it a couple more days to finish the break-in period and then let him know how it's going. If it still acts up by the end of the week, and he can't get it going properly, I'm afraid I'll have to go to the VW Dealer in the next city (~1 hour drive) and see if they can sort it out - at a premium cost, I'm sure.

Appreciate the input from ya'll. Not so much looking for advice, but I will accept it - you never know, as much as kinda fishing to see if I bought a lemon for my wife or if these issues occur with other VW's as well.

This won't help you but at least you'll know you are not alone. I read the whole link. http://newbeetle.org/forums/transmission-talk/49881-transmission-woes-high-water.html
BTW I do all my repairs and I find it very fulfilling, there is a ton of info out there for DIY'ers.

[likebikes]

too bad it's not a tdi, you'd probably have thousands of replies by now.

[Red Tornado]

This won't help you but at least you'll know you are not alone. I read the whole link. http://newbeetle.org/forums/transmission-talk/49881-transmission-woes-high-water.html
BTW I do all my repairs and I find it very fulfilling, there is a ton of info out there for DIY'ers.

I just read through that blog. I can feel some of his pain, except I'm letting the shop do the work for me. Don't have the time, tools or the inclination to go through all that myself. Our Beetle has not been through high water since we've owned it. Let's hope the new clutch & flywheel do the trick. Noticed he could also hear the new clutch engage/disengage - mine makes that noise as well.
I've always been partial to manual transmissions. Learned to drive on one, owned a few cars/trucks with them (the parents did as well). Until now neither my parents or I owned a vehicle w/manual trans that didn't have at least 100K on the original clutch. Starting to re-think that mind-set tho.....

[Ken Robb]

I think there may be a tendency to have a bit more clutch wear with a smallish turbo engine vs. normally aspirated. I have a turbo MINI and while it develops lots of torque from 1800 rpm it has very little at idle so I do rev it a little and ease the clutch in slowly to let the turbo spool up. Driving a car with a non-turbo engine I can usually start smoothly by easing out the clutch at idle and feeding in a little gas as the clutch engages but if I try that with my turbo I can get a momentary bog when the clutch bites before the turbo is spinning fast enough to provide boost and torque.

A little more slip=a little more wear though at only 55,000 miles the MINI shows no signs of wear of any kind. :cool:

[carpediemracing]

Replies to a couple posts on here...

Staggerwing/Shovelhd: They replaced the flywheel along with the clutch, hence the $2K+ bill. Changed from a dual mass flywheel to a single mass. Told me they've done this before on other VW's and worked out fine. I would think that "while they're in there" they would maybe take a look at the other parts they could see or get to, if nothing else to eliminate them from consideration. But that would take extra time, so maybe not.

Ken Robb: Suspected that after the 1st repair, which was to replace a broken master cylinder. Took back to shop, they re-bled the system, worked great after that - for a while. This latest go around, shop bled the system several times as they initially thought that could be the problem.

josephr: Found out driving it this morning that if I double clutch it when stopped, it goes into 1st gear perfectly. Last time I double clutched a vehicle it was a grain truck! After I made my 2nd post, I got to thinking about the synchronizer but wouldn't that affect all gears? There are two parts that I can only describe as "linkage cables" that were replaced about 6-8 months ago. Basically looks like a bicycle brake cable on steroids with a thick sheath or jacket over it and fittings on the ends. One was broken the other intact but looked worn, so changed out both on repair #2 IIRC.

Shop owner told me to give it a couple more days to finish the break-in period and then let him know how it's going. If it still acts up by the end of the week, and he can't get it going properly, I'm afraid I'll have to go to the VW Dealer in the next city (~1 hour drive) and see if they can sort it out - at a premium cost, I'm sure.

Appreciate the input from ya'll. Not so much looking for advice, but I will accept it - you never know, as much as kinda fishing to see if I bought a lemon for my wife or if these issues occur with other VW's as well.

We have two VWs (2010, 2011), and previously I had a 1998 and a 1987. All were manuals. I imagine that our transmissions are similar to yours.

On synchros - there is one per gear, they basically help the gears engage the matching gear on an "idle shaft" if you will. Instead of having one chainring you have a pair of gears that always work together. It's like having a 34x28, 36x26, 38x24, etc. Each pair of gears gets used together, not with others. The synchros are specific to each pair of gears. It's common to wear out the first gear synchro since it's engaged when the idle shaft is idle. It's also common to wear out the second gear synchro since people tend to shift down the gears without rev-matching at all.

I have no idea what would cause a number of slave cylinders to fail, or a clutch to go so early.

With the shop that replaced the clutch did they give you back the old pressure plate and flywheel? I'm curious how worn the clutch was at 77k miles.

On other cars I've driven clutches well over 100k with no problems. I'd be unhappy to have to replace a clutch at 77k.

[batman1425]

The syncros don't have much to do with selecting 1st gear when stopped. If you leave the clutch in long enough, the transmission will eventually stop spinning. If the gears aren't lined up when they stop, you'll have a hard time getting it into first. This is common with lots of MT cars (including new ones) and the fix is just what you did. Put it in neutral, let out the clutch for a couple seconds to get the transmission spinning again, then you can select 1st with out issue using the synchros. I have to do this occasionally for 1st and Rev on my brand new (1700miles) Golf R. It happens.

Also - synchros are separate for each gear - and the ones on 1st and 2nd typically wear first because they are the ones that get used (and abused) the most. If your clutch needed replacing at 60K, it suggests that it saw a lot of abuse from the previous owner - so worn synchros are a reasonably concern at this point for gear selection difficulties (provided the difficulty occurs when the transmission is spinning when you make the selection as described above).

Another possibility - the shift cable linkages could be worn. Put it in gear and try to move the stick side to side. Is there a lot of slop? If so, the cable end links could be worn which would make correct engagement spotty. Those are cheap to fix, could be worth a shot.

[batman1425]

I'd be unhappy to have to replace a clutch at 77k.

Me too... but I've seen the way some people drive stick, and I wonder how their's make it 10k, let alone 100k. My money is on the car's first owner driving it with fists of ham before the OP picked it up.

Original Flywheel/friction plate could have been bent - which could manifest as a hydraulic problem (creep). And would explain why 3 cylinders didn't fix it.

[shovelhd]

The syncros don't have much to do with selecting 1st gear when stopped. If you leave the clutch in long enough, the transmission will eventually stop spinning. If the gears aren't lined up when they stop, you'll have a hard time getting it into first. This is common with lots of MT cars (including new ones) and the fix is just what you did. Put it in neutral, let out the clutch for a couple seconds to get the transmission spinning again, then you can select 1st with out issue using the synchros. I have to do this occasionally for 1st and Rev on my brand new (1700miles) Golf R. It happens.

Also - synchros are separate for each gear - and the ones on 1st and 2nd typically wear first because they are the ones that get used (and abused) the most. If your clutch needed replacing at 60K, it suggests that it saw a lot of abuse from the previous owner - so worn synchros are a reasonably concern at this point for gear selection difficulties (provided the difficulty occurs when the transmission is spinning when you make the selection as described above).

Another possibility - the shift cable linkages could be worn. Put it in gear and try to move the stick side to side. Is there a lot of slop? If so, the cable end links could be worn which would make correct engagement spotty. Those are cheap to fix, could be worth a shot.

I'm leaning this way as well. If they swapped the DMF then they had a good look at the input shaft. You could replace the rubber bushings and/or shift cables or look into a short shift kit like Dieselgeek.

[carpediemracing]

Original Flywheel/friction plate could have been bent - which could manifest as a hydraulic problem (creep). And would explain why 3 cylinders didn't fix it.

So much about cars I don't know.

Ironically I'm about to drop off the JSW at the local shop because I couldn't get the caliper mounting brackets off the back to get the rotors off. I'm too weak to get it from the outside and too risk averse to getting under the car with an impact wrench even with four jackstands and a jack. I'm such a wimp.

[Ken Robb]

So much about cars I don't know.

Ironically I'm about to drop off the JSW at the local shop because I couldn't get the caliper mounting brackets off the back to get the rotors off. I'm too weak to get it from the outside and too risk averse to getting under the car with an impact wrench even with four jackstands and a jack. I'm such a wimp.

How about putting a length of pipe over the handle on your wrench for LOTS of leverage?

[carpediemracing]

How about putting a length of pipe over the handle on your wrench for LOTS of leverage?

I tried it but the angle was awkward and I was afraid of breaking the handle, or pulling weird and twisting the socket out of the bolt and wrecking the bolt. I think if you're standing under the car with an impact wrench, a universal joint, 3-6" extension, and the triple square socket, it'll be a straight forward thing. Or I could lay under the car and do the same thing, but frankly I'm scared of being under the car in my driveway.

[Red Tornado]

Probably the final post I'll do about this POS car. So it's been driving & shifting pretty well lately. The new clutch is a little noisy, especially in neutral, so if it's still like that in a few more weeks I'll take it back & ask about it.
The "cans" or "pods" that contain the headlights continue to be an issue. The passenger side still loosens up every 6 weeks or so, even though it's locked in. Now since the clutch replacement, the drivers side - that has never given us any problems - becomes "unplugged" almost every time we drive it; and it's also supposedly locked in. A co-worker whose wife had a new Beetle several years ago experienced the same problem, come to find out after asking him about it.
The place that replaced the clutch told me they work on a fair amount of VW's, all models. The owner told me that, recent emissions issues aside, he thinks VW's are generally well designed, well built and good, dependable cars - except for the new Beetles. In his words, "They seem to have been designed and built on the cheap." After 1 1/2 years of owning one, I agree 100%. Car has been a maintenance nightmare, and he informed me that mine isn't the only one whose owner has had issue after issue.
The wife and I are leaning heavily towards trading it in for something else after the holidays. I know I won't have my repair money out of it by then, but that car is quickly turning into a money pit for us.
That is all.

[Ken Robb]

[QUOTE=Red Tornado;2057368]Probably the final post I'll do about this POS car. So it's been driving & shifting pretty well lately. The new clutch is a little noisy, especially in neutral, so if it's still like that in a few more weeks I'll take it back & ask about it.
0%.

When a car rattles in neutral with the clutch pedal out it's usually just the gears in the transmission rattling and doesn't mean anything is wrong. It's pretty common in 4 cyl. cars because they don't idle as smoothly as 6 or 8 cyl. engines.

[gemship]

So much about cars I don't know.

Ironically I'm about to drop off the JSW at the local shop because I couldn't get the caliper mounting brackets off the back to get the rotors off. I'm too weak to get it from the outside and too risk averse to getting under the car with an impact wrench even with four jackstands and a jack. I'm such a wimp.

I snapped a socket wrench as well as a cheap 3/8" drive breaker bar from harbor freight trying to loosen caliper bolts on my GMC Sierra truck. I spent more money on a 1/2" drive Sears Craftsmen breaker bar and that worked perfect. I also recommend a six point socket vs. a 12 point for more contact of surface area, it's going to give you more squarness and leverage tool to fastener wise. Looking back on it I bet any 1/2" drive breaker bar would have worked but the tool quality of the Craftsmen vs. the Harbor Freight savings was totally evident. When I tried to use the 3/8" drive I should've backed off as I could actually feel the breaker bar flex upon snapping at the u joint where it attaches a socket. They did replace that tool for me but I didn't want to chance a second break so I got the more robust and better tool steel grade Craftsmen 1/2" breaker...big difference, like night and day.

[batman1425]

Probably the final post I'll do about this POS car. So it's been driving & shifting pretty well lately. The new clutch is a little noisy, especially in neutral, so if it's still like that in a few more weeks I'll take it back & ask about it.

Clutch "chatter" (which is actually gear rattling as Ken pointed out) is a common symptom when going from a dual mass flywheel to a single mass. Dual mass flywheels do a better job dampening the vibrations from the engine than a single mass. It's annoying, but won't hurt anything. It may smooth out as it wears in a bit. You may find you just tune out the noise after a while.

This is a common issue for folks that do big power upgrades and need bigger clutches to handle the power. The heavy duty aftermarket VW/Audi options are mostly single mass, and chatter like crazy.

[jemoryl]

A couple observations:

I recently had a slave cylinder fail on my Ford SVT Focus. Not totally surprising, as the car has 150k on the original clutch, but it would have to happen on a Friday night when I am out of town. Ford revised the design of the clutch after the original version's dual mass flywheel had problems, so you are supposed to get a whole kit (flywheel, clutch disk, pressure plate, and slave/throw-out bearing) when replacing.

It turns out that the savvy SVT owners don't buy the clutch kit from Ford, but find someone selling the correct P/N kit made by Luk, which is the (German) OEM. You save a lot of $ this way - might be true with VW as well. The garage I found was OK with having the kit (a reasonable $380) drop shipped to them for installation.

Also, the hydraulic system on this clutch setup is a real bitch to bleed, and you will get some of the symptoms described by the OP unless this is done well.

[Red Tornado]

Clutch "chatter" (which is actually gear rattling as Ken pointed out) is a common symptom when going from a dual mass flywheel to a single mass. Dual mass flywheels do a better job dampening the vibrations from the engine than a single mass. It's annoying, but won't hurt anything. It may smooth out as it wears in a bit. You may find you just tune out the noise after a while.

This is a common issue for folks that do big power upgrades and need bigger clutches to handle the power. The heavy duty aftermarket VW/Audi options are mostly single mass, and chatter like crazy.

And that's exactly what they did, swapped the dual mass for a single mass while replacing the clutch. Guy told me it's fairly common. Well, it's good to know that noise is most likely nothing major to be concerned about.

The brake/clutch system on this Beetle was a pain to bleed correctly, I'm told.

This issue, the light pods (yes I am unlocking, setting in place & then locking) a host of other sensors going bad, radio intermittently not working, windshield washer fluid reservoir cracking, etc. all happening on a car with less than 80K just ain't right.......

Can't answer to the driving habits of the original owner(s) which I understand could be the cause of some of these problems, but I can assure you that for the latest 12K or so, this car has been driven very carefully - and correctly.

[josephr]

How about putting a length of pipe over the handle on your wrench for LOTS of leverage?

that's what she said.....:banana:

[CSTRider]

Just read this thread and have to wonder if original owner drove car with:
- left foot resting on clutch pedal (causing slight clutch slippage and constant master/slave pressure) and
- right hand resting on shift knob (causing shift linkage wear) ...

[Red Tornado]

Could very well be, and I've thought of that often. Lots of people can drive a car with a manual transmission, but not all of them do it right.
For now, the shifting issues seem to be behind us. Those stupid light pods are what's got me pulling my hair out now.:crap::crap::crap::crap: LOL

[Red Tornado]

So the Beetle's shifting well (for now).

Finally got the headlight pods straightened out, at a cost of $55. That's a drop in the bucket compared to what I've put in this junk heap so far.

Since then:
- Both seat heater switches have gone bad (quick working, luckily on the off position)
- Vacuum pump leaking oil ($600+)
- Most recently the batteries in one (or more) of the tire pressure sensors have gone bad - and you replace the sensor, not the battery. I'm not replacing them because I don't plan on owning the vehicle that much longer. This last one doesn't bother me much because I half expected it.

So far we're over $3,500 repair (over and above routine service) costs in less than 2 years of ownership for a vehicle with less than 80K; it had about 70K when we bought it. I don't believe the 2 shops are taking me for a ride since I have taken my other vehicles to them for service the last 10+ years and never had anything like we've experienced with this car. My wife is a very good driver and is very easy on her vehicles.

For those of you that may own a new Beetle, or family member maybe, and are happy with it - great. IMHO, this car is a major P.O.S. and a few co-workers/friends are now saying "I told you so", so they agree with me. Planning to trade it off well before the inspection expires in March. In the past 9-12 months I have never stopped regretting the purchase of this crappy little car. The final chapter of this saga will be when we trade up for something that (hopefully) will not make us hemorrhage cash.

[batman1425]

That's a bummer. This seems typical of the VW/Audi experience - you either get a good one that needs nothing more than oil or a problem child that sucks you dry. My first VAG car was of the latter persuasion, but I was smart enough to get rid of it before the warranty ran out. I'm trying again now with a VW, but I rolled an extra 3 years onto the factory warranty (6/100k) - expect to keep this one for at least that run.

With 70k on the clock, I would have expected most of the kinks to have been worked out by the previous owner(s). I think you are making the right decision. That's a lot of cash for less than 2 yrs of ownership.


So the Beetle's shifting well (for now).

Finally got the headlight pods straightened out, at a cost of $55. That's a drop in the bucket compared to what I've put in this junk heap so far.

Since then:
- Both seat heater switches have gone bad (quick working, luckily on the off position)
- Vacuum pump leaking oil ($600+)
- Most recently the batteries in one (or more) of the tire pressure sensors have gone bad - and you replace the sensor, not the battery. I'm not replacing them because I don't plan on owning the vehicle that much longer. This last one doesn't bother me much because I half expected it.

So far we're over $3,500 repair (over and above routine service) costs in less than 2 years of ownership for a vehicle with less than 80K; it had about 70K when we bought it. I don't believe the 2 shops are taking me for a ride since I have taken my other vehicles to them for service the last 10+ years and never had anything like we've experienced with this car. My wife is a very good driver and is very easy on her vehicles.

For those of you that may own a new Beetle, or family member maybe, and are happy with it - great. IMHO, this car is a major P.O.S. and a few co-workers/friends are now saying "I told you so", so they agree with me. Planning to trade it off well before the inspection expires in March. In the past 9-12 months I have never stopped regretting the purchase of this crappy little car. The final chapter of this saga will be when we trade up for something that (hopefully) will not make us hemorrhage cash.

[Red Tornado]

Yes, with some of the research I've done, I can see how that is the case with VW's at least. I've had friends tell me the same.
We were wondering if trading and spending a few extra thou was the best idea, given the money we've put into it that we won't get back out of it, but I think it's a good decision. Realistically, if things with this car progress like they have been, I'll spend that money anyway in repairs. I'd rather spend it on a different, newer car and hopefully less problems. Better investment IMHO.
We both realized that this car is the first "lemon" we've owned; and hopefully the last.

[AngryScientist]

That's a bummer. This seems typical of the VW/Audi experience - you either get a good one that needs nothing more than oil or a problem child that sucks you dry. .

true of many euro cars. some people have had awful luck with BMW and cost of repairs/maintenance. i've had two that went deep into the 200k region and had very little problem beyond normal maint.

if you realize you have a problem child car, best to get rid of it early before it eats you alive. the good ones are good.

[Red Tornado]

Agree. That's what we will do early 2017.
On the flip side, we have a '04 Volvo XC90 with 157K and a '97 Camry LE with 207K. Both running well. Kinda expect that from the Camry, tho....

[Black Dog]

Sorry to hear about your troubles. Not much to offer here other than to recommend never downshifting. Brake pads are way cheaper than clutches. Have had two 5 speed VW's (TDI) each with well over 300K and never replaced a clutch. Lots of torque, but never any downshifting and clutches held up amazing well. VW's are often sweet lemon pie or just sour lemons!

[likebikes]

never downshifting.
what do you do when you're approaching a hill, or hit some traffic that cuts your speed 1/3rd?

also, 300k, i'm guessing thats in kilometers, not miles?

[Black Dog]

what do you do when you're approaching a hill, or hit some traffic that cuts your speed 1/3rd?

also, 300k, i'm guessing thats in kilometers, not miles?

I use brakes. Pads are cheap and easy to replace. If I am going down a hill I will put it in gear and let the engine do the braking until I need to supplement with the brakes. As for milage, one car 450000km and the other is on 350000km. That is around 270,000miles and 200,000miles respectively. But, you bought it used and it is possible that the previous owner was brutal on the clutch and thus you inherited a worn clutch. I have seen clutches go within 10000km when being driven badly.

[Fatty]

Cars in general last a long time now. Going over 200k miles isn't a big deal any more, city cars included. In my part of the country salt eats them up before they wear out from miles pounded on.

[likebikes]

Sorry to hear about your troubles. Not much to offer here other than to recommend never downshifting. Brake pads are way cheaper than clutches. Have had two 5 speed VW's (TDI) each with well over 300K and never replaced a clutch. Lots of torque, but never any downshifting and clutches held up amazing well. VW's are often sweet lemon pie or just sour lemons!

sounds like you need to learn to rev-match.

[Black Dog]

sounds like you need to learn to rev-match.

Thanks for the driving advice. I can rev match but choose not to. Downshifting shortens the life off the clutch and gearbox. Shift to neutral and push on the brake pedal. So simple. :D

[Red Tornado]

I use brakes. Pads are cheap and easy to replace. If I am going down a hill I will put it in gear and let the engine do the braking until I need to supplement with the brakes. As for milage, one car 450000km and the other is on 350000km. That is around 270,000miles and 200,000miles respectively. But, you bought it used and it is possible that the previous owner was brutal on the clutch and thus you inherited a worn clutch. I have seen clutches go within 10000km when being driven badly.

You are correct. No idea how the previous owner drove it the first part of its life. My wife is not a "downshifter" and it's her car. We won't be the owners in another month or two so it's all good. We're thinking Toyota or Honda for the next one.