H Plus Sons Archteype and Conti

[Tony T]

I'll be needing new tires soon and I'm considering getting 25mm Conti GP 4000s instead on the 23mm that I'm running now.
The Archetype are a 23mm rim and the Conti 23mm measure at almost 25mm when mounted on the rim.

Should I go with the 25mm Conti's on my Archetypes?

[foo_fighter]

Go for 25s if they fit your frame/fork.

[madsciencenow]

I know u didn't ask but I'm on these rims w vredestein 25s and they work well on my caad10. Could be my imagination but 100-105 psi produces a reasonable ride for an Al frame.


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[Tony T]

Would a decrease in pressure of 5psi be about right going from 23mm to 25mm?

[stephenmarklay]

Would a decrease in pressure of 5psi be about right going from 23mm to 25mm?


I am running that setup at about 75/85 and I am close to 190 right now.

[Tony T]

Well, just placed my order for 25mm Conti's
Thanks guys :)

[saab2000]

Inner width is more important than outer width for spreading out the tire's bead, which give it a more vertical sidewall with less sway and squishiness.

I'm loving my Pacenti SL23s with 23mm tires. I run them at 75-80 PSI and they are pretty much perfect for paved road riding.

[steelbikerider]

They will spread to about 28mm on your rim. They are practically the same width as HED Belgiums.

[fignon's barber]

Tony,
I think this test comparison will help:

http://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/specials/conti-gp4000s-ii-23-25-28

[saab2000]

Tony,
I think this test comparison will help:

http://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/specials/conti-gp4000s-ii-23-25-28

Definitely an interesting read. I can't argue with facts, but I feel the huge tires FEEL slower. Maybe it's because I expect them to feel slower?

I'd also be interested in seeing comparable data on aero stuff. We all know in an aero vs weight contest aero almost always wins. But light is more fun to ride.

[FL_MarkD]

Just in case others wonder, the 28 Conti GP 4000s ii on the Archetypes work well too. They measure right around 30mm. I have been running 80f 85r at 190 and they are nice.

I think they do feel 'slower' than my other wheels (stock ultegra) with 25s, but that is likely due to the added weight as I am running 32 spokes in the Archetypes.

[Mark McM]

Definitely an interesting read. I can't argue with facts, but I feel the huge tires FEEL slower. Maybe it's because I expect them to feel slower?

I'd also be interested in seeing comparable data on aero stuff. We all know in an aero vs weight contest aero almost always wins. But light is more fun to ride.

Aerodynamics will depend on the wheel, the tire, and how well they are matched.

In order to determine which tire is best for their wheels (or at least one model of their wheels), Flo Cycling tested a selection of tires on one of their wheels in a wind tunnel, and also measured the rolling resistance of the tires, and then combined the aero and rolling drags to find the tire that gave the lowest total drag. The tires included the Continental GP 4000s in both 23mm and 25mm. The test results can be found here (http://flocycling.blogspot.com/2016/06/flo-cycling-a2-wind-tunnel-tire-study.html).

Not surprisingly, the narrower tire had lower aero drag, and the wider tire had lower rolling drag. But when the aero and rolling drags were combined, it was a virtual tie.

Of course, Flo's results were just for the particular conditions they tested under. For lower speeds or higher wheel loads (rider weights), the advantage would tip toward the wider tire, and for higher speeds or lower wheel load, the advantage would tip toward the narrower tire.

[saab2000]

Aerodynamics will depend on the wheel, the tire, and how well they are matched.

In order to determine which tire is best for their wheels (or at least one model of their wheels), Flo Cycling tested a selection of tires on one of their wheels in a wind tunnel, and also measured the rolling resistance of the tires, and then combined the aero and rolling drags to find the tire that gave the lowest total drag. The tires included the Continental GP 4000s in both 23mm and 25mm. The test results can be found here (http://flocycling.blogspot.com/2016/06/flo-cycling-a2-wind-tunnel-tire-study.html).

Not surprisingly, the narrower tire had lower aero drag, and the wider tire had lower rolling drag. But when the aero and rolling drags were combined, it was a virtual tie.

Of course, Flo's results were just for the particular conditions they tested under. For lower speeds or higher wheel loads (rider weights), the advantage would tip toward the wider tire, and for higher speeds or lower wheel load, the advantage would tip toward the narrower tire.

Right now my favorite clincher combo is the Pacenti SL23 rim with a 20+ interior width with my 23mm Vittoria clinchers. I run them at 75-80 PSI and they've been absolutely terrific. The ride is very, very tubular-like and there have been no nasty surprises at all. The side wall is nearly vertical with a bulge. There is no side-to-side squish or slop when pushing corners or when out of the saddle. I'm sensitive to that, especially when climbing out of the saddle. None of that is exhibited here. The 25s I tried before are very nearly as good and many would find them better. They can be run with a slightly lower pressure.

This combination seems to be very pressure sensitive though. Too much and the nice ride is compromised. Too little and the ride gets squishy. There seems to be less than 10 PSI for that window of opportunity. It's weight dependent of course.

But I'm currently no waif and I'm not blowing away and I ride 23mm tires at 75-80 PSI. And I never ever pinch flat. Think about that. I'm becoming a believer in the wider rims.

But I still think internal width is critical and too big a tire and too soft and they get that dreaded light bulb shape.

This is about perfect. What a great combo: a Pacenti frameset and a Pacenti rim! I'm beginning to think the guy knows his stuff.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8578/28681140142_6efd0e51c8_b.jpg

[oldpotatoe]

I'll be needing new tires soon and I'm considering getting 25mm Conti GP 4000s instead on the 23mm that I'm running now.
The Archetype are a 23mm rim and the Conti 23mm measure at almost 25mm when mounted on the rim.

Should I go with the 25mm Conti's on my Archetypes?

yes, or any 25mm tire vs any 23mm tire..more better.

[Black Dog]

The conti 25's will measure out at 28mm actual on those rims. They also are very tall which can cause some clearance issues for some folks.

[franswa]

I'm really, really enjoying veloflex masters(25c) on my archetypes. Best ride I've experienced thus far.

[Fatty]

My 25c gp4000s Black Chili Contis, inflated to 80 psi, measure out to just under 28mm wide.

They are mounted up to made in Florida Velocity A23 rims.

Great tire rim combo.

[Tony T]

ProBikeKit has a Tyre sale: 10% off for 2 (Conti's @ $31ea), 15% off for 4 (Conti's @ $29ea)

[Duende]

I'm really, really enjoying veloflex masters(25c) on my archetypes. Best ride I've experienced thus far.

+1! Add in some latex tubes too!

[F150]

Only had time to listen to first half of Fiamme Red's Podcast thread. Road feedback aspect, what feels fast, was interesting.

[beeatnik]

The conti 25's will measure out at 28mm actual on those rims. They also are very tall which can cause some clearance issues for some folks.

Yep, don't bother with this combo if you have an IRB (Italian Race Bika).