VYNL Bikes

[avalonracing]

Am I the only one happy to see an American made aluminum bike with steep angles and a treaded bottom bracket?

http://www.vynlbikes.com/

I love my Ti bikes but my trusty Klein is still my favorite. Still, I'd be curious to check one of these out.

[livingminimal]

My friend has a beautiful one, he really, really likes it. I am still wary of riding alloy frames.

[ultraman6970]

They look pretty neat.

[54ny77]

$1900 for a made in the u.s. frame & enve fork, not bad. looks like they're fabricated by the guy known as "frank the welder."

aluminum: the other white meat!

here's wishing them luck & success. :cool:

[giverdada]

my lady and i were talking about her next road bike. these vynl are top of the list. sweet looking frames and all the right things in all the right places. i'd love to ride one.

[avalonracing]

My friend has a beautiful one, he really, really likes it. I am still wary of riding alloy frames.

My aluminum Klein is 15 years old, probably has 50,000 miles on it and has been raced hard well over 100 times (and even crashed a couple of times- with no damage). I'll take good aluminum to carbon any day.

[sandyrs]

My friend has a beautiful one, he really, really likes it. I am still wary of riding alloy frames.

Curious why that is. I've got three aluminum bikes now (well, two built, one just purchased as a frameset). I'm a fan.

[livingminimal]

My aluminum Klein is 15 years old, probably has 50,000 miles on it and has been raced hard well over 100 times (and even crashed a couple of times- with no damage). I'll take good aluminum to carbon any day.

That's good. I don't ride carbon either.

[maxdog]

I would love to hear from anyone who gets/got one.
They remind me of Gaulzetti's, one of the few bikes I desire, that I've never owned.

[livingminimal]

Curious why that is. I've got three aluminum bikes now (well, two built, one just purchased as a frameset). I'm a fan.

road buzz, harshness in the stays, usual reasons.

[jtbadge]

$1900 for a made in the u.s. frame & enve fork, not bad. looks like they're fabricated by the guy known as "frank the welder."

aluminum: the other white meat!

here's wishing them luck & success. :cool:

Is he doing both these and the new Spookys?

[eBAUMANN]

Is he doing both these and the new Spookys?

it would appear that way...dude is a legend.

the frames do look nice, but their cx geometry needs a little work #atmo.

That said...

Why anyone would pay $1799 for a stock sized cx frame when you could get a custom ZANCONATO for $1950 (http://cycling.zanconato.com/bicycles/cyclocross/) is beyond me...

[FlashUNC]

From what I've read they were made by Zen in Portland before Zen shutdown. Not sure if FTW is making them now, I'd be surprised if he was if he's also making Spooky's stuff. Only so many hours in the day after all.

And their marketing schtick behind "no good Made in the USA aluminum" is puzzling for guys from San Jose.

Do they not know Paul is just over the hill in Santa Cruz doing Rock Lobsters? Or Zanc back East does full custom aluminum for not much more? Or Low is doing batch production in SF for about what they're charging?

[54ny77]

is your reference point about 25+ years ago on a caad[low single digit number]?

today, neither of those applies.

:)

road buzz, harshness in the stays, usual reasons.

[54ny77]

i haven't the slightest idea. i just clicked on one of the links on their website and it mentioned he was fabricating the bikes while the company itself is west coast.

Is he doing both these and the new Spookys?

[R3awak3n]

/\ 99% sure he is making both. Frank is hussling

[jtbadge]

it would appear that way...dude is a legend.

Woah. Badass.


the frames do look nice, but their cx geometry needs a little work #atmo.

That said...

Why anyone would pay $1799 for a stock sized cx frame when you could get a custom ZANCONATO for $1950 (http://cycling.zanconato.com/bicycles/cyclocross/) is beyond me...

I mean, Pro(bab)lly because of internet marketing buzz.

You could also get into something like a Rock Lobster for less.

[54ny77]

i could never get my head around the fact that those frames are around what, 3 grand or so? and built by a constantly changing list of contract builders/fabricators? the ride is always complemented here by owners, etc., which means they're designed well, but in relative terms, how are they any better than a rock lobster that's literally half the price and made by one guy who's been doing top notch work for a very, very long time? nevermind the value proposition of a caad frame, although of course someone looking for a custom alu. might not be looking at a factory-made caad.

horses for courses and all that, i suppose. owners seem to love them and that's all that matters. value is always in the eye of the beholder/owner.


They remind me of Gaulzetti's, one of the few bikes I desire, that I've never owned.

[eBAUMANN]

i could never get my head around the fact that those frames are around what, 3 grand or so? and built by a constantly changing list of contract builders/fabricators? the ride is always complemented here by owners, etc., which means they're designed well, but in relative terms, how are they any better than a rock lobster that's literally half the price and made by one guy who's been doing top notch work for a very, very long time? nevermind the value proposition of a caad frame, although of course someone looking for a custom alu. might not be looking at a factory-made caad.

horses for courses and all that, i suppose. owners seem to love them and that's all that matters. value is always in the eye of the beholder/owner.

gaulzetti = branding, "custom" drawn tubeset, and geometry (experience)

why does a vanilla/SV cost what it does?
if you wanna buy fancy paint, buy a painting...

[tumbler]

I like 'em. Looks like a pretty nice offering, particularly if FTW is involved.

[hellvetica]

if you wanna buy fancy paint, buy a painting...

Damn that is a good one. QFT. TY.

[adamhell]

i see them every once in a while here in san francisco. they look good to me, but i don't think i would buy one.

[gdw]

Gotta agree with 54ny77. Paying big bucks for a production aluminum frame doesn't seem like a smart buy when you can purchase custom frames from established builders for about the same price or less.

[ColonelJLloyd]

I don't really want that, but I do very much want a frame made by FTW. I have a pair of Lyotard Berthets that a previous owner hacked up by removing the side tab and part of the platform. FTW fabricated a piece to replace the hack job. It's perfect and you have to look close to tell they're not as original from the factory. The dude is as nice as he is talented.

[54ny77]

it sounds like gaulzetti's are custom made and done with custom tubing, so that's an added value proposition.

i thought they were just tig'd 7005 standard stock tubes, etc, so that was my reference for price/value. sounds like there's more to it.

Gotta agree with 54ny77. Paying big bucks for a production aluminum frame doesn't seem like a smart buy when you can purchase custom frames from established builders for about the same price or less.

[sandyrs]

it sounds like gaulzetti's are custom made and done with custom tubing, so that's an added value proposition.

i thought they were just tig'd 7005 standard stock tubes, etc, so that was my reference for price/value. sounds like there's more to it.

Gaulzettis are custom geo, custom tubing (Craig had a new seat tube drawn specifically for me, for example), own-design carbon forks, etc. Definitely highly custom.

[pasadena]

The best alloy frames nowadays are hydroformed anyway. That is a lot to pay for a 6061 frame.

for that money, I'll save a bit more and go for a IF or CK Cielo. The steel bikes are what you can't get from the big names and they ride so well.

[eBAUMANN]

The best alloy frames nowadays are hydroformed anyway. That is a lot to pay for a 6061 frame.

for that money, I'll save a bit more and go for a IF or CK Cielo. The steel bikes are what you can't get from the big names and they ride so well.

a cielo is almost $3k for a STOCK SIZED frameset...
that.
is.
nuts.
NUTS.

you could get a custom frame from almost anyone you want for that kinda money.

[Mzilliox]

a cielo is almost $3k for a STOCK SIZED frameset...
that.
is.
nuts.
NUTS.

you could get a custom frame from almost anyone you want for that kinda money.

agreed, but some cats are always chasing value, i think maybe you are one of those cats... some guys like names, some like value

[chiasticon]

From what I've read they were made by Zen in Portland before Zen shutdown. Not sure if FTW is making them now, I'd be surprised if he was if he's also making Spooky's stuff. Only so many hours in the day after all.

And their marketing schtick behind "no good Made in the USA aluminum" is puzzling for guys from San Jose.

Do they not know Paul is just over the hill in Santa Cruz doing Rock Lobsters? Or Zanc back East does full custom aluminum for not much more? Or Low is doing batch production in SF for about what they're charging?agreed. plenty of fish in the sea for aluminum frames now. and as eBAUMANN says, you can get a custom Zanc for just a little more. probably a custom FTW for about that too. I absolutely adore my Zanc road bike and would go right back to him for another, should I need it. or for an aluminum cx bike. dude knows what's up and he's a hell of a nice guy.

anyway, yeah I believe your first statement is correct. their road bikes were made by Zen but then they moved to FTW for cx bikes. wouldn't be surprised if they eventually have him making their road bikes too, since there's no Zen. I mean he started making vynl and spooky cx bikes basically right at the same time, from my understanding. so apparently there's no conflict, although that seems odd... handshake agreement from vynl not to use the same geo and anodize their frames? who knows...

livingminimal: yeah, my spooky cx bike is like riding a jackhammer. but it's only designed to be ridden for an hour, right? but modern aluminum is something else. my deda-tubed Zanc is hard to distinguish from a steel bike (like my Sachs); it's just so smooth... but it's way more responsive than steel I've ridden, when you start to really throw some watts at it. Zanc didn't build it with super-oversized tubes and design it for maximum stiffness though, so it's a really pleasant ride.

[soulspinner]

a cielo is almost $3k for a stock sized frameset...
That.
Is.
Nuts.
Nuts.

You could get a custom frame from almost anyone you want for that kinda money.

+1

[.RJ]

agreed. plenty of fish in the sea for aluminum frames now. and as eBAUMANN says, you can get a custom Zanc for just a little more. probably a custom FTW for about that too. I absolutely adore my Zanc road bike and would go right back to him for another, should I need it. or for an aluminum cx bike. dude knows what's up and he's a hell of a nice guy.

anyway, yeah I believe your first statement is correct. their road bikes were made by Zen but then they moved to FTW for cx bikes. wouldn't be surprised if they eventually have him making their road bikes too, since there's no Zen. I mean he started making vynl and spooky cx bikes basically right at the same time, from my understanding. so apparently there's no conflict, although that seems odd... handshake agreement from vynl not to use the same geo and anodize their frames? who knows...

livingminimal: yeah, my spooky cx bike is like riding a jackhammer. but it's only designed to be ridden for an hour, right? but modern aluminum is something else. my deda-tubed Zanc is hard to distinguish from a steel bike (like my Sachs); it's just so smooth... but it's way more responsive than steel I've ridden, when you start to really throw some watts at it. Zanc didn't build it with super-oversized tubes and design it for maximum stiffness though, so it's a really pleasant ride.

Or, if you want to save money and like aluminum, then a specialized smartweld or cannondale frame will fit the bill for half the cost and ride much nicer.

I like aluminum ALOT for crits & cx racing, its got its place. But I never understood the vynl or spooky bikes, seems like such a poor value, and the gaulzetti's are even more expensive.

[Idris Icabod]

If anyone is in the market for a cheap as chips and decent quality aluminium frame/fork/headset, Trek is selling off their Emonda ALR framesets for $699 now:

http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/bikes/road-bikes/performance-race-bikes/%C3%A9monda-alr/%C3%A9monda-alr-frameset/p/1426100-2016

[bcroslin]

These bikes look killer but you can buy a complete caad12 for just little more.

As far as ride quality goes, aluminum frames have come a long way. I'm riding a caad12 and running 25's and there's no road buzz. The bike rides like my EVO hi-mod. Only difference is it's about 1/2 lbs heavier.

I've ridden carbon bikes since '05 and right now I'm riding an aluminum bike and a steel bike and I'm not missing a thing. Hoping to have something Ti under me soon. :hello:

[avalonracing]

If anyone is in the market for a cheap as chips and decent quality aluminium frame/fork/headset, Trek is selling off their Emonda ALR framesets for $699 now:

http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en_US/bikes/road-bikes/performance-race-bikes/%C3%A9monda-alr/%C3%A9monda-alr-frameset/p/1426100-2016

Nice deal but eff anything with a noisy pressfit BB when compared to a threaded BB.

[livingminimal]

livingminimal: yeah, my spooky cx bike is like riding a jackhammer. but it's only designed to be ridden for an hour, right? but modern aluminum is something else. my deda-tubed Zanc is hard to distinguish from a steel bike (like my Sachs); it's just so smooth... but it's way more responsive than steel I've ridden, when you start to really throw some watts at it. Zanc didn't build it with super-oversized tubes and design it for maximum stiffness though, so it's a really pleasant ride.


Totally. a pure race machine (crits or CX) are good applications for alloy. I could maybe get into that, if I did crits, or if I wanted a CX bike that I didn't actually spend more time on than strictly racing.

[sandyrs]

Totally. a pure race machine (crits or CX) are good applications for alloy. I could maybe get into that, if I did crits, or if I wanted a CX bike that I didn't actually spend more time on than strictly racing.

I just did D2R2 on my aluminum Gaulzetti. Every single thing about it was better than when I did it on my Honey two years ago.

[livingminimal]

I just did D2R2 on my aluminum Gaulzetti. Every single thing about it was better than when I did it on my Honey two years ago.

STOP TRYING TO BREAK MY MIND!

Your Honey is sick. Still have it, or did it finally sell?

[sandyrs]

STOP TRYING TO BREAK MY MIND!

Your Honey is sick. Still have it, or did it finally sell?

Haha. I still have it, and am building it up as my dedicated singlespeed for this season. I still love it, I just wish a couple things about it (tire clearance and braking mainly) were different (and I translated those to my 'zetti).

[zacstanley]

Ventana makes these frames not FTW. Yes they are aware of Paul and Rock Lobster - In fact one of the designers races for the RL factory team.

I think they def have their place in crits and cx racing.

I've been racing on Aluminum Lobsters for 5+ years and even won a few over dudes fully outiftted in plastic.

Zing!

[TunaAndBikes]

I am still wary of riding alloy frames.

They're pretty great; lightweight, stiff, reasonably comfy and most importantly fairly inexpensive for their performance level.
Aluminium for life!

[texbike]

I just saw my first VYNL on a ride a couple of days ago and was impressed! Sharp looking bikes!

Texbike

[William]

FTW has been known to drop in from T2T.


Nice rigs!





William

[doomridesout]

They look cool, but price out a Rock Lobster...

[texbike]

They look cool, but price out a Rock Lobster...

I won't be buying one, but I do like the look of them....

Texbike

[ORMojo]

And there's another new-ish entry: http://www.ridecirca.com/

I don't know anything about them, but I'll see their bikes in a couple of weeks at the Oregon Handmade Bike Show (http://oregonframebuilders.org/ohbs/).

[RichFox]

And there's another new-ish entry: http://www.ridecirca.com/

I don't know anything about them, but I'll see their bikes in a couple of weeks at the Oregon Handmade Bike Show (http://oregonframebuilders.org/ohbs/).

Yes! I'm the founder at CIRCA Cycles. We'll be at the Oregon Handmade Show. Looking forward to meeting you. I'm also happy to answer questions anybody might have here at The Paceline.