Psa: sell all of your clincher wheels now

[Tickdoc]

Tubulars are the way to go.

Just finished my first ride on my favorite old steed on clinchers.

Granted, this ride took place on conti all seasons, a tough but incontestably crappy riding tire, but the transition from tubs to clinchers sapped much of the magic Capet ride from my dream machine.

It is still a great ride, owing much to the beautifully made fork and steel frame, I suspect, but the struggle was real me and for the whole ride.

I love the look of the new wheels.....Montreal 76 rims mated to shiny record hubs. The roll smooth and fast and the look fits the bike well.

So what to do? Try something better like some corsa clinchers? Some veloflex masters?

I may try it just for fun, but I have a feeling my old Mavic rims just need to be sent off to Dr spud for some rehab so I can get rolling on tubs again.

You can go back to watching the olympics now if you want, but if I were you, I'd be finding a way to trade up your clinchers for sewups and get back on the magic bus with me.:beer:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/Handgod/D6860556-C955-471B-A50A-FADB153D096A_zps2d33sqiz.jpg

[R3awak3n]

please do and sell em cheap so I can buy em

[AngryScientist]

what you think you know is only an illusion of the mind.

[fiamme red]

Try some Compass or Grand Bois tires before you give up on clinchers.

[ThasFACE]

I'm a big fan of the Corsa G+/latex combination. It's not quiiiite as nice as my tubulars, but it's very very close.

[azrider]

but if I were you, I'd be finding a way to trade up your clinchers for sewups

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/d6/12/0b/d6120b834fff3ce2eda3744e2f8da1f6.jpg

[ColonelJLloyd]

Try some Compass or Grand Bois tires before you give up on clinchers.

And wide rims. Clincher setups aren't all equal like a 1st gen Prius is not a Tesla Model S. And now with reliable tubeless setups. . . tubulars are awesome, but the gap has been narrowed to the slimmest of margins.

[FlashUNC]

Vittoria Corsa G+s. Try 'em.

GP 4 Seasons are great tires, but they're not exactly known for riding nice. Getting you through flat free crappy off season rides? Totally. But not for a great ride.

[weisan]

funny you should say that tick pal. This past weekend, I swapped out the CG pave 27mm clinchers from my MX Leader and replaced it with a set of Velocity Escape tubular wheels that I recently built. It was mounted with Vittoria Corse Elite 25mm. I took it out for a 40-mile ride with my buddies and you know what....I think it's okay...not earth-shattering but just ok. The pave clinchers mounted on a wide rim (HED Belgium) and pumped to 85 psi or so, is actually pretty good...in a blind test, I would be hard-pressed to tell the difference between the two.

So....for all the mess involved with gluing and what not....I know I know, what I am about to say is almost punishable by death...but, with my right hand on my chest, I can honestly say...it ain't worth the trouble. :o:p:D

[Duende]

Tubs are a better ride. It's true.. better in cornering and smoother feel all around.

But open tubulars are not bad... and when combined with Latex tubes are acceptable second best ride for me.

I went off tubulars last year. I just couldn't bond with any of the glues available today. (No pun intended) Maybe if I had more patience and took more time. Just really wish they still made Clement glue!

[Tickdoc]

ive got some unused open corsa's and some latex tubes that may be fun to try next.

I'll report back then, but don't hold your breath.

[Tickdoc]

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/d6/12/0b/d6120b834fff3ce2eda3744e2f8da1f6.jpg

http://memeshappen.com/media/created/Pfft-You-already-know-meme-31676.jpg

[enr1co]

No denying the ride of tubulars.

Would ride them all day if this was following me each ride and had someone fixing or replacing them gratis ;)

http://c8.alamy.com/comp/BNNEWB/the-mavic-neutral-service-car-leads-the-peleton-onto-the-champs-elysees-BNNEWB.jpg

[unterhausen]

welcome to 1975. That was the year I started training on clinchers because every day tubulars cost too much for my high school/bike mechanic budget. It was definitely on again/off again for a number of years after that until I finally gave up on tubulars in the '80s sometime.

I'm somewhat optimistic that once road tubeless gets a little more mature, tubulars will be even more of a niche market than they are now.

[Ralph]

welcome to 1975. That was the year I started training on clinchers because every day tubulars cost too much for my high school/bike mechanic budget. It was definitely on again/off again for a number of years after that until I finally gave up on tubulars in the '80s sometime.

I'm somewhat optimistic that once road tubeless gets a little more mature, tubulars will be even more of a niche market than they are now.

My sentiments. I "discovered" tubulars in early 70's. Gave up on them in 90's. And gluing them on no big deal to me. Just don't see the point except for racing.

[oldpotatoe]

ive got some unused open corsa's and some latex tubes that may be fun to try next.

I'll report back then, but don't hold your breath.

Those Campag tubies were made by Vecchio's..I recognize the little rim sticker..

[oldpotatoe]

welcome to 1975. That was the year I started training on clinchers because every day tubulars cost too much for my high school/bike mechanic budget. It was definitely on again/off again for a number of years after that until I finally gave up on tubulars in the '80s sometime.

I'm somewhat optimistic that once road tubeless gets a little more mature, tubulars will be even more of a niche market than they are now.

Tubeless road is more 'niche' than tubular..with the number of carbon tubie rims out there..for road, 25-ish tires.

I get a kick out of these tubie discussions..so much info either comes 3rd or 4th hand or from something 'absolutely true' 30 or 40 years years ago. It's as if tubular 'technology' hasn't changed since then. PLUS this idea that gluing on a tubie is a black art and taping, valving, gooping, inflating(maybe), checking, leaking, trying againing..of tubeless is always way easier and less messy.

Add again the cost..as if a mid range tubular is way more expensive than a mid range clincher or tubeless..sorry, not true anymore and we aren't in HS any more.

"Tubeless gets more mature"..tubeless road has been around for over a decade..and the 'big boys', Michelin, Vittoria, Conti..have decided that road tubeless just doesn't make a lot of sense for them..sorry, me neither..

Rant-ish out.

[fuzzalow]

Add again the cost..as if a mid range tubular is way more expensive than a mid range clincher or tubeless..sorry, not true anymore and we aren't in HS any more.

HaHa! High School, oh how I wish that were true!

In a manner of speaking, for the great bulk of the unwashed masses it seems to me that High School was where they've never left. It was the pinnacle of their lives and the summit of their development. There is nothing more pathetic than a grown adult, in their own full glory, on full display of a thought process and behaviour that seems like it's exactly how they were, all those years ago, from High School! And now they're adults as parents - oh great, a tradition of stupid passed down to a new generation!

Somebody on this forum once posted a saying from his father that most people don't change much after high school. How right that is for far too many. Um, but not for me, of course. ;)

This rant isn't related to anything - the phrase you used just caused me a laugh.

Tubulars rule.

[huck*this]

Always had a set of clinchers thought nothing of the ride quality till I got a set of Bora Tubs. Lets just say I will not go back to clinchers no matter how many tubs I have to swap out. The ride is heavenly and very responsive. Descend a hill on clinchers and then on tubs and you tell me which you prefer. Night and day to me that is.

[unterhausen]

My point is that this tired old argument has been going on for 40-odd years since someone made a 1" clincher that would fit on a bike made for tubulars. Yeah, they have always been better, no, most of us aren't going to adopt them. When I was at Trek, I had them order me 20 Criterium Seta tires. Those were some good years for training tires. I think I might have 4 of them unused. I don't really remember when the hassle became too much for me.


I can't imagine that there are too many people the were cyclists in high school that consider those years to be their peak. But you guys may have gone to a high school where scrawny guys in tight shorts were the cool kids. I hate to think of where most of the football team from my high school is now. If they are still alive, probably sweeping floors somewhere if they are lucky. Those are the guys that are still living their high school years.

[KJMUNC]

Ha.....just depends on which side of the divide you're on.

10yrs ago I drank the kool-aid and went 100% tubular, which ironically was the time I stopped racing and just riding for fun. Last month I sold all of my tubular wheels and am back to 100% clincher.

There's no denying tubulars give a better ride, especially some nice big Veloflex at about 75psi. For years I didn't have flats and I was just fine, but recently I had a slew of flats and decided that it just isn't worth it any longer. I actually enjoy gluing tubulars, but it's the pain of changing one on the side of the road (especially if riding with others) that did it for me. I use very light amounts of glue and it still takes significantly longer (and more effort.....not a trivial thing when doing this in 100+ Texas heat) to rip a tire off compared to swapping a tube. Some say they can do it in the same time, but I've never been able to approach that level.

I'd ride them all day long if I had a service car behind me or if it didn't cost $25 to have them fixed when I flat (never did learn how to open them up and repair them).

[ripvanrando]

I have a new set of veloflex vlaanderen 27 mm tubulars on my 1973 Masi and the ride comfort is as good as the extra legere clincher tires in 28 or 32 mm and maybe the 28 mm Schwalbe Pro One tubeless but better comfort than the Conti GP4000 Sii in 28 mm for sure. I don't have Vittoria Corsa mounted up but for sure they are very comfy. I use latex tubes. I had wanted to put silks on the Masi but too damed expensive. I thought I'd enjoy riding the old GC but it sits in the garage....I'll take the bnew technology anyday.

I'm messing around with some very fast 23 mm clinchers and the one huge difference between all of the above tires and narrowish clinchers is cornering on fast descents. The larger tires are very easy to handle on a couple of fast bumpy descents (as are good tubulars) that I take on my routine trip down to the river for espresso. I've got some new Vittoria TLR tubeless 23 mm to try out. I suspect they might be sweet.

I almost went broke buying tubies and sewing them back up commuting to college in the late 70's. Bought 32 mm Avocet clinchers and actually raced on them. Never looked back

[Tickdoc]

My point is that this tired old argument has been going on for 40-odd years since someone made a 1" clincher that would fit on a bike made for tubulars. Yeah, they have always been better, no, most of us aren't going to adopt them. When I was at Trek, I had them order me 20 Criterium Seta tires. Those were some good years for training tires. I think I might have 4 of them unused. I don't really remember when the hassle became too much for me.


I can't imagine that there are too many people the were cyclists in high school that consider those years to be their peak. But you guys may have gone to a high school where scrawny guys in tight shorts were the cool kids. I hate to think of where most of the football team from my high school is now. If they are still alive, probably sweeping floors somewhere if they are lucky. Those are the guys that are still living their high school years.

This or that, tit for tat:

Tubs v clinchers, shimano/sram v campy, disc v rim, cables v electric, wide v narrow, ti v steel.... I just love going over it all on a semi annual basis.

I'm torn between all of it and have a hard time picking one over the other in nearly every instance. ( except on the shimano/sram campagnolo seperiority front :-)

[ripvanrando]

This or that, tit for tat:

Tubs v clinchers, shimano/sram v campy, disc v rim, cables v electric, wide v narrow, ti v steel.... I just love going over it all on a semi annual basis.

I'm torn between all of it and have a hard time picking one over the other in nearly every instance. ( except on the shimano/sram campagnolo seperiority front :-)

Tubs v clinchers, Clinchers

shimano/sram v campy, SRAM

disc v rim, Rim

cables v electric, Cables

wide v narrow, Wide

ti v steel. Magnesium

[benb]

You shouldn't base this opinion on Conti clinchers, IMO they are some of the worst riding clinchers. Just about every other brand seems to be more supple and not wear any worse.

[Mzilliox]

duuuuuude... so feeling this. I just got some Boras, my first set of Tubular wheels, and wow, i see what cats are talking about. My plan was to put the Boras on, swap out brakes, and ride em a few times for fun on the Serotta before swapping them out and saving them for a future custom build. Well, swapping out brakes is not fun, so thats my excuse for keeping on the carbon Tubulars.

I don;t know if its the 320tpi casing on the Vittoria corsas, or if there is something else magical, but there is no comparison. I was riding Pacenti rims on Chris King hubs with panaracer tires, not some crap clincher with gatorskins. night and day.

The best part is the wheels are noticeably stiffer, noticeably lighter, yet noticeably softer riding. how does that kind of voodoo work?

[FlashUNC]

The best part is the wheels are noticeably stiffer, noticeably lighter, yet noticeably softer riding. how does that kind of voodoo work?

Well for starters the tire/rim relationship is entirely different in the tubular vs clincher set up.

[Vamoots58]

I finished the conversion to 100% tubular (three sets now) at the beginning of the summer. I have to admit, the ride of top quality clinchers (Veloflex for example are pretty spectacular). I actually enjoy the whole process of stretching and gluing, etc. probably makes me slightly nuts, but hey, it's a harmless fascination.

Tubulars are the way to go.

Just finished my first ride on my favorite old steed on clinchers.

Granted, this ride took place on conti all seasons, a tough but incontestably crappy riding tire, but the transition from tubs to clinchers sapped much of the magic Capet ride from my dream machine.

It is still a great ride, owing much to the beautifully made fork and steel frame, I suspect, but the struggle was real me and for the whole ride.

I love the look of the new wheels.....Montreal 76 rims mated to shiny record hubs. The roll smooth and fast and the look fits the bike well.

So what to do? Try something better like some corsa clinchers? Some veloflex masters?

I may try it just for fun, but I have a feeling my old Mavic rims just need to be sent off to Dr spud for some rehab so I can get rolling on tubs again.

You can go back to watching the olympics now if you want, but if I were you, I'd be finding a way to trade up your clinchers for sewups and get back on the magic bus with me.:beer:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/Handgod/D6860556-C955-471B-A50A-FADB153D096A_zps2d33sqiz.jpg

[parco]

Go on a group ride with sewups, get a flat and get left because you are taking too long to fix your flat and out come the clinchers. Gluing up a set at home is a nice luxury but changing one on the road with 50 other riders waiting for you is another thing completely.

[Seramount]

tubular, schmubular...whatevers.

that Ciocc is smashing! and what I want to know is do you keep the white pedals so white...?

I've got some white Look Keo Carbon 2s that require more maintenance than the rest of the bike combined...I can get them clean, but one ride and they're filthy again.

[Big Dan]

good luck with that.
Sold my last tubular wheels last year.

[ntb1001]

I don't have a set of tubulars on any bike right now, not because of anything wrong with tubulars, just have some nice clinches right now.
I do a think tubulars are the top, but with good tires such as Veloflex...the ride on clinches are fairly comparable.
One of the comments against tubulars that irk me though, are that they are hard to deal with, and it tales a long time if you flat. I actually have the spare on and and moving much quicker than with clinchers. I really don't qet why people think otherwise. Also, I find that I flat much less with tubulars...much less, almost never even!!

[Tickdoc]

tubular, schmubular...whatevers.

that Ciocc is smashing! and what I want to know is do you keep the white pedals so white...?

I've got some white Look Keo Carbon 2s that require more maintenance than the rest of the bike combined...I can get them clean, but one ride and they're filthy again.

Clorox wipes, and thanks.

[cnighbor1]

Have you had a flat on the road yet how did fixing it go

[cnighbor1]

Have you had a flat on the road yet how did fixing it go
Has I understand it these tires go hard very hard so much so it is nearly impossible to fix on the road by adding a inner tube that's why I avoided them

[sparky33]

I have a new set of veloflex vlaanderen 27 mm tubulars on my 1973 Masi and the ride comfort is as good as the extra legere clincher tires in 28 or 32 mm

Right there with you. Vlaanderen 27s compare well with Extra Leger clincher 28s, maybe not as cushy as EL 32s. I am riding the Vlaanderens lately. I like the EL clinchers quite a bit still. The difference is fuzzy, but the tubulars feel more special. That works for me.

I carry a spare tub and a tiny bottle of sealant - no follow car.

[ripvanrando]

Right there with you. Vlaanderen 27s compare well with Extra Leger clincher 28s, maybe not as cushy as EL 32s. I am riding the Vlaanderens lately. I like the EL clinchers quite a bit still. The difference is fuzzy, but the tubulars feel more special. That works for me.

I carry a spare tub and a tiny bottle of sealant - no follow car.

Agreed....Vlaanderen 27mm tubies are sweet BUT I would be willing to guess the Vittoria G+ Corsa Clincher 28mm is much faster and equally comfortable. I have not tried them yet.

I generally find a 28 mm clincher with supple casings is where clinchers are on par or better than the best tubulars although Veloflex Masters are nice but then again, the 25 mm nominal measures out a petite 24 mm on my rims.

[oldpotatoe]

Have you had a flat on the road yet how did fixing it go

Ah so, the only advantage to clinchers are mentioned. 'Fixing' on the road.

[ripvanrando]

Ah so, the only advantage to clinchers are mentioned. 'Fixing' on the road.

Clinchers are faster, cheaper, safer, longer wearing....is that enough?

[sparky33]

Agreed....Vlaanderen 27mm tubies are sweet BUT I would be willing to guess the Vittoria G+ Corsa Clincher 28mm is much faster and equally comfortable. I have not tried them yet.



I generally find a 28 mm clincher with supple casings is where clinchers are on par or better than the best tubulars although Veloflex Masters are nice but then again, the 25 mm nominal measures out a petite 24 mm on my rims.


Hah! I recently picked up some discounted G+ 28 clinchers, haven't ridden them yet... my stock of tires is healthy now.

Veloflex Roubaix 25 tubs were just a bit too narrow for me, coming from a world of 28-32 EL clinchers. Nice to see some high-zoot 27-28 tubs out there.

[oldpotatoe]

Clinchers are faster, cheaper, safer, longer wearing....is that enough?

Faster depends or who yer asking/what/where.
Cheaper, not so, apples to apples(include the $ of the tube),
Safer-nope, clinchers can come off a rim when flat(assuming both installed correctly)
Longer wearing-nope, most have the same tread as tubulars..

next? If ya want to use clinchers, go right ahead but as I mentioned, there is so much misinformation out there about tubulars..it's kinda funny.

[mcteague]

Faster depends or who yer asking/what/wear.
Cheaper, not so, apples to apples(include the $ of the tube),
Safer-nope, clinchers can come off a rim when flat(assuming both installed correctly)
Longer wearing-nope, most have the same tread as tubulars..

next? If ya want to use clinchers, go right ahead but as I mentioned, there is so much misinformation out there about tubulars..it's kinda funny.

Come on! You want to compare the effort of patching a clincher tube to that of a tubular? On the latter, you have to remove the tape, cut the sticthing, find the hole, patch it, sew it back up, glue the tape back on and then glue back to the rim. No thanks. For clinchers, remove tube, patch, insert tube, remount tire, inflate and ride on.

I'm sure, with decades of experience, you have gotten fairly quick at tubular repair. For we mortals, it is just too much work.:D

Tim

[oldpotatoe]

Come on! You want to compare the effort of patching a clincher tube to that of a tubular? On the latter, you have to remove the tape, cut the sticthing, find the hole, patch it, sew it back up, glue the tape back on and then glue back to the rim. No thanks. For clinchers, remove tube, patch, insert tube, remount tire, inflate and ride on.

I'm sure, with decades of experience, you have gotten fairly quick at tubular repair. For we mortals, it is just too much work.:D

Tim

No..as I mentioned, the only real advantage to a clincher is you can repair it on the road. The other 'advantages' mentioned by ripvanrando aren't accurate..IMHO

AND I have had 2 flats on the road on one ride....exactly twice in 36 years of using tubulars.

[Lionel]

AND I have had 2 flats on the road exactly twice in 36 years of using tubulars.

Probably means you should ride more. I am a big tubular fan and only ride on them these days but 2 flats in 36 years let's be real.

[oldpotatoe]

Probably means you should ride more. I am a big tubular fan and only ride on them these days but 2 flats in 36 years let's be real.

2 flats on ONE RIDE...not clear on original post...sorry...

[ripvanrando]

Faster depends or who yer asking/what/where.
Cheaper, not so, apples to apples(include the $ of the tube),
Safer-nope, clinchers can come off a rim when flat(assuming both installed correctly)
Longer wearing-nope, most have the same tread as tubulars..

next? If ya want to use clinchers, go right ahead but as I mentioned, there is so much misinformation out there about tubulars..it's kinda funny.

Cost

Vittoria Corsa tubular = $112 + $3 glue + $25 labor = $140 per tire

Vitoria Corsa Clincher = $70 + $10 tube +$10 labor = $90 per tire

Edit: Continental Grand Prix tubular vs clinchers is $117 vs $41 per tire.

Safer

I have never had a clincher tire come off the rim but did have a shop mounted tubular roll once.

Durability

Clinchers are easily repaired and restored back to original condition unlike tubulars, which time and skill to repair or they must be shipped off to Florida for repair. With respect to tread wear, most clinchers are vulcanized and have much thicker thread and they simply last longer. Appleas to apples would be Vittoria Corsa CX or Veloflex Master clinchers but how many riders use these during training?

Rolling resistance


As I said, only the very top end tubulars approach the lower rolling resistance of clinchers. If you have data to support otherwise, I'd love to see it.


http://www.rouesartisanales.com/article-1503651.html
http://www.biketechreview.com/tires_old/images/AFM_tire_testing_rev7.pdf

https://www.biketiresdirect.com/search?kw1=vittoria+corsa&mfg=vi&adl=1&gclid=CjwKEAjwltC9BRDRvMfD2N66nlISJACq8591G_OAReST 9MClHPq8RnnIIyv9W25xPabJyeygKVnGBRoCswTw_wcB

[Lionel]

2 flats on ONE RIDE...not clear on original post...sorry...

Ah ok, makes sense. This actually never happened to me.

[happycampyer]

Ah ok, makes sense. This actually never happened to me.that's bad juju right there.

[sparky33]

I have a new set of veloflex vlaanderen 27 mm tubulars on my 1973 Masi and the ride comfort is as good as the extra legere clincher tires in 28 or 32 mm and maybe the 28 mm Schwalbe Pro

RipVR, could you comment on Extra Leger 28s versus Schwalbe Pro One tubeless? ELs are my benchmark clincher, and I'm curious how how the Schwalbe Pro One compares since I've never tried that one.

[oldpotatoe]

Cost

Vittoria Corsa tubular = $112 + $3 glue + $25 labor = $140 per tire

Vitoria Corsa Clincher = $70 + $10 tube +$10 labor = $90 per tire

Edit: Continental Grand Prix tubular vs clinchers is $117 vs $41 per tire.

Safer

I have never had a clincher tire come off the rim but did have a shop mounted tubular roll once.

Durability

Clinchers are easily repaired and restored back to original condition unlike tubulars, which time and skill to repair or they must be shipped off to Florida for repair. With respect to tread wear, most clinchers are vulcanized and have much thicker thread and they simply last longer. Appleas to apples would be Vittoria Corsa CX or Veloflex Master clinchers but how many riders use these during training?

Rolling resistance


As I said, only the very top end tubulars approach the lower rolling resistance of clinchers. If you have data to support otherwise, I'd love to see it.


http://www.rouesartisanales.com/article-1503651.html
http://www.biketechreview.com/tires_old/images/AFM_tire_testing_rev7.pdf

https://www.biketiresdirect.com/search?kw1=vittoria+corsa&mfg=vi&adl=1&gclid=CjwKEAjwltC9BRDRvMfD2N66nlISJACq8591G_OAReST 9MClHPq8RnnIIyv9W25xPabJyeygKVnGBRoCswTw_wcB

Nice that you include the web sites...OBTW, I pay nuthin to install my tubulars. Glad you never had a clincher come off, I've never paid $112 for CXs either. I did mention, 'installed correctly'. Used tubulars for 30 years, worked in bike ships for 28 years, gluing a 'few' tubies on for customers, never had one roll.

I have an idea!!! Use clinchers, don't use tubulars!! I see no compelling reason for being a Nancy, you do...ok. Ya know its bike tires, not heart lung machines.

->:)

[hollowgram5]

Nice that you include the web sites...OBTW, I pay nuthin to install my tubulars. Glad you never had a clincher come off, I've never paid $112 for CXs either. I did mention, 'installed correctly'. Used tubulars for 30 years, worked in bike ships for 28 years, gluing a 'few' tubies on for customers, never had one roll.

I have an idea!!! Use clinchers, don't use tubulars!! I see no compelling reason for being a Nancy, you do...ok. Ya know its bike tires, not heart lung machines.

->:)
[emoji481] [emoji481]

I learned to glue them years ago, and haven't paid for a glue job in a while. If you don't wanna do it yourself, just go ride clinchers. That's just more tires for the OldSpud and I.

My struggle is deciding which tubulars to ride on my rollers, when I don't want to ride in the rain.

[oldpotatoe]

[emoji481] [emoji481]

I learned to glue them years ago, and haven't paid for a glue job in a while. If you don't wanna do it yourself, just go ride clinchers. That's just more tires for the OldSpud and I.

My struggle is deciding which tubulars to ride on my rollers, when I don't want to ride in the rain.

Conti sprinters...or even Giros. Made by Vittoria.

[hollowgram5]

Conti sprinters...or even Giros. Made by Vittoria.
That or old tires I don't want to run on the ****e roads where ever the company moves me (currently MS)..

[benb]

Using the Vittoria's as your cost example for clinchers is kind of lame as they are priced way out there and are not necessarily better than stuff that is cheaper.. lots of great clinchers at or around the $50 point.

I've got the specialized S-works Turbo's on one of my bikes, one of the fastest clinchers in all these tests and including the tubes my per wheel cost was more like $35 as they are on sale so often. Even big S and T want $100 per tire for their tubulars and their dealers from what I've seen don't even stock the tubulars so they're probably not going on sale.

If tubulars are only popular with Euro brands because the last holdouts are European racers then they are going to be super expensive simply because everything from Europe is priced high.

[Tony Edwards]

I know it's probably an aberration, but the one time I rode tubulars was on a rented track bike at Hellyer Park Velodrome. I rolled the front one off at high speed, causing the most serious and painful crash I have ever suffered on a bike. Since then I really have not had an appetite to try them again.

[Kirk007]

Vittoria CX tubulars: $45.00 http://www.probikekit.com/tyres-tubes/tubular-bicycle-tyres.list


I could go on and on but this makes the point; you can by great tubulars at very competitive prices from Euro websites all day long so the clincher vs tubular price argument goes right out the window.




Using the Vittoria's as your cost example for clinchers is kind of lame as they are priced way out there and are not necessarily better than stuff that is cheaper.. lots of great clinchers at or around the $50 point.

I've got the specialized S-works Turbo's on one of my bikes, one of the fastest clinchers in all these tests and including the tubes my per wheel cost was more like $35 as they are on sale so often. Even big S and T want $100 per tire for their tubulars and their dealers from what I've seen don't even stock the tubulars so they're probably not going on sale.

If tubulars are only popular with Euro brands because the last holdouts are European racers then they are going to be super expensive simply because everything from Europe is priced high.

[benb]

All depends on what you are going for, there are a bunch of top quality clinchers on PBK that are 1/2 the price of that tubular that are all faster performers. Tubulars from PBK are still close to $50 per wheel when I was talking about $50 for 2 wheels and not having to get them mailed in from Europe. You can have Schwalbe Ones or Michelin Pros or whatever off PBK for $30 or less.

The only argument for tubulars is the much more subjective ride quality argument... that one will always persist cause it's just about 100% subjective.

[559Rando]

Try some Compass tires and you'll be golden. :banana:

[chiasticon]

I have an idea!!! Use clinchers, don't use tubulars!! I see no compelling reason for being a Nancy, you do...ok. Ya know its bike tires, not heart lung machines.

->:)I see no compelling reason for name-calling. we can discuss like adults, no?

[Kirk007]

Try some Compass tires and you'll be golden. :banana:

Got some 32s - they're ok, look nice, but not the orgasmic experience one might be lead to believe from the internet. But I really need to put more miles on them and for rides with higher proportions of dirt, gravel etc. I can understand the popularity. Maybe I need to try the extralight casing, but then you are in the $80+ market.

I've also got the new Vittoria corsa graphene yada yada 28s. Not all that impressed here either; had them skip out on surface irregularities in corners that other tires stuck too. At the right pressure I find them about the same as the Compass 32 in the "subjective feel" category and good enough that I'm probably done experimenting with any tire over 30mm for road riding.

I think Schwabe One tubeless 23s, 25s; IRC 25 tubeless, vittoria, even Paves, and veloflex all beat every clincher I've tried regardless of size for regular road riding. Next to test one of these days in the "larger" category with be tubeless 28s or 30s.

As I no longer race and rarely ride in a group to worry about slowing down with a flat I pick my wheel/tire combo by conditions - riding to work in December - ruffy tuffys with sealed tubes rule. A beautiful summer day on pavement, break out the tubulars or tubeless. Gravel or dirt, the Clement MXOs work nicely.

Easy to criticize tubulars with facts and figures and horror stories, but I ride for the riding experience, the rest doesn't matter to me and on that my subjective butt likes what it likes.

It's all fun and games and we have a lot of really outstanding choices in tires these days.

[ColonelJLloyd]

Maybe I need to try the extralight casing, but then you are in the $80+ market.

I think the standard versions are really nice. But, in my experience, the EL casing is where the magic (Kool Aid?) is found. All my miles are for pleasure/exercise so the extra dough is justified as me doing something nice for myself. But, horses for courses and to each his own and all that. . .

[oldpotatoe]

I see no compelling reason for name-calling. we can discuss like adults, no?

I guess ya missed the :) yes? A tire on a toy.:D:D

[ripvanrando]

Nice that you include the web sites...OBTW, I pay nuthin to install my tubulars. Glad you never had a clincher come off, I've never paid $112 for CXs either. I did mention, 'installed correctly'. Used tubulars for 30 years, worked in bike ships for 28 years, gluing a 'few' tubies on for customers, never had one roll.

I have an idea!!! Use clinchers, don't use tubulars!! I see no compelling reason for being a Nancy, you do...ok. Ya know its bike tires, not heart lung machines.

->:)

You said I was spreading misinformation.

I provide evidence to the contrary.

You call me a "Nancy" but I assure that I ain't not no Homosxual as you allege and even if I was, why the vitriol.

If you have data to show that tubulars are faster, let me know. I like messing around with tires and have spent way over $1500 on tires this year. I test them and sometimes/often they go into a heap. On the same stretch of road, I do roll down tests under calm conditions with multiple of replicates per tire.

I may not be a "Nancy" but I do have a tire fetish.

[Tickdoc]

I like messing around with tires and have spent way over $1500 on tires this year.


Wha, wh, whaaat?:eek:

[ripvanrando]

RipVR, could you comment on Extra Leger 28s versus Schwalbe Pro One tubeless? ELs are my benchmark clincher, and I'm curious how how the Schwalbe Pro One compares since I've never tried that one.

Compass is much more durable and flat resistant and more comfortable although the Pro One tubeless is faster. The Pro One Tubeless is almost as fast as a 28 mm Conti GP4000 Sii with latex tubes by my tests but I'd say the Schwalbe is a bit more comfy than the Conti. Back to your question. The Compass is a little narrower (true to size) than the puffy Schwalbe (30.5mm actual). I am not a Pro One Tubeless fanboy because I have seen too many casings that split and that are unrideable even with a boot and tube. A fellow racer from Finland on TransAM had this happend to him and he lost a day. It happened to me twice. I like the 28 and 32mm EL Compass tires but have had a lot of problems with the 35 MM Bon Jovi 35 mm EL. The Compass tires wear pretty well. I have 5,000 miles on a front Bon Jon that still looks good.

[oldpotatoe]

You said I was spreading misinformation.

I provide evidence to the contrary.

You call me a "Nancy" but I assure that I ain't not no Homosxual as you allege and even if I was, why the vitriol.

If you have data to show that tubulars are faster, let me know. I like messing around with tires and have spent way over $1500 on tires this year. I test them and sometimes/often they go into a heap. On the same stretch of road, I do roll down tests under calm conditions with multiple of replicates per tire.

I may not be a "Nancy" but I do have a tire fetish.

Oh my goodness, Fred, Nancy, has nothing to do with your sexuality. No 'vitriol' intended, saying people who ride clinchers are 'Nancys, right up there with the 'far superior Italian threading' on BBs. I don't get angry about much 'bike, certainly not about tires. Yes you do have a tire fetish, I agree and if you enjoy spending the time and $ on that, groovey. I just don't think it's all that important, tires on a bicycle. IMHO. If you do, fine...Jim.

[ripvanrando]

Vittoria CX tubulars: $45.00 http://www.probikekit.com/tyres-tubes/tubular-bicycle-tyres.list


I could go on and on but this makes the point; you can by great tubulars at very competitive prices from Euro websites all day long so the clincher vs tubular price argument goes right out the window.

Those are blow out prices of the old Corsa version.

I used to be able to get the old vittoria clincher version on blow out prices for $35

My veloflex master clinchers are $45 whereas the Vlaanderen tubulars are $90 each. I'd love to have the Vlaanderen for $45.

[ripvanrando]

Oh my goodness, Fred, Nancy, has nothing to do with your sexuality. No 'vitriol' intended, saying people who ride clinchers are 'Nancys, right up there with the 'far superior Italian threading' on BBs. I don't get angry about much 'bike, certainly not about tires. Yes you do have a tire fetish, I agree and if you enjoy spending the time and $ on that, groovey. I just don't think it's all that important, tires on a bicycle. IMHO. If you do, fine...Jim.

We must have different understandings of name calling.

You called me Nancy and now Fred.

You can apologize anytime you see fit.

[oldpotatoe]

We must have different understandings of name calling.

You called me Nancy and now Fred.

You can apologize anytime you see fit.

I called you Jim...:D

[chiasticon]

I guess ya missed the :) yes? A tire on a toy.:D:Dit's far from the first time you've called non-tubular users "Nancies." and they don't all have smilies. I'm sure it's all in good fun. I just don't see the need to drag the conversation down with it. and clearly the recipient didn't enjoy it in this case.

as you say, it's just tires on a bike. :beer:

[oldpotatoe]

it's far from the first time you've called non-tubular users "Nancies." and they don't all have smilies. I'm sure it's all in good fun. I just don't see the need to drag the conversation down with it. and clearly the recipient didn't enjoy it in this case.

as you say, it's just tires on a bike. :beer:

Last one, yes very much in good fun. Bikes, supposed to be fun, toys. Used it many times, first time it's been seen as a serious insult. It isn't. If I upset anybody, sorry. I take a closer look at who I answer next time. But bikes, ya know. Out

[Anarchist]

One fellow posts a tongue in cheek, entirely good natured post telling us how much he enjoys the ride of tubulars on his (beautiful) Ciocc.

And it degenerates into the entirely predictable clinchers are better, they are faster (who cares about stupid lab tests of "fast" tires?) , etc.

Then we segue right into beating up on Oldpotatoe because his M0 on all of these stupid threads is now seen as a personal attack, homophobic, etc.

Jesus wept. Some of you really need to just go outside and step away from the Internet.

[cadence90]

Wow, for a thread about sensitivity this got way too sensitive....



You may call me Freddy, you may call me Nancy
You may call me Tubby, you may call me Clinchy
You may call me Jim, you may call me Jill
You may call me Joe, but no matter what I'm still

Gonna call oldspud a Pietro.
:)

[Tickdoc]

I just really miss my tubs, never thought it would be a "do we need to shut this thread down" escalation.

Lighten up, Francis.

Some things are worth getting all elbows and assholes over, but not the eternal tubs v clincher discussion, Imo.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/Handgod/image_zpsp5bw0njt.jpeg

[Kirk007]

I like messing around with tires and have spent way over $1500 on tires this year. I test them and sometimes/often they go into a heap. On the same stretch of road, I do roll down tests under calm conditions with multiple of replicates per tire.

I may not be a "Nancy" but I do have a tire fetish.

Wow, good on 'ya. I thought my very unscientific comparisons this summer with 4 wheelsets and different tires was a bit over the top; hope you will share your conclusions some day. Last night I came across a series of interesting articles on the Silca website (under Journal) on various widths, tire pressures, rolling resistance) - very interesting stuff.

[Fivethumbs]

It sucks to get to the top of a climb on tubs and realize you've got a flat. No fast descent for you!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ColonelJLloyd]

Last one, yes very much in good fun. Bikes, supposed to be fun, toys. Used it many times, first time it's been seen as a serious insult. It isn't. If I upset anybody, sorry. I take a closer look at who I answer next time. But bikes, ya know. Out

You're leaving without linking the evidence that tubulars are faster than modern clinchers? Aw, man. . .

[fuzzalow]

My goodness me, the sheer nerdy nebbishness in this thread. Not a light hearted moment to be found in some of these responses as if in response to some effeminated clincher humiliation.

C'mon, lighten up. Don't be so literal. Get to know some of the blokes on this forum that have earlier join-dates than you. Listen more and talk less. It's perfectly OK to think of yourself as self-important but the price for that is ya gotta actually have something to say - nobody wants to hear you whine.

Tubulars rule but I'm not apostolic about 'em, I use clichers too. Tubulars are just more emblematic of the cycling subculture.

[Duende]

Old potatoe! You can call me Nancy anytime! And thank you for all the insights you've shared here!

[fiamme red]

I guess ya missed the :) yes? A tire on a toy.:D:DFor some people, the bike is a tool (e.g., for commuting) as well as a toy (e.g., for recreation or exercise). Almost all of them ride clinchers. :)

[azrider]

Holy cow. How much wine spritzer was had to result in so much butt-hurtedness......would the Nancies please lighten up?

For reals.

[denapista]

It sucks to get to the top of a climb on tubs and realize you've got a flat. No fast descent for you!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

How is a flat any different than on a clincher? Toss in Stans on the side of the road, or a spare tire if you have one.

I'm 100% Tubular these days. I ride tubular for the simple fact of riding very light deep carbon rims, that weigh around 1100g complete. I like the light wheel factor and the feel of Veloflex Tubular (Vlaanderen/Roubaix/Arenberg) tires. The only deep carbon clincher rim that I feel can build a lightweight complete build are the 77 composite rims (41c = 340g), which are hard to track down without ordering from overseas. Reynolds makes the Attack rim in clincher, which is wide and 29mm tall, but I want deeper wheels to hold speed for my roller style rides. I don't dislike Clincher rims and tires, I just prefer Tubular. Are there more risks than rewards, probably so. Who cares though when you're riding on pillows like Veloflex tires.

The trick to Tubular riding, is to always be on the hunt for deals at all times. The more spare tires you have, the less downtime you have when you puncture and need to glue on a new tire. I'm always buying tires and leaving them stretched on old Campagnolo alloy tubular rims. Gluing and fixing a puncture on the fly isn't the issue for me.

[Mark McM]

You're leaving without linking the evidence that tubulars are faster than modern clinchers? Aw, man. . .

Hush! We don't want those people slowed down by their tubulars to catch on to our secret!

[Mark McM]

How is a flat any different than on a clincher? Toss in Stans on the side of the road, or a spare tire if you have one.

I think the statement about finding a flat tubular at the top of a descent isn't about the ability to fix the flat, or even the speed to do a tire change. It's about how careful you want to be a on tricky descent when riding on a freshly mounted tubular tire which hasn't had a chance for the glue to set.

I don't argue that tubulars can be fixed on a ride. Or even which is faster to fix, a tubular or a clincher (they can each be done in a just a few minutes, and skilled tubular changer can even be faster than a less experienced clincher changer). But on a practical level clinchers can be more "fixable" on the road than tubulars. You can carry several spare tubes, a patch kit, plus some tire boots, in less space than a spare tubular tire, so you can keep riding even in the case of multiple flats, and even with sizeable tears in the casing (that's what the boots are for).

[denapista]

There's only been once instance when I had to mount my spare on the road (Tufo because they ball up tiny). When I got home, I PR most of the climbs and getting the spare tire off was the same effort to getting a glued tire off..

When you mount a spare, it's on there pretty damn good. I understand the scenario of getting to the top of a climb, and seeing you have a flat. That would require you to take it easy on the descent, factoring in the rolling of a tire mystique. Nothing wrong with saving your descent efforts for another ride, but that tire is going to be on there. I wouldn't Nicky Hayden knee drag in turns, but just be mindful of the lack of glue granted my tire was a bitch to get off. Mastik mends pretty damn well on the fly.

[Gsinill]

Man, all this while I am literally waiting for the UPS truck to pull up with my FMB PRs after their long journey all the way from France.
Was hoping those fine tubulars would make up for me being old, fat and slow...
Might just decline delivery and head over to Alibaba.com to order a bunch of knock off clinchers which would be much more appropriate given my skills and capabilities...
:beer:

[benb]

Someone mentioned the Compass hype.

I haven't been able to get myself to try those because my biggest association with Compass tires was a group ride I did last winter. About 60 miles and the high temp that day was 27 degrees and it had snowed the day before so the roads were very sloppy. I took some 45NRTH studded tires that day and really paid for the weight by the end of the day but was safe. But we had a very very very cold stop about halfway through the ride when some Compass clincher tires flatted and kept flatting to the point practically the whole group each got a turn trying to fix them. Now I have this huge association with them being fragile that I have to get past.

Maybe if I rode in Southern California I might be interested in 1100g Tubular setups. The feather weight sounds nice. Not here.

[etu]

one of things i am grateful for as a member of this forum is the effusive enthusiam over tubulars expressed by some here. it's convinced me to give them a try, and they have a wonderful ride quality, and of course the snob factor is particularly appealing.:D

[djdj]

Hello, my name is Nancy. And I like tubulars.

[Anarchist]

Hello, my name is Nancy. And I like tubulars.

Yo! Nancy!

Welcome here.

[martl]

i'm prepared fo whichever silly trend is next :p

https://fotos.rennrad-news.de/f/1u/r7/1ur7x8a5xure/medium_raeder.jpg?0 (http://fotos.rennrad-news.de/p/342104)

[marciero]

I finally relented this year, in part as result of remarks of OP and others over the last year or two, winding up with a set of Nemesis and a set of Nucleons. The ride is pretty sublime on both sets with 27 Vittoria. I love the handling and road feel of a 700c 27 or 28 tire, and the tubulars seem to be the pinnacle of that, though nice clinchers are pretty darn good too. I dont see the point of riding anything less than the highest quality tubular tires. For me its all about ride quality and handling.
Am still mostly a nancy though as most of my riding is on Compass 650B 42mm tires. So that is a different ball of wax and a differnt type of riding; mostly much longer rides, for one thing, and mixed terrain. Those tires are very comfortable but you give up the sporty handling and road feel.
I've yet to have a single flat on the tubulars. This includes a brief period with Tufos on Reynolds at 140psi about 15 years ago. (As you can see, I'm not superstitious)

[oldpotatoe]

I finally relented this year, in part as result of remarks of OP and others over the last year or two, winding up with a set of Nemesis and a set of Nucleons. The ride is pretty sublime on both sets with 27 Vittoria. I love the handling and road feel of a 700c 27 or 28 tire, and the tubulars seem to be the pinnacle of that, though nice clinchers are pretty darn good too.
Am still mostly a nancy though as most of my riding is on Compass 650B 42mm tires. So that is a different ball of wax and a differnt type of riding; mostly much longer rides, for one thing, and mixed terrain. Those tires are very comfortable but you give up the sporty handling and road feel.
I've yet to have a single flat on the tubulars. This includes a brief period with Tufos on Reynolds at 140psi about 15 years ago. (As you can see, I'm not superstitious)

Squirt a bit of Orange seal in there and you'll have even less. ;)

[Tickdoc]

Squirt a bit of Orange seal in there and you'll have even less. ;)

Yes, and you should know part of the secret in the sauce with orange seal is Nanites.....small particles for you nancies to help seal up any punctures or gaps.:beer:

[pjmsj21]

I'm a convert to tubulars as well, though I also enjoy tubeless.

For me it's all about the ride and handling and the Nuetrons with Arenberg's are both comfortable and confident.....really the very best tire/wheel combination for me. I even have my wife riding tubulars on a set of DT Swiss carbon wheels.