Gravel bikes

[oldmill]

I'm intrigued by No. 22's Drifter, but haven't been able to find any reviews on it, probably because it's a relatively new model. If anyone has one or has ridden one, I'd appreciate hearing any thoughts. The bike looks nice. Also considering the tried-and-tru Evergreen, where the reviews seem to be plentiful and positive. Thanks

[hollowgram5]

I'm intrigued by No. 22's Drifter, but haven't been able to find any reviews on it, probably because it's a relatively new model. If anyone has one or has ridden one, I'd appreciate hearing any thoughts. The bike looks nice. Also considering the tried-and-tru Evergreen, where the reviews seem to be plentiful and positive. Thanks
I can't speak for either the Drifter or the Evergreen, but for the money I've been really happy with my TwinSix RandoTi. Still need to tweak a few things on it but dang, it's pretty awesome.

Versatile from a tire standpoint 700x43 or 650x48, geo works well for me. I'll have to put a review up after I get moved next month.

[Jad]

Both look really nice. I have ridden an Evergreen (not mine and not for long), never seen a Drifter. Seems like a tough comparison since the Evergreen would be built to fit, while the geometry looks set with the Drifter (can you get a custom fit with it?). That surprised me, so maybe I'm missing it on their site.

[TunaAndBikes]

I can't speak for either the Drifter or the Evergreen, but for the money I've been really happy with my TwinSix RandoTi. Still need to tweak a few things on it but dang, it's pretty awesome.

Versatile from a tire standpoint 700x43 or 650x48, geo works well for me. I'll have to put a review up after I get moved next month.

Can i ask you about the weight of the finished up twin six, and what package you have on it?
I'm in a similar dilemma and after writing to no.22 they told me that it weighed in the lower 17 lbs (7.75 kgs), which ain't too shabby!

[hollowgram5]

Can i ask you about the weight of the finished up twin six, and what package you have on it?
I'm in a similar dilemma and after writing to no.22 they told me that it weighed in the lower 17 lbs (7.75 kgs), which ain't too shabby!

So I just weighed mine on my bathroom scale, and it was right at 21 lbs.

I ride a 59cm, so its a larger frame to start with. Build is currently as follows:
-59cm Twin Six Standard Rando Ti
-Salsa La Cruz Disc steel fork with lots of steerer (from a frame that broke and was warrantied)
-Cane Creek 110 headset
-46cm Salsa Bell lap bars
-130 Thomson Elite stem 26.0 clamp
-Salsa 'Shaft' Seatpost 31.6 with Fizik Tundra Saddle
-SRAM S700 Hydro disc
-X0 Type 2 Short cage der
-Cannondale Hollowgram SI Crankset with SEACO Team spider and Race Face 42T Narrow wide
-Mavic C29SSMAX wheelset (First Gen) set up with Hutchinson Sector 28 Tubeless tires, 160mm rotors, and 11-32 cassette.

I went 10s because my Vaya Travel is also 10s. That allows me to go back and forth with wheelsets if I so choose without having to swap cassettes.

Places I could lose weight: (besides my midsection)
New Fork - the steel fork is quite a bit heavier than any of the tapered carbon forks on the market
Cutting down the current steerer would slim it a bit, but not as noticeable as a new fork
Lighter bar/stem/post
Lighter wheels/tires

I'm headed out or a ride in a bit with 650x48s, I'll snap a picture or two and get them posted.

[TunaAndBikes]

I'm headed out or a ride in a bit with 650x48s, I'll snap a picture or two and get them posted.

Sweet!
Have a safe ride, can't wait for the pics

[R3awak3n]

yeah, post p some pics. Those twin six bikes are so good looking.

Didnt it come with a carbon fork? I thought you could only buy it F/F and the fork is nice looking too with the TI paint. 21lbs is pretty solid with a steel fork. Cant wait to see some pics with the switchbacks

[DrSpoke]

Not sure if it's relevant or not, but I've got a Niner RLT 9 Steel and it's right at 21 lbs. It's a pretty sweet ride. It's set up w/Force1 hydro and fairly heavy wheels/tires (Easton EA70 XCT w/WTB Nano 40c TCS). That said, I like the Twin Six bikes and am considering the Standard Rando in steel as a future build using a bunch of spare parts - mostly take-offs from a Ridley X-Trail C30 I'm converting to Di2. The titanium Rando looks very nice.

[R3awak3n]

Not sure if it's relevant or not, but I've got a Niner RLT 9 Steel and it's right at 21 lbs. It's a pretty sweet ride. It's set up w/Force1 hydro and fairly heavy wheels/tires (Easton EA70 XCT w/WTB Nano 40c TCS). That said, I like the Twin Six bikes and am considering the Standard Rando in steel as a future build using a bunch of spare parts - mostly take-offs from a Ridley X-Trail C30 I'm converting to Di2. The titanium Rando looks very nice.

I keep seeing the RLT steel, really cool bike. My question is, every picture I keep seeing of it has a different fork, some have rack mounts and others don't. what gives? Also wonder if the RLT can fit a 650b 48mm tire

[DrSpoke]

The rack mount fork is fairly new - about 6 months or so. The new fork also is thru axle. The older version is w/o the rack mounts and has QR axles. But you're right in that even the Niner website shows the old fork on some of the photos.

Not sure about fit on the 650b. I'm running Nano 40c now. It looks like there is room for about a 44 in back and maybe a 42 in front. Niner, it my experience, has pretty good customer relations so it might be worth giving them a call.

[Hilltopperny]

I'm intrigued by No. 22's Drifter, but haven't been able to find any reviews on it, probably because it's a relatively new model. If anyone has one or has ridden one, I'd appreciate hearing any thoughts. The bike looks nice. Also considering the tried-and-tru Evergreen, where the reviews seem to be plentiful and positive. Thanks

Scott from no22 is a forum member he goes by shock on the forum. I'm pretty sure he can do custom for a little extra if needed, but that question would be best left to him. I am looking at a drifter myself, but it will more than likely be bought in mid November as that will make more sense financially for me. The drifter is cold worked stress relieved bi ovalized ti tubing made by the crew that was formerly Saratoga Frameworks and Serotta. The frames I've seen in the shop look top notch and they can also be anodized as well.

[ERK55]

Scott from no22 is a forum member he goes by shock on the forum. I'm pretty sure he can do custom for a little extra if needed, but that question would be best left to him. I am looking at a drifter myself, but it will more than likely be bought in mid November as that will make more sense financially for me. The drifter is cold worked stress relieved bi ovalized ti tubing made by the crew that was formerly Saratoga Frameworks and Serotta. The frames I've seen in the shop look top notch and they can also be anodized as well.

They will do custom for $500.

[adhumston]

Can i ask you about the weight of the finished up twin six, and what package you have on it?
I'm in a similar dilemma and after writing to no.22 they told me that it weighed in the lower 17 lbs (7.75 kgs), which ain't too shabby!

Low 17s seems really light for a titanuum gravel bike, For references, I have an Ibis Hakkalugi disc (carbon) built with some weight weenie parts and it weighs 16.5 lbs w pedals. I also have a Salsa Colossal ti built w Ultegra hydraulic, sub 1500g wheelset, and carbon cockpit and it weights 19.5 w pedals.

[Hilltopperny]

Low 17s seems really light for a titanuum gravel bike, For references, I have an Ibis Hakkalugi disc (carbon) built with some weight weenie parts and it weighs 16.5 lbs w pedals. I also have a Salsa Colossal ti built w Ultegra hydraulic, sub 1500g wheelset, and carbon cockpit and it weights 19.5 w pedals.
I'm pretty sure that Scott said he could build one of these up to be sub 14s with the right compononts so 17s seem within reason.

[hollowgram5]

No fork was required to be purchased at the time. They had options, but they didn't quite meet the needs I was going for (threaded mounts for fenders and a drilled crown for fender/dynamo light).

As of about a month ago, Brent the owner of TwinSix is testing a Ti unicrown fork with a tapered steerer, a drilled crown, and lowboy mounts on the legs/fender mounts at the dropouts. If I were to change forks at this point, it would be for one of those.

Pictures from Yesterday's ride: (I stole the wheels/tires from the lady's Straggler, just to see what the road plus rage is about)
http://i.imgur.com/qUzrTBHl.jpg http://i.imgur.com/cAVX0t5l.jpg

And a few earlier shots:
http://i.imgur.com/TaIxItYl.jpg http://i.imgur.com/aF8WSZOl.jpg

[TunaAndBikes]

Low 17s seems really light for a titanuum gravel bike, For references, I have an Ibis Hakkalugi disc (carbon) built with some weight weenie parts and it weighs 16.5 lbs w pedals. I also have a Salsa Colossal ti built w Ultegra hydraulic, sub 1500g wheelset, and carbon cockpit and it weights 19.5 w pedals.

I wouldn't know, just transmitting info I received, but i don't think low to mid 17 lbs would be ridiculous if it's the weight without pedals. That's about what my aluminium cross bike weighs with ultegra and lightweight alloy clinchers. Yet again, aluminium =/= titanium, disc brakes are heavier so maybe it is a bit optimistic, but i trust no.22'S honesty on the matter.

[John H.]

Low 17's is really a stretch with a ti bike.
1st of all- Discs add a pound, no way around it.
Low 17's could be achieved with no pedals or cages- but only if the build was super light (and not as useful for actual gravel riding).
This would entail:
carbon bars
carbon post
light saddle
dura-ace or Red 22 build with a tight cassette of the light variety-
140mm rotors
light wheel set
light and probably underperforming tires.

I base this on my S-works Crux with discs. When it is set up with an 11-36 cassette, spd pedals, cages, and 33mm tires it is over 18. And I know that my frame is way lighter than any titanium cross/gravel frame would be.


I wouldn't know, just transmitting info I received, but i don't think low to mid 17 lbs would be ridiculous if it's the weight without pedals. That's about what my aluminium cross bike weighs with ultegra and lightweight alloy clinchers. Yet again, aluminium =/= titanium, disc brakes are heavier so maybe it is a bit optimistic, but i trust no.22'S honesty on the matter.

[sandyrs]

Low 17's is really a stretch with a ti bike.
1st of all- Discs add a pound, no way around it.
Low 17's could be achieved with no pedals or cages- but only if the build was super light (and not as useful for actual gravel riding).
This would entail:
carbon bars
carbon post
light saddle
dura-ace or Red 22 build with a tight cassette of the light variety-
140mm rotors
light wheel set
light and probably underperforming tires.

I base this on my S-works Crux with discs. When it is set up with an 11-36 cassette, spd pedals, cages, and 33mm tires it is over 18. And I know that my frame is way lighter than any titanium cross/gravel frame would be.

This.

Plus, weight within a few pounds shouldn't be anywhere close to a priority for a "gravel bike." Sure riding a 30 pound gravel bike might be noticeable, but who notices 19 vs 17 pounds when you're actually out on the dirt? These bikes often end up loaded up with gear anyway.

[miguel]

dude those ergo drops are so ugly

[Hilltopperny]

Low 17's is really a stretch with a ti bike.
1st of all- Discs add a pound, no way around it.
Low 17's could be achieved with no pedals or cages- but only if the build was super light (and not as useful for actual gravel riding).
This would entail:
carbon bars
carbon post
light saddle
dura-ace or Red 22 build with a tight cassette of the light variety-
140mm rotors
light wheel set
light and probably underperforming tires.

I base this on my S-works Crux with discs. When it is set up with an 11-36 cassette, spd pedals, cages, and 33mm tires it is over 18. And I know that my frame is way lighter than any titanium cross/gravel frame would be.

I'm sure the 17s is without pedals and cages

[adhumston]

I'm pretty sure that Scott said he could build one of these up to be sub 14s with the right compononts so 17s seem within reason.

Now that is something I would love to see! I find that really hard to believe, but I guess with mechanical discs, ultra light tubulars, weight weenie cockpit, and a 1x drivetrain it could be done.

With that being said, I can guarantee you I wouldn't want to take it on some of the roads I ride!

[TunaAndBikes]

This.

Plus, weight within a few pounds shouldn't be anywhere close to a priority for a "gravel bike." Sure riding a 30 pound gravel bike might be noticeable, but who notices 19 vs 17 pounds when you're actually out on the dirt? These bikes often end up loaded up with gear anyway.

That is indeed true, just adding a frame bag adds at least 1 pound to the setup.
Although we should get back on track: Anyone with experience or suggestions on gravel bikes would be very welcome! I've also been looking at the Mosaic GS1 and Breadwinner B-Road that are around the same price range as the Drifter. Anyone have experience with any of these? And what about gravel bikes on light single track?

[hollowgram5]

dude those ergo drops are so ugly
Are you talking about the bars on my TwinSix?

[Hilltopperny]

:DNow that is something I would love to see! I find that really hard to believe, but I guess with mechanical discs, ultra light tubulars, weight weenie cockpit, and a 1x drivetrain it could be done.

With that being said, I can guarantee you I wouldn't want to take it on some of the roads I ride!
Yes it would definitely be a 1x and possibly cantis. I'm just going by what I heard from the horses mouth. Not disputing that it wouldn't be suited for some more serious trail riding. I'm 200lbs and would rather have a stouter build anyway and cantis or mechanical disk would be fine for an all arounder. I'm looking at sram red 22 build with reasonably stout wheels and cantis for what I would use it for. If I wanted a cross bike I'd get the broken arrow. The drifter is more of an adventure bike.

[ceolwulf]

That 650B x 48 setup looks really intriguing with the deep soft gravel we have in vast quantities here. Like riding through porridge. Except, you know, gravel.

I might have to look into this a bit.

[TunaAndBikes]

Are you talking about the bars on my TwinSix?

I think it looks ok, either way comfort>looks !
:beer:

[TunaAndBikes]

:D
If I wanted a cross bike I'd get the broken arrow. The drifter is more of an adventure bike.
About that, for a true all rounder which way would either of you go?
Cross or Adventure? Do they feel really much different? I've only ever had experience with either cross or full on roadie

[Clancy]

About that, for a true all rounder which way would either of you go?
Cross or Adventure? Do they feel really much different? I've only ever had experience with either cross or full on roadie

I have a Gunnar Hyper-X, BB7 brakes, SRAM Force build, weights 19.5 with SPD pedals, cages. I just finished building a custom Ti, Ultegra group, Shimano C24 wheels, Ritchy cockpit, with pedals and cages, 17.3. I'd say that's average for a Ti bike WITH caliper brakes - 17.5 lbs. so getting a Ti disc down to the same would take some pricy parts I believe.

My Gunnar is not as stable on fast decents as my steel frame Anderson. The Anderson has a lower bottom bracket and longer wheelbase.

That's the big difference with cross vs adventure - adventure bikes will have lower bottom brackets and longer wheelbase. That's if you're comparing a true cross frame to a true adventure/gravel frame. But it's not that black and white with so many companies jumping onto the gravel bike wave. Lots of gray with what some are labeling adventure bikes. And now even more blending with the emerging "all rounder", which seems to be a bike that leans more towards endurance geometry and can take 32s, like the new Cervelo. Not a cross bike, not an adventure, not a, not a, not a.....

Geez, when did road bike geometry get all these sub-groups? I remember when.........

[TunaAndBikes]

Geez, when did road bike geometry get all these sub-groups? I remember when.........

At least we don't have to worry about suspension...
Wait...

[hollowgram5]

At least we don't have to worry about suspension...
Wait...

I know right...

http://brimages.bikeboardmedia.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/lauf-grit-gravel-road-bike-leaf-spring-suspension-fork-6.jpg

http://brightcove.vo.llnwd.net/e1/pd/526148719/526148719_4854729869001_4854612349001-vs.jpg?pubId=526148719

[miguel]

Are you talking about the bars on my TwinSix?

http://i.imgur.com/aF8WSZOl.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-aepfRvb6bHs/UCEfINP0aUI/AAAAAAAACJU/URKo9rjwZjw/s1600/creepy1.jpg

[hollowgram5]

I think it looks ok, either way comfort>looks !
:beer:

:beer: correct. The bike rides well, and it was built out of the parts bin stuff I had laying around. No need to spend excessive money if the stuff is all laying around unused. :no:

[scottyjames]

Hollowgram, I'm arriving a little late here but I'm curious about the sizing of your 59 cm T6 ti rando. In the pictures you included earlier, what's the bb center to top of saddle measurement? Great looking bike.

[GonaSovereign]

Both look really nice. I have ridden an Evergreen (not mine and not for long), never seen a Drifter. Seems like a tough comparison since the Evergreen would be built to fit, while the geometry looks set with the Drifter (can you get a custom fit with it?). That surprised me, so maybe I'm missing it on their site.


No. 22 will do custom for a bit more $.

[VoyTirando]

that's pretty!!!! for whatever reason, that uni actually moves me. I usually hate how they look, and pine for something more elegant. but this one is hot. Nice.

[hollowgram5]

Hollowgram, I'm arriving a little late here but I'm curious about the sizing of your 59 cm T6 ti rando. In the pictures you included earlier, what's the bb center to top of saddle measurement? Great looking bike.
I am away from the bike til early next week, but I'll get you dims when I get home of how it finished out.

[Noah_Deuce]

Another vote for Twin Six here - I've got a steel Standard Rando and love it. Running wTB Horizons on it and it just floats.
(Also have a Ti Rando for sale, if anyone wants a screaming deal on a 55cm frame).