Merlin Road - frame set advice

[gt eunuch]

I will get more pics soon, but I am on the fence about picking it up so I need to call upon the never ending wisdom of ThePaceline.

I have the opportunity to get an extremely good deal on a Merlin road frame. The only things on the frame are the seatpost and the seatpost clamp. There are no markings on the frame aside from 'Merlin' on the down tube and the s/n on the rear dropout. The head tube is for a 1" fork, and the cable stops are mounted on the head tube.

Obvious issue here is the lack of a fork. There are a plethora of forks that I could use for this (eyes on a Wound Up) but I want to ensure I get one with the right axle to crown length, and the correct rake.

I called the number on Merlin's site, only to find out that they were bought out and no longer carry information about bikes this old (guy on the phone said 'WOW that's IS old' when I mentioned the head tube size)

Any information on this would be lovely, of course pics would help, but I hope I have covered enough info to get this ball rolling.

[jtakeda]

Hmm. What size is this frame?

I have a Merlin I'm selling with fork and headset.

[gt eunuch]

Seems to be 54 square as far as the measuring tape goes.

[mhespenheide]

For what purpose?

Merlins are, in general, great bikes. I've heard of some reports of too much flex for the XLM (ultralight) models in larger sizes, but this probably isn't an XLM, and yours is on the small side regardless.

There are many, many fine bicycles out there with 1" head tubes.

[gt eunuch]

For what purpose?

Bah, I guess the confusion comes from the term frameset. This is a frame only, and does not come with the fork, and the owner does not have the fork. Thus my search for a (the correct) fork.

[cadence90]

If Merlin can't, Tom Kellogg might be able to help you with the fork info.

[jds108]

My 55 extralight has a 1" headtube. I bought it in '96 or '97. It takes a fork with a 40mm rake which is/was hard to find. Not sure how much the handling will change with a 43 and sorry to say but I don't know the appropriate axle to crown measurement. My fork is an Ouzo Pro.

[mhespenheide]

Bah, I guess the confusion comes from the term frameset. This is a frame only, and does not come with the fork, and the owner does not have the fork. Thus my search for a (the correct) fork.

Ah, sorry. I interpreted you to be asking whether or not you should buy the frame.

[cachagua]

For what purpose?

Merlins are, in general, great bikes. I've heard of some reports of too much flex for the XLM (ultralight) models in larger sizes, but this probably isn't an XLM, and yours is on the small side regardless...

I've never ridden a stiffer bike than the 55cm Extralight I had. Forty ounces of eternal, unyielding solidity. I think at best these are vixens, nasty little crit bikes, and if that's your taste you'll love it. (See first question above.) But the fork is crucial -- I never could make peace with the way mine handled, and I didn't understand 'til much later that the 43mm rake fork I had was simply incorrect. I think 40 is a much more realistic figure for the way these frames are made.

So if someone's offering you a flaming deal, and IF that's the style of bike you want, I'd say poke around and see what kind of fork you can turn up, and go for it!

[carpediemracing]

I sold Merlins in that era.

First, you never mentioned the BB. I'm assuming that it's an English BB then? The Wound Up forks came out just around when Merlin went to the threaded BB.

Next, I don't know who does what with titanium anymore, but back in the day Merlin would take frames back and do surgery on them. They could literally replace any tube on any (Merlin) frame. One of our normal things was to get an old press-fit BB Merlin back and get an English BB shell "installed". One guy had the s-curve stays put on while getting the BB shell installed - his bike was totally different when it came back.

Another thing - we sold custom Merlins, which carried Kellogg decals because Kellogg approved the geometry or something. One of our customers got a regular custom Merlin and then the same thing in the Extralight. He then got S&S couplings for the regular Merlin, retrofitted. He said that the Extralight was stiffer initially but with the couplings the regular became stiffer (because the couplings don't flex and they effectively shorten the tube lengths of the frame).

My thought is that you might look into what it would take to replace the 1" headtube with a 1-1/8" head tube (or even a tapered, although that wouldn't be super period correct). The 1-1/8" headtube opens up options for you and, if you have an English BB, is something that was offered at about that time.

Finally, if you've never ridden a Merlin, you ought to. I rode a Merlin back in the day and I hated it. I thought something was broken in the frame, it felt so flexy (this was a regular Merlin, press BB, 1" head tube, Wound Up fork - it was the owner's bike). I was riding Cannondales at the time so there's that, but it felt more flexible than anything else I'd test ridden. I put my wheels on it to eliminate that as a variable (it helped a bit but not that much). At that time we sold Specialized, had recently sold Panasonic - I had a pair of the Tange Prestige bikes in road and mountain flavors, Cannondale, Gita/Italian stuff, some others.

[pbarry]

Seems to be 54 square as far as the measuring tape goes.

From my rusty memory of Somerville, a 54 should have a 73 HT angle. A 43 rake fork will give a good trail number. You can measure the HT angle by placing the frame in a pivoting bike stand, rotate until the TT is level, then put a digital protractor on the HT.

[djg21]

I will get more pics soon, but I am on the fence about picking it up so I need to call upon the never ending wisdom of ThePaceline.

I have the opportunity to get an extremely good deal on a Merlin road frame. The only things on the frame are the seatpost and the seatpost clamp. There are no markings on the frame aside from 'Merlin' on the down tube and the s/n on the rear dropout. The head tube is for a 1" fork, and the cable stops are mounted on the head tube.

Obvious issue here is the lack of a fork. There are a plethora of forks that I could use for this (eyes on a Wound Up) but I want to ensure I get one with the right axle to crown length, and the correct rake.

I called the number on Merlin's site, only to find out that they were bought out and no longer carry information about bikes this old (guy on the phone said 'WOW that's IS old' when I mentioned the head tube size)

Any information on this would be lovely, of course pics would help, but I hope I have covered enough info to get this ball rolling.

I had one of the originals in the early 90s. My bike came with the prism AL fork, which was awful, and I quickly replaced it with a Time fork, which completely changed the way the bike felt and rode. The geometries of the 1997 model were posted in a thread here: http://forums.roadbikereview.com/litespeed-merlin/1992-merlin-road-geometry-228324-post3030472.html#poststop

Maybe you can do a search on the way back machine archive to confirm.

If not, Merlins were designed by Tom Kellog. I'd contact him and ask.

So you know, the bike is pretty flexy at the bottom bracket. I'd get derailleur rub by pedaling. Newer Ti bikes are much improved. The press-in WTB bottom brackets also are a pain in the ass.

[bobswire]

I had a 54 Merlin EL 1989 model 1" headtube that had a Time fork, nice ride but I felt it lacked something,especially descending. I emailed Tom Kellogg and he suggested a Wound Up (this was about 9 years or so ago) and 43 rake would be fine. The WoundUp with steel steer tube made all the difference in the world in handling and especially descending.

http://i67.tinypic.com/1e9eo4.jpg

This is from Spectrum site in regard to his thoughts on forks in general and Wound-Ups.
http://www.spectrum-cycles.com/forks.php

Forks | History | Time Fork Ride | The Alpha Q | The ENVE Road Forks |
| Serotta Fork Series | WoundUp | The Reynolds UL |

Fork


If there is one thing Tom loves to test and write about, it's bicycle forks.

GENERAL CARBON FORK INFORMATION: A brief description of the various general types of "carbon" forks.

CARBON BLADES
All of the early carbon forks and still some carbon forks today use this general design. They are usually built with an aluminum steerer and aluminum crown. Most of them have their crown area painted black in order to disguise the aluminum crown.

CARBON BLADES AND STEERER, ALUMINUM CROWN: This category of carbon forks is mostly confined to private label forks. Early in the carbon steerer days, this was a popular approach to lighter forks until it was found that this design is quite difficult to make reliable forks with. One exception to this rule is the extremely reliable WoundUp fork. Most forks of this design are "mid priced" forks.

FULL CARBON Usually with aluminum or stainless crown race. This is still one of the most common fork designs. The steerer, internal crown and blades are all carbon, assembled during the final blade layup process. In the past, this is how most Reynolds forks were manufactured.

MONOCOCUE: Or single piece molding. Monocoque fork building is very difficult and time consuming. Only a few forks are built this way. The entire fork is molded at once from the bottom of the blades to the top of the steerer. Any internal reinforcement must be molded at the same time as the body of the fork and the steerer. Potentially, this method can produce the best combination of light weight, stiffness and ride qualities, but at considerably higher costs.
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History of Forks


The development of carbon forks has taken many fits and starts over the years. The first widely distributed carbon fork was the Kestrel EMS designed by John Mouritsen. It used a steel steerer and crown (brazed together) bonded to a lay-up of carbon blades that fully surround the crown. The process of overlapping carbon blade material to bond to and cover the crown is now a rarely used manufacturing process.

As carbon forks became more popular, a number of different fabrication techniques were developed and in some cases dropped. Time's Equipe Pro for example; started with a steel steerer bonded to an aluminum crown. Then pre woven carbon and polypropylene "socks" were drawn over flexible foam blade cores up onto the aluminum crown. Before the assembly was placed in the mold for resin injection and curing, a small piece of carbon cloth was wrapped down the front of the crown, underneath and up the back, very clean.

WoundUp continues today using a wound blade design bonded into a machined aluminum crown. This design gives WoundUp a great deal of control over the ride and performance characteristics of their forks, more than most other forks we have tested. It also makes it relatively easy for them to make up custom forks with differing brake clearances, etc.

The most popular high-end forks today use either "Full Carbon" or " Monococue " technology. Properly manufactured carbon forks are reliable light-weight forks. The ENVE 1.0 fork tips the scales at about 310 grams. The lightest forks, those under about 330 grams however, do all suffer in one way or another in the control department.

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Time Fork Ride and History


When Time first began to market a carbon fork in Europe many years ago, we were very excited to be given the opportunity to test it. Both Spectrum and Merlin were interested in getting another fork supplier in addition to Kinesis at the time and the Time option was exciting. After reading some good reports about the Time fork, Tom began testing it for possible use on Spectrum and Merlin road frames. As soon as he got on the original fork he found that it was too harsh for his tastes. It had good control characteristics, but he was able to feel every bit of the road surface. We contacted Time with our concerns and had a new prototype on the text bike in less than two weeks.

The new version was a remarkable improvement. In talking with Jean Pierre from Time/France we found out that the "fix" was actually quite simple for Time to accomplish. The fork was made up of fiber "Socks" pulled up over a foam core. The original fork used only carbon socks while the new one had some "vectran" fiber built in. Vectran is a form of Polypropylene. In any case, the new version did a wonderful job of insulating much of the harsh characteristics of the original fork. As time continues to develop new forks, we'll keep testing them.

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The Alpha Q


The Alpha-Q fork, developed by Dr. Kyu Lee, was the first of the "Carbon Rooted" forks. Dr. Lee's design enabled him to reduce the weight of his forks further than others could at the time and still retain the strength and rigidity required in a high end fork. The other distinctive characteristic of the Alpha-Q line of forks was their hand workmanship. The lay-ups of their forks were simply the most beautiful in the business at the time. In addition, Alpha-Q forks became known for their superior rigidity. They were available with a variety of steerer materials, diameters and blade shapes. AlphaQ offered both heavier and lighter forks for riders of different needs along with versions designed for tandems and Cyclo-X. A number of years after True Temper bought AlphaQ from Kyu, they closed the division, citing dropping profits and increasing liability costs.

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The ENVE Road Forks


ENVE is a Utah based company, formerly known as EDGE that began when a few engineers and production folks from existing bicycle composite component manufacturers decided to start their own company. Their forks are manufactured in a monocoque process. They are composite from tip to tail, no metal is used. They have become the high end composite fork standard over the last few years as they have been adopted by many of the best frame builders in the world. We offer ENVE forks with our titanium frames as a standard fork.

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The Seven Fork Series


Seven Cycles has been offering composite forks for many years. Their "5-E" fork is their standard road fork and is available to us in a very wide range of offsets, lengths and dropout configurations. Of all the composite forks that we offer, it has the most traditional profile with a smooth gentle curve. This is our choice of fork when we need an offset or length that is out of the ordinary, and frequently our customers' choice when they choose their fork by appearance. An excellent choice in any case since the 5-E is by any standards a high performance fork. The Seven 5-E is a standard fork with our titanium frames.

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The Pegoretti FALZ Fork


Dario Pegoretti is one of the most respected frame builders in the world. He has been building frames under other names for decades for many of the most famous professional racers beginning in the early eighties. He now builds exclusively under his own name and is renowned for his amazing ability to create works of art that are second to none from a performance perspective. It took Dario a number of years to develop his composite fork, the FALZ. He was looking to distinguish the fork from others with both appearance and lateral stiffness. Although the FALZ looks similar to a number of other forks in profile with a gentle curve to the blades, Dario's crown area is very distinctive with the general look that you might expect from a traditional flat top crown. The FALZ is only available with 45mm and 50mm offsets and should not be used with front end geometries outside the range of 72.5 - 73.5 head angles. The FALZ is a standard fork with our titanium frames.

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The Serotta Fork Series


Serotta Cycles had been building composite forks for many years. Manufacturing had been done in southern California in the same facility where Reynolds Composites built their original Ouzo Pro and UL forks. The manager of the operation was Mike Lopez who ran the Reynolds operation there for many years. The Serotta forks were built using the same manufacturing techniques that Mike developed for the ultra reliable Ouzo Pro. These forks were available in a variety of stiffness ranges, rakes, clearances and even had options for fender mounts and mounts for cantilever brakes when required. The Serotta forks gave us a huge range of functional options to work with in designing a custom frame set and the quality of workmanship was unsurpassed. Sadly, the Serotta company ended operations a few years ago.

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The Reynolds UL


The Reynolds UL was developed by Tom Kellogg and Mike Lopez at Reynolds as the "new generation" of forks to come out of Reynolds over the winter of '06-'07. Tom and Mike spent about 16 months between the first concept discussions and final production. Those intervening months were spent in ID work (industrial design), process development, materials decisions, and a lot of prototype testing. Tom became known for riding the "fork of the week" by the other riders in his area. During one especially intense testing period, Tom rode four different prototypes over a two week period.

The result? The UL was by far the highest high performance Hyper-Light fork ever made. With the steerer cut to 200mm, the UL weighed in at 270gr. The lightest fork which can match all of its stiffness characteristics weighed over 100gr. more at the time. The other forks in its weight class were considerably more flexible both laterally and torsionally. It is beyond sad that Reynolds got out of the fork business. Many years later, I still ride and race on prototype #8. At least I've got one.

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WoundUp


It took me a few hundred meters into my first ride on a WoundUp many years ago to figure out that we had something special here. It took a couple hundred miles to fully appreciate the fork though. Of course my first reaction to the fork was, UGLY! In any case, it was pretty odd looking at. However, once on the bike it didn't look too bad.

Now to what the fork does. Ultimately, the single biggest advance made by WoundUp relative to other forks was the torsional rigidity of the blades and fork as a whole. Most people assume that fork stiffness is most important in resistance to lateral forces. Actually, this is not the case. Torsional rigidity is considerably more important because sufficient lateral stiffness is very easily built into a fork while torsional rigidity is not. Try to picture what lateral forces do to a fork in the real world. There, you have a front hub clamped onto the front drops keeping them parallel. With the hub in there as a structural member, lateral deflections will, by definition, force the blades to deflect in a "S" shape curve, not a "C" shape curve. What this means is that forks (in the real world) are about twice as laterally stiff as you feel when you squeeze the dropouts together. Torsional stiffness is tougher to accomplish though. The front hub, as a part of the fork structure only helps by forcing the two blades to work in tandem as they resist torsional stresses.

You might ask "what torsional stresses?" Actually, torsional stresses are not all that great, but they can really cause a fork to feel vague if not addressed. Take the Time Club fork as an example. Although it is very light and eminently comfortable, it is torsionally quite flexible. It is a great fork for putting on the miles. The problems develop when you put it in stressful situations. For example; hairy descents and hard criterium cornering can really stress the Club. Under these conditions, the Club fork will make you feel as though you are not connected to the front wheel. Indeed, it seems as though there is actually a lag time between handlebar input and bike reaction. You lose the immediacy if input.

With a good competition fork like the ENVE, Pegoretti or Seven fork, this is not the case. The WoundUp is the next step. While the Seven, FALZ and ENVE forks are great forks and I would not have expected anything more from a fork, the WoundUp is clearly a great choice for a fork when the going gets seriously twisty. You just have to get used to the way that they look.

This was my Merlin before and after:

http://i55.tinypic.com/28cj6g7.jpg

http://i54.tinypic.com/a58gar.jpg