Lance: Good or Evil [Archive] - The Paceline Forum

JohnS

06-24-2006, 11:44 AM

We've had several threads lately on what Lance is really like. Some say that he's a kind individual who helps others while others say he is a mean, cutthroat businessman who runs roughshod over others. Maybe it's not an either/or answer. Maybe it's both. It seems to me that he changed when he became Lance Inc. and not Lance the bikerider on USPS. For those that think people can't change that much, look at Michael Jackson. Don't laugh. He was a nice kid back in the J5 days and now his mom wouldn't recognize him without a picture, and I don't just mean physically.

Fixed

06-24-2006, 12:08 PM

bro I bet he doesn't send frankie and betsy a christmas gift .
cheers

Bill Bove

06-24-2006, 12:19 PM

I remember people thought he was an arrogent d!ck when he was young, before he won the worlds and before he got sick. people just wrote it off as youth and being from Texas. Then he won the worlds and people started thinking he was coccky but had reason to be and he was still from Texas. Then he got sick and we all felt sorry for him because like him or not you wouldn't wish that on anybody even if he was from Texas. Now that we were all in his camp and on his side we all projected our image of what we wanted him to be but he is who he is and he is from Texas.

Good? Bad? He's got seven wins.

Kevan

06-24-2006, 12:29 PM

don't get me started on the subject of Texas.

dave thompson

06-24-2006, 12:40 PM

don't get me started on the subject of Texas.
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS! TEXAS!
TEXAS!
So there.

Lunar Probe

06-24-2006, 01:26 PM

Texas has a lot of hot chicks.

Ti Designs

06-24-2006, 01:27 PM

here's an idea: Take a phone book the thickness of a small step stool, open up to some randon page of the white pages, pick some name off the page. Is that person good or evil? Most of us really only know slightly more about Lance than we do about some random person picked out of the phone book. What we do know (and pin on Lance) is what the marketing people want us to know, and the reaction of the public to this marketing. I've been called "Lance" on the bike path ('cause I ride a road bike and wear funny shoes), did the person who called me that know Lance? I don't think so, Lance don't visit this neck of the woods too often. It's the media, to them there was exactly one american rider worth watching, and that's all people heard about (cept for the good people of Marblehead MA who kept asking "who's this Lance guy?").

So, the real question is if Lance's media representation is good or evil. As someone who works in the bike industry I would have to say that it's at least part good. People know about cycling and are inspired to give it a try - that's the good side. Trek has made their whole marketing scheme about Lance. They put his picture on the cover of their catalog every year. They even left off the year - everybody knows that picture is from 2003... I think the evil side is best shown with Trek's own race promotions - the race to replace. The negative side isn't how good Lance was, it's how everybody else is put in his shadow. How many countries are looking for their next great champion and discarding the talent they have now? Spain is looking for the next Indurain, France is looking for the next Hinault, England is still looking for a replacement for Simpson, and the US is looking for Bin Laden - oops, I mean a replacement for Lance! Great champions lead to long periods of disapointment.

I could care less who's on top of the cycling world (I haven't seen the 2004 or 2005 tour - I have a pretty good idea of who wins). I'm not looking for the next Lance. I'm looking for great performances from local riders - you're heard of them, maybe you've even seen one or two. They don't show up on Trek catalogs (IF and Cannondale have been known to show 'em), they show up on club rides wearing old team jerseys. Is a top 10 place in a cat 5 race by a guy who took up cycling after he turned 40 any less impressive than some pro winning a stage race? OK maybe it is, but it's a lot closer to home and I'm pretty sure they won't pop positive in a blood test a month later. My point here is that the media focus on exactly one person to the exclusion of all others.

The down side of what the media does is the masses of people who "identify with" their hero instead of being themselves. (I know, bad subject for me to bring up). Last season I was out for a ride when I met up with four local racers. Clearly there was a lot of wannabeitis, as they called one of them Chippo. At every town line they would lead out their sprinter as they had seen in so many videos. And each time I took the line without much effort. Many people will say "that's what they want to do, just let them". I say they could do so much better and understand so much more if they would stop trying to look like euro pros and started learning as novice racers should. The question is, is it better to look like the guy at the top of the sport or to be the best individual you can be? They only see two things, Lance as the top of the sport, and everyone else as a failed Lance replacement. When you put it in that light...

Just to put it in better perspective, who's your pick for the 2016 tour? All the guys in the hunt this year are going to be on TV with Bob Roll or pushing their clothing line. So who's the new kid with both potential to make it and the stability to hold it together? It's some kid who's out there putting in the effort in some two bit local race. Y'all are going to be talking about them enough in 10 years, why not try to pick 'em out so you can start early?

MallyG

06-24-2006, 01:27 PM

A very good friend sat next to him at a Charity dinner in London recently. Talked all evening about kids, riding, travelling etc
My pal came away thinking he was a 'mensch'.

swoop

06-24-2006, 01:28 PM

who cares what he's like? for all i care he eats babies and sh*ts hand grenades. we are all just jacka**es on bikes. who said anything about being nice as a requirement for anything?

Bill Bove

06-24-2006, 02:25 PM

don't get me started on the subject of Texas.
Texas is like a fan...

Serpico

06-24-2006, 02:30 PM

...

Fat Robert

06-24-2006, 02:37 PM

good or evil? this is a question for a zoroastrian.

hey, I'm all evil. I'm a bad mutha.

lance is whatever he is.

eddief

06-24-2006, 04:17 PM

then there's The Axis of Evil.

I'll take Lance's brand any time.

SoCalSteve

06-24-2006, 04:50 PM

This is a very important saying in a very important group/s of people in our society (doesnt matter which group-those of you who know, know).

Ok, the point being: Does it REALLY matter if LA is a "warm and fuzzy" guy? Doesnt all that really matters is the work he does for society?

Isnt the final outcome how much money he has raised for cancer research or what a tremendous athlete he and doing so while overcoming such great odds?

Isnt it more important that he is an inspiration for many hundreds/thousands even millions of people who are fighting the hard fight on a daily basis?

Who really cares if he is a "nice guy" or not. If he does good work for society, then why should it matter.

Principles over Personality.

Steve

Lunar Probe

06-24-2006, 04:55 PM