KING 40th anniversary stuff...

[eBAUMANN]

https://www.chrisking.com/2016/04/40th-anniversary-olive-crate-collectors-product-offering/

I almost spit coffee all over the screen when I saw the prices...

[AngryScientist]

silliness with those prices. nothing really special about the kit either.

[tuscanyswe]

That is idd ridiculous!

Must admit i kinda like the olive color tho

[azrider]

Good grief.....just because you can, doesn't mean you should

[eBAUMANN]

That is idd ridiculous!

Must admit i kinda like the olive color tho

i LOVE the color but CMON!!!! :crap:

[likebikes]

reminds me of the limited edition serotta le patron and VentiCinque bikes.

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=85051

[ColonelJLloyd]

Good grief.....just because you can, doesn't mean you should

You don't think they'll sell all they make?

[FlashUNC]

https://imgflip.com/readImage?iid=29982724

[azrider]

You don't think they'll sell all they make?

I hope they do. When you read my comment please use the voice of a whiny, crying little 14 year old girl who isn't getting her way.

Just like the limited run of $2000 pumps last month that Dario 'painted'.....

Oh they'll sell alright

[bicycletricycle]

The reissue of the original style 2 nut headset is cool.

A little rough on the price side

But

It does look good.

[thirdgenbird]

I admit, the original 2-nut headset is pretty sweet. It would look killer on something like a new Della Santa. Bonus points if you pair it with some reissue white industries racer hubs.

[Dead Man]

I just don't understand who loves King that much..

They make incredible bearing parts and come in groovy colors... but it's not like they invented hub.

At least when you sport some anniversary edition of Campy, someone might recognize it and give you the affirmation and gratification you sought when you dropped the coin - but who is ever gonna ride up next to you and say "woah! 40th edition King hubs on those wheels! You have such good taste!"

:p

[ColonelJLloyd]

I hope they do. When you read my comment please use the voice of a whiny, crying little 14 year old girl who isn't getting her way.


Don't have to imagine. My 3.5 year old daughter is right here. ;)

I didn't infer that you were upset by their kit or the price, just making the point that there are lots of people who will want this kit and will pay for it.

At least when you sport some anniversary edition of Campy, someone might recognize it and give you the affirmation and gratification you sought when you dropped the coin - but who is ever gonna ride up next to you and say "woah! 40th edition King hubs on those wheels! You have such good taste!"


$20 says no one here will ever see these on a bike that is being ridden.

[Cornfed]

I'll wait for the 50th.

[beeatnik]

The salt and pepper shakers and the 1" headset on the stand are good values. Why not have some cycling industrial design around the house (other than the bikas, of course).

[mwynne]

The salt and pepper shakers and the 1" headset on the stand are good values. Why not have some cycling industrial design around the house (other than the bikas, of course).

If they did a pepper mill (not shaker) I'd be sold.

[LJohnny]

I guess they see people going nuts and paying $1.3K for a floor pump...

[charliedid]

They should sell it with a Leica and charge $25K

[msl819]

The reissue of the original style 2 nut headset is cool.

A little rough on the price side

But

It does look good.

I love the color and would pay the price, as ridiculous as it, for a 2nut in olive, but they apparently aren't doing the 2nut in olive - just reissue chrome. Id love a 2nut and a set of 32 hole in olive, neither of which are available as I can tell. But I agree their prices are crazy.

What are the chances the olive becomes a standard color down the road?

[d_douglas]

The prices make me gag a bit. Anyone want to buy my R45 disc hubs for a mere $1000? :banana:

I actually prefer Hope and DT hubs, and part of it is the embarassment of the cost of these.

[Dustin]

King hubs are groovy and all, but after going Onyx on my recent MTB build, I don't think King will be getting any more of my money, Olive color or not. Nice color though!

[Matthew]

I got a new Colnago EPS frame/fork, headset, carbon Colnago seatpost, Deda stem, and Deda carbon bars for what they are charging for their kits. In better colors. I didn't get a fancy book or metal name plate though. Guess I did get a crap deal.

[donevwil]

For true nostalgia a 40th anniversary CK threadless headset should have an o-ring instead of the split ring.

[Black Dog]

Sooooo, has CK now become the Rapha of parts? Someone had to say it...:D

[alexsteinker]

the thing that will surprise you the most is all the young 20 something instagram "influencers" that will be running all these parts on their coffee run bikes. Just wait.

[eBAUMANN]

the thing that will surprise you the most is all the young 20 something instagram "influencers" that will be running all these parts on their coffee run bikes. Just wait.

i wonder when these companies will realize that tactics like that only serve to further resentment not only towards those "influencers" but also towards the company itself.

its just such a blatant money grab, makes me want to seek out quality alternatives to king stuff instead of giving them even more of my money. though that already kinda happened the day i realized how genius the DT end cap system was...

the saddest part is that since its a special edition anniversary thing, the chances of them adding the olive as a standard color is almost nonexistent. oh well.

[Seramount]

The reissue of the original style 2 nut headset is cool.

A little rough on the price side

just bought a regular 2Nut online for $129...not as shiny.

still pretty tho.

[mwynne]

[...]makes me want to seek out quality alternatives to king stuff [...]

Debating that for both a wheel rebuild (old, but still good King hubs - actually, to those pacenti rims you sold me!), and a new bike/build...

[tumbler]

i wonder when these companies will realize that tactics like that only serve to further resentment not only towards those "influencers" but also towards the company itself.

its just such a blatant money grab, makes me want to seek out quality alternatives to king stuff instead of giving them even more of my money.

This sums up my feelings. They make nice parts and all, but this is a bit much.

[livingminimal]

its just such a blatant money grab,

I think this is the thing that pisses me off more than anything. If there was a slight premium on the packaging, and the color was more of a "thanks for being a CK supporter" type of thing, I could stomach that and I might actually be in for a crate for my upcoming build. This though? This is a bull**** cash-in.

they're getting ripped a new one on IG and rightfully so.

though that already kinda happened the day i realized how genius the DT end cap system was...

Yup. Same. Running one set of king hubs at this point, and four sets of DTs....

[eBAUMANN]

they're getting ripped a new one on IG and rightfully so.

hahaha there are some gems in there:

"Will the "Olive Crate" offer still be around after I get my corrective cosmetic orthodontics practice off and running?"

"calm down, it comes with a box."

"One time I had to wait 8 weeks for a limited edition Cobra Commander, it was totally worth it."

[Buzz Killington]

Too bad the company isn't older, I could only afford those kits if King was founded in 976AD, or earlier....

[Mikej]

CERAMIC BEARNG UPGRADE IN HUBS AND BB. Prices are not that far above normal when you take ceramic upgrade into consideration.

[eBAUMANN]

CERAMIC BEARNG UPGRADE IN HUBS AND BB. Prices are not that far above normal when you take ceramic upgrade into consideration.

NOBODY ASKED FOR CERAMIC BALLS!!!

This is reminding me of something I noticed at the movie theater last week...

The 7-9pm shows are ONLY available in 3D...which is a $19 ticket...yea.

The 12/5pm shows and 1050pm shows are in 2D.

So, they get the people who don't want 3D to fill the theaters at times when they would otherwise be empty, then they empty the wallets of those trying to go during "primetime hours," offering only their most expensive product.

AMC and Chris King should be buddies.

[1X10]

I am thinking that a set of those Boost hubs rocking out a 29+ on the trails would be rather sic...:beer:

Only problem is I would be afraid to bury them in mud and sand...

To be honest if I could float $2k USD without any questions I would...

Reality...maybe for some?...maybe?...Not I...

Cool offering!!

[54ny77]

King must be responding to some sort of market demand, inquiry, etc., obviously none if whom reside in this thread. :D

The market will speak as to the true interest. More power to em, and they're all machined right here onshore, right? It looks beautiful, and we'll crafted. Yeah crazy price but so what, it can still be appreciated. Why ridicule them when they're doing the real deal (design and production) in the u.s. whereas, as someone mentioned price comparison to rapha, thats all made in some random factory in China probably by some kid or woman making a few bucks a day.

Nothin' wrong with what King is trying to achieve.

[Satellite]

Really considering the salt and pepper shakers. Always wanted them anyways.

[eBAUMANN]

Why ridicule them when they're doing the real deal (design and production) in the u.s. whereas, as someone mentioned price comparison to rapha, thats all made in some random factory in China probably by some kid or woman making a few bucks a day.

Nothin' wrong with what King is trying to achieve.

I dunno about the rest of you guys, but I have heard some less-than-favorable things from people about what its like to work as an employee of the CK empire...

[ergott]

The 7-9pm shows are ONLY available in 3D...which is a $19 ticket...yea.

The 12/5pm shows and 1050pm shows are in 2D.

I hate movies in 3D.

:beer:

[chiasticon]

the kit and headsets are expensive and it's annoying you can't buy the hubs or BB's by themselves, but if you're after a wheelset with the hubs built in, it's $135 more. a decent chunk of change, sure, but not worth getting p*ssed-off over. it's not three times the already crazy-expensive price ala silca/pegoretti.

these are $1285: http://wheelshop.chrisking.com/40th-anniversary-alloy-race-climb/

these are $1150: http://wheelshop.chrisking.com/alloy-race-climb/

I'm kinda annoyed the headsets are on STANDS though; like they don't expect you to ever actually install and use them.

[likebikes]

Why ridicule them when they're doing the real deal (design and production) in the u.s. whereas, as someone mentioned price comparison to rapha, thats all made in some random factory in China probably by some kid or woman making a few bucks a day.

If you're buying CK because you believe they treat their workers well, think again. (http://www.portlandmercury.com/IAnonymousBlog/archives/2015/08/04/dear-bike-part-manufacturing-company)

[AngryScientist]

If you're buying CK because you believe they treat their workers well, think again. (http://www.portlandmercury.com/IAnonymousBlog/archives/2015/08/04/dear-bike-part-manufacturing-company)

yea, more of the same:

https://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/Chris-King-Precision-Components-Reviews-E871182.htm

[oldpotatoe]

Good grief.....just because you can, doesn't mean you should

'Shouldn't'?
Free market, he can price them any way he wishes. If you think it isn't worth it, vote with your wallet. But I did get my 50th and 80th Campagnolo anniversary groups for less $.

[oldpotatoe]

King must be responding to some sort of market demand, inquiry, etc., obviously none if whom reside in this thread. :D

The market will speak as to the true interest. More power to em, and they're all machined right here onshore, right? It looks beautiful, and we'll crafted. Yeah crazy price but so what, it can still be appreciated. Why ridicule them when they're doing the real deal (design and production) in the u.s. whereas, as someone mentioned price comparison to rapha, thats all made in some random factory in China probably by some kid or woman making a few bucks a day.

Nothin' wrong with what King is trying to achieve.

A lot of Rapha stuff is made in Europe.

[54ny77]

relying on making fringe bike parts on $10/hr as primary source of income sounds like a dead end disaster waiting to happen, regardless of working conditions at ck. doesn't portland have a minimum wage law?

of course, tell the foreign factory worker at the very lowest rung of the supply chain, whose labor creates the materials used to create the products that enable posting to this thread, that $10/hr sucks.

point being, defining a moral high ground in purchasing decisions is a very slippery slope.

[Dead Man]

They sound like every machine shop in town

[cinema]

Really thankful this post brought up the issues. I will continue to support cane creek and white industries

[oldpotatoe]

Really thankful this post brought up the issues. I will continue to support cane creek and white industries

Hmmmm, 2 anonymous posts by employees? Or maybe somebody that heard something from somebody? Don't know. Not saying that the 2 posts aren't accurate but...hourly work more than 40 hours, has to receive overtime pay. Plus unemployment is pretty low in Portland(6%), if it sucks that bad, go elsewhere.
Not skilled labor. I'll keep my CK HS.

[cinema]

Hmmmm, 2 anonymous posts by employees? Or maybe somebody that heard something from somebody? Don't know. Not saying that the 2 posts aren't accurate but...hourly work more than 40 hours, has to receive overtime pay. Plus unemployment is pretty low in Portland(6%), if it sucks that bad, go elsewhere.
Not skilled labor. I'll keep my CK HS.

so will I but i'm not a ck snob and won't be. I have one ck, one cane creek, one Velo orange, one campy... lots of companies make good stuff. part of me wants to think the premium i'm paying for ck is going to a decent company so it was just a little disappointing to see those ten reviews where many mention harassment

[CiclistiCliff]

Heard from a former employee that these brown turds are from a bad ano batch that they kept and just engraved......

Wouldn't surprise me.

[FlashUNC]

Not skilled labor.

CK's marketing would have you think its highly skilled labor, constantly touting their made in the USA precision, tolerances, engineering and technical excellence, etc etc.

[Dead Man]

CK's marketing would have you think its highly skilled labor, constantly touting their made in the USA precision, tolerances, engineering and technical excellence, etc etc.

They probably have two programmers making $22ish/hour to set up the machines, who probably double as shift leads.. then operators making $10 doing the actual production runs. The operators just plug the billet into the machine and hit start, make sure nothing stupid happens while the part spins around, then removes the part and puts it on a tray..... repeat... all day... shift after shift

It's not skilled, and doesn't need to be

[Dead Man]

As machining goes, the stuff King makes is NOT incredibly hard to do. They machine rings and cylinders, and none of it will be used in rocket engines or satellites... so it's not like it even needs to be particularly precise, as machining goes.

For bike parts, it's high-end stuff... I'm not knocking them. I'm just saying for machining, it's pretty simple ****.

[buldogge]

Wow...

I pay my counter-girls more than that...they help customers, answer phones/email, and post to social media...sometimes they get me a coffee.

My machinist buddy, Tim, wouldn't "look-at-you-the-wrong-way", for $10/hr.

BTW...This is is the STL, in the Midwest US of A.

Portland's cost-of-living is ~50% higher (where 100 is national average, Portland is 125, STL is 85), FWIW.

BTW, I've never bought a CK product (not counting headsets installed on framesets I purchased used)...too rich for my blood.

-Mark in St. Louis

[FlashUNC]

"We practice authentic good will. We are generous in our community. It starts with our employees and extends through our local, regional & national advocacy commitments. We recognize a responsibility to the local and global community. Further, we openly share our knowledge, our point of view, and our philosophy."

https://www.chrisking.com/why/manufacturing/

[Satellite]

LOL, I still want a Salt and Pepper shaker even at the risk of Chris King employees getting paid less than Wal-Mart employees or sweat shop workers.

[cadence90]

"We practice authentic good will. We are generous in our community. It starts with our employees and extends through our local, regional & national advocacy commitments. We recognize a responsibility to the local and global community. Further, we openly share our knowledge, our point of view, and our philosophy."

https://www.chrisking.com/why/manufacturing/

Right.
And I'm Papa Paolo Sesto, Roberto Baggio, and Felice Gimondi, all wrapped up in one.

In that sector (CK, W.I., Phil, DT, PMP, even Campa NA) the arrogance of CK customer service, in my experience, has been greater than all the others combined. Too high a horse for me.

LOL, I still want a Salt and Pepper shaker even at the risk of Chris King employees getting paid less than Wal-Mart employees or sweat shop workers.
And Sat rolls in with post #1000. :)
Why, though?

[Black Dog]

yea, more of the same:

https://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/Chris-King-Precision-Components-Reviews-E871182.htm

After reading these reviews I am tempted to pull the two CK headsets I have out of my bikes!!! Wow. I do not think that CK will see my $$ in the future. Sad.

[ivanooze]

Lawd.jesus... I'm gonna buy 2 sets :D

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk

[54ny77]

Clearly the mgmt. and owners run a sweatshop. Bring the pitchforks!

What we're hearing are very 1-sided complaints in social media setting which, surprise, is no surprise.

They're in Portland. Can only imagine the "green" regulatory and permitting costs as a manufacturer at the local, state & federal level. Then there's overhead, yadda yadda. For a manufacturing concern, making $150 retail headsets. Not 6-figure precision machined components. In other words, margins probably aren't huge and they depend on as much volume as possible to make the gargantuan amounts of money the $10/hr employees seem to know that the greedy owners make.

To maintain minimum wholesale margin on that retail headset, once the greedy owners evaluate the impact of employees getting goosed up to minimum $20/hr, which is still a crappy full time living wage for a family of 2 or 3 with 1 primary breadwinner, the beloved King headset with new & improved employee salaries is now looking to be $350 retail.

And all the complainers will then pile on, "Screw that, I ain't paying no $350 for a headset!" in a defiant tone of hypocrisy, having gotten what they wanted in the form of higher wages for employees.

King owners/mgmt. then properly evaluate the alternatives, which presto revolve around time to go offshore and get 'em made for but a fraction of the original cost, maintain that $150 price point, and have a real killer margin. King then lays off nearly all staff other than designers/marketing people and industrial/manufacturing engineers, with a couple of full timer ex pats over yonder near the factory/factories to check in now & then on QC.

Be careful what ya ask for....:bike:

[Candyman]

the kit and headsets are expensive and it's annoying you can't buy the hubs or BB's by themselves, but if you're after a wheelset with the hubs built in, it's $135 more. a decent chunk of change, sure, but not worth getting p*ssed-off over. it's not three times the already crazy-expensive price ala silca/pegoretti.

these are $1285: http://wheelshop.chrisking.com/40th-anniversary-alloy-race-climb/

these are $1150: http://wheelshop.chrisking.com/alloy-race-climb/

I'm kinda annoyed the headsets are on STANDS though; like they don't expect you to ever actually install and use them.

I inquired about the 2Nut Headset and was told that it is made of UN-ANODIZED, polished aluminum and it is NOT intended for use, but as a display.

[Satellite]

And Sat rolls in with post #1000. :)
Why, though?

Oh yeah look at that I did break a 1000. I had way more than 1000 back in the day when it was the Serotta Forum some where along the way I had to register over again and was reset to zero. Then my Serotta was retired when I got my Moots and I had 1000's of post on the Moots forum before some Handle Bar buldge j@ck@ss made it to hard for Moots employees to moderate.

As to your why question I think its its silly for someone to want to remove their headset off three of there bikes because they read something unsubtanchated on the internet. Plus I really want the Salt and Pepper shakers. Anybody that wants to throw theirs out should PM me first.

[oldpotatoe]

so will I but i'm not a ck snob and won't be. I have one ck, one cane creek, one Velo orange, one campy... lots of companies make good stuff. part of me wants to think the premium i'm paying for ck is going to a decent company so it was just a little disappointing to see those ten reviews where many mention harassment

I'm not either but these small, anonymous posts about any company kinda irk me. For all you know it's people at CaneCreek that are posting. I know a big wig at Nike..his story about what 'some' say about them is horrifying, and false.

54ny77-great post.

For right below...probably say that about any company, in this era of social media. All it takes is somebody, anybody, with a computer and a grudge or agenda.

[Black Dog]

Oh yeah look at that I did break a 1000. I had way more than 1000 back in the day when it was the Serotta Forum some where along the way I had to register over again and was reset to zero. Then my Serotta was retired when I got my Moots and I had 1000's of post on the Moots forum before some Handle Bar buldge j@ck@ss made it to hard for Moots employees to moderate.

As to your why question I think its its silly for someone to want to remove their headset off three of there bikes because they read something unsubtanchated on the internet. Plus I really want the Salt and Pepper shakers. Anybody that wants to throw theirs out should PM me first.

That was my comment. I was speaking to my reaction to the nature of the comments. I know that it is the internet and that such things need to be taken with a grain of salt, even from a CK salt shaker. My headsets remain, however, even of there is a grain of truth to the comments then CK as a company needs some serious introspection.

[livingminimal]

Hmmmm, 2 anonymous posts by employees?

It was actually a whole page of posts on Glass Ceiling.
The allegations of sexism and discrimination should be perk the ears of anyone who gives a **** about other people.

[FlashUNC]

Clearly the mgmt. and owners run a sweatshop. Bring the pitchforks!

What we're hearing are very 1-sided complaints in social media setting which, surprise, is no surprise.

They're in Portland. Can only imagine the "green" regulatory and permitting costs as a manufacturer at the local, state & federal level. Then there's overhead, yadda yadda. For a manufacturing concern, making $150 retail headsets. Not 6-figure precision machined components. In other words, margins probably aren't huge and they depend on as much volume as possible to make the gargantuan amounts of money the $10/hr employees seem to know that the greedy owners make.

To maintain minimum wholesale margin on that retail headset, once the greedy owners evaluate the impact of employees getting goosed up to minimum $20/hr, which is still a crappy full time living wage for a family of 2 or 3 with 1 primary breadwinner, the beloved King headset with new & improved employee salaries is now looking to be $350 retail.

And all the complainers will then pile on, "Screw that, I ain't paying no $350 for a headset!" in a defiant tone of hypocrisy, having gotten what they wanted in the form of higher wages for employees.

King owners/mgmt. then properly evaluate the alternatives, which presto revolve around time to go offshore and get 'em made for but a fraction of the original cost, maintain that $150 price point, and have a real killer margin. King then lays off nearly all staff other than designers/marketing people and industrial/manufacturing engineers, with a couple of full timer ex pats over yonder near the factory/factories to check in now & then on QC.

Be careful what ya ask for....:bike:

If things are that tight at CK, how do they have the money to put on fancy Foodie Gran Fondos and a number of other side projects that those same complaints seem to indicate generate no revenue for the company?

Thus gets back to the classic capital/labor argument, but if the company is operating on such razor thin margins, whiy all the seemingly excess stuff? And if they are doing great to be able to afford the excess stuff, why not reward the people actually making the product?

[54ny77]

it's like the grocery store situation: tight margins but entirely dependent on volume. king seems to have found its niche on running as tight a ship as possible. i'm guessing the margins are thin, but you gotta figure on a what, $100 wholesale (?) item, regardless you gotta make a darned LOT of them just to crank out enough after-tax profit to pay salaries, rent, insurance, electric bills, and whatever else just to keep the doors open.

the buck stops with king's owner(s), ultimately, and that includes setting the mgmt culture. those complaining posts, a few of which I read, don't point out anything about the owner. it's all on mgmt & hr.

perhaps the foxes have control of the henhouse and the owner's checked out, or maybe the owner is doing what they want and mgmt is following in footstep. main point is, the $10/hour machine operator likely has no clue on what the real state of the company is, other than seeing behaviors on a daily level. and everything here on this forum is all speculation, including my guesstimate on their biz model.

the owner(s) have the freedom to do whatever the heck they want with the company, including making bad mgmt. decisions, sponsoring events and whatnot, as well as running the biz into the ground. gee, that sounds like a bike company we once all knew. :rolleyes:

If things are that tight at CK, how do they have the money to put on fancy Foodie Gran Fondos and a number of other side projects that those same complaints seem to indicate generate no revenue for the company?

Thus gets back to the classic capital/labor argument, but if the company is operating on such razor thin margins, whiy all the seemingly excess stuff? And if they are doing great to be able to afford the excess stuff, why not reward the people actually making the product?

[Satellite]

That was my comment. I was speaking to my reaction to the nature of the comments. I know that it is the internet and that such things need to be taken with a grain of salt, even from a CK salt shaker. My headsets remain, however, even of there is a grain of truth to the comments then CK as a company needs some serious introspection.

Didn't mean to pick on you specifically the timing was just there to illustrate my point. I do care about people. I have always been anti establishment "Down with the Man". Now I am management such is the cycle of life for us Generation Xers. I now have to be loyal to the companies bottom line. If I worry about everyone getting paid top dollar from the janitors to my scientist the company goes out of business because we can't compete then 1000's of people lose their jobs. Nothing pains me more than when I have to fire people. Unfortunately it has to be done and tough decisions have to be made. We are at the end of a contract change if we win the bid I will have to cut salaries and yes including mine in fact mine is the heaviest hit so I can preserve my work force.

[cinema]

Didn't mean to pick on you specifically the timing was just there to illustrate my point. I do care about people. I have always been anti establishment "Down with the Man". Now I am management such is the cycle of life for us Generation Xers. I now have to be loyal to the companies bottom line. If I worry about everyone getting paid top dollar from the janitors to my scientist the company goes out of business because we can't compete then 1000's of people lose their jobs. Nothing pains me more than when I have to fire people. Unfortunately it has to be done and tough decisions have to be made. We are at the end of a contract change if we win the bid I will have to cut salaries and yes including mine in fact mine is the heaviest hit so I can preserve my work force.



Congratulations. Now I realize these anonymous posts are anyone's guess, but let's also trust people on our forum who claim to know former employees--please justify racial and sexual harassment reported at ck mr manager

[FlashUNC]

it's like the grocery store situation: tight margins but entirely dependent on volume. king seems to have found its niche on running as tight a ship as possible. i'm guessing the margins are thin, but you gotta figure on a what, $100 wholesale (?) item, regardless you gotta make a darned LOT of them just to crank out enough after-tax profit to pay salaries, rent, insurance, electric bills, and whatever else just to keep the doors open.

the buck stops with king's owner(s), ultimately, and that includes setting the mgmt culture. those complaining posts, a few of which I read, don't point out anything about the owner. it's all on mgmt & hr.

perhaps the foxes have control of the henhouse and the owner's checked out, or maybe the owner is doing what they want and mgmt is following in footstep. main point is, the $10/hour machine operator likely has no clue on what the real state of the company is, other than seeing behaviors on a daily level. and everything here on this forum is all speculation, including my guesstimate on their biz model.

the owner(s) have the freedom to do whatever the heck they want with the company, including making bad mgmt. decisions, sponsoring events and whatnot, as well as running the biz into the ground. gee, that sounds like a bike company we once all knew. :rolleyes:

Absolutely. Its Chris' business to run as he sees fit. Even if that apparently makes some front-line employees miserable.

If I were in his shoes, I'd be more worried about throwing a couple extra dollars per hour to the front line guys in the machine shop or dealing with customer service issue, rather than a fancy Foodie Fondo.

But you're right its totally his business to run as he sees fit.

[Dave B]

Oh yeah look at that I did break a 1000. I had way more than 1000 back in the day when it was the Serotta Forum some where along the way I had to register over again and was reset to zero. Then my Serotta was retired when I got my Moots and I had 1000's of post on the Moots forum before some Handle Bar buldge j@ck@ss made it to hard for Moots employees to moderate.

As to your why question I think its its silly for someone to want to remove their headset off three of there bikes because they read something unsubtanchated on the internet. Plus I really want the Salt and Pepper shakers. Anybody that wants to throw theirs out should PM me first.

I loved that forum, even the very early old one, but the second gen...I think it was the second gen, loved that place. So many good folks and well just a great bunch of e-people.

[54ny77]

totally agree. the acquisition cost, i.e., lost productivity in turnover vs. another buck or so an hour to good employees, apparently is lost on owner and/or mgmt.

then again, and like anything on this thread as pure speculation, maybe the disaffected employees think more highly of themselves than the market or their employer does.

(the hostile work environment accusations, which indeed is a substantive and serious issue, is a separate conversation relative to skillsets.)

a good machinist, welder, etc. need not be a "bike bro" with tats and knowing what the heck the word colourway means. what they need is to be darned good at their skill set. if they are, their services will be in demand, and they don't get paid $10/hr. i have friends who are owners in various trades & construction-related businesses that desperately need qualified welders, for example. there just aren't enough of them out there. and pay--man, you're talking very, very good hourly wages or salary/benefits. most keep 'em on salary even if there's a lull in contract jobs, because they can't afford NOT to have 'em available & at the ready. heck, even our plumber--a licensed, bonded, unionized 3rd generation firm with several master plumbers in their employ--charges $100+/hr!

that segues into another discussion on the screwed up educational system that downplays solid trades/industry training vs. the favoring of shipping students off to learn transgender aboriginese comparative poetry, which naturally leads to wonderfully unproductive things like suckling the teats of a govt. career (which includes pursuing a phd in such studies and then teaching it at a state university) or community organizing, for example. the u.s. needs highly skilled technicians & tradespeople of all kinds.



Absolutely. Its Chris' business to run as he sees fit. Even if that apparently makes some front-line employees miserable.

If I were in his shoes, I'd be more worried about throwing a couple extra dollars per hour to the front line guys in the machine shop or dealing with customer service issue, rather than a fancy Foodie Fondo.

But you're right its totally his business to run as he sees fit.

[kittytrail]

But you're right its totally his business to run as he sees fit.


and its totally our right as customers to go buy something else because of it. my first King headset came with a Skyway cruiser frameset bought in 1983 from a SoCal shop, it was really nice. i then bought a few others for road bikes and MTBs until my interactions with CK customer service and one last with Chris K. himself made me switch to Cane Creek. haven't looked back since. :rolleyes:

there's as good and even better stuff out there despite all them hipsters' hype. :banana:

[cmbicycles]

$2k for a set and the best they can do is slap it in a cardboard box? Not specifically knocking the price of the set, though it is... well... anyway presentation seems weak imo.

[Black Dog]

Didn't mean to pick on you specifically the timing was just there to illustrate my point. I do care about people. I have always been anti establishment "Down with the Man". Now I am management such is the cycle of life for us Generation Xers. I now have to be loyal to the companies bottom line. If I worry about everyone getting paid top dollar from the janitors to my scientist the company goes out of business because we can't compete then 1000's of people lose their jobs. Nothing pains me more than when I have to fire people. Unfortunately it has to be done and tough decisions have to be made. We are at the end of a contract change if we win the bid I will have to cut salaries and yes including mine in fact mine is the heaviest hit so I can preserve my work force.

No harm taken and I know that none was implied at all. Being a bit dramatic and facetious does not always come through the inter webs pipes as intended.

[cadence90]

$2k for a set and the best they can do is slap it in a cardboard box? Not specifically knocking the price of the set, though it is... well... anyway presentation seems weak imo.

Good point.

I am not entering the CK employee grudge discussion, because I have no knowledge of the facts.

But, staying, with this kit, I also would have expected the set to come in a box made of real olive wood or, if not "green" enough, then certainly a nicer presentation box than the cheap cardboard die-cut one provided. $2000 watches certainly come in nicer boxes.

What really irks me, in addition to the exorbitant price, is this:
"To commemorate the 40th anniversary of Chris King Precision Components, we have pulled together a very limited offer of collector’s kits. Every kit includes a hub set, bottom bracket, headset, and a 58mm espresso tamper."

Since when is a coffee tamper (or s/p shakers) a component? And yet, if one wants the olive green hubset + bb + headset, they ram the stupid tamper down your throat.

CK then state that, "In addition to the kits we have produced a selection of stand-alone items that have been limited to 100 units per item...".
2 of those are the stupid coffee tamper and s/p shakers, and the other 2 are headsets on "Collector's Stands".

A standard CK NTS costs $145. So, they're charging $131 more for the olive color (no additional cost to them than any other color, I'm sure) and a useless, lonely stand? Wow.

I see a lot of misplaced priorities in the new CK.
They appear to be moving further and further away from their true component DNA.
Fancy cross-branding coming next?

If I were in his shoes, I'd be more worried about throwing a couple extra dollars per hour to the front line guys in the machine shop or dealing with customer service issue, rather than a fancy Foodie Fondo.
Agree.

[denapista]

Chris King "Olive Crate (cardboard box)" limited edition..

Take a cue from Campy...

http://keyassets.timeincuk.net/inspirewp/live/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2015/04/Campagnolo-tool-case-630x420.jpg

http://www.ykkbikes.com/sites/ykkbikes.com/files/product_images/VALIGETTAverticale.jpg

https://spinwell.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/picture-1.png

[Satellite]

Congratulations. Now I realize these anonymous posts are anyone's guess, but let's also trust people on our forum who claim to know former employees--please justify racial and sexual harassment reported at ck mr manager

Racial and sexual harassment is more than just report it to the CK MR (did you mean HR) Manager. If this truly happened there is legal recourse. Seek justice outside of the King empire. File a police report and see a lawyer, I am sure an employee attorney would love to tackle Chris King Components Inc. We have a zero tolerance where I work but proof is an entirely different matter. It would be pretty easy to get folks fired if you just claimed Sexual Harassment and poof they were fired. You would have to walk on egg shells to NOT piss anyone off. Being a Manager isn't always easy and you don't get to make everyone happy try as you might.

All I want is a Salt and Pepper Shaker, WOW this has gotten excited!

[bfd]

Chris King "Olive Crate (cardboard box)" limited edition..

Take a cue from Campy...

http://keyassets.timeincuk.net/inspirewp/live/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2015/04/Campagnolo-tool-case-630x420.jpg

http://www.ykkbikes.com/sites/ykkbikes.com/files/product_images/VALIGETTAverticale.jpg

https://spinwell.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/picture-1.png

Shimano did and you get a Seiko watch too!

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5228/5689622059_1d22ee5903_z.jpg

[54ny77]

If I had $ to burn I'd buy one of those kits just for the heck of it.

Both that and the Campy 50th....that is just so...so....nice.

How I wish they'd both make all-alu. silver parts again. Probably won't see that in many years, if ever again.

Shimano did and you get a Seiko watch too!

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5228/5689622059_1d22ee5903_z.jpg

[pdmtong]

The DA 25th is the only anniv group that still makes me sit up.

Everything else is nice, but not worth the premium for me to chase.

Is CK 40 really any different than the $18k Eddy 70th bike?
Both chasing big dollars from limited units.

[pavel]

I am not entering the CK employee grudge discussion, because I have no knowledge of the facts.

Sure, none of us were there but, 10 separate reviews on glass door, from different functions within the company, all negative, over a 2 year pattern certainly seem to establish a pattern.

[jlwdm]

Sure, none of us were there but, 10 separate reviews on glass door, from different functions within the company, all negative, over a 2 year pattern certainly seem to establish a pattern.

Two sides to every story. I personally don't give much credence to complaints I read on the Internet.

Jeff

[cadence90]

Sure, none of us were there but, 10 separate reviews on glass door, from different functions within the company, all negative, over a 2 year pattern certainly seem to establish a pattern.

Yes. A pattern of negative complaints on an internet site.

[pavel]

Well, dismissing something because it's on the internet doesnt seem like particularly sound logic. Glass door doesnt have a reputation as a site where people go just to complain. A couple of companies that I worked for that are truly horrendous still somehow have positive reviews there.

[cadence90]

Well, dismissing something because it's on the internet doesnt seem like particularly sound logic. Glass door doesnt have a reputation as a site where people go just to complain. A couple of companies that I worked for that are truly horrendous still somehow have positive reviews there.
I am neither accepting nor dismissing. I simply do not know.

I am confused by your example, though.
On the one hand you seem to be saying that one should accept Glassdoor, etc., reviews as legitimate information.
On the other hand you seem to be saying that Glassdoor reviews contradict your personal experience.
:confused:

[eBAUMANN]

I am neither accepting nor dismissing. I simply do not know.

I am confused by your example, though.
On the one hand you seem to be saying that one should accept Glassdoor, etc., reviews as legitimate information.
On the other hand you seem to be saying that Glassdoor reviews contradict your personal experience.
:confused:

People tend to leave reviews when they have strong feelings about a business, they can be positive or negative feelings, but you will almost never see a voluntary review from someone who is indifferent. Yelp is a good example of this.

I think that the fact that there are 10 very similar and very bad reviews from employees across varying dept's in the company says a lot. Even if there were 10 glowing reviews to counter, those negative experiences are very much worth hearing out, especially due to the consistency in the types of grievances voiced.

I have heard "reviews" very close to these from first hand RELIABLE sources, I had not however seen these glass door (or even heard of the site for that matter) reviews until they were posted here.

CK stuff is nice, but it is not so nice that I would not look elsewhere based on principle alone. This discussion (and the 40th set) has already shifted my plans to spec Cane Creek 110 headsets instead on my next couple bikes. Just cause.

[pavel]

I am neither accepting nor dismissing. I simply do not know.

I am confused by your example, though.
On the one hand you seem to be saying that one should accept Glassdoor, etc., reviews as legitimate information.
On the other hand you seem to be saying that Glassdoor reviews contradict your personal experience.
:confused:


Yes, I believe that glassdoor reviews are legitimate.
Yes, there are several glassdoor reviews that contradict my personal experience. More accurately, the experiences of 20-30% of the people who have also worked at the same companies that I did had experiences that contradicted my own. What this is reinforcing is my original statement is that glassdoor does not exist as a complaint-only platform and that people come there with a range of opinions.

What my example is illustrating is that even in situations that I absolutely detested, some percentage of the population came forward to say that those companies were good places to work, had a favorable outlook, etc.

That fact that in the last 2 years not one person posted a generally positive review of CK seems pretty telling. A highly visible brand with international recognition and such a green/down to earth/"made with pride in the USA"/PORTLAND ethos and there's not so much as a naive intern being excited about working there?


I think that the fact that there are 10 very similar and very bad reviews from employees across varying dept's in the company says a lot. Even if there were 10 glowing reviews to counter, those negative experiences are very much worth hearing out, especially due to the consistency in the types of grievances voiced.

exactly.

[cadence90]

pavel and eBaumann: what you write may very well be true.

I know nothing about CK's employee practices and relationships, but I do know this:
1) I have been really disappointed with CK customer service and tone, and that is a huge negative to me.
2) Whatever CK pays their employees, I would never buy a ~$2K special edition set with a coffee tamper in a cardboard box from them (or any other company for that matter). There is nothing remotely special about it, imo.

I will however await with baited breath their "50th Anniversary Super Special Collector's Limited Edition" stuff. I bet that will be a whopper. :eek:

[pavel]

i havent experienced their customer service but I'm 100% in agreement with you on point 2.

[Corso]

No one forces anyone to buy King products
No one forces anyone to work for Chris King.

Would you really the set if it as in a better box? Really?

As far as people thinking Chris should spend his money on one thing or another, it’s HIS money. HE owns the company, and can start a bonfire with cash if he chooses.

Lots of talk on this thread, not much of it makes sense to me...

[eBAUMANN]

The discussion here stems primarily from disappointment.

I would venture to guess that the vast majority of the members of this forum own or have owned a chris king component at some point or another, and they likely had very positive experiences with said component because, at the end of the day, chris king makes nice stuff.

This has garnered CK a certain amount of global prestige in the bike bizz and I would venture to guess that we american cyclists take a certain amount of pride knowing that we are supporting american manufacturing every time we pay the premium for a CK part. I know I do.

THAT said, we american cyclists also naturally want to romanticize things we enjoy, we believe that the chris king factory is a place of great wonder and innovation, or at least (at the very least) a place where employees are valued and respected. We want the reality of the company to match our own reality with the company's products and sadly, that doesn't seem to be the case.

Its kinda like learning many years later that your favorite cyclist was a lying, cheating, doper. Something like that.
Or that the fork you thought was "made in the USA by choice," was actually made in taiwan...

[saab2000]

Would you really the set if it as in a better box? Really?



No, but since it's a premium product at a premium price, presenting it in a proper case (that's a lot of 'p's) seems like good marketing.

I hope he sells tons of these. But I too think the presentation in a cardboard box is kind of cheap given the price of the items in question.

Having this NOS in 20+ years would be cool and a lot cooler in a wooden or aluminum box to show off what's inside.

As far as working there, yeah, I agree. If people don't like their employer the onus is upon them to change that situation. Don't whine about it and then stick around. Do something about your situation. That's a much larger issue of course......

[eBAUMANN]

Having this NOS in 20+ years would be cool and a lot cooler in a wooden or aluminum box to show off what's inside.

What, EXACTLY, would be cool about having a fancy box full of special bike parts too valuable to be ridden?

The coolest thing CK could have done was add the color to their standard offerings and have some with special 40th engraving that were priced slightly higher and in a limited edition. THAT, in my opinion, would have been super duper cool.

As far as working there, yeah, I agree. If people don't like their employer the onus is upon them to change that situation. Don't whine about it and then stick around. Do something about your situation. That's a much larger issue of course......

Not everyone can afford to just up and walk out of their job on principle. I think its awesome that some people can...but its not a reality for most.

[cadence90]

No, but since it's a premium product at a premium price, presenting it in a proper case (that's a lot of 'p's) seems like good marketing.
I would not buy it if even it came in a numbered ss box signed by CK himself, since it is not special to me in any way, but I do agree that the cardboard box is cheap and contradictory.

In fact, I think that the box (regardless of material), and the inclusion of the tamper, is the real problem with this whole thing.

Imagine the (likely vastly different) tone of this thread if (no box, no tamper) an announcement had been issued reading:
"To commemorate the 40th anniversary of Chris King Precision Components, we are now producing our components in a special new color, Olive Green, to be issued only in 2016."

Period. Done. Positive comments all around, I bet.
This beat is just trying too hard.

EDIT:
Exactly. This would have been perfect, understated, simple:
The coolest thing CK could have done was add the color to their standard offerings and have some with special 40th engraving that were priced slightly higher and in a limited edition.

[Corso]

The discussion here stems primarily from disappointment.

I would venture to guess that the vast majority of the members of this forum own or have owned a chris king component at some point or another, and they likely had very positive experiences with said component because, at the end of the day, chris king makes nice stuff.

This has garnered CK a certain amount of global prestige in the bike bizz and I would venture to guess that we american cyclists take a certain amount of pride knowing that we are supporting american manufacturing every time we pay the premium for a CK part. I know I do.

THAT said, we american cyclists also naturally want to romanticize things we enjoy, we believe that the chris king factory is a place of great wonder and innovation, or at least (at the very least) a place where employees are valued and respected. We want the reality of the company to match our own reality with the company's products and sadly, that doesn't seem to be the case.

Its kinda like learning many years later that your favorite cyclist was a lying, cheating, doper. Something like that.
Or that the fork you thought was "made in the USA by choice," was actually made in taiwan...

I’m with you, well stated. Already understood.
But take the “working conditions” part out of this,(every company has disgruntle employees) and you have a fancy kit in a low cost box, that (to most) isn’t worth the (extra) money.

Most agree His headsets have set the standard, and over the life of a bike, ARE worth the $ or his company would have folded years ago. A hit. The olive bad set is (based on comments) a miss.

The market will decide. If they re-name them GRAVEL GRINDER SPECIALS perhaps they will sell out?

Am I suddenly disappointed in Chris King based on this miss? Or internet rumor? Nope. Most bike companies have had a “miss" over the years. You have to try, right?

[saab2000]

I agree with the above sentiments except to say that at the prices asked a nicer box would make it more appealing.

I'm not buying either way. I have a CK headset on my Indy Fab but that's it.

I appreciate the workmanship and the rest but I'm not in love with CK stuff. I hate the buzz saw noise from their hubs and their headsets have too high a stack height for my liking. I use Campagnolo headsets on most of my bikes that take aftermarket headsets.

My only opinion is that at the prices asked it's not unreasonable to expect something more than a cardboard box. As always, vote with your wallet.

[chiasticon]

Not everyone can afford to just up and walk out of their job on principle. I think its awesome that some people can...but its not a reality for most.agreed. with the caveat that we're talking about bottom of the rung, minimum wage jobs here (from the sound of the glass door reviews). in my experience, those are by far the easiest jobs to come by.

for me, I think it sucks to think people are mistreated and making a crap wage at a company that sells high priced goods and touts proudly that they're expensive because they're made in America.

however, we're all lying to ourselves if we think they're unique in this regard.

[sandyrs]

I absolutely cannot get over the fact that the creator of the "foodie fondo" is selling a pepper shaker instead of a pepper mill. Everything else aside that's enough reason to dislike this whole series in my mind.

[velomonkey]

i absolutely cannot get over the fact that the creator of the "foodie fondo" is selling a pepper shaker instead of a pepper mill. Everything else aside that's enough reason to dislike this whole series in my mind.



^^^^^^^^ like

[Birddog]

I absolutely cannot get over the fact that the creator of the "foodie fondo" is selling a pepper shaker instead of a pepper mill. Everything else aside that's enough reason to dislike this whole series in my mind.

Good one, nuff said.

[Fatty]

yea, more of the same:

https://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/Chris-King-Precision-Components-Reviews-E871182.htm


If half of that is true I'll never buy another C. King product.

[Ryun]

I kind of like the limited color runs they were doing: Normal pricing just a small window to get that specific color (purple, sour apple, turquoise etc) but this just seems like a surcharge for engraving and some extra junk. meh..

[Dead Man]

If half of that is true I'll never buy another C. King product.

All those reviews sound like they were written by the same person...

[denapista]

I'm still baffled by individuals who logon to a forum and complain about forum people discussing bike things. I mean.... That's the purpose of a forum right? The banter doesn't have to be right or wrong, but it's a forum for cyclists to discuss things. Yes, we're all bothered that we've been pouring money into the CK brand since racing BMX days, and they're trying to sell us $1800 olive green parts in a cardboard box. When you go to a nice restaurant, would it bother you if your steak came out with mash potatoes tossed on top all sloppy, or do you cherish presentation, knowing you're eating at a very nice $$$$ dining establishment?

It's a collectors set in what looks to be an inside out folded Fedex/Dominos Pizza box. I mean.. C'mon.

[eBAUMANN]

not box..."crate," its a "crate" ;)

[Nooch]

It's a collectors set in what looks to be an inside out folded Fedex/Dominos Pizza box. I mean.. C'mon.

I'm waiting for some artisinal spin like "Chris King is packaging the 40th anniversary group in a used domino's pizza box, same as the first one he shipped 40 years ago..."

[cadence90]

I absolutely cannot get over the fact that the creator of the "foodie fondo" is selling a pepper shaker instead of a pepper mill. Everything else aside that's enough reason to dislike this whole series in my mind.
+S, +P.

Or, as they should say in Portland, salt/pepper mills designed by world-class designer/architects for the win:
http://www.themagazine.info/56/Pictures/Stelton/SaltMillPepperMillThree.jpg



not box..."crate," its a "crate" ;)
Excellent point.
Die-cut cardboard crates are far more expensive to produce, and far more prestigious, than die-cut cardboard boxes.


I'm waiting for some artisinal spin like "Chris King is packaging the 40th anniversary group in a used domino's pizza box, same as the first one he shipped 40 years ago..."
With coffee stains. Vintage coffee stains. Details are important.

[bmeryman]

I’m with you, well stated. Already understood.
But take the “working conditions” part out of this,(every company has disgruntle employees) and you have a fancy kit in a low cost box, that (to most) isn’t worth the (extra) money.

Most agree His headsets have set the standard, and over the life of a bike, ARE worth the $ or his company would have folded years ago. A hit. The olive bad set is (based on comments) a miss.

The market will decide. If they re-name them GRAVEL GRINDER SPECIALS perhaps they will sell out?

Am I suddenly disappointed in Chris King based on this miss? Or internet rumor? Nope. Most bike companies have had a “miss" over the years. You have to try, right?

I absolutely cannot get over the fact that the creator of the "foodie fondo" is selling a pepper shaker instead of a pepper mill. Everything else aside that's enough reason to dislike this whole series in my mind.

Apologies if this has already been said (a lot has already been said in this thread), but I think CK's missed out on a really big opportunity with this 40th anniversary stuff. Gravel grinders are taking off, pepper mills are en vogue again (this might be a bit of a stretch).

Seems like a gravel (pepper) grinder (mill) would have been obvious.

[Dead Man]

Seems like a gravel (pepper) grinder (mill) would have been obvious.

Yea.. but that would have required some actual thought/effort. I strongly suspect this wasn't given much of either

[velomonkey]

Is there gonna be a special 40th Anniversary edition cardboard box, er crate, painted by Taylor Phinney for 10k - that's what I'm waiting for.