Wheel slightly off...any options?

[Bradford]

I'm assuming the answer is no, but here goes anyway. I usually run 25s, but I tried a 28 Conti 4000IIs on my Legend yesterday. The non-drive side had clearance, but the drive side just barely doesn't fit. The tire bulges out slightly about half of the revolution, so it clears for half and rubs for half.

The wheel is true, but not centered. Before you ask, I did take the wheel on and off a few times to make sure it was all the way in. I thought I noticed this with the 25's on, but it is confirmed with the 28s. The wheel is SL 23 on an ultegra 6800, built locally about a year and a half ago.

So, two questions. First, is it possible to adjust the wheel and move the rim to the center. And second, if I could, would I want to? it is pretty hard to measure how much space I have on the non-drive side, but I'm guessing its between 5 mm and 10 mm. Attached is the space I have to work with.

[Anarchist]

A competent wheel builder can centre that rim on the hub and re-tension the wheel.

Emphasis on competent.

There is one from Boulder who hangs around here.

[AngryScientist]

try another wheel first. it's certainly possible that your rear end is out of alignment too, which would cause a rub...

[David Kirk]

There are at least two different things that could be going on here-

- the wheel dish could be off so that the rim isn't centered between the hub lock nuts. In this case the rim would also be off to one side between the seat stays also. This is very easy for you to check........take the wheel out and filp it around and see if the rim is uncentered to the same side of it it is now close to the other stay. If it switches to the other side then the wheel dish is off. This is easy-peazy for a real mechanic to fix and should take a very short period of time.

- on the other hand if you flip the wheel and it's still uncentered to the same side this indicates that the frame is off in one of two ways....

------ it could be that one chainstay is very slightly longer than the other.

------ it could be that the rear end of the frame is pushed off to one side relative to the centerline of the front triangle.

These two things can be diagnosed by a top shelf mechanic or better yet a framebuilder and in most cases the repair should be left to a f-builder.

I hope that helps.

dave

[TEMPLE]

One thing I noticed is that my tires themselves often aren't "true". I'm pretty OCD about my wheels being true and round. But, on one bike, I have a fork that barely clears some 28mm tires. With the tires that are on the cusp of fitting, it's the tire itself that is the problem, i.e., the tire will bulge a millimetre or so here and there, and that is what rubs.

I really notice tire variations with my mountain bike meats, where my rims will be completely true, but I will be able to detect some wobble visually.

Anyways, I don't know if trying a different tire would give you the clearance you need, but just some thoughts.

Good luck!

TEMPLE

[berserk87]

I would agree on checking the dish of the wheel. I had a set that I bought, used, last year and the dish was off on the rear.

[FlashUNC]

If the lope is there regardless of tire, then it rules out the tire.

As others mentioned, you've got a dish issue or a frame issue. My money is on the wheel since it disappears for half a revolution of the wheel, a frame would just be outta whack regardless.

[Bradford]

I have confirmed that it is the wheel and not the bike alignment using the AngryScientist method (or is it the Angryscientific method?). I mounted a back up wheel with the 700 x 28 tire and it is centered between the chain stays on the test wheel. It also spins with enough clearance on both sides, as well as on the seat stays as well. That rim is a CXP33, which is narrower than the SL23, but it is still centered, which is what I was testing for.

So, the new questions are:

1) Do I call the bike shop that built it 18 months ago and ask for them to make it right or has it been too long to bring it back?
2) Do I just go to Boulder and have it done there?
3) If I were to go to another shop, or one man operation in the People's republic, how much would I expect to pay?

[Cicli]

Page the spud and have him fix it.
The cost will be well worth the quality job you will get.

[Peter P.]

Dishing a wheel is simple. Even a stoner mechanic working under the influence of legal cannabis in the People's Republic of Boulder could do it!

[ryker]

No experience but I think working on wheels on cannabis would be a lot trickier than sober.

[dgauthier]

1) Do I call the bike shop that built it 18 months ago and ask for them to make it right or has it been too long to bring it back?
2) Do I just go to Boulder and have it done there?
3) If I were to go to another shop, or one man operation in the People's republic, how much would I expect to pay?

Just so it's clear what we're talking about, someone will tighten all the spokes on one side of the wheel (maybe 1/4 to 1/2 a turn each), and loosen all the spokes on the other side of the wheel the same amount. The rim will move towards the side that's tightened. Then they will check whether the rim is exactly centered or not using a "bicycle wheel dishing gauge" (Google for more info) and tweak as needed. This is a very simple operation, and should only take about half an hour of time (or much less) with an experienced mechanic.

In answer to your questions:
1) Eighteen months is a long time. If you've been riding the wheel all that time, it could have naturally gone out of adjustment. You certainly could take it back to the shop that built it, but if I were in your place I'd expect to pay.
2) Is Boulder convenient for you? This is something that's nice to do with a talented mechanic, but can really be done almost anywhere. You just don't want a bozo doing it.
3) Essentially you are truing one wheel. Around 25 bucks. Go nuts and have them true the front wheel too while you're at it.

BTW, a wheel can't be "true" if it's not centered. A wheel that isn't centered is 100% wrong. A wheel with a wobble is only wrong in a couple of places...

[savine]

take it back to shop n get em to centre it, shouldnt take long at all to do.

[LouDeeter]

Others have covered the wheel true issue well. Once you get that fixed, I would be concerned about the second problem mentioned by Temple, so,I'm going to comment on the tire. In one of the issues of Bicycle Quarterly, Jan Heine discusses how different rims can affect how well a tire seats (clincher). Some rims have too shallow a bed, others have too deep a bed. Others are just like Goldilocks and are just right. If your tire is not seating properly, you'll see those bumps you are talking about. Out of round tires that haven't been damaged are rare these days, although I've had a few. Still, I would make sure the tires are seating well, the wheel is perfectly true, then see if I have the bumps/bulges on the tire. I know a lot of people don't use talcum powder inside their tires anymore, but I do. That allows the tube the move freely within the tire/rim space, sometimes helping the tire to seat properly faster than without the talc. The downside is that it can make patching the tire a bit more of an issue as you have to clean off the talc as well as roughing up the tube before applying the glue/patch.

[R3awak3n]

Lou has a great point. I just went through something similar. I had a weird bump on this wheel (horizontal not radial though) and thought it was the rim that was not true. Took the tire off, put it on the truing stand and the rim was nice and true. Re mounted the tire and made sure it was seated properly all the way around (this stupid tire was a PAIN to mount) and that bump was gone.

[oldpotatoe]

I have confirmed that it is the wheel and not the bike alignment using the AngryScientist method (or is it the Angryscientific method?). I mounted a back up wheel with the 700 x 28 tire and it is centered between the chain stays on the test wheel. It also spins with enough clearance on both sides, as well as on the seat stays as well. That rim is a CXP33, which is narrower than the SL23, but it is still centered, which is what I was testing for.

So, the new questions are:

1) Do I call the bike shop that built it 18 months ago and ask for them to make it right or has it been too long to bring it back?
2) Do I just go to Boulder and have it done there?
3) If I were to go to another shop, or one man operation in the People's republic, how much would I expect to pay?

1) If it hasn't been seen by anybody else, yes, they need to dish it. It doesn't stay true and go out of dish by itself.
2)Yes, Jim or Carl at Vecchio's can certainly dish/true/round/tension the wheel
3)$15-$20 depending on how long it takes(at Vecchio's). They take the tire off, do it right. If some guy slaps it into a truing stand w/o taking the tire off..poor form. You can't do dish well with a tire on.

If the wheel is out of dish, I gotta wonder what else is wrong with it. Dishing is one of the 4 required variables to get 'right' when building a wheel. True, round, dish and tension.