Wheel spoke question

[gregblow]

I am looking for advice on wheel spoke count. One of my best all time training wheels are from Easton. I got them as OEM on my P3. They are 28 in the front and 28 in the back. They have never failed! I now want another pair, but they don't make them anymore. My questions are, would it be better to have 32 in the front and 32 in the back? More durable? better ride? more stiff? What are the trade offs?

Thank you for the advice!

[oldpotatoe]

I am looking for advice on wheel spoke count. One of my best all time training wheels are from Easton. I got them as OEM on my P3. They are 28 in the front and 28 in the back. They have never failed! I now want another pair, but they don't make them anymore. My questions are, would it be better to have 32 in the front and 32 in the back? More durable? better ride? more stiff? What are the trade offs?

Thank you for the advice!

All things being equal, 32 spokes are more durable than 28. BUT there are lots of variables with wheels since they are made up of 3 main components, rims, spokes and hubs..and those individually vary a lot. My biggest gripe with easton are stoopid proprietary spokes/rims/hubs(along with all wheelsouttaboxes) and poor design hubs/flange distances.

There are more than a few wheelbuilders here, PM or ask, what do you want these new wheels to do, are you a light or heavy rider, both in terms of weight and technique, budget?

Plus lots of decent wheelsouttaboxes and some here will sing their praises as well.

But raw spoke count is just a teeny part of the wheel design 'equation'.

[gregblow]

Thank you old spud!

[marknreimer]

I have a bunch of wheels with varying spoke counts/lacing patterns, including

36 spokes, 3x
32 spokes, 3x, 2x, radial
24 spokes 2x DS, radial NDS
24 spokes, 2x
18 spokes, 2x


I've never noticed higher spoke count to make a wheel stiffer. If anything, my 24 wheels are ultra stiff (HED Belgium, Sapim Laser, Chris King R45), and my Campy Neutron factory-built wheels the stiffest ever for me (that's the 24 with radial NDS).

Only time I've broken spokes was when a derailleur was sucked into my 24spoke CX wheels. And I ride mostly gravel and dirt (weigh 155lbs).

Higher spoke count does tend to keep them in true longer though. But yeah, I don't see any reason to have more than 24/28 spokes unless you're going to be carrying a load. That said....32 3x always looks the best to me

[Mark McM]

I have a bunch of wheels with varying spoke counts/lacing patterns, including

36 spokes, 3x
32 spokes, 3x, 2x, radial
24 spokes 2x DS, radial NDS
24 spokes, 2x
18 spokes, 2x


I've never noticed higher spoke count to make a wheel stiffer. If anything, my 24 wheels are ultra stiff (HED Belgium, Sapim Laser, Chris King R45), and my Campy Neutron factory-built wheels the stiffest ever for me (that's the 24 with radial NDS).

Only time I've broken spokes was when a derailleur was sucked into my 24spoke CX wheels. And I ride mostly gravel and dirt (weigh 155lbs).

Higher spoke count does tend to keep them in true longer though. But yeah, I don't see any reason to have more than 24/28 spokes unless you're going to be carrying a load. That said....32 3x always looks the best to me

A few comments:

When we talk about feeling wheel stiffness, we are talking about lateral stiffness. Don't expect to feel any difference in wheel vertical stiffness.

Wheel stiffness depends on many variables, not just the number of spokes. The rim and hub also influence wheel stiffness. If your 36 spoke and 18 spoke wheels were built with the same model of rim and hub, you'd would likely be able to detect the differences in lateral stiffnesses (particularly if it were a shallow, lightweight rim).

The influence of spoke crossings on wheel performance is often exaggerated. Direct measurement has shown the difference in stiffness with different spoke crossings is a few percent at best (and roughly proportional to the differences in spoke lengths). Differences between rims, hubs, and even different spoke types/thicknesses, has a larger affect than the number of crossings.