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gone
06-15-2006, 12:12 PM
Since this was my fourth trip to Italy, "Impressions from Italy" doesn't seem appropriate as a title but I thought I'd send along some notes from my recent trip to go along with those posted by Climb (which I really enjoyed reading!) and will follow his lead in writing a series of vignettes rather than a narrative.

I was in Italy for a little under 5 weeks. I spent just under 2 weeks riding then was joined by my wife for another 3 weeks. It was her first trip to Italy so the main purpose of the last 3 weeks was to play tour guide for her. I have to say that was truly a delight, getting to watch someone experience the sights and sounds (and tastes!) of Italy for the first time was great.

The area we visited was central Italy between Rome and Florence. We spent 5 days total in Rome and Florence and the rest in smaller towns in Umbria and Tuscany.

As climb said, the Italians are very cycling friendly. Cyling is the third most popular sport in Italy (after soccer and motor sports of any kind) and everyone either cycles or knows someone who does. Italians drive like lunatics but amazingly, I've had drivers follow me on the bicycle for 3k because there wasn't a safe place to pass. If I were in a car, they'd pass on a blind curve cresting a hill.

I second the recommendation for doing a granfondo while in Italy. I didn't on this trip but have in the past and they're great fun and usually on pretty challenging routes. The Italian cycling magazines have a schedule of upcoming events.

After driving in Italy, it's always a shock to return to the states and see the ridiculous land yachts we drive. My car (a Toyota Matrix) is at the large end of the scale of average car size in Italy but is dwarfed by most cars in the states.

Think gas is expensive? To fill up my Smartcar forfour (12.42 gallon tank) was 52 euros. Based on $1.30 per euro that's $67.60 or $5.44 per gallon.

I'll echo climb's comment about Italy being so old. It sounds funny to say it but it always amazes me when I'm in any one of countless 700+ year old hilltop towns in Italy that they're living communities, not tourist exhibitions like Williamsburg in the states where the "residents" leave at the end of the day.

I spent a day at the Giro d'Italia watching the time trial, I'll post separately about that.

The Italians love cycling (redux). One day (a Saturday) while riding on the via dei sette ponte which runs between Arezzo and Vallambrosa I was amazed at the number of 30-40 strong groups of cyclists. I joined one of them for the climb up to Vallambrosa and spent some time chatting with them at the monastery at the top. Speaking of history, Galileo went to school at that monastery.

Gravity doesn't exist. The leaning tower at Pisa is proof. When you see it in person and see the angle of the tilt you'll believe me.

Make a vow that before you die you'll go see il Palio in Siena. I was there last year and it is one of the most amazing things I've ever experienced. Briefly, Siena is divided into 17 districts called cantratas, each with their own symbol (some real, some mythological). The Palio is a horse race around the piazza which is about half the size of a football field. The sequence of events goes like this:

1. The 17 contratas hold a drawing for the 12 that will get to race in the Palio.
2. 4 days before the Palio, a drawing is held to assign horses (you don't get to choose your own horse).
3. Each contrata takes their horse into church to be blessed.
4. A track is built out of packed dirt around the edge of the piazza.
5. Members of the contratas parade around Siena (not in costume) with each contrata singing the same tune but with different words (usually mild insults to the other contratas and how theirs is the best and they're going to win). The people wear scarves with the symbol of their contrata on it.
6. On the day of the Palio, the contratas (in renaissance costume this time)
parade into the square with bands playing. There's an elaborate competition where the men carrying the banners do all kinds of tricks with them, twirling, throwing & catching, etc. More than 14,000 people pack into the plaza which is closed off starting two hours before the race begins (also, no restroom facilities inside the plaza. The "inside joke" is you go in with two bottles, one empty, one full. You come out with two bottles, one empty, one full....)
7. After lots of jockying around (it's a long story but in its history, the race has taken up to 3 days to start. In modern times, usually no more than a few hours) the race starts. Three laps around the plaza and the race is over, in less than 2 minutes. The horses are *flying* - these are thoroughbred race horses - and crashes are common. The riders are paid mercenaries and nobody cares about them since the first horse across the line wins, even if the rider isn't on board!

And what does the winning contrata get? A flag (palio means flag in italian) that they can display for a year and lots of bragging rights. Partying by all the contratas goes on late into the night.

It is a spectacle unlike anything you've ever seen. More details at:

http://www.premier.net/~Italy/palio.htm

Be prepared to eat dinner late. Most restaurants don't open for dinner until 7 at the earliest. Also, don't be in a hurry. Italian meals are multi-course with lots of time in between to drink wine and talk.

Want to buy a farmhouse in Tuscany? Bring money, lots of it. I saw an ad for a farmhouse "waiting restoration" (realtors are geniuses at understatement) that wasn't much more than a pile of stone outlining where the walls used to be that basically included the land it was sitting on for 250k euros.

Italian dogs don't chase cyclists. In about 5000 miles of riding in Italy, I've yet to be chased even though I've passed lots of dogs that were loose. One day on this trip I was riding from Pienza to the Abbadia di Monte Oliveto (a beautiful place) and saw two german shepherds sitting by the side of the road watching me approach. I thought I was about to be canine antipasti and got ready to sprint. As I rode past, one of them let out the most desultory "woof" you've ever heard and they didn't move a muscle.

Study the language. The Italians are delighted even if you only speak a few words and will do their best to figure out what you really mean when you say you've got an olive tree in your pants.

Most Italian food in the states bears absolutely no resemblance to food in Italy.

Gearing is an interesting thing. I've done the same route three different times on three different bikes, always in the lowest gear I had on that particular bike which varied from a 30x25 to a 39x25. In each case, the climb was really hard.

Speaking of climbing, there's almost nowhere in the states where you can do the sort of climbs that are common in Italy i.e., 10-12 miles at an average of 7%. The hardest climb I've ever done was 3 miles never below 7% followed by 8 switchbacks with 200 yard ramps of 17-19%. It was where I discovered my maximum heart rate was higher than I thought :)

Life is too short not to spend at least part of it in Italy.

Ciao,

BoulderGeek
06-15-2006, 12:26 PM
Prova eccellente!

Ho un olivo nei miei ansiti!

Cycling in the Italian mountains (Alps, Dolomites) is definitely on my list.

Your gearing comments reminded me of trying to climb the Col du Telegraphe after 70 miles already, in a 39/25. Thought my 35 year old ticker was going to pop out of my chest to say goodbye.

gone
06-15-2006, 12:30 PM
Ho un olivo nei miei ansiti!

Faccia attenzione quando assettate!

Climb01742
06-15-2006, 12:50 PM
another cycling tidbit: here in the states, if a recreational rider is wearing a pro team jersey, almost always he/she wears just plain black shorts. but in italy, full team kit seems to be the norm. there's something very cool about seeing a group of 60 to 70 year old dudes happily pedalling along in full matching jerseys and shorts. there, it works somehow.

agree that there are climbs right outside your door in italy -- seemingly wherever you are -- that we'd travel hours or days to find. if you can't get fit in italy, you can't get fit.

and, absolute ditto on how italian italian food is nothing like american italian. and the best lunch you can have in italy is: in the morning, walk to the local bakery and buy some fresh bread. then walk to the local shop and get speck ham and some sort of cheese. then walk to the fruit/vegetable shop and buy "real" tomatoes and fresh basil. get some local olive oil. ride to a quiet spot. combine all of the above ingredients. drink glass of wine. die and go to heaven.

Too Tall
06-15-2006, 01:03 PM
why O why wasn't I born Italian?

davids
06-15-2006, 02:26 PM
why O why wasn't I born Italian?
You're a member of the tribe. Be glad you weren't.

zeroking17
06-15-2006, 02:57 PM
<snip> ...when you say you've got an olive tree in your pants.



Reportedly that's the explanation that Luigi Menocchio (a rookie rider for Liquigas) gave when his team manager asked Menocchio why he'd ridden the first three kilometers of the stage in a full-tuck position. Apparently Menocchio (barely out his teens) had spotted Elisa Basso in the pre-race sign-in area.

P.S. Another wonderful report on an italian journey. Thanks.


...

Proxy
06-15-2006, 02:58 PM
where exactly did you find these sort of climbs? Thanks.

stevep
06-15-2006, 03:18 PM
french alps, italian alps, swiss alps, dolomites, pyrennes...
massif central.
old roads in europe.
worlds best riding.
be there soon... i am more ready when reading climbs stories.

Climb01742
06-15-2006, 03:24 PM
where exactly did you find these sort of climbs? Thanks.

there is a climb outside of trento that is, i believe, 17.5km and averages about 7%. also another outside of bassano (named fittingly grappa something or other) that is similiarly long and tough. truly, they are everywhere. right outside of asolo is a 3km climb that surely is double-digits, mt washington-esque the whole way coming up the backside, not the cornuda side.

gone
06-15-2006, 03:26 PM
where exactly did you find these sort of climbs? Thanks.
There are lots of them in the Dolomites, many of the passes are at those lengths and gradients. Two I've done are from Trento up the Passo del Tonale and from Pordenone up to Forcella Staulanza. I believe the Stelvio and Plan de Corones are both longer and steeper though I've not done either.

Proxy
06-15-2006, 03:35 PM
There are lots of them in the Dolomites, many of the passes are at those lengths and gradients. Two I've done are from Trento up the Passo del Tonale and from Pordenone up to Forcella Staulanza. I believe the Stelvio and Plan de Corones are both longer and steeper though I've not done either.

I am aware of french climbs and the dols, but to my knowledge there is nothing in tuscany that is very long or steep- Monte Amiata is supposed to be the tallest and it only a little more than 1700m. I agree, nice place - I just got back myself, but I would not recommend it if pure climbing is what someone was looking for

stevep
06-15-2006, 03:40 PM
ventoux is 22 k to the top.
tourmalet is 18k
galibier is 38k but only 4%
izoard is 18k
these are all 7-8-+ %

look at the tour guide.
there are many, many beautiful climbs over there.
will report on the stelvio in a couple of weeks. highest pass in europe.

Proxy
06-15-2006, 03:41 PM
ventoux is 22 k to the top.
tourmalet is 18k
galibier is 38k but only 4%
izoard is 18k
these are all 7-8-+ %

look at the tour guide.
there are many, many beautiful climbs over there.
will report on the stelvio in a couple of weeks. highest pass in europe.

the thread is about tuscany

gone
06-15-2006, 03:44 PM
I am aware of french climbs and the dols, but to my knowledge there is nothing in tuscany that is very long or steep- Monte Amiata is supposed to be the tallest and it only a little more than 1700m. I agree, nice place - I just got back myself, but I would not recommend it if pure climbing is what someone was looking for
Sorry, I was mixing trips. The trip notes were from my recent trip which was centered in Tuscany & Umbria but the climb comment was from previous trips to the Dolomites. There are a number of long climbs in Tuscany (from SS2 up to Radicofani and from Gaiole to Radda are both 7+ miles at an average of about 5%) but none that are as long or steep as in the Dolomites.

Proxy
06-15-2006, 03:56 PM
Sorry, I was mixing trips. The trip notes were from my recent trip which was centered in Tuscany & Umbria but the climb comment was from previous trips to the Dolomites. There are a number of long climbs in Tuscany (from SS2 up to Radicofani and from Gaiole to Radda are both 7+ miles at an average of about 5%) but none that are as long or steep as in the Dolomites.

is that a nice road? I just rode from way south of siena to florence last week and that was an option we looked at. btw, found an amazing place to eat when you take that ride into florence next time - Osteria alla Piazza. Too bad they don't show the view, its just unreal out there.

http://www.divinacucina.com/code/castellina.html (2nd down on the list)

Bauch
06-15-2006, 04:15 PM
We dined there twice in one week while staying in Panzano and it is amazing!

Proxy
06-15-2006, 04:23 PM
We dined there twice in one week while staying in Panzano and it is amazing!

there goes the rest of the work day - I was pretty lit after that lunch, not the best thing to do with all that riding still left - lunch was 3 hours and the saddle time to florence was 3:45, you do the math. did you happen to float through that wooded section past the osteria? what a beautiful area - the whole tuscan area is heaven on earth.

gone
06-15-2006, 05:51 PM
is that a nice road? I just rode from way south of siena to florence last week and that was an option we looked at. btw, found an amazing place to eat when you take that ride into florence next time - Osteria alla Piazza. Too bad they don't show the view, its just unreal out there.

http://www.divinacucina.com/code/castellina.html (2nd down on the list)
Since I mentioned two roads, I'm not sure which you were referring to. Given your route, I assume it's the 408 that runs from Sienna through Radda. Yes, it's a very nice road, you have a choice of whether or not to go through Gaiole as there's a fork in the road, one direction goes straight to Radda and is a more gradual climb, the other goes through Gaiole and is longer and steeper. Continuing from Radda toward Panzano is also very nice.

Thanks for the restaurant recommendation, already bookmarked for next trip. By the way, did you do the climb up to the church in Panzano in the attached photo? It's short but it's a steep little sucker.

CPP
06-16-2006, 02:24 AM
Hey Climb,
I used to work for Vetta and our office was just down the road from Asolo. Great place to ride. Also, a lot of cycling related companies are there. Pinarello, Sella italia, Scapin, Gipiemme. While on a ride, you never knew if you might see Fausto P out on the road.
CPP