JRA - Thomson mtn stem

[LegendRider]

I found this while washing my bike today. (Yes, I used a torque wrench)

[Megalodon]

Which torque wrench did you use?

[djg21]

I found this while washing my bike today. (Yes, I used a torque wrench)

Thomson will warranty it no questions asked.
Did you take a spill? Could the end of the bar taken a hard impact?

[LegendRider]

I used the Bontrager pre-set torque key.

I crashed pretty hard a couple of years ago. Since the crash, I've changed bars but it's the same stem.

[Keith A]

Glad you found it washing your bike...rather than when you were laying on the ground.

[djg21]

I used the Bontrager pre-set torque key.

I crashed pretty hard a couple of years ago. Since the crash, I've changed bars but it's the same stem.

It looks like the crack was from torque on the bars and not from over-tightening. I've cracked a faceplate on an x2 by over tightening it when my bar slipped after hitting a big pothole, and it looked nothing like that. There was no daylight visible through the crack.

[DRZRM]

I've had that happen on two Thomson's, one mine one my wife's, both were smaller diameter (not 31.8, maybe both 25.4). Fortunately, like you, I found them early. I built the bikes before I used torque wrenches, so I always figured it was my fault, but I'm always surprised how often I see this.

[d_douglas]

That makes me shudder. And I am a Thomson lover.

[purpurite]

Holy crap, how tight are guys tightening face plates?

That's not a normal part failure area.

[DRZRM]

Actually, it is pretty common. I think Thomson recently switched to smaller bolt heads on their face plates (4mm to 3mm) as a sort of torque limiter, so ham fisted mechanics would stop splitting their faceplates.

I use a Richey mini torque wrench, now, but as I said, I didn't see much of it with the 31.8 faceplates. I think they distribute load better.

[Mark McM]

This is one of the reasons I only use 4 bolt face plates. If this were a 2 bolt face plate, the bar would have already detached.

[jmal]

Holy crap, how tight are guys tightening face plates?

That's not a normal part failure area.

It is on these stems.

[purpurite]

Common? I can't say I've seen that type of stem breakage before.

[rustychisel]

Common? I can't say I've seen that type of stem breakage before.

Google 'Thomson stem broken' or similar.

The internet is always correct

[purpurite]

Google 'Thomson stem broken' or similar.

The internet is always correct


Crazy. I actually searched "broken stem" and most were Thomson and Control Tech--which are the only stems I have ever used, outside of old school Ringle.

[Cicli]

As stated, Thomson always takes care of things in a good fashon.

[purpurite]

I'll continue to use Thomson stems and seatposts... if I break either of them like that at 145 pounds, I have lots bigger issues than a broken stem faceplate.

[Buzz Killington]

That's happened to me twice with Thomson. They sent new faceplates both times, but it was a little disconcerting that customer service treated this as an everyday occurrence. I no longer run Thomson. I'm also far into Clydesdale territory, might just not be the right customer for these. One time I had to ride home holding the stem like a tiller.
Make sure you have equal gaps on the top and bottom gaps between faceplate and body of the stem. I seem to remember Thomson offering a thicker face plate option, but not sure....

[dancinkozmo]

..anyone know if these faceplates are forged ? seems like they should be

[eBAUMANN]

..anyone know if these faceplates are forged ? seems like they should be

nope, they are machined. I've cracked 2 like this and have had some issues with bar slippage at the proper torque spec on the new 3mm versions. as much as i love thomson, it has me looking elsewhere.

[likebikes]

it's extremely common and a result of inherent flaws in the materials & manufacturing of thomson parts.

[rustychisel]

it's extremely common and a result of inherent flaws in the materials & manufacturing of thomson parts.

Welllllllllllll, given the sheer numbers involved I'd be careful of bandying phrases like "extremely common" about the place.

Other than that, I have no dog in this fight.

[dgauthier]

..anyone know if these faceplates are forged ? seems like they should be

At last someone points out the elephant in the room: forged metal parts are stronger. CNC milling makes a pretty, precise stem, but not a strong stem. You want milled aluminum, buy a Macbook.

[oldpotatoe]

That's happened to me twice with Thomson. They sent new faceplates both times, but it was a little disconcerting that customer service treated this as an everyday occurrence. I no longer run Thomson. I'm also far into Clydesdale territory, might just not be the right customer for these. One time I had to ride home holding the stem like a tiller.
Make sure you have equal gaps on the top and bottom gaps between faceplate and body of the stem. I seem to remember Thomson offering a thicker face plate option, but not sure....

These stories are not unusual. I sure wouldn't use a Thompson stem because of them. 'Great customer service' doesn't help with dental bills. Seems they would rather warranty then redesign after the 'r' word.

[jmal]

For those surprised that this is common, perhaps it's a road vs mtb thing. Thomson has a long history of broken stems in the mtb world. I can't believe they continue to make such a poor product for such a critical safety area of the bike. You are better off with the forged $10 throwaway stems that come on lower to mid tier bikes. They are not the bike jewelry that the Thomson is, but you will be a lot safer.

[tigoat]

At last someone points out the elephant in the room: forged metal parts are stronger. CNC milling makes a pretty, precise stem, but not a strong stem. You want milled aluminum, buy a Macbook.

Yep in general, I would stay away from components like a stem and seatpost made by machining, as there is inherently a lot of built-in stress from this process. There are ways to mitigate this problem from machining by heat treating and cyro treating but it is unlikely that they would or know how to do that. The best way to make these metal parts is from the old school of cold forging, which increases the strength of the metal significantly. Unfortunately, nowadays, most forgings are hot forgings but it is still ways better than machining.

[LegendRider]

My stem was out of warranty and their response was the following:

If it's just the clamp, those are available through our webstore. The product line itself was discontinued 6 yrs ago.

[benb]

I'm another person here who cracked a Thomson faceplate.. I was using a torque wrench all along too.

Mine cracked on the trainer so I didn't get hurt. Bars did sag down though. It was on my road bike, and at that point I never took my road bike offroad or on gravel roads at all. IIRC it was about 2 years of use and it cracked.

I haven't used the stem since then (they warrantied the face plate but it took a long time). I just don't trust it and I've had much better luck with cheaper forged stems.

If you were to search the archives this thread has come up many times before on either paceline or the old serotta forum. My guess is if you search on road bike review or velocipede salon you'll find it there too.

[93legendti]

I don't know how Thompson got its bulletproof rep, but these threads seem to pop up fairly often. Maybe they have more stems out there than other manufacturers?

[cp43]

I don't know how Thompson got its bulletproof rep, but these threads seem to pop up fairly often. Maybe they have more stems out there than other manufacturers?

I think the rep comes from the seatposts, which, at least in my experience, are very reliable.

I only have one Thompson stem, and I'll be keeping a close eye on it.

[djg21]

I think the rep comes from the seatposts, which, at least in my experience, are very reliable.

I only have one Thompson stem, and I'll be keeping a close eye on it.

I have Thomson x2s on two road bikes and x4s on my MTB and cross bike. I've once cracked a faceplate on an x2, but I know I got ham-fisted and over-tightened after my bar slipped on the road (I hit a massive pothole -- operator error). I've never had an issue so long as I tighten correctly and make sure that the faceplate is positioned correctly. I do check the stem bolts every time the bike is on the work stand, but would do this for any brand of stem.

[Fatty]

My Bud cracked the faceplate on his Thomson 25.4 mountain stem.
I loaned him a stem, a .99 cent REI closeout special.
When he got the replacement faceplate from Thomson we swapped it out in my shop, and when I pulled off my loaner I was shocked at how tight he had tightened the bolts. Like Gorilla tight.
I run and and have had a bunch of them. Some I bought used. Never had a problem.

[benb]

The thing with the X2 at least is it has almost no surface area in contact with the bars compared to many other stem designs, which makes it more likely to slip if it doesn't mate up with your chosen handlebar AND it is more prone to cracking if it gets overtightened.

I am just not a fan of it now due to:
- CNC being weaker
- They machined away most of the clamping surface

I'm much happier with stems that do not machine away the clamping face. Who cares if it's 10g heavier.

They spend a lot of time seemingly blogging and trying to debunk failures but I'm not sure why they continue to machine away so much. They even say it doesn't have enough clamping force for cyclocross... not sure why road is supposed to require so much less clamping force when a slip can be so catastrophic. They could probably change the faceplate to not have the giant hole and be done with these problems forever, and it would cost them less to manufacture.

IIRC the last time I saw a stem test the X2 was neither super stiff nor super light so I'm not sure what the point of the machined away faceplate is.

[EPIC! Stratton]

Thomson will warranty it no questions asked.
Did you take a spill? Could the end of the bar taken a hard impact?

Don't take it they warranty for nice big gouge in the faceplate c/o a USPS and the asphalt? :rolleyes:

[PeregrineA1]

I have cracked 4-5 Thomson faceplates over the years. With and without the use of a torque wrench. Also cracked a stem proper. Suppose I should put them in a box and send them to Thomson to see if they will warranty.

All were high hour/mileage. Only one was discovered while riding, the stem. Fortunately, when the bike quit steering, I was riding away from the truck...walked back.

[guyintense]

I just went through that same thing on my bike, 25.4 like yours but not as impressive a crack. I called Thompson but they weren't going to warranty it at first. With a little coercing and a photo of the part they sent me a free replacement. Then I thought because the 25.4 size was so outdated I ordered a spare, just in case.

[linger]

Never had them not issue me a warranty faceplate or stem. I have had 2-3 25.4 faceplates split and one other 25.4 stem crack near the steerer tube. All were on mtn. bikes. And yes I still buy them over other stems in both sizes.
I have also used an x2 for mtn biking (gasp) with and Enve sweep carbon bar and never had an issue. Thomson on all my bikes.

[jmal]

Never had them not issue me a warranty faceplate or stem. I have had 2-3 25.4 faceplates split and one other 25.4 stem crack near the steerer tube. All were on mtn. bikes. And yes I still buy them over other stems in both sizes.
I have also used an x2 for mtn biking (gasp) with and Enve sweep carbon bar and never had an issue. Thomson on all my bikes.

Just out of curiosity, why would you continue to buy a product that has failed you multiple times instead of another product that will not fail?

[jimcav]

i was going to get a thomson (wanted something shorter than what came on my bike), i picked up a bontrager stem, if it doesn't have that thomson look does that mean it is forged?

[CircuitHero]

I keep seeing broken Thomson faceplates but I've been using the same X4 daily for 3+ years on three different bikes without a problem. It's currently on a track bike that has flat bars on it during the week and drop bars on weekends. I have never used a torque wrench on it (it has 3mm bolts.)

My theory is that a lot of these failures come from either not tightening the bolts in the right order, or not paying attention to the spacing between the faceplate and the stem itself.

[jmal]

i was going to get a thomson (wanted something shorter than what came on my bike), i picked up a bontrager stem, if it doesn't have that thomson look does that mean it is forged?

Bontragers are forged, and though they lack that 90s bike jewelry look, they are better stems than Thomsons.

[bewheels]

As a side note...

Back in the day (1990's) I was on a MTB team that was sponsored by a well known maker of stems, seat posts, bars, etc. ...it was not Thomson.

Their policy was for us to get new stems, bars and seatposts each year. We never had an issue with their products but they wanted 'weight bearing' parts replaced each year.

I am not suggesting that everyone follow this. We were doing a high volume of riding/racing.

I am suggesting that people consider how much use some of these weight bearing components have seen.

Again - this is a side note to this thread. I am not suggesting that people experiencing broken Thomson faceplates are doing anything outside of what they were intended to do.

[Cicli]

I have never had an issue with Thomson. I did ride with a guy that was super OCD and would go over his bike with a three way before every ride. He cracked a faceplate. Thomson replaced it.

[linger]

To answer your question which is a good one by the way: I'm not sure. I have never had a crack in my faceplates nearly as big as the OP. I have just found small hairline cracks close to the center of the plate. The broken stem was due to a wreck which was my fault, again warrantied. I like how they look which should be at the bottom of my priorities I know. I have several Thomson parts in a drawer which is another reason. Thomson has always warrantied them as I said which probably helps. For the record my teeth as well as all body parts are important. I guess my trust is strong in them for some strange reason. I also am a few fries short of a happy meal admittedly.

Which products will not fail?

Happy trails.

Just out of curiosity, why would you continue to buy a product that has failed you multiple times instead of another product that will not fail?

[rrudoff]

Well I ride with an X4 on my cross bike currently-but I will now be checking it more carefully. I took a look on the Thomson site, and they use 7000 series aluminum, while it has a higher yield it is far more prone to stress and fatigue failure than some other alloys, and there are certainly cyclic loads on the face plate without a lot of extra material. I would think a 6000 series alloy might be a much better choice for the face plate in this case.

[DRZRM]

Seems to be a problem that mostly affected the 25.4 bar size, far fewer cracked faceplates on 31.8 stems, and when they have cracked, it seems they radiate from one hole, not across the face as we see on the 25.4 plates.

It seems to have largely been the result of over-torquing. Over many decades of use, I've found Thomson's to work very well. I currently use Thomson, Moots and one Easton stem, if you google it, you can find pictures of all of these forks with broken faceplates. Everything can break (see my Surly Moonlander thread), but Thomson seem to have largely dealt with the issue by re-engineering their stems, their bolts and extending a liberal warranty policy.

Not to disregard the issue, but all companies suffer failures. I don't think you are putting your life, or your teeth, at risk by riding a Thomson. Just check your parts periodically, which you should be doing anyway.

[FlashUNC]

Ugly and they crack? Where do I sign up?

[jmal]

Does anyone else find it suspicious that for decades we were fine without the use of a torque wrench and then mfgs begin using an inferior process when making stems and suddenly the problem is over-torquing? Stems undergo a ton of stress regardless of the application. I find it hard to accept that all the failures are due to over-torquing, but assuming this is true, shouldn't the stems be designed with a little (or a lot) of headroom? What happens to a properly torqued stem when a sprinter goes full tilt? My guess is more than a few clicks of the torque wrench are exerted on the stem. Forging produces a superior product. Why risk safety for CNCed bike jewelry? Victims of the 90s?

[alembical]

Jmal,
Problem is that we as consumers are weight weenies. As weight drops, durability does as well. I know my x2 stem is considerably lighter than my threaded 3t stem on my Serotta. They make heavier beefier stems, and many sprinters use them, but those don't seem to be at issue here.

[djg21]

Does anyone else find it suspicious that for decades we were fine without the use of a torque wrench and then mfgs begin using an inferior process when making stems and suddenly the problem is over-torquing? Stems undergo a ton of stress regardless of the application. I find it hard to accept that all the failures are due to over-torquing, but assuming this is true, shouldn't the stems be designed with a little (or a lot) of headroom? What happens to a properly torqued stem when a sprinter goes full tilt? My guess is more than a few clicks of the torque wrench are exerted on the stem. Forging produces a superior product. Why risk safety for CNCed bike jewelry? Victims of the 90s?

It has more to do with the materials being used. There was no risk of cracking a tubular steel stem like those once made by Salsa, or an old quill stem. The new designs are much improved, but forged aluminum has its limitations, and hence the need for a torque wrench. I like Thomson stems and have used them without major issue for years. As noted earlier, one faceplate cracked on me as the result of my own operator error, but that was far from catastrophic, and Thomson replaced the faceplate in days, with no questions asked.

[zap]

Well I ride with an X4 on my cross bike currently-but I will now be checking it more carefully. I took a look on the Thomson site, and they use 7000 series aluminum, while it has a higher yield it is far more prone to stress and fatigue failure than some other alloys, and there are certainly cyclic loads on the face plate without a lot of extra material. I would think a 6000 series alloy might be a much better choice for the face plate in this case.

Also check the stem where it clamps to the steerer. That's where our X4 broke-Thomson replaced the stem.

[DRZRM]

It has more to do with the materials being used. There was no risk of cracking a tubular steel stem like those once made by Salsa, or an old quill stem...

I generally agree with your argument...but,

Salsa Recalls 8,600 CroMoto Stems (http://www.bicycleretailer.com/recalls/2009/02/26/salsa-recalls-8-600-cromoto-stems#.VrOjOTYrLow).

[jmal]

It has more to do with the materials being used. There was no risk of cracking a tubular steel stem like those once made by Salsa, or an old quill stem. The new designs are much improved, but forged aluminum has its limitations, and hence the need for a torque wrench. I like Thomson stems and have used them without major issue for years. As noted earlier, one faceplate cracked on me as the result of my own operator error, but that was far from catastrophic, and Thomson replaced the faceplate in days, with no questions asked.

I understand the problem conceptually, but I don't understand the market for poor product just because it is imperceptibly lighter. Also, a well designed forged stem is not a problem. The problem is the CNC stuff from a billet. Forging makes the material stronger. My issue with Thomson is that they have a known failure point and they respond by decreasing the size of the bolts to reduce torque. This is a critical safety area and they need to look at their design/materials rather than basically saying, "yeah, we know it is weak, so just don't tighten it as much as you would for other stems." This also applies to other mfgs that use face plates that have had too much material removed in the name of saving a gram.

[jmal]

I generally agree with your argument...but,

Salsa Recalls 8,600 CroMoto Stems (http://www.bicycleretailer.com/recalls/2009/02/26/salsa-recalls-8-600-cromoto-stems#.VrOjOTYrLow).

I was going to mention this, but I feel like I have already spent too much time spouting in the fantasy land of the Internet.

[djg21]

I generally agree with your argument...but,

Salsa Recalls 8,600 CroMoto Stems (http://www.bicycleretailer.com/recalls/2009/02/26/salsa-recalls-8-600-cromoto-stems#.VrOjOTYrLow).

Don't the recalled ones have forged faceplates?

http://www.salsacromotostem.com

I was referring to the old 1" quills with the single HB clamp bolts like the one pictured below.

[jmal]

Don't the recalled ones have forged faceplates?

http://www.salsacromotostem.com

I was referring to the old 1" quills with the single HB clamp bolts like the one pictured below.

True. I think the two bolt design on the newer ones might be a problem. However, I don't know if they are forged or machines from billet. Either way, your point still stands. If you are going to use aluminum the design must be adequate to withstand the intended use.

Anyone want to revisit carbon forks?��

[djg21]

True. I think the two bolt design on the newer ones might be a problem. However, I don't know if they are forged or machines from billet. Either way, your point still stands. If you are going to use aluminum the design must be adequate to withstand the intended use.

Anyone want to revisit carbon forks?��

I may be using the wrong terminology. I'm referring to the manufacturing technique used to fabricate the Thomson faceplates and those on similar stems. Are they machined from billet? I'm not sure what the correct term is and I'm too lazy to use Google right now.

[madcow]

It's not that unusual and it's definitely not particular to just Thomson. A lot of these types of failures are a result of stress corrosion cracking. Not something that happens when a stem is new, but once it's been under stress for an extended period of time. Salt from ocean air, salted roads or even your own sweat can speed the process, but is not required.

scc is more common with 7000 series alloys as I would guess Thomson stems are. It's not very common with 6000 series alloys though 6000 is not necessarily a better material in all aspects.

[mg2ride]

The Thomson line is wayyyy over rated. Many breaks

[CunegoFan]

They should put a vertical hole through the stem just behind the bar and tell people to zip tie the bar through the hole...just in case.

Off to check my Thomson MTB stems...just in case.

[d_douglas]

So, I like Thomson stuff and have it on a few bikes. What are forged alternatives that are equally stiff? Pro? Easton EA-series? Ritchey? I sound dumb, but are these all forged?

I still like Thomson stuff :)

[zap]

So, I like Thomson stuff and have it on a few bikes. What are forged alternatives that are equally stiff? Pro? Easton EA-series? Ritchey? I sound dumb, but are these all forged?

I still like Thomson stuff :)

Which Thomson stem?

I find that the 3T ARX Team is stiffer than the Thomson X2 stem. Stems are listed as having the same length. The Thomson X4 is pretty stiff-I have yet to use a stem as stiff.

Fairwheel Bikes has a nice write up on stems posted on their website.

[benb]

Easton EA90 is forged and is ~10g lighter than an Elite X2 in the same size, with a solid faceplate with no hole/machining that reduces clamping force.

I don't even have the EA90 on my bike, I have the EA70, 5g more than the Thomson at half the price.

I'm sure it's not hard to find others.

[zzy]

My EA90 is about the stiffest stem I've ever used. Only my Syntace is similar, and maybe the FSA OS-99 CSI.

You do need to be very careful with Thomson stems. They did switch to 3mm bolts recently, and even supply fiber paste with the X2 stems. Set to 4Nm I've never seen a problem. I think the bigger issue here is that people don't understand you need to build up the tension evenly in a figure-eight pattern as you tighten the faceplate. I've actually never seen it happen to an X2 (tho I'm not a huge fan of 2 bolt stems) but many times to an X4 (31.8, 26.0, and 25.4).

[benb]

The design should be changed to be more tolerant.. this is just not an area where you can tolerate failure.

It kind of blows my mind that folks here have had multiple failures and buy Thomson's line and keep riding on them.

I have no desire to wake up in the hospital because my stem wasn't tightened and lubricated to the same precision as some component on a rocket or fighter plane or something. Not when there is almost no real advantage to this particular design. (How often do they want me to get my torque wrench calibrated if it's a type that needs calibration? Does the grease or micro-sphere non-slip agent age and have to be replaced? Does the stem need to be tightened at a certain ambient temperature? LOL.)

Just seems a cop-out that they always blame the user.

Start doing google searches for other stems cracking.. some you can't find a single hit. I get >200,000 for "Thomson stem crack", I get 0 for "Easton stem crack", "3T stem crack", "bontrager stem crack", "specialized stem crack".

I do get even more hits for "salsa stem crack", but clearly there are some brands that even with hundreds of millions of people on the net no one has bothered to share an experience about a failed stem.

[kittytrail]

same as cars, motorbikes, planes or almost any modern mechanical apparatus: almost never needed precise torqueing of bolts for close to a century, then advances in engineering/material science permitted weight reductions/better performances/reduced usage costs with "new" alloys or materials having different properties and new, different, industrial processes than what was available before. in any one of those industries the same f*cktardish thinking of the "i've always tightened fasteners that way, like my father and my grandfather before, and never had any problem" school of heavy handed mechanics had the same results over and over: from broken parts to dead people. sorry, world has changed. you want light and safe? be more careful when bolting anything on your bike and learn correct and best practice when working on new to you stuff.


that said, the JRA stories are just that. stories. mostly by people never owning to their own errors and with a huge sense of entitlement to a free replacement for life of any part they buy because they are so special and so perfect that they won't ever admit that *they* made an error. ever. :butt:

to all those f*cktards that let the other customers pick up their bills by having manufacturers factor the costs of their specialness and entitlement in the price of those parts when they do sing that sweet JRA complaint to get free replacements i won't say "thank you". ever. :no:


sorry, end of rant. back to some nice JRA storytelling before bedtime. :rolleyes:

[jmal]

I may be using the wrong terminology. I'm referring to the manufacturing technique used to fabricate the Thomson faceplates and those on similar stems. Are they machined from billet? I'm not sure what the correct term is and I'm too lazy to use Google right now.

I believe they are from billet as opposed to forging which changes the grain structure of the metal (making it stronger). Forged face plates can still break if too much material is "removed." I think some of the best stems are those cheap stems you see around shop fit stations. Something like lower to mid range Bontrager/Specialized, etc.

[jmal]

same as cars, motorbikes, planes or almost any modern mechanical apparatus: almost never needed precise torqueing of bolts for close to a century, then advances in engineering/material science permitted weight reductions/better performances/reduced usage costs with "new" alloys or materials having different properties and new, different, industrial processes than what was available before. in any one of those industries the same f*cktardish thinking of the "i've always tightened fasteners that way, like my father and my grandfather before, and never had any problem" school of heavy handed mechanics had the same results over and over: from broken parts to dead people. sorry, world has changed. you want light and safe? be more careful when bolting anything on your bike and learn correct and best practice when working on new to you stuff.


that said, the JRA stories are just that. stories. mostly by people never owning to their own errors and with a huge sense of entitlement to a free replacement for life of any part they buy because they are so special and so perfect that they won't ever admit that *they* made an error. ever. :butt:

to all those f*cktards that let the other customers pick up their bills by having manufacturers factor the costs of their specialness and entitlement in the price of those parts when they do sing that sweet JRA complaint to get free replacements i won't say "thank you". ever. :no:


sorry, end of rant. back to some nice JRA storytelling before bedtime. :rolleyes:

In case you failed to read all the responses, there are many people that do use the proper torque and tightening procedure and still have failures. It doesn't mean that everyone is stuck in a cycles of blindly following the methods of the past. Furthermore, I personally couldn't care less about light weight at the expense safety and function. Critical areas of bikes should never be designed such that failure is imminent, regardless of what the public desires in weight savings.

[LegendRider]

same as cars, motorbikes, planes or almost any modern mechanical apparatus: almost never needed precise torqueing of bolts for close to a century, then advances in engineering/material science permitted weight reductions/better performances/reduced usage costs with "new" alloys or materials having different properties and new, different, industrial processes than what was available before. in any one of those industries the same f*cktardish thinking of the "i've always tightened fasteners that way, like my father and my grandfather before, and never had any problem" school of heavy handed mechanics had the same results over and over: from broken parts to dead people. sorry, world has changed. you want light and safe? be more careful when bolting anything on your bike and learn correct and best practice when working on new to you stuff.


that said, the JRA stories are just that. stories. mostly by people never owning to their own errors and with a huge sense of entitlement to a free replacement for life of any part they buy because they are so special and so perfect that they won't ever admit that *they* made an error. ever. :butt:

to all those f*cktards that let the other customers pick up their bills by having manufacturers factor the costs of their specialness and entitlement in the price of those parts when they do sing that sweet JRA complaint to get free replacements i won't say "thank you". ever. :no:


sorry, end of rant. back to some nice JRA storytelling before bedtime. :rolleyes:

Since I was the OP, I will reiterate that I did the stem installation by the book - carbon paste, torque wrench and slow, methodical tightening of the bolts in a figure eight pattern.

[kittytrail]

Since I was the OP, I will reiterate that I did the stem installation by the book - carbon paste, torque wrench and slow, methodical tightening of the bolts in a figure eight pattern.

i like your "I crashed pretty hard a couple of years ago. Since the crash, I've changed bars but it's the same stem" statement too. no correlation. ever.

i'm not a Thomson fanboy(but i do use their products extensively along with others since 1996). there's not many companies that do what they do: develop a product, really test it like they do test teir other non-bike parts they make, sell it and revise it if need arise and stick with it for years instead of getting out a new range of overpriced products every year with new colours, new shapes only for the sake of bringing something "new" to market every year and then go on sale at the end of the season to make room for "new" inventory.
do their products come with limitations? sure they do. do they fail too? sure. do they fail more than others when properly installed and torqued? no. guess why they did change bolts to 3mm ones? because JRAers are way too stupid to not overtorque them with 4mm bolts and have the faceplates or steerer clamps fail. nor replacing said faceplate after a hard crash and bitching online because it cracked two years later. still no correlation of course.

bike components have a use life. they're not immortal gods of metal that never need replacing, they need to be cleaned, inspected and if need be, changed. Thomson states clearly that their products do have a max use of 10 years, less if used hard like in competition, they make no mystery of that fact. fatigue life is a real thing except of course in cycling were them laws of physic do not apply. lore and ever changing fashions still rule that realm.

TL;DR: Thomson is no Kooka. end of rant number 2.

[zap]

that said, the JRA stories are just that. stories. mostly by people never owning to their own errors and with a huge sense of entitlement to a free replacement for life of any part they buy because they are so special and so perfect that they won't ever admit that *they* made an error. ever. :butt:

to all those f*cktards that let the other customers pick up their bills by having manufacturers factor the costs of their specialness and entitlement in the price of those parts when they do sing that sweet JRA complaint to get free replacements i won't say "thank you". ever. :no:



m-kay. This is the internet so it can be difficult to know who's who and what's what.

Spend enough time here and you might get a sense for who knows how to properly assemble bicycles. Also, over the years there have been a number of threads regarding length of service for various parts.

[LegendRider]

i like your "I crashed pretty hard a couple of years ago. Since the crash, I've changed bars but it's the same stem" statement too. no correlation. ever.

Google "non sequitur."

Your rant was about installation errors, not crashing. I was very clear on two points - (1) I crashed and it may have played a role and (2) I installed the stem correctly. Beyond that, I all know is the faceplate cracked and lots of other people have experienced the same problem.