Winter clothing NOT for riding

[Ti Designs]

I've been riding year 'round near Boston for 25 years, I think I have dressing down to a science. I also product test for a number of clothing makers, some of whom even listen to me (most don't - a rant for a different day). This winter, my mode of transportation when it's cold is either my bike or my feet, so this morning (it was 10F outside) I walked to the gym. What I found was what works for riding doesn't work that well for walking. A number of things failed, like my glasses kept fogging up - that doesn't happen when the bike is moving... OK, a face mask that directs my breath down will solve that problem. Next, I don't generate the same kind of heat, so the thermal layer isn't getting the job done. I'm going to need far more loft in that layer than what I wear while riding. Then there's the fact that I'm going to the gym, so having 4 layers to take off and then put back on is gonna get old.

There are plenty of serious hikers on this forum, how much crossover do you allow between the two activities, and what do you use that's off the bike only?

[FlashUNC]

I'm a big fan of down vests or jackets for insulation.

Don't work on the bike for a lot of reasons, but keep the chill out off.

[benb]

For 10 degrees extended time outside without heavy exertion:

Thick/High-loft Primaloft liner + hard shell
Something like snowboard pants + long underwear underneath - fleece pants would be fine when going to the gym
Insulated boots + wool socks
Serious gloves + hat (fleece with ear extensions) + hard shell hood
If it was ultra nasty ski mask
Don't have this right now but ski goggles.. some have extraction fans for glasses wearers.. they do mostly work.

That's roughly what I wear for some stuff like running the snowblower when it's stupid cold.. pretty much impervious to the weather.

Worst case thing I've experienced is actually probably riding ski lifts in really bad + cold weather. Hiking is not as bad as you stay out of the worst of the wind when you can and you have a high exertion level. Single scariest moment for me happened snowboarding when a bad storm came in.. temp was like 10-15F with 30+ mph winds and blowing snow & high humidity. I couldn't keep my goggles clear and took my face mask off.. skin started freezing and snow was not melting on my face, very scary. Got off the mountain ASAP, would have been ultra scary having to hike out of that although the lower exertion level would have kept the goggles working.

Actually the other worst case is riding a motorcycle.. I've motorcycled down to almost 10 degrees and you create your own wind chill. It is brutal as you have near 0 exertion but you have a ready source of power for a heated jacket liner & heated gloves or grips.

Blocking the wind over 99% of your body is key.

[coffeecake]

I'm a fan of UNI QLO ultra-light down (http://www.uniqlo.com/us/men/outerwear-and-blazers/ultra-light-down.html). Mainly because of the price.

It's packable, lightweight, and deceptively insulating.

[AngryScientist]

part of the big issue is, of course that ultra-fit people have very little body fat, the lack of blubber really hurts when the mercury drops.

for low exertion walking, which i have to do every day to work - 2 layers are necessary, an insulating layer and a hard shell. to keep the warmest, the key is to eliminate as much air transfer as possible. the body is just a big heat exchanger, and keeping the flowrate down keeps the core warm.

so yea, primaloft is pretty good for the insulating layer, and a hardshell of some sort. keep the openings (neck, waist area, sleeves) as tightly sealed as possible to prevent air (heat) xchange.

[adavco]

There's not much crossover (base layer maybe) in my cold weather cycling and cold weather hiking wardrobes. Layering is the most important thing when hiking.. its warmer and lighter than a single heavy jacket and allows you to strip layers as you warm up. In single digit temps I usually wear a thin wool base layer, a light weight down jacket, and a shell to block the wind. Goretex is nice for blocking wind while still letting your body breath a little.

[flydhest]

How long was your walk to the gym. From my experience, that matters a lot. I went at 5:30 this morning at 15 degrees, but it is only 4-1/2 blocks, so I basically jogged with a puffy down jacket and wind proof cycling pants. If it had been more than just a couple minutes, that wouldn't have cut it, but it is so close. I swam a mile and did the same thing home.

[merlinmurph]

I find that the most important thing when dressing for weather is to have pieces that allow you the greatest flexibility. Conditions will change and your exertion level will change, and having pieces that you can easily adjust or change allows you avoid overheating or getting cold. Hiking is probably the best example of this because your exertion level changes a LOT and conditions can change a LOT.

The easiest way to modulate temperature is with a hat. If you're getting warm, take your hat off. Or, unzip your shell. Take your shell off. Unzip your pit zips. Replace your fleece with a vest. Etc.

[sitzmark]

Distance and pace are important. Slow/normal walking pace and extended distance probably best addressed with down/synthetic down vest/sweater and shell (ideally with pit zips or alternate ventilation for maximum functionality). A wind blocking shell pant (insulated if wearing over gym shorts alone) and extended length socks. This probably most convenient combination when reaching the gym.

My cold weather hiking/snowshoeing kit leans a bit toward thermal cycling clothing - focus on layers with a mid and/or outer wind stopper layer. Usually a vest so I can shed some heat /water vapor through arms and pits. A Gore-Tex shell for really brutal (windy) conditions below zero. Brisk pace walking can generate similar heat and moisture if done for an extended period of time.

For me, as long as I keep my core warm I usually don't wear hats/masks unless there's a strong windchill factor working to below zero "feels like" conditions that risk frostbite. A shell with a hood works well to adjust head protection/overall ventilation.

Finally, a sunny 10*F is a different beast than damp and dark 10*F.

[saf-t]

Huh. Saw someone walking down the hill this morning while I was driving to the ofice and thought " geez- that guy's dressed for riding- but where's the bike"?

[eippo1]

These are fantastic for walking the dog in the cold:
http://www.carhartt.com/products/carhartt-winter-clearance-sale/Washed-Duck-Dungaree-Flannel-Lined-B111

For an upper, I wear the LLBean Rugged Ridge, over a down pullover or a wool Vittoria jersey plus a wool snood (from BWW). The snood is essential for regulating temp without fogging the glasses.

With this getup, I can stay out with the dog in -20 windchill for 90plus minutes.

[christian]

There are plenty of serious hikers on this forum, how much crossover do you allow between the two activities, and what do you use that's off the bike only?

For hiking and backpacking, my only crossovers, are Aclima wool mesh baselayers, wool socks, and a neck warmer. Everything else is specific to the activity.

For XC skiing, I use all my cycling gear, pretty much. XC-specific hat and gloves.

[Ken Robb]

I like down jackets a lot. I have them in light (REI called it a "down sweater" when I bought it 20 years ago), medium, and heavy which covers the hips and has a belt at the waist to prevent drafts. I am quite warm-blooded so only the lightest one works for me when skiing.

I think I could be comfy in one of my jackets over workout wear in any weather you would encounter with the addition of wind pants for really cold/windy days and/or sweaty walks home from the gym. I would hope to avoid special under-layers and the requirement to change out of them at the gym. I am assuming that you don't carry a change of clothes so you can shower at the gym rather than at home.

[verticaldoug]

You should read Kolyma Tales written about the gulag in Siberia by Shalamov. He has whole short stories on 'cold'. They didn't have thermometers so had their own definitions of cold - snot freezes in nose, spit froze before hitting ground, piss froze before hitting ground. The guy was a poet and it is a really entertaining book on the trade-offs in the most inhumane conditions.

After reading it, you will be okay in the Boston winter in flip flops , jeans and a hoodie.

(I grew up in north central Minnesota in the 70's. I don't consider it to be cold until it is -20F or so. )

[93legendti]

My Father was born in a village in Poland and never wore a winter coat. A corduroy sport coat was his winter coat. Probably how he survived the cold during the battle of the Bulge.


This morning I wore my 60g primaloft TNF thermos all jacket under my 100g primaloft Eddie Bauer Igniter jacket. T shirt underneath it all. Toasty. Temp was 17 deg, wind chill was 10 deg or less. Layers.


Hoods. Hoods. Hoods.
I wear hats, but a hood is much warmer-covers the neck and part of the face and keeps the wind of the sides of your face, with a hat underneath, even warmer.

[mgm777]

Here's how I dress in Colorado for cold(less than 20 deg) weather:

Case 1 --little to no physical exertion/activity
-Head: wool hat -- a balaclava in brutal cold.
-Torso: base layer(Patagonia mid-weight) + R1 Fleece + down or primaloft sweater jacket + insulted shell jacket (Spyder Bernese or ArcTeryx Sidewinder shell) -- you need a shell on top to block the wind and cold.
-Legs: Patagonia mid-weight(cap 3) long johns, and a heavy pant -- the denser the weave, the better.
-Feet: Wool socks + insulated boots (Sorels or Blundstone #560s)
-Hands: Ski Gloves or Mits (Swany or Hestra)

Case 2 -- moderate physical exertion (i.e. walking for a mile or greater)
-Head - wool hat
-Torso: base layer(Patagonia Cap3 mid-weight) + R1 Fleece + a soft-shell jacket with wind block panels -- Spyder Patsch Hoody or Patagonia Softshell.
-Legs: Patagonia mid-weight long johns+soft-shell pants (Patagonia Alpine Guide)
-Feet: Wool socks & Blundstone 560s

I really like soft-shell jackets and pants in cold weather with moderate activity levels. I find I don't overheat and the soft-shell breathes really well. No sweat build-up, which allows me to stay dry and warm. If you are not going to be doing much physical exertion...standing around watching a game, for example, then you really need a shell on top of your insulation layers to block the wind and cold. The shell will help you build a micro-climate and keep you toasty.

[HenryA]

My Father was born in a village in Poland and never wore a winter coat. A corduroy sport coat was his winter coat. Probably how he survived the cold during the battle of the Bulge.


This morning I wore my 60g Thinsulate TNF thermos all jacket under my 100g thinsulate Eddie Bauer Igniter jacket. T shirt underneath at all. Toasty. Temp was 17 deg, wind chill was 10 deg or less. Layers.


Hoods. Hoods. Hoods.
I wear hats, but a hood is much warmer-covers the neck and part of the face and keeps the wind of the sides of your face, with a hat underneath, even warmer.

Excellent advice regarding the hood! Waayyy better than just a hat.

I'd wear a long sleeve hi-tech underwear shirt, a fleece, a down or synthetic light jacket and a wind/rain shell over all that. At a brisk pace you should stay toasty for a good while.

Or you could HTFU like 93legendti's dad. The things that generation accomplished....

[Ti Designs]

After reading it, you will be okay in the Boston winter in flip flops , jeans and a hoodie.

I coached a girl who was from northern Vermont, we were out riding, it was below 20F and it started to snow kinda hard. She said "well, at least it's warm" On the flip side, one of the guys on the team was from Florida. We were stopped at a light on the way back in and the moisture that had built up in his clothing literally froze solid.

I get that there's a huge difference in how cold is perceived by different people, but there's a limit to that. At < 10% body fat I can still keep my house at 50F in the winter and I'm fine with that, but much below 20F my core temp will start to drop pretty rapidly if I'm exposed - being from Siberia doesn't change that.

Places that have really cold winters also tend to have people who claim they're tougher 'cause they grew up that way. I'm not buying it, for two reasons. First, I rode my bike all winter in the Boston area, I didn't see many other people out there. I'm talking 60 mile rides on common cycling routes, I saw maybe a half dozen other cyclists in a month. I did see the same guy 4 times in different places, so I know he rides (he's from the DC area). The other reason is a company called 45North. They're from Minnesota, and they make some of the warmest clothing on earth - they're not tough, they're smart...

I've come up with my own little list of what goes wrong when it's cold. It's not as hard core as "piss freezes before it hits the ground", mostly 'cause I don't want to risk the exposure in finding out. Here's my own list:

25F: Non insulated water bottles freeze
25F, 2 hours later: THe water bottle cage breaks off (water in it's liquid state acts as it's own shock absorber, as a solid it's mass will break the cage)
20F: Gel saddles freeze.
<20F: CO2 inflators are useless. The tube will freeze and shatter. I found this out on the most miserable ride I can remember...
<15F: condensation from car exhaust forms black ice on surfaces that can't absorb the moisture, like those cobblestone crosswalks.
<10F: Breathing faster or deeper does no good. My rides home from work last winter were often below 10F, I would wonder if it's better to ride slow to reduce headwind or ride fast to generate heat and get home sooner. I was a moot point, I really couldn't ride much faster...
<5F: My eyes stop moving in the sockets. I found this out by accident, but it's been tested many times. I won't ride in the city when it's that cold 'cause I can only look straight ahead.
I've never been on a bike below zero - guess I'm just a wimp.