Lugged Steel v. Nove/Ottrot

[Shredder]

Sadly, my beloved Moots no longer fits properly (8 cm drop even w/ riser stem) due to flexibility restrictions caused by a now (mostly) rehabbed bulging disc. I need something custom with a tall head tube and short top tube (I have long legs and a short torso).

I am currently going back and forth b/w chosing a Nove/Ottrot or a lugged steel work of art, probably a Kirk, but possibly a Vanilla. My dilemma: head v. heart.

I have ridden an Ottrot and it was amazing, everything it was cracked up to be. Not too hard on the eyes either. However, I have old school taste. For no rational reason, the Serotta leaves me a little cold. My head, however, tells me this is the best bike around.

On the other hand, I have always lusted for a lugged steel beauty. The real beauts such as Kirk, Vanilla, Sachs, etc. make my heart sing. I have a Serotta CXII CS and love the ride, but I don't think the rides will really be comparable. I once owned a Reynolds 531 bike, which was not stiff enough for me-not really an issue with the new steels. I don't have a clear idea of how one of these will ride and doubt I will have an opportunity to test ride one.

I am, however, concerned that I am focusing too much on style and not enough on the ride. All things considered, this is a very close call for me.

Anyway, I was hoping to get some insight into the relative ride qualities of these bikes to better inform my decision. Any input will be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.

BTW- I am 40 yro, 6'3" 210 lbs. I am an MOP long distance triathlete and ride my road bike more than my tri bike. I live in Colorado and do long rides in the mountains. I will never race the road bike-just train and ride century type events.

[Nic Schmidt]

You've named three lugged framebuilders, each in different time zones. I'd cover your bases and add Curt Goodrich Bicycles as your representative for the Central Time Zone. I'd narrow your choices down to 2 of them and give each a call (you may even discover your heart going pitter-patter in talking directly to the actual individual that's going to actually build your frameset). After that, you may have a better idea between the latter and a Serotta.

Good luck.

[rePhil]

Follow your heart, otherwise you will never be satisfied.

[rnhood]

You will always be able to get a modern plastic bike and, each year the hype will proclaim this years better than last years. Prices will likely decline as well. So I don't really see that there is any compromise in putting off the purchase of a modern bike.

On the contrary, a top quality lugged steel frame reeking with the craftsmanship of an artisan will likely not be as readily available in the future. A dying art in the age of cheap sunglasses. And, given that there is no consensus that a modern high zoot bike rides any better than these hand made steel bikes, a decision here would seem to be an easy one - all in my opinion of course.

I assume you will sell that Moots. What model and size?

[Dr. Doofus]

kirk

goodrich

sachs

zanconato

de salvo

doof has done a lot of digging, and has not heard anyone have second thoughts about the fit process, design, and construction of these bikes. eliminate extra parties from the discussion, go right to the source, let them do their thing. you won't go wrong.

doof'll give a special shout to zank -- he was going to do a frame for the doof, but it got redirected due to other stuff that doof is not currently at liberty to discuss yo. zank was 100% professional, fair, and had some killer plans for a doof race bike.

you might also check out the builders (zank, kirk, and sachs amongst) who use kirk pacenti's stuff -- www.bikelugs.com/pacentilinks.html.

if your heart says lugs, go for lugs.

[Fixed]

bro you may get better keep the cost down but get a bike that works for you now. i.m.h.o.
I love classic art though .
cheers

[slowgoing]

I have an Ottrott and several lugged Serottas. I like the Ottrott better, with the Atlanta a close second. There is just nothing not to like about the Ottrott.

Lugged steel? I'd also consider Tom Kellogg, especially if you have fit issues.

[Serpico]

call Dave Kirk

[atmo]

>>On the other hand, I have always lusted for a lugged steel beauty.
>>I am, however, concerned that I am focusing too much on style and not enough on the ride.
>>All things considered, this is a very close call for me.


mebbe don't confuse the two features. lugs are a way
to join tubes - nothing more, nothing less. builders who
don't choose lugs are not doing so in order to make a
statement that their techy, well riding frames are any
less detailed. and "lug builders" are not here to serve
those from the art crowd. any builder of either type
should be able to make a well crafted, high performance
frame that fits well. the burdern of that research is on
you, and fellow forum-ites are good listeners and advice
givers. along those lines, here is a list of cats (http://www.richardsachs.com/nextwave.html) that i think
should be on everyone's radar atmo.

[Serpico]

speaking of...

did anyone else notice:

Serotta chose the "archaic" method of joinery known as lugs for their new carbon frame

they discontinued one lugged frame (csi) for another (mevici)


--just thought it was interesting, nothing else :)

[imho]

"art" is a stupid criteria by which to choose a bicycle.

imho

[atmo]

"art" is a stupid criteria by which to choose a bicycle.

imho


i agree.
after bridge over trouble water, the duo jumped the shark.
that little yentil guy is a control freak and ruined what
might've been a decent sound for another 5-10 years.
lastly, art had the cooler 'do atmo.

[imho]

i agree.
after bridge over trouble water, the duo jumped the shark.
that little yentil guy is a control freak and ruined what
might've been a decent sound for another 5-10 years.
lastly, art had the cooler 'do atmo.


that post is all funkled up.

imho

[atmo]

that post is all funkled up.

imho


the blond with the fro.
carnal knowledge, etc.
wt'ph' are you talking?

[Dr. Doofus]

atmo mp imho mp idao

yo

[palincss]

i agree.
after bridge over trouble water, the duo jumped the shark.
that little yentil guy is a control freak and ruined what
might've been a decent sound for another 5-10 years.
lastly, art had the cooler 'do atmo.

Hello, Atmo, my old friend
You've come to talk with us again
Because a vision softly creeping,
Left its seeds while you were sleeping,
And the vision that was planted in your brain
Still remains
Within the sound of silence.

[Serotta PETE]

based of the flexibility requirement, I would look at a sloping Ottrott with st rear. Ride is excellent. Other choices are Steel Serotta (CDA) or the old CIII (forgot new name). These you can get in about 2 months.

From what I understand on availability

Serotta is quickest
Kirk
Goodrich
Kellog
Sachs

YOUR BUDGET AND TIME FRAME for the delivery of the frame will dictate some of the selection process. Sachs is great but a few years out. I think VANILLA is also a year out (or more)

Good shopping.


Pete

Ti works well (VERY WELL FOR THE LEGEND ST) others to consider would be Kellog Ti, Moots,

[atmo]

atmo mp imho mp idao

yo


time for doof to sybil-ize.

[Dr. Doofus]

time for doof to sybil-ize.

idbo --

sybil:

no.

centaur:

yo.

siren:

mo.

[atmo]

Hello, Atmo, my old friend
You've come to talk with us again
Because a vision softly creeping,
Left its seeds while you were sleeping,
And the vision that was planted in your brain
Still remains
Within the sound of silence..

[steelrider]

Hey, add Eisentraut, Della Santa, Rex, Litton, and Taylor to the list. If you're into lugs, they are all worthy of your consideration.

[eddief]

like with a steel fork and a quill stem? If your heart does not take you all the way to the classic, then maybe it would work best if you went for carbon ti modern. Having one bike sometimes does not serve for the curious and addicted.

[imho]

like with a steel fork and a quill stem? If your heart does not take you all the way to the classic, then maybe it would work best if you went for carbon ti modern. Having one bike sometimes does not serve for the curious and addicted.


that's not real. it's just old. threadless is the future....like sybilizing.

imho

[Fixed]

welcome back bro
cheers

[imho]

welcome back bro
cheers


thanks bro.

imho