HED alloy rims, why are they so expensive? Also, new open pro?

[bicycletricycle]

Anyone know why HED rims are so expensive, seems like they are 50%-100% more than the price of the competition.

I guess the most direct competition would be the archetype, tb14, velocity a23 and aileron, pacenti sl23, kinlin xc279, etc.

I guess it doesn't matter, just buy one of the cheaper options, just curious if I am missing anything.

Also,


New 2016 open pro? Can't seem to find out if it's wider or not than the old one, apparently the ksyriums got wider.

[SlackMan]

'Cause they're awesome. :D Just kidding. I did have a set, and did think they were awesome, but I haven't compared them to others to know whether the price difference is justified.

[bicycletricycle]

I do think they are a very handsome rim

[livingminimal]

I have both, and I will say that I find minimal difference between Archetypes and HED Belgians.

That said...I know the HEDs will have lasting satisfaction an durability. The Archetypes are still new to me. Still through a cross season where I raced one set and trained on a second, they seem to be good...but this is a pretty limited window.

I have no doubt that the HEDs I have on my road bike will last as long as any wheel could reasonably be expected to...

[echelon_john]

Because they're overpriced, and have a very 'selective' distribution model because they make WAY less money on supplying rims to wholesalers, wheel builders and the general public than they do on selling wheels with really ····ty hubs.

(Spoken as an early rim customer of HED who tried hard to make things work)

** Edited to clarify that I think they're great rims. But there are lots of comparable rims now; Pacenti, H+Son are just two.

[weisan]

I found this insight from 11.4 pal in another thread helpful.
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showpost.php?p=1708252&postcount=28

By the way, I managed to find a HED C2 rim at a good price during the BF sale ($90 after discount), which sort of bring it closer to the price of the other comparables. It's on its way to me, and as soon as I have it built it, I will have three different set of rear wheels built out of Pacenti SL23, H Plus Son Archetype and HED C2 to compare with side by side.

I've got all three -- 440 OC's, Archetypes, and C2's -- and like 'em all. The C2's seem to be a little more durable than the Archetypes and especially on disc brake wheels I like the C2 non-machined finish better than the hard anodized Archetype, but that's an aesthetic issue. The C2's are the only rims I've not seen cratered. The older DT's seemed to be a little softer alloy and dented a little more easily, but with the newer generation like the 440 OC's, that seems to have been fixed. And now their alloy sidewalls outlast practically anything else except possibly the HED's. I do notice some difference between the narrower 440 OC's and the wider C2's, but you see it mostly when turning, sprinting, or descending because the wider rim helps stabilize the sidewall profile of the tire. If you are mostly riding straight-line training or group rides, don't expect the extra width to amount to much. On the other hand, if you really need a stronger wheel, I found I built the C2's optimally to a higher tension than what the Archetypes favored, and the 440 OC's built completely differently at a lower tension to a much more even build. If I wanted the best wheel build, it would be the 440 OC's. If I wanted the best race wheel or wheel for serious lateral stresses, it would be the C2. The Archetypes would miss out by a relatively small margin. If it came down to a much lower price, I'd buy the Archetypes, but they are the only rim where I've actually worn (on the hard anodized Archetypes) the sidewalls to where they needed replacement. That just speaks to shorter lifetime and the small potential for a failure if I weren't attentive to replacing components as needed. I'm riding a pair of Pacenti's now and liking them, but don't have enough data on them. I did ride a pair of A23's for a brief while and really didn't like them for their soft alloy and because they didn't build up anywhere near as well as the other rims discussed here.

[FlashUNC]

Best alloy rim I've used personally.

[cachagua]

Second. I don't remember what initially made me buy pair of Belgiums... oh yes, it was to put on the Merckx. They were scrupulously flat and round, and very friendly to build. But after using Open Pros for decades, I was disappointed that it was so difficult to mount tires on the Belgiums -- like, I couldn't do it by hand, and my hands, in all modesty, are not pansies.

However the Belgium Plus rims are as delightfully easy to put tires on as Open Pros. So I'm a happy guy again. And although it means nothing to me, they're rated for tubeless, in the bargain.

They're expensive, but things are tough all over. I don't go through wheels very fast, so I anticipate getting good value out of the ones I have. Overall I'd say they're just about as much better than Open Pros as the price would indicate. So Archetypes and other lower-priced ones? Maybe we should think of them as bargain rims.

[alexstar]

Re: the "new" Open Pro... Looks like nothing has changed for 2016 except the decals ("Open Pro C"...). Also, the Reflex is now called the "Open Pro T". The CXP range got new names as well but it doesn't seem as though anything has changed. Same rims as the last decade or so.

[marciero]

I still have soft spot for Open Pro after all these years. Have a set on a steel Colnago. Aint nothing wrong with that wheel.

The Belgiums are more expensive, but on the other hand used wheelsets in good condition turn up fairly often here. I bought a set of VGC C2/ultegra wheels that cost less than the single Belgium+ front I got from wheelbuilder. Ouch on that one. I also have tb-14, sl23, A23 (in 650B). They all built up pretty well and work pretty well for me. Velocity required some cleaning up of metal debris.

[oldpotatoe]

Anyone know why HED rims are so expensive, seems like they are 50%-100% more than the price of the competition.

I guess the most direct competition would be the archetype, tb14, velocity a23 and aileron, pacenti sl23, kinlin xc279, etc.

I guess it doesn't matter, just buy one of the cheaper options, just curious if I am missing anything.

Also,


New 2016 open pro? Can't seem to find out if it's wider or not than the old one, apparently the ksyriums got wider.

Add DT440, as one of the wider/thinner rims. WITH OC drilling, great rim.

I have built all of the above and the last A23 iteration is a great rim. I think they are past the issues they had right after they moved production to FL.

HED-Expensive decal on a good rim. I think HED watches/controls/monitors production really carefully, plus a good design. But I'm not sure why they are so expensive. I think they control distribution really well also.

OpenPro same as before. Doubt Mavic is going to spend any $ on a new rim. I'm surprised they still make rims at all.

Glad Echelon above mentioned the HED hubs..poor, IMHO, not on par with many hubs now on wheelsouttaboxes(shimano and Campagnolo/Fulcrum).

[mktng]

Open Pros will always be my favorite. However I bought a set of Belgium's to lace to some nice Royce hubs. Thought they deserved something nicer....

No complaints on the Belgium's. Wide. Solid rims. Built strong without being overly heavy. Look nice and perform great.

I would definitely build another set in the future. Maybe the + model.

Sent from my A0001 using Tapatalk

[pff]

The plus rims are super nice, and the widest available, so there's no direct competition. I do think there's a good deal of brand-name markup, you aren't getting the same bang for your buck as with kinlins. Pacenti sl23s (last gen) were a nightmare to put tires on, but HEDs have always been on the easy side for me (no tire lever), which really is a huge benefit when you're stuck on the side of the road futzing around with cold fingers.

[BobbyJones]

After tens of thousands of miles on Open Pros, I got my first set of C2's a few years ago and drank the KoolAid. Not sure if they're the best thing ever, but a really nice ride and have held up incredibly well.

I've been lusting for the C2 "Black" series rims, but looks like it's a no go unless you go full wheels from HED.

Pacenti's incoming...looking forward to the new year on them.

Wheels (and rims) are just one of those things... most of us get at least a few years out of them. What's another 50-60 bucks in the long run?

[Jeff Borisch]

Most of my clincher miles are on Belgiums or A23 wheels I built myself. The Belgiums seemed to build easier than the A23s. Belgiums have better braking. I have no idea why but it's noticeable. They are expensive but if anything they make the A23s seem overpriced. The next rims I buy will probably be Pacentis just to see what they are like. I really like them aesthetically.

[ctcyclistbob]

Add DT440, as one of the wider/thinner rims. WITH OC drilling, great rim.


OP, do you know anything about the new DT Swiss RR 511 Rim? Sounds like a promising wide rim, but wonder what you think.

[donevwil]

Most of my clincher miles are on Belgiums or A23 wheels I built myself. The Belgiums seemed to build easier than the A23s. Belgiums have better braking. I have no idea why but it's noticeable. They are expensive but if anything they make the A23s seem overpriced. The next rims I buy will probably be Pacentis just to see what they are like. I really like them aesthetically.

Funny you mention this as I've had the exact same experience, but thought it was just me.

The rear OC A23 I had was evidently from the first US batch and was absolute garbage. My builder said it was unbuildable, but my timeframe didn't allow for a Velocity replacement so he built the rear with an Archetype.

Both my Ardennes and Echelon John built HED + on Campy are beautiful and bombproof.

[oldpotatoe]

OP, do you know anything about the new DT Swiss RR 511 Rim? Sounds like a promising wide rim, but wonder what you think.

Haven't seen one in the wild. Seems like a lighter version of the 585. Tubeless compatible also. Interesting part about specific washers and nipples tho..Torx head, wonder if these are not true-able outside the rim(booo).