Syrian refugees

[Veloo]

Yay Germany!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC_nkR0qlEU

[roguedog]

That's cool. I can't imagine how that must feel after losing so much and so much turmoil. It must have been a few hours of normalcy and we all know how cycling kind of helps you work thru stress and all those mental/emotional things.

Very cool:beer:

[weisan]

That's cool. I can't imagine how that must feel after losing so much and so much turmoil. It must have been a few hours of normalcy and we all know how cycling kind of helps you work thru stress and all those mental/emotional things.

Very cool:beer:

Indeed!

[93legendti]

Refugees....:rolleyes:
How does anyone know what they are and where they are from?

[Mikej]

Until that whole Isis plot comes together and they start beheading guys using 10s master links on 11s chains...

[oldpotatoe]

Refugees....:rolleyes:
How does anyone know what they are and where they are from?

Well, nobody knows. Unfortunately, there are probably some ISIL members embedded in the multi hundred thousand+ 'refugees'. We'll see how this shakes out. Ain't gonna be pretty.

[93legendti]

Well, nobody knows. Unfortunately, there are probably some ISIL members embedded in the multi hundred thousand+ 'refugees'. We'll see how this shakes out. Ain't gonna be pretty.

Agreed. Too many well fed men in their mid 20's. And the timing is very suspicious.

When my father came here legally, he was a thin as a rail, my Grandmother had to "fatten him up for a year" before they would let him and my family in.

[goonster]

How does anyone know what they are and where they are from?
That is what the asylum application review process, whatever its flaws and shortcomings, is for.

They do actually deny and deport people.

[FlashUNC]

There may....may...be some nebulous ISIS threat. So let's fret over that and not the greatest human displacement and migration since WWII.

Sigh...

[93legendti]

FBI admits no way to vet the Syrians:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3283587/FBI-admits-s-no-way-screen-Syrian-refugees-Obama-administration-plans-accept-US.html

[soulspinner]

There may....may...be some nebulous ISIS threat. So let's fret over that and not the greatest human displacement and migration since WWII.

Sigh...

double sigh

[93legendti]

"US has accepted more than 500 Syrian refugees and plans to admit thousands more | Daily Mail Online

'It's clearly a population of concern,' National Counterterrorism Center director Nicholas Rasmussen told the Committee in February...

'You are talking about a country that is a failed state, that does not have any infrastructure so to speak.'

'So all the data sets, the police, the intel services, that you would normally go to and seek that information, don稚 exist.'"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2958659/US-accepted-500-Syrian-refugees-plans-admit-thousands-ISIS-slip-country-them.html

[Gsinill]

Refugees....:rolleyes:
How does anyone know what they are and where they are from?

What alternative would you recommend?

[Grant McLean]

So let's fret over that and not the greatest human displacement and migration since WWII.


Yes, by some logic, when the next hurricane comes,
let's only evacuate the skinny people. #facepalm.
For anyone who wants to know more about the demographics
of those displaced (the ones registered by UN) have been counted.
The 'mainly young men' story doesn't seem to be supported by data.

http://data.unhcr.org/syrianrefugees/regional.php

There is a very strange assumption that those displaced by a war
are poor or dangerous because they are 'refugees'. I guess that
says a lot about some people's mental picture of why people get
forced into fleeing.

I'd imagine that really almost every middle class North American
would find them selves in the same situation if your home town was
bombed to pieces, and everyone in the community who could get
out were trying to do the same. This has been going on for years
to get to the point today where desperation reaches new lows.
Those of us in safety should have more freaking compassion.

-g

[akelman]

What alternative would you recommend?

He's trolling. Ignore him and hope he goes away.

[Grant McLean]

FBI admits no way to vet the Syrians:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3283587/FBI-admits-s-no-way-screen-Syrian-refugees-Obama-administration-plans-accept-US.html

http://www.alternet.org/media/americans-are-110-times-more-likely-die-contaminated-food-terrorism

[93legendti]

What alternative would you recommend?
Iran is flush with cash, let them go there...or any other Islamic state where they will be happy and enjoy pork and alcohol bans, as well as burkas, women not being allowed to drive or work and the other things Islam believes in.

[93legendti]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/germany-calls-for-new-refugee-benefit-standards-in-europe/2015/09/25/bee704fe-616d-11e5-8475-781cc9851652_story.html



BERLIN German officials said Friday that nearly a third of all asylum seekers arriving in Germany and claiming to be Syrian in fact come from other nations, even as Interior Minister Thomas de Maizi鑽e called on European nations to take radical new steps to curb the region痴 refugee crisis.

[FlashUNC]

Iran is flush with cash, let them go there...or any other Islamic state where they will be happy and enjoy pork and alcohol bans, as well as burkas, women not being allowed to drive or work and the other things Islam believes in.

You realize Christians and people of essentially all denominations are refugees from the Syrian Civil War, right?

[akelman]

Iran is flush with cash, let them go there...or any other Islamic state where they will be happy and enjoy pork and alcohol bans, as well as burkas, women not being allowed to drive or work and the other things Islam believes in.

Islam isn't monolithic -- any more than Judaism or Christianity or any other major religion is. You're a troll and a bigot. And yet, despite the fact that you poison so many discussions with your vitriol, nothing ever changes. It's absolutely inexplicable.

[akelman]

You realize Christians and people of essentially all denominations are refugees from the Syrian Civil War, right?

He doesn't care. He's just looking for an outlet for his fear and anger.

[93legendti]

http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/6668/germany-migrant-crime-wave


"...According to a classified document, the German government now estimates that Germany will receive as many as 1.5 million asylum seekers in 2015, including 920,000 in the last quarter of 2015 alone. With family reunifications, the actual number of asylum seekers could swell to more than 7 million. Separately, German authorities now estimate that at least 290,000 migrants and refugees have entered the country without being registered.

"The behavior of these highly delinquent youths towards police officers can be characterized as aggressive, disrespectful and condescending. ... When they are arrested, they resist and assault [police officers]. The youths have no respect for state institutions." Confidential report, leaked to Die Welt.

In Berlin, a classified police report revealed that a dozen Arab clans hold reign over the city's criminal underworld. The report says the clans, which are dedicated to dealing drugs, robbing banks and burglarizing department stores, run a "parallel justice system" in which they resolve disputes among themselves with mediators from other crime families. If the state gets involved, the clans use cash payments or threats of violence to influence witnesses.

"For years the policy has been to leave the population in the dark about the actual crime situation... The citizens are being played for fools." Andr Schulz, head of the Association of Criminal Police.

According to the President of the German Police Union, "In Berlin or in the north of Duisburg there are neighborhoods where colleagues hardly dare to stop a car because they know that they'll be surrounded by 40 or 50 men." These attacks amount to a "deliberate challenge to the authority of the state attacks in which the perpetrators are expressing their contempt for our society."

Asylum seekers are driving a surge in violent crime in cities and towns across Germany. German authorities, however, are downplaying the lawlessness, apparently to avoid fueling anti-immigration sentiment.

A confidential police report leaked to a German newspaper reveals that a record-breaking 38,000 asylum seekers were accused of committing crimes in the country in 2014. Analysts believe this figure which works out to more than 100 a day is only the tip of the iceberg, as many crimes are either not resolved or not reported.

The current spike in crime including rapes, sexual and physical assaults, stabbings, home invasions, robberies, burglaries and drug trafficking comes amid a record-breaking influx of refugees from Africa, Asia, the Middle East and the Western Balkans..."

[CunegoFan]

Iran is flush with cash, let them go there...or any other Islamic state where they will be happy and enjoy pork and alcohol bans, as well as burkas, women not being allowed to drive or work and the other things Islam believes in.

There is a simpler solution. They should go to the part of Syria that is not in turmoil: The Golan Heights.

How do you like that solution?

[93legendti]

I remember when people here were cheering the Arab Spring...

Good times.

[verticaldoug]

http://www.alternet.org/media/americans-are-110-times-more-likely-die-contaminated-food-terrorism

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/trouble-with-chicken/

Foster Farms is a terrorist organization?

[93legendti]

There is a simpler solution. They should go to the part of Syria that is not in turmoil: The Golan Heights.

How do you like that solution?

The Syrian Golan Heights has turmoil.

Or they could go to your neighborhood. How do you like that solution?

[93legendti]

You realize Christians and people of essentially all denominations are refugees from the Syrian Civil War, right?


I do.


We aren't letting them in, unfortunately.

http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/world/2013/december/christian-syrian-refugees-denied-visas-to-west/?mobile=false


" Christian Syrian refugees have found temporary shelter in Jordan, but their immigration requests have been rejected by Western countries.
Some of them have spoken to the Associated Press, but want to remain anonymous for safety reasons."

[PQJ]

Iran is flush with cash, let them go there...or any other Islamic state where they will be happy and enjoy pork and alcohol bans, as well as burkas, women not being allowed to drive or work and the other things Islam believes in.

Judaism has some pretty odd proscriptions and requirements, too. (In my opinion, as one.)

[exapkib]

Considering the positive nature of the original post, it is discouraging to see the tone that the discussion has taken here.

As one who works closely with individuals displaced by the violence in Syria (and so many other parts of the world) both in the US and abroad, I want badly to share my experiences in working with this population, but I also recognize that a thread like this one is not a place where detailed, nuanced experiences are easily digested and contemplated.

Yes, there are bad people in the world. Choosing to reach out to people in need wherever we find them (in spite of the bad guys) is part of what keeps us human.

[Anarchist]

this got a lot more pleasant to read after i updated my ignore list.

[goonster]

alcohol bans

There are over 500 dry municipalities in the U.S., but I don't see anyone wringing their hands over this crisis of national identity.

I'd also like to point out that Italians were vilified in almost exactly the same way at the dawn of the 20th century. "There are anarchists who are Italian, therefore every Italian immigrant represents a security risk we can't afford . . ." etc.

[Anarchist]

There are over 500 dry municipalities in the U.S., but I don't see anyone wringing their hands over this crisis of national identity.

I'd also like to point out that Italians were vilified in almost exactly the same way at the dawn of the 20th century. "There are anarchists who are Italian, therefore every Italian immigrant represents a security risk we can't afford . . ." etc.

But I'm not Italian!!!

[goonster]

But I'm not Italian!!!
Prove it, paesano.

[verticaldoug]

The Syrian Golan Heights has turmoil.

Or they could go to your neighborhood. How do you like that solution?

I am okay with that. I remember when catholic charities helped the Hmong people immigrate from their Thai refugee camps to MSP/StPaul. Initially, they lived in closed communities but part of that was because of the charitable organizations wanting to keep the refugee communities together. Generation 1 was hard, generation 2 is becoming part of the community, gen 3 will be even more integrated. It takes a long time, but I believe the Hmong are contributing to Minnesota in many ways.

Minnesota also has the largest population of Somali in the US. The FBI is showing concern and definitely monitoring the community but they will also eventually integrate into the larger community. I was recently back helping my Dad downsize the house. He was planning an auction, my aunt is friendly with many Somali. She brought families over to the auction and the families received some real deals. It was a win for everyone.

It wasn't that long ago that New York had no Irish need apply signs, or in central Minnesota the German community was viewed with suspicion during WW2.

There are no instant solutions, it just takes time, maybe 20 or 30 years.

(I think a bigger problem is our angry young men with guns walking into schools. )

[bcroslin]

How about we put and Off Topic designation on this thread and lay off the xenophobia. Between some of the posts in this thread and the Colnago/ Misogyny post I'm thinking I might need a vacation from the PL. At least with the Colnago post I started to wade in and then realized what it was about and then ignored it due to the predictable comments.

[93legendti]

There are over 500 dry municipalities in the U.S., but I don't see anyone wringing their hands over this crisis of national identity.

I'd also like to point out that Italians were vilified in almost exactly the same way at the dawn of the 20th century. "There are anarchists who are Italian, therefore every Italian immigrant represents a security risk we can't afford . . ." etc.

Is there a difference between citizens who want to live a certain way and bringing in people who demand we live only according to their beliefs?

Do those places ban pork, and bar women from driving and working?

I am glad "Syrian refugees" are so settled that they have a cycling team.

I am sure flooding western countries with unvetted refugees is a great idea. I hope they go to your neighborhoods. I don't deserve to have them live in mine.

Sorry to the OP.

I thought a discussion involves more than one side, not just reflexsive mutterings of "that's swell, I feel so good, damn the torpedoes".

[redir]

Considering the positive nature of the original post, it is discouraging to see the tone that the discussion has taken here.

As one who works closely with individuals displaced by the violence in Syria (and so many other parts of the world) both in the US and abroad, I want badly to share my experiences in working with this population, but I also recognize that a thread like this one is not a place where detailed, nuanced experiences are easily digested and contemplated.

Yes, there are bad people in the world. Choosing to reach out to people in need wherever we find them (in spite of the bad guys) is part of what keeps us human.

Keep up the good work! There's nothing like the Internet to help one give up hope in all of humanity. People sometimes wonder how atrocities could ever happen in the first, I just say go read the comment section on any news site.

[FlashUNC]

Is there a difference between citizens who want to live a certain way and bringing in people who demand we live only according to their beliefs?

Do those places ban pork, and bar women from driving and working?

I am glad "Syrian refugees" are so settled that they have a cycling team.

I am sure flooding western countries with unvetted refugees is a great idea. I hope they go to your neighborhoods. I don't deserve to have them live in mine.

Sorry to the OP.

I thought a discussion involves more than one side, not just reflexsive mutterings of "that's swell, I feel so good, damn the torpedoes".

C'mon. Your default position here isn't "Hey guys, let's make sure we handle this crisis in the right way to ensure that folks get to a safe place, start a new life and, no less importantly, that we're not letting any criminal or other nefarious element in." Your stance is "All Muslims want to conquer the world and take away our way of life, and this is another of their scheming, nefarious plots to do so."

One is a completely reasonable and sensible position to take that's certainly contrary to the "throw open the borders and let 'em all in" strategy that some -- like me -- advocate. The other requires a willful and selective misreading of the situation based largely, from where I sit, on xenophobia.

[akelman]

Sorry to the OP.

Have you ever asked yourself why so many discussions that you enter almost instantly become a problem? Why they end up with bad feelings all around? Why they have to be locked so frequently? Do you honestly believe it's because you're some kind of martyr? An oppressed minority voice who's speaking hard truths to power? Because really, that's not it. It's that you're a bigot and a troll. You turn what otherwise might be interesting and civil conversations into something toxic.

[akelman]

And yes, I should be ashamed of myself for wasting my time like this. Sincere apologies all around. It's just that there's a very small cast of characters here who, when they show up in a thread, can reliably be counted on to bring more heat than light. It's tedious. But then again, tedious is a perfect description for my comments. Again, I'm sorry for being part of the problem in this case.

[brockd15]

Have you ever asked yourself why...they have to be locked so frequently?

Just an observation, but there have been some pretty charged topics on this forum (which I think is a good thing) that the mods (rightly, IMO) allow to continue until it degrades into name calling and attacks.

Honestly, I think you're the only one who's been doing that here, and it will likely be locked because of it.

Well, others have called xenophobe, which I think is kind of a default cop out to not really address the question/objection. To have good discussion it's far better to say what about the position you disagree with, and why, instead of attacking the person.

[slidey]

To have good discussion it's far better to say what about the position you disagree with, and why, instead of attacking the person.

Not everything is up for a discussion; treating one religion differently is playing right into the hands of the delusional extremists' reading of the world order, where they gin up support by show of fear/power (guns/money via oil, etc). This trend of posing an absolute bunk opinion of a fringe, extremist minority to a reasonable stance, and asking to be given an equal platform to present this theory in the name of freedom of speech/furthering discussion is plain deception.

[FlashUNC]

Just an observation, but there have been some pretty charged topics on this forum (which I think is a good thing) that the mods (rightly, IMO) allow to continue until it degrades into name calling and attacks.

Honestly, I think you're the only one who's been doing that here, and it will likely be locked because of it.

Well, others have called xenophobe, which I think is kind of a default cop out to not really address the question/objection. To have good discussion it's far better to say what about the position you disagree with, and why, instead of attacking the person.

1) I disagree with the supposition that all Muslims was to restrict rights of women and kill everyone who is not of their religion. And that somehow these are core tenets of the faith.
2) I disagree with those who hold views of religions and groups of people as monolithic with sinugular goals.
3) I disagree with those who essentially are stating that the Islamic equivalent of Appalachian Pentecostal Snake Handlers are everything.
4) I disagree with those whose sole judgment on how to respond to a very real and pressing global crisis seems to be based on which version of the magical sky wizard a group of people on the Arabian Peninsula thought up a couple thousand years ago someone tends to believe in.

[gasman]

I think we've run the course on this thread.

Thank you to anyone trying to help their fellow humans. I believe that the majority of people are basically good, wherever they live.