Switching to 28 mm tires, what should I expect?

[tuxbailey]

Hopefully I will gain a lot of comfort.


I forgot to check tire clearance but hopefully it will fit. Tires coming from merlincycles.

[eddief]

on my coupled travel bike. For some reason that bike has always seemed a bit less compliant than one would expect from good steel, but I think Curtlo (Doug Curtiss) built it that way to handle a bit of load. Regardless, the Endurance tires seem to be a great set. Me 190, rear pumped to 70, front to 65 and the ride felt good bouncy and somehow the tires seemed "fast-er" than the ones they replaced.

Tests would suggest my findings are true:

http://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/road-bike-reviews

Endurance not quite as smooth as Compass 32 tires, but usually around half the price.

[Fishbike]

I feel much more secure on poor pavement on 28 mm tires. The bigger tires handle the cracks, sand and potholes better. This weekend the roads were covered in acorns, leaves, pine needles, etc. The bigger tire gives me more confidence to power through the crud on the road.

[weisan]

Going straight to 28 or even 32/35 is not a guarantee that you will enjoy newfound joy of "wider and fatter."

You need to be brave enough to experiment with lower tire pressure...much, much lower than you are used to. Plus, not all tries are made the same. If you have been attention to what's posted here every so often, the general consensus is Compass, Grand Bois are usually positive, there are cheaper alternatives that are not too far from a performance standpoint if you are willing to go that route. And lastly, the rim you have is important too, it must be able to take advantage of the wider profile.

[tuxbailey]

I guess I should have checked here first for experienced opinions before ordering the tires.

Bike: 2005 Merlin Extralight with standard fork (Merlin fork - Reynolds Ouzo Pro?)

Wheels: DT Swiss RR440.

Previous tires: 23 mm GP4Ks.

New tires: 28 mm Vittoria Rubino Pro

PS: I weigh 200 lbs.

[benb]

Yep.. I've been riding nothing smaller than 28s since late 2013.

You really need to lower the pressures, but the tires still will not be magic if your frame/wheels are super harsh.

I'm just under 180.. I've been riding a porker of a bike, 25lbs or so. The 28s I have are Conti Grand Prix 4 Seasons (they seem to have discontinued this tire in 28c). I run the back around 85-90psi and the front 55-60psi. I seem to have a lot of weight on the back on my bike so can't seem to lower the rear much more.

The 35s I have are more commuter/gravel oriented.. rear tire goes at about 55-60psi and the front goes around 45-50psi. My bike is definitely more intended for the bigger tires and seems to handle a little better with the 35s.. the 28s really speed up the steering. I can ride some seriously rough stuff on the 35s though. I took my bike up/down some really steep gravel fire road stuff yesterday, it was not great on the 15% stuff due to lack of braking power & wanting even more of a MTB tire but I was able to safely do it and I did some singletrack too and was pretty much OK other than some uphill rock garden stuff where I got bounced around a bit too much.

Definitely higher end tires are better for the ride quality even at these sizes.. I can't really get a good tire pressure in my 35s that can come close to the 28c Contis in terms of a combo of ride quality/rolling resistance. The 35s I have are too stiff (wire bead, lots of puncture resistance, long wearing rubber). They feel real slow at the tire pressures I run them to get a good ride quality, but if you pump them up any more they become brutal.

All that said.. my bike is way too stiff IMO.. (steel frame and fork built to carry a 350lb rider + 50lbs of luggage) My old carbon bike which probably had a 250-275lb limit was arguably more comfy with 23s or 25s over lots of stuff. Hard to say as that bike arguably fit better too. Last week I test rode a Cannondale Synapse with 28s.. it was light years more comfy than my bike with 28s.

[sparky33]

Hopefully I will gain a lot of comfort.

and Enlightenment.
you will be reborn as air that fills tires softly and rotates in a happy circle for all eternity.

Or you may get fewer flats and suffer less back pain. Basically the same thing.

[oldpotatoe]

Hopefully I will gain a lot of comfort.


I forgot to check tire clearance but hopefully it will fit. Tires coming from merlincycles.

Put 'em on and let us know. Experiment with pressure, find the one that is the best combo of comfort, non squishy, non lethargic, 'bright' ride. But put 3 people in a room and ask about such things, get 4 opinions.

[eddief]

Ouzos were in the era before fat tires. 28 fit nicely under an Enve, but they were designed with fat in mind.

I guess I should have checked here first for experienced opinions before ordering the tires.

Bike: 2005 Merlin Extralight with standard fork (Merlin fork - Reynolds Ouzo Pro?)

Wheels: DT Swiss RR440.

Previous tires: 23 mm GP4Ks.

New tires: 28 mm Vittoria Rubino Pro

PS: I weigh 200 lbs.

[tuxbailey]

So I am looking at the RR440 specs and the product specification says that the wheel has the following spec:

External width: 21 mm
Internal rim width: 16 mm
Depth: 21 mm

From the DT Swiss website:

http://www.dtswiss.com/Resources/Tech-PDF/Tire_Pressure_Dimension

The 28 mm tire width matches three clincher inner width columns in 15-17.9 mm, 18-19.9 mm, and 20 - 22.4 mm.

Does it mean that 28 mm tire will fit these rims?

Thanks for any help.

[thwart]

Bike: 2005 Merlin Extralight with standard fork (Merlin fork - Reynolds Ouzo Pro?)

The Ouzo Pro on my Peg will allow a 25 mm Michelin Pro3 mounted on a Hed 23 mm rim, which actually measures 26+ mm.

I haven't yet found a 28 mm tire that'll fit, although I've only tried a couple.

[tuxbailey]

The Ouzo Pro on my Peg will allow a 25 mm Michelin Pro3 mounted on a Hed 23 mm rim, which actually measures 26+ mm.

I haven't yet found a 28 mm tire that'll fit, although I've only tried a couple.

Ouch... Oh well I will give it a try. Hopefully nothing rubs.

[oldpotatoe]

So I am looking at the RR440 specs and the product specification says that the wheel has the following spec:

External width: 21 mm
Internal rim width: 16 mm
Depth: 21 mm

From the DT Swiss website:

http://www.dtswiss.com/Resources/Tech-PDF/Tire_Pressure_Dimension

The 28 mm tire width matches three clincher inner width columns in 15-17.9 mm, 18-19.9 mm, and 20 - 22.4 mm.

Does it mean that 28 mm tire will fit these rims?

Thanks for any help.

Yes the tires will fit fine.

[tuxbailey]

Yes the tires will fit fine.

Thanks. Now I hope the fork will play nice :)

[jtakeda]

Good luck.

28s are pretty nice. A nice cushy ride compared to 23s.
I can't get anything bigger than 25 on my Merlin.
Wound up fork though so you might have better luck with the ouzo pro.

[exapkib]

I've been riding 28s on my Yamaguchi (!) for the past couple of weeks. For me, the jump from 25 to 28 is more noticeable than the jump from 23 to 25. It has taken me a bit of experimenting to find a comfortable pressure that does not seem bouncy or sluggish, but I think I'm there.

Overall, it seems that the quality (suppleness) of the tire matter almost as much as the width/pressure. For example, I found 25mm Veloflex Masters to be a better combination of comfortable adn fast than the 28mm Clements that I'm running now.

Now that I know that the wider tires will fit (barely), I'll be excited to try a nicer 28mm tire when these wear out.

[palincss]

Hopefully I will gain a lot of comfort.


I forgot to check tire clearance but hopefully it will fit. Tires coming from merlincycles.

Well, maybe, if you're coming from 23mm or 25mm tires, and your 28s are actually 28mm and not 25s with a lying label; but only if you adjust air pressure downwards (pump those 28s up to the pressure you'd use on a 23 and you'll turn your bicycle into a literal boneshaker) and if your new tires are at least as supple, if not more so, than the old ones.

[RyanH]

I found 27mm Vittoria Pave's to be subtly more comfortable than Veloflex carbons (23mm). I run them at 60/70 psi (I weigh 150lbs). It's most noticeable on big cracks and rutted roads. Definitely not a night and day difference, especially if I run the Veloflex's down to 80/90 psi.

[professerr]

I'm with Old P on this -- experiment to find what you like because with tire width and tire pressure everyone has an opinion and literally every combination of bike and body is different.

I have one set of wheels with 28s mounted, and I'm not convinced that bigger is always better. I loved them at first because they swallowed bumps like nothing else. But now I only use them for fire roads and similarly nasty surfaces. Everywhere else, I find them too bouncy, no matter how I inflate them. It is akin to a car with worn shocks that bounces too much after the initial impact. This was especially true for the Compass (I forget the name) tires, which many others love for their super suppleness. But me at 155 on a steel bike is not the same as a big guy on a carbon monster.

[rwsaunders]

I'd be interested to see if your 28's actually measure 28. If so, the Ouzo Pro that I had on one bike was capable of fitting up to 25's, depending on the model of course.

[layneo59]

Have some experience with this. I have an Eriksen with an Ouzo Pro fork, HED 23 mm wheels, standard Ultegra calipers and here is what I found out about 28's:
Michelin Pro--no way does this fit
Specialized (most models)--nope, just a little too tight
Ruffy Tuffy--nope
Continental (most models)--yes it fits!

I currently have Vittoria Open Pave 27 on the bike and these fit fine and ride very nice.

Hope this is helpful.

[thwart]

I'm with Old P on this -- experiment to find what you like because with tire width and tire pressure everyone has an opinion and literally every combination of bike and body is different.

I have one set of wheels with 28s mounted, and I'm not convinced that bigger is always better. I loved them at first because they swallowed bumps like nothing else. But now I only use them for fire roads and similarly nasty surfaces. Everywhere else, I find them too bouncy, no matter how I inflate them. It is akin to a car with worn shocks that bounces too much after the initial impact.
But me at 155 on a steel bike is not the same as a big guy on a carbon monster.

I had the same experience with 32's, but actually found 28 mm Ultremo Ones to be OK. About the same rider weight.

As you said, everyone is different.

[tuxbailey]

Not much room left both front and rear but the tires fit with some clearance.

Front:

http://tuxbailey.zenfolio.com/img/s4/v65/p1592477307-4.jpg

http://tuxbailey.zenfolio.com/img/s6/v134/p1592477708-4.jpg

Rear:

http://tuxbailey.zenfolio.com/img/s3/v24/p1592477607-4.jpg

http://tuxbailey.zenfolio.com/img/s3/v38/p1592477483-4.jpg

http://tuxbailey.zenfolio.com/img/s12/v171/p1592477340-4.jpg


Tire has specification of 70 psi min and 110 psi max. I pumped it to 80-85 psi F/R. We will see how it rides.

[thwart]

Think you're OK.

The obsessives among us (like me) would throw some protective film on the underside of that fork crown. Especially for bad weather use.

[tuxbailey]

Think you're OK.

The obsessives among us (like me) would throw some protective film on the underside of that fork crown. Especially for bad weather use.

Duct tape?

[bironi]

That should work fine, but I would try the Vittoria Pave in 27.
It is a very nice ride.
As most have commented, play with the pressure.
You'll be surprised how much lower you can go and how much comfort you get.

[thwart]

Duct tape?
Sure, although something thinner (like the stuff you'd use to protect the driveside chainstay) would perhaps be a better choice.

[tuxbailey]

Sure, although something thinner (like the stuff you'd use to protect the driveside chainstay) would perhaps be a better choice.

Cool. Maybe I will trim some clear packing tape and stick it under the crown.

[tuxbailey]

That should work fine, but I would try the Vittoria Pave in 27.
It is a very nice ride.
As most have commented, play with the pressure.
You'll be surprised how much lower you can go and how much comfort you get.

Sure I will keep that in mind when these tires are done.

Silly question: for a 27 mm tires, do you use the 19-26c tube or 28-32c tube?

[thwart]

Cool. Maybe I will trim some clear packing tape and stick it under the crown.
PM me your address and I'll send you something far better.

[oldpotatoe]

Sure I will keep that in mind when these tires are done.

Silly question: for a 27 mm tires, do you use the 19-26c tube or 28-32c tube?

Using the smaller one means it'll get a bit thinner for larger sizes, using the big one means ya gotta make sure it's all in the tire, and none is peeking under the bead anywhere. I'd use the smaller one.

True Story, I know a guy who uses 26mm MTB tubes on his 29er, says 'cuz they're lighter'..

[tuxbailey]

True Story, I know a guy who uses 26mm MTB tubes on his 29er, says 'cuz they're lighter'..

How does that even work?

Hmmm, so my 19-26c might still be usable in the 28c tires. They are the regular thickness butyl varieties. So in essence I will have "light weight" inner tubes! :p

[saab2000]

It is my firm opinion that wider tires need wider rims to take full advantage of the extra width and volume.

Many rims don't have a wide enough internal width in my opinion.

Years ago I owned a set of Campagnolo Nucleon clincher wheels. I don't remember the internal width but when I installed some 25mm clinchers the nice feel of the wheel disappeared. They felt squishy because now the tires had the dreaded light bulb shape. I went back to 23s and liked the way they felt.

Today wider tires and rims are all the rage but many of them have a narrowish internal width, though wider than they used to be.

I have a set of the Gen 1 SL23s on my Hampsten. They're great with 23mm tires and spread them out. They're close to the same internal width as many other wheels.

Now Pacenti has introduced the next generation of wider rims and they really spread out the internal width. I have a set of SL25s with an internal width of 20mm on my Indy Fab and the 25mm tires spread out to 28mm. I roll them at about 75 PSI and it almost feels like too much. They roll super nicely and don't have any feeling of squishiness at all and don't feel 'soft' either. I'd like to try these with the 30mm Challenge Strada Bianca tires at about 65 PSI or lower for gravel riding.

Anyway, my point is that I actually do believe that the internal width matters when moving to wider tires and I think others will eventually follow suit with 20mm internal widths.

Remember when rims were like 18-19mm wide and 21mm tires or even 19s were common!?!?!

This picture shows what I perceive happens to wider tires on narrow rims and shows the previous generation SL23.

http://www.m2endurance.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/IMG_0163.jpg

[tuxbailey]

^^^

Thanks for the input. It was informative.

According to the spec, my wheels have internal width of 16 mm. The tire fits so the next thing is to see how they roll...

[palincss]

Silly question: for a 27 mm tires, do you use the 19-26c tube or 28-32c tube?

Not silly at all. With an excessively large tube it's difficult to install the tire without catching the edge of the tube under the bead of the tire, eventually resulting in the tube wedging the tire right off the rim leading to subsequent explosive blow-out.

That said, not all tubes marked the same are actually the same width. Specialized tubes marked 26 x 1.5/1.75 are significantly wider than Maxxis tubes marked 26 x 1.5/1.75; the Maxxis are a perfect fit for 650Bx42, but the Specialized are just too large.

[Waldo]

Expect using bigger inner tubes.