Does this custom paint job quote sound reasonable?

[yoshirider]

I'm a bit shocked by the quote that a local frame painter gave me when I asked to paint a matte black stealth Canyon Ultimate CF SLX frame to look like the Katusha team frame. He quoted me $600. Does this sound reasonable to you?

I don't know anything about painting, but from the looks of it, he would just need to paint over the grey lettering and stripes with white or red paint to match. The undersides of the chain stays and fork are already painted red.

1697908828
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[Joachim]

Sounds about right for one color. If he is painting more than one, its cheap. Remember its not the painting time you are paying for, its the taping and creating crisp lines.

[thirdgenbird]

A paint job from the likes of Joe bell will hit 1k quickly.

A job like this will require a lot of masking work if you intend to have him paint the logos. If that also includes a full clear coat, it's probably a very good price.

I like it as is...

[druptight]

I'm a bit shocked by the quote that a local frame painter gave me when I asked to paint a matte black stealth Canyon Ultimate CF SLX frame to look like the Katusha team frame. He quoted me $600. Does this sound reasonable to you?

I don't know anything about painting, but from the looks of it, he would just need to paint over the grey lettering and stripes with white or red paint to match. The undersides of the chain stays and fork are already painted red.

1697908828
1697908827

You can ask him to break down his quote for you - most will, but think about all the masking he'll have to do in order to paint that - masking out the lettering and the lines for the red in 2 separate sessions most likely. Plus you're looking mixing up 2 colors one of which will have to match your existing color, then they'll probably have to do some sort of matte clearcoat over top plus the various sessions of sanding so you don't end up with edges on the newly painted bits that you can feel.

I'm always shocked at how much the paints quotes are, but when you consider the time it takes, the cost of the materials, and the level of skill required it's not as shocking as it might seem at first.

[joosttx]

seems fair to me.

[yoshirider]

I see. This makes sense now. I don't think my husband will want to pay to get his frame painted then. How about vinyl? Will it look similar in vinyl?

[Cicli]

I see. This makes sense now. I don't think my husband will want to pay to get his frame painted then. How about vinyl? Will it look similar in vinyl?

It will look the same but be a bit cheesy.

[vqdriver]

to be honest, i actually prefer it the way it is.

[jtakeda]

$600 is about right.

I was quoted $800 for a one color wet paint job.

That was paint and decals though.

[zap]

to be honest, i actually prefer it the way it is.

agreed.

[David Kirk]

Clean and sand old paint, spray one color, cure, wet sand, mask for second color, spray second color, cure, wet sand, clear coat #1, clear coat #2, polish, buff, box and ship...........? $600 is a wicked bargain.

dave

[yoshirider]

The stealth color is okay... It makes the bike look like every other stealth bike out there. You can't really see the Canyon logo at all which is a bit of a bummer.

[tiretrax]

Too much seatpost showing.

Seriously, it's probably a good deal, but why emulate a bunch of d-bags. Another vote to leave it like it is. What's around the white stripe on seat tube/seat stay junction?

[ptourkin]

A paint job from the likes of Joe bell will hit 1k quickly.

A job like this will require a lot of masking work if you intend to have him paint the logos. If that also includes a full clear coat, it's probably a very good price.

I like it as is...

Yep. I have a couple friends who work for Joe - painting a cf frame is not as easy as it looks. It is not a perfectly smooth surface. There are pinholes and other things that require meticulous prep before the spraying begins.

[R3awak3n]

The stealth color is okay... It makes the bike look like every other stealth bike out there. You can't really see the Canyon logo at all which is a bit of a bummer.

that is a blessing considering canyon likes to put their logo 50 times in their frames.

I much prefer the stealth frame to the other one and I have got quotes for painting and $600 is about right.

[SoCalSteve]

Stealth is awesome! You should have seen how garish this was before Allan Wanta removed all the paint.

[Dead Man]

http://www.lowes.com/pd_42849-61158-11203-6_0__?productId=3543514

http://images.lowes.com/product/converted/075815/075815112033lg.jpg

Little cheaper than $600, if all you're looking for is flat black

[krhea]

Contact Allan Wanta for a paint quote.

Also, here's a C'Dale my ride buddy purchased, didn't like the paint scheme so we designed a scheme, took it to a high end automotive vinyl place and they did a killer job. He's ridden it for 2yrs and not a single person has an idea the red is a vinyl "wrap"

https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2898/14030140903_411e973a52_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/nnN966)IMG_0018 (https://flic.kr/p/nnN966) by KRhea FrzFrmFoto (https://www.flickr.com/photos/krheapvpics/), on Flickr
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7071/14031174913_05ab63f173_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/nnTrsR)IMG_3693 (https://flic.kr/p/nnTrsR) by KRhea FrzFrmFoto (https://www.flickr.com/photos/krheapvpics/), on Flickr

[Formulasaab]

Keep in mind the prep...

To (properly) prepare a previously painted surface for paint you need to sand it to remove surface contaminants, both intentional (wax) and unintentional (environmental/pollutant). If you only chemically prep it, you assume a certain degree of risk.

So, how would you ONLY sand the lettering? You can't. Or at least *I* can't. Maybe the pros have a trick here. If they don't have a trick, then even just changing the color of the logos means pretty much a complete refinish.

Then, as others have said, there's the masking work. That's tricky tricky stuff, as I have learned by doing it myself with mixed results.

[nicrump]

Clean and sand old paint, spray one color, cure, wet sand, mask for second color, spray second color, cure, wet sand, clear coat #1, clear coat #2, polish, buff, box and ship...........? $600 is a wicked bargain.

dave


Agreed. if we are sanding it all back and burying the new paint lines followed by a nice matte top coat? $1000 is in order for a top notch job.

fwiw my buddy got a quote for a respray on his '64 falcon, nothing special, single stage factory color. they would guarantee the work for 5 years, $20,000! the money was in the prep.

[alancw3]

earl schrieb would paint your car for $299 including pre work.

[nicrump]

earl schrieb would paint your car for $299 including pre work.

if by prep you mean roll it into the booth, yes. but i'm sure you were joking.

[ultraman6970]

I would try with vinyl 1st... just measure really well, do your stuff in a pdf using your fav graphics software... go to good signs (car printing signs preferable) place and they will work out the pdf so they can cut it. Wont be expensive tho.

there's a super thin vinyl that is not going to fail soon if that worries you.

[CampyorBust]

I have always had trouble swallowing the price tag of wet paint job. I know how much work and time goes into it and from that point of view the price tag is certainly justified. However from a buyers perspective I can never pull the trigger. I have found cheaper paint jobs for around $200-300, not for the perfectionists. $600 + is just too much for me, maybe with all the bells and whistles.

I once looked into painting my own frames, the cost of doing it right was prohibitive. From what I gathered you will need a very powerful air compressor, blasting booth, ideally a painting booth, paint guns and accessories and the paint which is insanely toxic or at least the good stuff is. When all was said and done I was looking of upwards of 8-10k for the quality materials. So that too must be taken into consideration.

A cheap solution is having your frames painted when you are having bodywork done to your car, unfortunately I might be trying this out in the near future. I figure it should be better than my half-@$$ed rattle can job, though it will almost certainly not be my color of choice but that of my car. Which is fine I guess, beggars can't be choosers.

[CampyorBust]

You could always Swril it...

https://youtu.be/BU52F1BZIZI

[Formulasaab]

A cheap solution is having your frames painted when you are having bodywork done to your car


Have you already worked out the logistics of this?

Depending on the bodywork being done to your car, the paint system may not be compatible with your bike's needs.

Paint for plastics (modern bumpers) is different from paint for metals, as are the primers. In addition, primers for aluminum are different than primers for steel (I don't know about Ti offhand). Primers for bare metal are different than primers for coating over existing finishes.

In all cases, the existing finish needs to be scuffed at a bare minimum or removed entirely. Most body shops are doing less and less bare metal work these days, as it is more expensive than replacement panels which come pre-primed. Specialty shops that work on restorations and hot rods and the like still do plenty of it, but they're expensive.

Of course, the body shop may not opt to explain all the little details if they see an easy few hundred bucks on the line. It might look great when they hand it over but durability may vary wildly.

A rattlecan paint job can look pretty damn decent if done with care and if plenty of post-paint work (wet sand and compounding). It will never have the durability of the automotive quality paint, so weigh the pros and cons.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[bicycletricycle]

Painting is a lot of work, especially when there is a lot of masking involved. That is a pretty reasonable price.

If you can use adobe illustrator you could get some vinyl cut stickers made and achieve almost the same effect for short money.

[tuscanyswe]

You could always Swril it...

https://youtu.be/BU52F1BZIZI

Haha thats video needs some editing .. :D But thats a pretty neat outcome, always fun to c how ppl do stuff.

[dawgie]

I have looked into getting my favorite bike repainted several times, and $600 sounds about par for the course. My bike is a Waterford with a beautiful paint job but a lot of chips, and since I bought it used, the colors are not my preference. However, after pricing out the cost of a repaint, the existing paint is looking better and better to me. I probably will get the bike repainted by Waterford at some point, but plan to wait until I retire because I commute a lot on that bike, which can be tough on paint jobs.

BTW, I think your existing paint job looks pretty nice.

[Len J]

I have a friend that rails against the excessive cost of a $700 paint job, but thinks nothing of a set of $300 bars, or $3K wheels, or a $5K frame.....

Different priorities.

Len

[Formulasaab]

I've painted two frames now, because I'm obsessive about doing things myself and learning all about how its done, sometimes to my detriment. So I'm no expert, but I've learned some stuff.

If you haven't been exposed to the world of automotive quality paint and the costs associated, stop by the local PPG (or equivalent) paint shop sometime and price the paint (the good stuff, not their fleet line) in the smallest containers they'll sell you.

Sure, it may be enough to do three frames or two framesets plus accessories, but it will run you $500+ for primer, sealer, two colors, and clearcoat. It goes up from there if you choose candy-coat and other fun stuff. Additionally, the choices of colors and tints in non-metallic finish are minimal, as the industry has swayed heavily towards metallics. There's custom blend, but that's $$$ too.

As was mentioned before, that doesn't count the tools and other supplies necessary. I do quite enjoy saying "I painted it myself" though.

[AngryScientist]

Stefan,

Can you expand on your painting process using automotive grade paint?

did you use a negative air room to keep dust down and paint in? what about curing, at room temperature or elevated (baked)? etc...

[bikeridah]

Contact Allan Wanta, he painted my nude Calfee in Mondrian for less than your quote. Outstanding workmanship.

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=135807

[Formulasaab]

Stefan,

Can you expand on your painting process using automotive grade paint?

did you use a negative air room to keep dust down and paint in? what about curing, at room temperature or elevated (baked)? etc...

Sure.

I built a temporary (although its been up almost a year now) spray booth inside my garage. I used 2x4s and 2x2s with transparent plastic sheeting. On one end I have a hole about 2x3 that I covered with a few layers of cheap home central air filters. On the other end, I repurposed an old attic vent fan. Using some plywood and cardboard, I made a temporary air-tunnel and vent-door to the outside that "mated" with my garage door so that I could keep the overspray dust outside, and not just circulating in my garage.

I could have just opened the garage door, but by making a fairly tight seal to the outside at the exhaust end, I could control the incoming air temperature and humidity better by pulling air-conditioned air into the booth from the rest of the garage (or, during winter, heated air).

The first frame I painted was in the winter and I let it cure with heat running and forced into the booth. That curing environment was pretty warm, around 90-95 deg, but nothing compared to the pros and their infra-red curing systems.

The next frame was done in the summer (August) so temperature wasn't an issue, just our Delaware humidity. So I ran the AC in the garage the whole time.

I bought a cheap thermometer/humidistat at Harbor Freight to keep an eye on temp and humidity.

[yoshirider]

Thanks for all the replies. I think my husband is going to try vinyl since it's more economical and he can remove it if he doesn't like it anymore. I contacted a local car wrap shop and I'm waiting to hear back from them.

[CampyorBust]

Sure.

I built a temporary (although its been up almost a year now) spray booth inside my garage. I used 2x4s and 2x2s with transparent plastic sheeting. On one end I have a hole about 2x3 that I covered with a few layers of cheap home central air filters. On the other end, I repurposed an old attic vent fan. Using some plywood and cardboard, I made a temporary air-tunnel and vent-door to the outside that "mated" with my garage door so that I could keep the overspray dust outside, and not just circulating in my garage.

I could have just opened the garage door, but by making a fairly tight seal to the outside at the exhaust end, I could control the incoming air temperature and humidity better by pulling air-conditioned air into the booth from the rest of the garage (or, during winter, heated air).

The first frame I painted was in the winter and I let it cure with heat running and forced into the booth. That curing environment was pretty warm, around 90-95 deg, but nothing compared to the pros and their infra-red curing systems.

The next frame was done in the summer (August) so temperature wasn't an issue, just our Delaware humidity. So I ran the AC in the garage the whole time.

I bought a cheap thermometer/humidistat at Harbor Freight to keep an eye on temp and humidity.

That is a sweet DYI set up. There is something to be said about doing something yourself.

I will have to try the rattle can with wet sanding sometime, I just seriously dislike sanding tight spots. I have painted some cheep bike parts with decent results but never a frame. I want to try some fades and lug lining. I値l have to ask them about the paint and primer. The car panel they will be painting is aluminum, and my frame is going to be steel either with chrome or just straight steel.

Perhaps a question for another thread, but ill ask it here What I would like to see (in my dreams) is a cromovelato effect. If you painted scuffed chrome could this look be achieved or do you need perfect chrome all over?

[54ny77]

that bike must've been quite the tickler.

http://www.parkeology.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/moon_river-fletch.jpeg

Stealth is awesome! You should have seen how garish this was before Allan Wanta removed all the paint.

http://forums.thepaceline.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=1697908830&stc=1&d=1445285654

[54ny77]

p.s. $600? That's cheap if it's a good pro job. A dumb painter who doesn't know what they're doing could ruin your bike in less than 30 seconds.

[Doug Fattic]

I read Paceline a lot but seldom have time to post. I'm a pro painter that has done thousands of frames in 40 years. Mostly I teach framebuilding classes now (an outgrowth of being a high school teacher) but I still squeeze in an occasional paint job when time allows. And sometimes students have time to paint the frames they made at the end of a 3 week class (by painting I mean I spray and they do the prep). I have probably around $20,000 in painting equipment and estimate I can only do 1 or 2 paint jobs a week depending on their complexity. When I average the cost of just paint alone I buy a year and divide that by the number of jobs I do, it comes out to be something like $150 a frame. That doesn't include shop overhead which is also a significant cost.

My students are always startled at how much work goes into a show quality paint job. Just the outline of the steps required takes a whole page of single spaced typing. The written descriptions takes 3 pages. I'm a bit lazy tonight to retype it all on this post but the short version is: prep frame, chemical wipe, 2 coats of primer, sand, sealer coats, color coats, clear coats, sand, decals, multiple clears over decals, sand some more, final clears, rub it all out. Those multiple coats have to be applied within certain time windows for maximum adhesion. That means I can't start just any time I want. It gets a lot more complicated with more colors. In fact I could probably paint 3 single color frames in the time it takes me to put on a 2nd color. Really it shouldn't be called painting but rather sanding. I estimate only 10% to 20% of the time it takes to paint a frame is spent actually spraying in the booth. Another thing students find interesting is that it takes more skill to paint than braze or file making a frame. They often say what impresses them the most watching me demonstrate making a frame is when I spray on the final clear coats.

So to review, it takes a lot of expensive equipment and materials as well as substantial time and skill to do it right. It is absolutely amazing a decent multi color paint job is so cheap and not that it is so expensive.

Doug Fattic
Niles, Michigan

[AngryScientist]

THanks for the response Stefan, sounds like a good set-up.

having dabbled with painting in the past (i painted a car a had and loved once, with a similar DIY booth, came out "OK"), i absolutely agree with Doug, in that it takes more skill to get a pro paint job on a frame than to build a frame. the devil is in the details, indeed with painting!

good thread!

[Lovic]

The Ol adage on this one probably rings true, you get what you pay for!!!

I just paid $150.00 for a basic powder coat of a utility bike.

Take into consideration the time, prep, and professionalism that will go into a carbon frame and I think you'll be happy with what you spend your money on.