My Past and Present Serotta(s) (Warning: Long post)

[weisan]

My connection with this forum started back in the Serotta days. I was not in tune with the Serotta brand and its history as a whole when I first started but I consider myself VERY VERY lucky to have owned and ridden several along the way, both past and present.

It was sometime in early 2003 that I bought my first used Serotta or I should say Serottas, because I was so intrigued by the brand that I bought two in quick succession. ;)

There's actually a backstory. The funds that I used to purchase my first serottas came from the money that the insurance company had paid out to replace what I would consider my first purchase of a high-zoot bike off eBay, a KHS Flite, that got stolen outside my garage less than two weeks after I bought it. :o

It was a blessing in disguise, of course, on hindsight.
The KHS was a ill-fitting bike for me. The picture shown is me trying to set it up to mimic the pros in the peloton. Bad idea! :help:

KHS Flite
http://alicehui.com/serotta/history/khs_flite1.jpg

My very first Serottas....Serotta TG (53cm)
http://alicehui.com/serotta/history/serotta30.jpg

And....a Serotta C4Ti 54cm
http://alicehui.com/serotta/history/serotta_bike.jpg

I got rid of the TG after a year or so, kept the Serotta Ti and soon after bought, in my opinion, not only the best-looking Serotta of the lot but probably the best value, a lugged steel Atlanta 53cm.
http://alicehui.com/serotta/history/1.jpg

I only built it up once and rode a couple of rides before stripping it down and left it as a frame. In fact, I appreciated it more as a wall art than a bike. One day I finally gave in and decided that this bike deserved to be ridden...so I sold it and left with just the Serotta Ti.

Probably less than a year passed before I got the serotta itch again...and this time, I landed myself on the "Unicorn" in the Serotta family: a Hors Categorie. I really wanted to give it a try after hearing so much from others and Dave Kirk about the unique ride qualities of the DKS. Here in this picture, coupled with the Topolino wheelset, it rides like a dream.
http://alicehui.com/serotta/history/hors_cat_no_topos.jpg

After a relatively short period of time, I sold the Hors as well but kept the Legend Ti. :rolleyes:

[weisan]

Several years passed....I had several other branded bikes (Cannondale, Ritchey Logic, LOOK, Lemond, etc) that came and went also. I was experiencing great discomfort riding a bike, my back was bothering me...It came to a head finally when I decided I need to go up to Boulder and pay a visit with Andy Pruitt. Dr. Pruitt prescribed me with a fit (http://cyclingtips.com.au/2012/10/a-chat-with-andy-pruitt/http://cyclingtips.com.au/2012/10/a-chat-with-andy-pruitt/) that I can only describe as "what-the-____?!" It was so drastically different than where I started, I dare not post a picture of the new fit on the forum for fear of ridicule.
http://cdn.velonews.competitor.com/files/2011/03/Pruitt-Riis-Jens-632x421.jpg
Andy Pruitt (center) working with Jens Voigt on a bike fit. Saxo Bank director Bjarne Riis is on the left.
http://cdn.velonews.competitor.com/files/2012/11/040_VeloFeb1-369x440.jpghttp://cdn.20m.es/img/2010/01/20/1038455.jpg
http://www.alicehui.com/pics/pruitt_scan.jpg
But lo and behold, Andy was RIGHT! With the new fit numbers, I could ride pain free again, that was the turning point. But there's a price. When I transferred those numbers over to my Legend Ti, I knew it was a compromise; it changes the weight distribution and the way the bike handles. I was not 100% happy and was tempted to go the custom route but the cost was prohibitive...which is a funny thing to say because after all the money I have spent on buying and changing bikes over the years, playing the musical chair, I could have easily paid for a full custom from reputable builders like Tom Kellogg or David Kirk, which are two of my top choices today if I were to have someone build a custom bike.

Then, came along Paul Taylor...yup...the Aussie framebuilder who made an offer that I could not resist. :cool: Actually come to think of it, I have Thwart-pal to thank. :fight:
He posted this (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=69095&highlight=paul+taylor) on the forum which alerted me to Paul's outrageous offer to build a custom bike with fancy paint, fancy lugs, whatever you want...get this...for $1,300.

Being a cheapskate, I jumped at the opportunity to have Paul built me my first and only custom. (Order form (http://www.alicehui.com/Taylor/order_weisan.htm))
As quite a number (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=106589&highlight=paul+taylor)of us know, Paul's got "issues (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=104346&highlight=Taylor)". :no:
That's all I'm gonna say to that. But to be fair and honest, Paul built me a killer bike, I was more than pleased with the end results. ....I say killer because it rode so well that it practically killed my lust for bike n+1 BUT more importantly, it made me finally sold my LEGEND Ti....NO!!!!! :crap: Yes, indeed, that was the last Serotta in my stable. :o

http://alicehui.com/pics/Taylor/img/taylor5.jpg

[weisan]

Soon after I got the Taylor, we moved overseas.

http://alicehui.com/AUS/pics/mini-P1110985.JPG
http://alicehui.com/AUS/pics/mini-P1120200.JPG
In order to make space for luggage, I sold everything I had (bike-wise) and brought only the Taylor with me. It remained my sole ride for almost 4+ years, which was perfectly fine, as it was built as a "DO-ANYTHING-AND EVERYTHING" kinda bike. I can use it as regular road bike or I can slap a set of 35mm tires on it anytime and turned it into a gravel bike that I have used in Katy Trail and D2R2. It even comes with the Ritchey breakaway couplings for easy travel.

http://alicehui.com/pic/bike/mini-taylor_cross.jpg
http://forums.thepaceline.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=1697866312&stc=1&d=1377560819
http://alicehui.com/pic/d2r2_2013/DSCN2607.JPG
http://alicehui.com/pics/katy/img/35.jpg
After we moved back to the US two years ago, and we have a garage again, I got sick.....I was infected by the N+1 disease, which I was told have no real cure and so...I caved and bought first a Waterford, then a Surly, after that a Merlin, and then a LOOK 585 which I sold recently to a forum pal (again, fit issue) ...until two weeks ago...when this appeared on the classified.

http://forums.thepaceline.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=1697890779&stc=1&d=1416759763

Triathlon, time trials, and even the color (yellow) are really not my "thing" :rolleyes: but what really caught my eye were these magic numbers...


Serotta CXII
62 st c-t
54 tt c-c
19 ht
74 degree seat tube
72 degree head tube


Ding, ding, ding...we have a WINNER here!

Those were like the exact same fit numbers that Andy gave me several years ago...no, he wasn't trying to set me up for Ironman or the Crono.
And it's a S-E-R-O-T-T-A!!!
Unbelievable!

I wasn't sure at first...so I found this bike comparator spreadsheet (http://alicehui.com/bike/bike-comparator.xls) and played around with it, it was almost an exact match, that's interesting....

And then, I overlaid my Taylor over it:
http://alicehui.com/bike/combo2.jpg

GOAL!

Like they say, the rest is history.
http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/cxii.jpg
If you are still tracking with me, thanks for reading this far...
Not only did I acquire a Serotta back into my stable but I found one that actually meets my crazy fit criteria...what are the odds?

I took it out for its first shakedown group ride on Saturday, got home, made a couple more tweaks, I think this is a keeper....of course I say that everytime.

What I found interesting is how I have come full circle...now I am a proud owner of a Serotta again!

[weisan]

More closeups...

I dunno why, for every Serotta that I have owned, the world champion stripes, 1972 stickers is by far my favorite part of the frame...hmmm :rolleyes:
http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/cx8.jpg

http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/cx2.jpg

http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/cx5.jpg

http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/cx3.jpg

http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/cx7.jpg

http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/cx.jpg

[etu]

Nice story weisan pal!
Good looking bikes and your position looks pretty good too me.
Is the yellow frame aluminum, seems like there is a resurgence recently.

[thwart]

Then, came along Paul Taylor...yup...the Aussie framebuilder who made an offer that I could not resist. :cool: Actually come to think of it, I have Thwart-pal to thank. :fight:
He posted this (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=69095&highlight=paul+taylor) on the forum which alerted me to Paul's outrageous offer to build a custom bike with fancy paint, fancy lugs, whatever you want...get this...for $1,300.

Ahhrrg... a post I'd rather have back, now 5 yrs later.

At least it worked out well for you, Weisan-pal.

I think I remember Pete cautioning folks about this 'deal' back then. What, frame builders promise but don't deliver... ? Once again, the voice of wisdom.

Love your new bike, especially the color. I see a budding triathlete soon... ;)

[MePaleo]

Awesome find... love the journey!

[paredown]

I've always been a sucker for a good love story!

Funny, I have yet to bite--but just tonight I spotted this econo Serotta CDA that RebelBiker has for sale:
http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=164572

Not that I need it, but I am tempted....

[Tony]

I enjoyed reading this journey of yours Weisan pal
Thanks for sharing!

[jlwdm]

Nice history of your bikes and especially the Serottas. My first custom, a Serottas, got me to this forum. I was very naive when I joined the Serotta Forum as I thought I only needed one bike. But I have learned that one bike is not enough. I bought another frame last week and now I have to figure out what to do with it.

I hope the new Serotta works out for you as well as the Taylor has.

Jeff

[weisan]

@etu pal: No, it's not alum but according to Serotta's official product info it's called Aero Columbus Niobium tubeset, in other words, highly manipulated aerodynamic tube shapes made out of steel.

Here's the glamorous marketing piece:

"Slice through the wind and cheat the clock on the slippery CXII. Built of Columbus Aero Niobium, the most advanced steel available, Serotta's CXII is an efficient and comfortable time-trail and tri rig designed to put you on the podium. Every one is built for a custom fit and ultra-efficient and aerodynamic ride to ensure top speed and slash time on your next event so you'll set new records and achieve all your goals.

Serotta's CXII is custom built to your specifications!

@thwart pal: Don't be too hard on yourself. It's one of those things that are out of your control. We are responsible for our own actions ultimately.
No way! You won't catch me doing tri with my pants down...I hate running and swimming unless I am trying to cross the Mekong River and flee from pursuing soldiers...

@MePaleo, @Tony : Thanks for reading!

@paredown pal: if it fits...by all means.

@jlwdm: I won't necessarily consider it "naive" - it's like a gourmet chef having different knives in the kitchen for different things - same with bikes! :D
What did you get?


Thanks again guys for wading through my mumbo jumbo....

[Peter P.]

I enjoyed reading your bike buying history.

The pic of you climbing a dirt road on D2R2 shows good position on the Taylor-nice, flat back and angle while on the hoods.

[Ray]

Weisan,

I remember a lot of discussions when you were working out the details on your Taylor. I remember being concerned, given all of the "issues" that were being written about with his business, but I'm really glad you ended up having an OK experience and a great bike out of it. My experience with a Spectrum was the same - killed gear lust for a long time. So far, forever! And finding a Serotta with nearly identical specs, very cool! I hope you enjoy them both.

-Ray

[dustyrider]

What a great "little" bio.! Universally speaking: if you go straight long enough, you end up where you were.

[thegunner]

it's always fun doing an audit of your bike history :) i'm glad you took pictures of them all haha

[douglas]

Great story--thanks for posting it. I don't know the back story on the Paul Taylor but it's a beautiful bike. Glad you found the Serotta. Wishing you many happy miles on both of them.

[fuzzalow]

A wonderful cycling life tale told not of epic melodrama but as a gradual unfolding. The journey is the reward. Way to go weisan-pal.

[deechee]

Thanks for the story, it was fun to read. Its great that you have all these photos of your bikes. I don't think I do.

Its great the CXII is working out for you. Similar to you, I wasn't looking for one, but one popped up on the slowtwitch classifieds with the exact geometry I was looking for. I bought it and raced it for a few years, but gave it to a friend's wife when she got into triathlon as I stopped. Sadly I think its collecting dust now; I almost want to ask for it back even though I have a P2C for tri again... :P

[Seramount]

cool story, bro!

seriously.

[Tickdoc]

yeah, this is a really epic post.

This is the star wars of posts, IMO.

I love the way your story unfolds and the bikes and positions change to adapt and then comes full circle.

I can't wait for episode 7.

[rugbysecondrow]

Ahhrrg... a post I'd rather have back, now 5 yrs later.

At least it worked out well for you, Weisan-pal.

I think I remember Pete cautioning folks about this 'deal' back then. What, frame builders promise but don't deliver... ? Once again, the voice of wisdom.

Love your new bike, especially the color. I see a budding triathlete soon... ;)

Yeah...I bit on that one.



Cool chronology to read and see.

[572cv]

A fine story, Weisan-pal. Coming back around to a Serotta is a wonderful thing. They are still terrific bikes!

[juanj]

Weisan, I keep coming back to your new fit dimensions--if I got on your Taylor I could easily reach the handlebars but would have no hope of touching the pedals!

[weisan]

...I could easily reach the handlebars but would have no hope of touching the pedals!

juan pal, what if I let you sit on my lap...? :rolleyes:

[juanj]

juan pal, what if I let you sit on my lap...? :rolleyes:

Then I would reach neither the handlebars nor the pedals!

[Elefantino]

Serotta is a funny brand. The loyalty it inspires, or at least the quirky nature of that loyalty, is unlike any other even in this post-Ben manufacturing world.

I keep coming back to it, too. In order:

2001: Atlanta #1
2003: CSI #1
2007: Concours
2009: LaCorsa
2012: Atlanta #2
2013: Atlanta #3
2013: CIII (wife's)
2015: Fierte IT
2015: CSI #2


I believe the word is addict.

[93legendti]

Great story. That Atlanta looks like one I bought here (From Bill Bove?) and sold to someone here...maybe I sold it to you? Mine had a blue Serotta steel fork I bought from MaryAnne.

[cmbicycles]

Glad the bike is being enjoyed, even if you don't care for the color :banana:

[ANAO]

Several years passed....I had several other branded bikes (Cannondale, Ritchey Logic, LOOK, Lemond, etc) that came and went also. I was experiencing great discomfort riding a bike, my back was bothering me...It came to a head finally when I decided I need to go up to Boulder and pay a visit with Andy Pruitt. Dr. Pruitt prescribed me with a fit (http://cyclingtips.com.au/2012/10/a-chat-with-andy-pruitt/http://cyclingtips.com.au/2012/10/a-chat-with-andy-pruitt/) that I can only describe as "what-the-____?!" It was so drastically different than where I started, I dare not post a picture of the new fit on the forum for fear of ridicule.
http://cdn.velonews.competitor.com/files/2011/03/Pruitt-Riis-Jens-632x421.jpg
Andy Pruitt (center) working with Jens Voigt on a bike fit. Saxo Bank director Bjarne Riis is on the left.
http://cdn.velonews.competitor.com/files/2012/11/040_VeloFeb1-369x440.jpghttp://cdn.20m.es/img/2010/01/20/1038455.jpg
http://www.alicehui.com/pics/pruitt_scan.jpg
But lo and behold, Andy was RIGHT! With the new fit numbers, I could ride pain free again, that was the turning point. But there's a price. When I transferred those numbers over to my Legend Ti, I knew it was a compromise; it changes the weight distribution and the way the bike handles. I was not 100% happy and was tempted to go the custom route but the cost was prohibitive...which is a funny thing to say because after all the money I have spent on buying and changing bikes over the years, playing the musical chair, I could have easily paid for a full custom from reputable builders like Tom Kellogg or David Kirk, which are two of my top choices today if I were to have someone build a custom bike.

Then, came along Paul Taylor...yup...the Aussie framebuilder who made an offer that I could not resist. :cool: Actually come to think of it, I have Thwart-pal to thank. :fight:
He posted this (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=69095&highlight=paul+taylor) on the forum which alerted me to Paul's outrageous offer to build a custom bike with fancy paint, fancy lugs, whatever you want...get this...for $1,300.

Being a cheapskate, I jumped at the opportunity to have Paul built me my first and only custom. (Order form (http://www.alicehui.com/Taylor/order_weisan.htm))
As quite a number (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=106589&highlight=paul+taylor)of us know, Paul's got "issues (http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?t=104346&highlight=Taylor)". :no:
That's all I'm gonna say to that. But to be fair and honest, Paul built me a killer bike, I was more than pleased with the end results. ....I say killer because it rode so well that it practically killed my lust for bike n+1 BUT more importantly, it made me finally sold my LEGEND Ti....NO!!!!! :crap: Yes, indeed, that was the last Serotta in my stable. :o

http://alicehui.com/pics/Taylor/img/taylor5.jpg

How was your saddle almost 4cm too low without you realizing it!

[weisan]

How was your saddle almost 4cm too low without you realizing it!

I dunno...for the longest time, it seems right to me. Call me a dork. :D

http://www.gifbin.com/bin/012013/1359571005_riding_tiny_bike.gif

[weisan]

I don't know whether it's pure dumb luck or the people who designed and built the Serotta are simply genius...I think it's a bit of both. :D

You know how folks would give up a limb or sell their mother just to be able to squeeze in that extra millimeters of 28mm tires through their forks or chainstays....:p

Well, guess what...it's raining like cats and dogs over here and I am bored so I took off the wheelset mounted with Compass 32mm tires off my gravel bike and tried them on the CXII...and it fits! I mean the front is a bit tight even though the wheel is spinning nicely without obstruction but I am not so sure if I am perfectly comfortable riding with that little clearance between the tires and the fork blades.
The rear...no problem at all.


I guess I probably won't use 32mm on my regular road bike but it's comforting to know if there's ever a need or an emergency while on vacation, It can accommodate up to 32mm and allow me to ride back to my little clubby house. :hello:

Obviously, my taylor was built from ground up to accommodate up to 35mm, so there was never a problem there.

The Front:
http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/DSCN5328_1000x.jpg


The Rear:

http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/DSCN5335_1000x.jpg

http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/DSCN5334_1000x.jpg

http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/DSCN5337_1000x.jpg

[ANAO]

Front looks WAY close.

I'd ride the rear like that though :)

[tiretrax]

Great story, Wei-pal. I'm feeling the love for Serotta again and going to look at one this weekend.

That front tire might fit on the stand, but it is likely that it will rub when you're riding it. I've experienced that twice before.

Rainy in D, too. Strange weather this year.

[benb]

Yah this is a great story... you've got to be ALL leg, your saddle height is crazy high for a 54TT!

I have kind of the same story my saddle height is just shy of 79cm and I really fit best on a stock bike with a 56TT.

I think it is VERY common for folks like us to end up at a position with the seat too low when we first start out. It makes it a heck of a lot easier to get on a stock bike and have it fit. I want to say my seat got raised about 4cm when I got my first comprehensive fitting. Later fits they tried to raise it another 2-3cm which was way too high, I ended up putting it back down with my more recent fits.

At the correct seat height I need a "tall" bike with a 56-57cm ETT depending on Seat tube angle. If I lower the seat I can fit on the bike that isn't that tall.

At my height 58-59cm size bikes were always recommended to me to get the bars up reasonably high but that makes the reach too far. I even ended up on a custom Serotta that was way too long for me. I certainly wasn't ready to be ordering a custom and there were several fitters who didn't know what to do with me and basically encouraged me to end up with the ill-fitting custom bike. (The custom bike got the back end of the bike right and raised the height of the frame appropriately but didn't shorten the reach.)

I'd love to have the money for a custom these days now that I understand what is going on with my dimensions. I'd end up with ~59cm seat tube with 72.5STA, 56.5-57 ETT and something like a 72.5-73 HTA with maybe a 20cm HT? (That's the tricky part.) That'd probably let me run a -7 X 100-110mm stem at somewhere between 5-7cm of drop with minimal spacers. It was sad to let my Serotta go but it didn't fit right and if I ended up in a position to get another bike I'd have loved to have been able to order a new one.

You're lucky you saw a really good fitting team.. lots of fitters would probably have screwed you up even more.

[rounder]

Good story Weisan.

I first came here (serotta forum) when I bought a serotta CIII frame off ebay and was trying to figure what to do with it (never bought anything off ebay before). I already had a serotta nhx that I bought new years before and the geometry looked similar. The bike turned out great. Loved the serotta forum and checked in daily just to see what was going on.

Later went to NAHBS in Richmond and met K. Bedford. Ended up buying two bikes. I know they are not serottas, Kelly is great on his own. But feel like they are, somehow, still in the serotta family and love that about them.

[AngryScientist]

how did i miss this post the first time around? Cool photo-dramatic history!

i remember seeing your taylor and admiring it at D2, very cool and versatile bike, but i'm glad you found a Serotta that works for you again. the [real] big "S" is ultimately what ties us all together on this forum!

cheers!

[txcid05]

Awesome post. I just bought a Serotta Pronto off of a fellow forum member and and slowly acquiring parts to build it up. I'm kinda cheap and lookin' for deals..haha.

I am excited as heck to get it all built up to ride, it's a beautiful frame to look at thats for sure! :banana:

[weisan]

Having gone through several bikes and an iterative process, if someone asked the question: "What makes a killer bike?" I know what my answer is gonna be...It's a combination of things that I have learned over time and adapted to my style of riding, and applied in the way I set up my bike. Maybe a picture will tell a thousand words....:p
Note that I did not mention "material" of the frame. :D
http://alicehui.com/bike/cx/combo3.jpg