Getting Initiated in the Dark Arts (aka Tubulars)

[etu]

With all the coolaid getting thrown around here about tubulars, I just couldn't resist trying. Today I just finished gluing on my first pair of vittoria tubs to an awesome wheelset built by OP.
Lots of help from youtube videos - Zipp and GCN being primary ones.
I wanted to consult the experienced about a few observations I made.

1) I started by gingerly applying glue to get NO glue in the spoke holes, but after seeing on the videos how thick and quickly the pro mechanics put it on, I got faster/sloppier on the second and third layers. Brushing across the hole didn't seem to put excess glue in them. Is this OK?
2) Getting the tires on was not hard at with the vittorias (understand other brands could be more difficult). I did initially panicked a bit because they didn't seem to be on straight, and my hands were getting sore trying to wiggle the tires on even from the edge of the rim on both side, but inflating the tires seems to straighten them out on their own. At 20 psi, they looked slightly wobbly, but at 150psi, they look great!
3) A point of concern is the area around valve which doesn't seem to be apposed as tightly to the rim. Fully inflated they're better, but will look at them more carefully tomorrow after 24 hours.

Thanks in advance for your continuing advice and encouragement.

[FlashUNC]

1) You'll be fine.

2) Biggest issue will be spinning the wheels to see if the tread is straight, and whether there's a hop in the tire. Not all tubie treads are mounted at the factory dead straight. So you might need to massage it around a bit.

3) Give it a day and see how it is.

[regularguy412]

You'll know you got the valve area glued correctly if there's no hop and, upon every revolution of the tire, there's no 'tick, tick, tick' -- which can be evidence of either not enough (or too much) glue in that area. The pressure of the rider/bike weighing on that glued portion causes the base tape to stick to the rim and then, as the valve area comes up and around, become unstuck (just a little). It's not really unsafe, just really annoying. Also, having the valve stem stick out as close to precisely perpendicular to the rim face is important, as well. Don't let it angle forward or back. This is much easier to accomplish with deep section rims as compared to really light box section rims (like Campy Record Chrono or GEL 280's).

With a little experience, you'll know just how much to apply to YOUR tire brand/rim brand combo so that you get silent running.

MIke in AR:beer:

[Ralph]

150 psi?

[etu]

Zipp video recommends 150 psi - assuming to help bond the tire to the rim nice and tight. Plan on riding it at @90. 700x25 corsa sc.

[11.4]

Cue to a screaming woman's voice in the shower here.

Nobody should be using 150 psi in a tubular. Read more, and in the meantime send the nearest forumite your new wheels so they don't get treated so inappropriately. You can recover them when you can show that you know how to differentiate 105 versus 110 psi in a rear wheel.

The hop is the most insidious issue to deal with when mounting tubulars. You can make a mess of the tubular and the rim, you can both have it off-line and rotated on the rim, but it still rides fine. It's the damned hop that gets you. And the only way to avoid the hop is to apply sufficient tension while mounting (or I should really say "even" tension) so the tire isn't fatter at the valve stem or thinner at the opposite point. Some tires make it very difficult because they are too tight, some are pretty lose and give even more trouble because you have to stretch to begin with to avoid a fat spot, but then you end up with an extra couple inches of tire.

[etu]

:eek:
just ran down to the garage and let some air out.
tires look good the truing stand, no obvious hop
will take it for a short spin tomorrow afternoon once glue is set.

[Jaq]

Don't forget your spare, which is usually an old sew up that's already done its service. But since you're new, you ll have a new one. That's fine. But your spare should have a light coat of glue on the tape enough to make it stick long enough to get home.

If push comes to shove, you can ride on a flat sew up, just not very fast.

Oh and sew ups should be properly rolled and stored under the seat, preferably wrapped in an old racing number.

[oldpotatoe]

Don't forget your spare, which is usually an old sew up that's already done its service. But since you're new, you ll have a new one. That's fine. But your spare should have a light coat of glue on the tape enough to make it stick long enough to get home.

If push comes to shove, you can ride on a flat sew up, just not very fast.

Oh and sew ups should be properly rolled and stored under the seat, preferably wrapped in an old racing number.

And a Binda strap, Campagnolo is a suitable replacement.

[11.4]

And a Binda strap, Campagnolo is a suitable replacement.

Only if you have a Campy tattoo. Campagnolo was a poseur when it came to toe straps -- late to the party and a desecrator of the fine name of Alfredo Binda.

[oldpotatoe]

Only if you have a Campy tattoo. Campagnolo was a poseur when it came to toe straps -- late to the party and a desecrator of the fine name of Alfredo Binda.

Ouch;)

[slinkywizard]

Don't forget your spare, which is usually an old sew up that's already done its service.

Do you guys really carry spares...??? I've ridden tons, including pretty much all the +2000m passes carrying just some EF latex sealant...and never even needed that...but hey, this is Switzerland...excellent roads virtually devoid of débris etc. and excellent public transportation pretty much everywhere. But still, does one still need to carry a spare tubular when one can carry a little container of sealant?

[Jaq]

Sealant's nice, but I've had flats that no amount of goop would fix. Why take a chance when I don't have to?

[oldpotatoe]

Do you guys really carry spares...??? I've ridden tons, including pretty much all the +2000m passes carrying just some EF latex sealant...and never even needed that...but hey, this is Switzerland...excellent roads virtually devoid of d饕ris etc. and excellent public transportation pretty much everywhere. But still, does one still need to carry a spare tubular when one can carry a little container of sealant?

Big enough hole and sealant won't seal. I carry a preglued tubie under the saddle, plus $5 and a wee metal tire lever. I also pre goop my tubies with OrangeSeal. I get very few flats(1 this year).

[slinkywizard]

Sealant's nice, but I've had flats that no amount of goop would fix. Why take a chance when I don't have to?

Big enough hole and sealant won't seal. I carry a preglued tubie under the saddle, plus $5 and a wee metal tire lever. I also pre goop my tubies with OrangeSeal. I get very few flats(1 this year).

I guess it does make sense as insurance policy. But riding the roads we have here, I'd be hard pressed to get an unsealable hole. There just seems to be no glass, thorns, wire or whatever on the road...ever...I used to live on the east coast (Boston) for a couple of years and there I completely get the rationale. Nevertheless, I'll probably start carrying a spare under the saddle, either in a bag or using a strap. I used to ride tubulars on my mtb as well here, but that just made me uneasy; the bulk of a spare tire is kind of prohibitive to carrying one in that scenario. I sometimes just think that the necessity of carrying a spare contributes to the perception of riding tubulars being a "dark art"...

Riding a set of nucleon clinchers (that came on a colnago I picked up for my better half) on my Seven while my LW Gen III's are out for servicing has kind of puzzled me though: the come suspiciously close to the ride quality of the neutron/veloflex combo I have on my other bike...kind of demystifying almost...

[rwsaunders]

Sealant's nice, but I've had flats that no amount of goop would fix. Why take a chance when I don't have to?

+1 and on occasion I've been too far out to make the "call of shame" as well.

[Ralph]

Back when I rode tubulars (for about 30 years), and wanted that cool euro look, just used a Campy or equivalent toe strap to hold tire under seat. Then one day, had a flat, and noticed the toe strap had worn a hole in side of spare tubular, so after that, put tubular in old folded up sock with C02 and toe strap, etc. Look not so cool, but worked better. BTW....I know it's warm here in Florida usually, and glue probably stays tacky better, but I never put new glue on spare tubular. There was always enough on rim to always get me home safely. Don't recall ever having a problem with spare coming off. Did reglue another tire when got home. Installing tubulars not rocket science, don't over think it.

[Neil]

I have a few of those Arundel tubi bags, ideal size for a pre-glued tub, or a couple of inner tubes and a patch kit.

Keeps everything nice and clean, and swaps between bikes easily.

[SlackMan]

Several years ago, I went riding on tubulars that I had mounted, a.k.a., "hopping." Despite very sore thumbs and a large helping of swear words under my breath, I never could get them mounted correctly so as not to hop. You've inspired me to think about trying them again....maybe.