Eddy Merckx cable routing issue.

[frankiefrijoles]

Some numb nut previous owner cut the housing into the internal routing brazeon . My question is does this act only as a cable stop or does the housing run through the entire frame. Just gauging the amount of work. I've seen most Merckx that are just stops but was wondering if anyone had any advice. I've already put some work into it and it doesn't wanna budge.

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/11/4637123a421fe1193cb4b93afe236afd.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/11/cc8678976d609bf675a1510d1cf7090b.jpg


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[R3awak3n]

my corsa 01 ran through the whole tube, I would assume this one does too.

[seanile]

use some needle nose pliers and pull that nub out. only the cable goes through a thin brass tube in my corsa extra, so, just a stop in my experience.
like this: http://www.cycle-frames.com/bicycle-frame-tubing/INNER-GUIDE-SET-WITH-BRASS-INTERNAL-TOP-TUBE-AND-FERRULES.html

try to get a ferrule like this to go with it:
http://brimages.bikeboardmedia.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Shimano-Dura-Ace-9000-shift-cable-installation04-600x398.jpg

[lhuerta]

...Merckx frames with internal top tube routing were produced with internal sleeve/tube and w/out. My 10th Anniversary frame (exactly like yours) does not have the internal sleeve. Just

Just curious, what does the other end look like....is there cable stuck on the other end as well? If not, then you can slide a spoke, with slightly bent tip, into the braze on and check whether there is a sleeve or not. If there is a sleeve then find a long and thick wire and insert at clear end (hoping it is clear) and maybe you can push the bungled wire through the other hole, or at least more strands so that you can get more purchase with your needle nose pliers. If there is no sleeve then things get tricky ...let me think on possible solution for that scenario.

[oldpotatoe]

Some use the housing thru the whole way, some just the cable. If it's the housing the whole way, I don't think a 5mm ferrule would fit into the hole unless it's a 25% or 50% step ferrule. Can you pull the remnants out? .

[frankiefrijoles]

The other end also showing cable. Unable to really budge either side.


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[velomateo]

Sorry about your situation. I dealt with the same scenario on a Masi last year. The bike had been used for a long time on a trainer, and the riders sweat corroded the cable so badly that it swelled and became totally stuck. I worked on it off and on for about six months.
I tried using Kroll oil. I closed off one end, filled the tube - and let it soak. Thick black crud flowed out the bottom end every time, but the cable never loosened up enough to remove it. I'm not predicting a happy ending for you, but I really hope you can save it. Good luck.


PS. One thing I did was cover the top tube with heavy tape while I was working on it. It kept scratches to a minimum.

[frankiefrijoles]

This frame is great but already imperfect. It's gonna be a basket bike so in the end I may just run full length housing and say screw it. Thanks for insight anyhow


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[jmoore]

If you are keeping the frame long term, I'd drill that thing out and run full length housing.

Both my Merckx (MXL and Strada OS) have full length housing and no issues.

[frankiefrijoles]

If you are keeping the frame long term, I'd drill that thing out and run full length housing.



Both my Merckx (MXL and Strada OS) have full length housing and no issues.


Drill it out? How do I manage that?


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[frankiefrijoles]

The issue is if there is housing running the full length of that tube there is not enough on the end for me to grip and is possibly really really stuck. So do I attempt to punch it out with a long piece of metal?


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[oldpotatoe]

If you are keeping the frame long term, I'd drill that thing out and run full length housing.

Both my Merckx (MXL and Strada OS) have full length housing and no issues.

If there is a tube in there for just the cable and stops at the ends, that won't work unless he could somehow get the tube out. If he left it in there, it would rattle mightily. If ya got the housing through the holes, then filled the tube with foam, that might work.

[buldogge]

How about a MTB brake cable...pull it thru one end, coil it up and put some decent gloves on...or pull it around a pole. Get the cable to move out of one end and then gab the OD from there.

-Mark in St. Louis

[oldpotatoe]

The issue is if there is housing running the full length of that tube there is not enough on the end for me to grip and is possibly really really stuck. So do I attempt to punch it out with a long piece of metal?


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If the housing is rusted in the tube, gonna be tough. Soak it then smack the end with a punch or small brass rod.

[jmoore]

deleted.



didn't think about the internal tube.

[phcollard]

First thing I would do is try to know if that housing goes full length or if it is just top tube cable stops. I would carefuly drill the end of the housing to destruction, but be careful not to go too far if those are cable stops. You don't want to break anything other than the stuck housing.

If you are dealing with cable stops that shouldn't take too much of your time. Just destroy the housing by any means. That will bring you joy.

If the housing goes full length that's a bit more work. I had something stuck right in the middle of the top tube cable route of my Corsa Extra and boy did I sweat to get it out.

I ended up working with a spoke. I filed the threaded end of the spoke so it has a real sharp flat edge, like a micro chisel, and then was able to turn the offender into pieces so I could push them out...

Let is know how you're doing!

[frankiefrijoles]

Lol so I destroy the ends of the housing now, assuming they are just stops, I would inadvertently be destroying the only amount of meat I have to grab onto with my pliers :/


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[frankiefrijoles]

Soaking then attempting punching one side to get more meat. Then the grab. Or maybe try getting cable through. Thanks for all info


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[frankiefrijoles]

Either way I'm very sad about this

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/12/7d3d009c8dac09bd98ee256195c6bb26.jpg


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[phcollard]

Lol so I destroy the ends of the housing now, assuming they are just stops, I would inadvertently be destroying the only amount of meat I have to grab onto with my pliers :/


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Well you said nothing moves and you have nothing to grab onto to start with...

Lol.

[frankiefrijoles]

I have literally 3mm. It's very dear to me


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[Hindmost]

Is there a hole entering the top tube from the seat tube? From the head tube? Large enough to be of service?

Just thinking out loud here.

[zmudshark]

Have you tried to rotate the housing? I'm thinking either an awl jabbed in and twisted, or a low speed drill, just enough to grab the inner housing and twist the whole thing. If the housing twists at both ends, you should be able to get it out (in theory).

[jmoore]

Could you plug one end and blow some compressed air in there enough to loosen things up any? No idea whether this would work. Just thinking out loud.

[Hindmost]

...blow some compressed air in there enough to loosen things up any?

A good (and messy) way to apply penetrating oil if needed.

[frankiefrijoles]

A good (and messy) way to apply penetrating oil if needed.


Will try


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[dlui]

How about using a Dremel with a carbide burr bit to clear out the stop?

[oldpotatoe]

How about using a Dremel with a carbide burr bit to clear out the stop?

Cuz it might be housing full length. I like the idea of getting a cable thru the housing(if full length housing) and tying cable to pole and pulling on frame.

[velomateo]

Have you checked the seat tube and head tube junction for access in to the top tube? Some times there is a small hole there. You could jam a stiff piece of wire in there and try to make contact with either a brazed in tube or a cable housing, assuming that they would sound/feel differently. May give you a better idea of what you're dealing with.
When I was trying to clear my frame with the same issue, I used a very thin welding rod, that I got from the weld shop at work. It was very thin and quite rigid - which allowed me to really get behind it and force it in.
Don't get hasty, this may take a while. Good luck.

[frankiefrijoles]

Trying cable and tree tonight. Will see if I can spot anything through he whole in seat tube.


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[ultraman6970]

From the bikes I've had with internal cable routing, ive seen two versions, ones where you can pass the cable casing in and the ones that you cant pass the cable casing in, hope this is not the case of.. hulk passing the cable casing in a tube that has a smaller diameter...


Did you try using a hair dryer and then try to pull after the area is hot??

If you still can pass a brake cable all the way through, then you can use two needle ferules at each side and live with the bike like that??

There is like a saw thing that is basically a cable, but no idea if cutting that from the inside could help tho.

Good luck with this one, keep us posted please.

http://www.bikeforums.net/bicycle-mechanics/771064-stuck-jammed-internal-toptube-cable-housing.html

[frankiefrijoles]

Been at it all night attempting to get a cable in it. Nothing.

The fact it's der cable is making it much harder. I guess the twisted up cable is covering the inner sheath so I can't get the cable through.


By the amount of wire threads left and the rigidity of them I'm gonna assume the housing runs through

Nothing visible through seat tube or headtube.

:((((


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[frankiefrijoles]

Just took a pretty good photo illustrating the hell im in

I think it actually was a stop and the cable under compression began to slip into the whole.

Hopefully drilling it out solves this problem.

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/13/1e7b32e2f2bbd2aeab05e8d1dd3ef1ef.jpg


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[frankiefrijoles]

Bottom
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/13/3df13b1870db2d0eb9870c2ab73bb366.jpg


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[ultraman6970]

WOW!!!...

Good luck man, hope you can fix it.

[buldogge]

So...There's an INNER cable still in there.

I would try to pull a single strand...and then another...and then another...hopefully.

Alternatively, you're gonna have to turn it into a full cable run by drilling out the stops and fishing the inner tubing out.

-Mark in St. Louis

[oldpotatoe]

So...There's an INNER cable still in there.

I would try to pull a single strand...and then another...and then another...hopefully.

Alternatively, you're gonna have to turn it into a full cable run by drilling out the stops and fishing the inner tubing out.

-Mark in St. Louis

Think so. Getting the tube that's inside the top tube out is going to be a 'challenge', but if you do get it out-then run full length housing.

[jmoore]

I'm mezmerized by this thread!

Please continue to keep us posted.

[velomateo]

That's going to difficult to drill through that wad of cables. It will cause the drill to wander all over and eventually shred the outer cable guide. Now that you've determined that it's just a cable in there - and not a cable housing too, I think that improves your chances of success quite a bit.
Go to welding supply store and look for a slender welding rod. Tell them you want the most rigid rod they have . If you can get some penetrating oil in the tube, and let it soak, I think you can drive that out of there to a point where you can get a good grip on it and pull it completely out.

[Birddog]

Do you know any Urologists? They probably have a tool that would work to get that out of there.

[wildboar]

Maybe a hand crank drill with a tiny bit could snag some of those wires enough to grab them with a hemostat?

[phcollard]

Do you know any Urologists? They probably have a tool that would work to get that out of there.

Post of the day. I'm still laughing :)

[rePhil]

Go to 3:53.......https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWQAYfGxsPE




Do you know any Urologists? They probably have a tool that would work to get that out of there.

[frankiefrijoles]

Think I ate some rust last night cuse ice had stomach issues all day. Needless to say no progress will be made tonight.


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[oldpotatoe]

Go to 3:53.......https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWQAYfGxsPE

Guy looks like Vaughters...

[CampyorBust]

Well this is probably the biggest nightmare I have seen with a vintage frame. You have my sympathy. Even worse than a stuck seat post or stem, in which case PB Blaster often saved my arse. I would suggest trying it here however I fear it wont help much to loosen things up.

If this happened with my Corsa Extra I would be livid. Congrats on not loosing it. Like on my Corsa Extra the cable appears to be in the frame by itself with no housing or liner going all the way through. The cable was rubbing on the metal lip of the braze on cable stop, after sometime and lack of TLC by aforementioned numb nuts (surely a crime on a frame like this) it began to fray. One of the threads snapped and thus began the downward spiral to the cable rats nest nightmare we have here.

Like others have mentioned, if you could just get a hold of and pull out one of the threads that would be a promising start. However with a rats nest or two of metal cable I doubt it will budge. I fear your only solution is to drill out the cable stop. Very very carefully starting with a small drill bit and moving up in diameter until you have drilled out the lip of the cable stop. Pulling the cable out after that should be fairly easily (knock on wood). I think you will be able to bring this beauty back from this sorry state of neglect.

Your bike is yours to do with as you please, nevertheless a Eddy Merckx Corsa Extra basket bike? Surely such a travesty can be averted?

[frankiefrijoles]

Made some progress.

Kinda just went to town on the inner hole with the smallest bit I had and either cleaned out original hole or created a new one. Unsure of which point.

Either way no inner guide for cable so it looks like I'll be fishing for a hole all day tomorrow.

At least I can get some cable through tho now!!


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[jmoore]

Made some progress.

Kinda just went to town on the inner whole with the smallest bit I had and either cleaned out original whole or created a new one. Unsure of which point.

Either way no inner guide for cable so it looks like I'll be fishing for a whole all day tomorrow.

At least I can get some cable through tho now!!


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Progress!

pics please

[Jeff N.]

On my MX Leader, the entire cable/housing routes through. I'm thinking it's the same way with yours, but perhaps not. Good luck getting that rascal out! -Jeff N.

[Hindmost]

So, am I understanding correctly:

At each end is a cable stop where the housing ends.
The cable is routed through the top tube without housing.
There is no internal tube brazed into the top tube.

[frankiefrijoles]

So, am I understanding correctly:



At each end is a cable stop where the housing ends.

The cable is routed through the top tube without housing.

There is no internal tube brazed into the top tube.


Exactly.

The holes where jammed with der cable so pulling that mess out was a no go.

I drilled out all the housing and still couldn't feed any cable through

I then proceeded to actually drill into the hole and on both sides felt a 'give' which I'm hoping was original hole.

There is no internal sleeve guide for cable (unless I've accidentally drilled new holes that bypass the sleev or go through it

Going to be difficult running the cable


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[Hindmost]

So you have the best-case scenario:

Free the cable at both ends. Fish the loose cable out thru the head tube or seat tube.

The frame is back to original.


There are a lot of tricks for fishing a new cable.