1st Flat Stage and the Bikes Have Spoken (spoilers)

[velomonkey]

1st - A Ridley kinda sorta but not really an aero frame

2nd - Venge, Venge, Venge (and to be fair the dude did get caught out 15k with a flat and got back on, but he did have his team there, too)

3rd - A Trek Madone Aero

4th - A Specialized 5minutes of Aero every 40k (and the dude had the largest team in the break) - Hey, buddy, if you took a peddle stroke or 2 more your team mate who slaved himself would have gotten yellow

[Cicli]

Yeah, well, you know, uhhhhhh.

[herb5998]

Sagan was on a Venge....

[chengher87]

I LOVE crosswinds.

[Elefantino]

Apparently the Ettix-QuikStep Venges are only good for 385 meters because they stop pedaling 15 meters from the finish line, royally screwing teammates' Ettix-QuikStep Venges.

[herb5998]

It was odd to see EQS with so many guys royally botch the lead out......


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[velomonkey]

Sagan was on a Venge....

Oh, you're right - gotta make changes, I'm still stuck thinking he is Dale

[bcroslin]

It was odd to see EQS with so many guys royally botch the lead out......


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They have experience with this. They've done it before. :)

Also, as was mentioned when the newer style aero helmets appeared a few years ago, when everyone is riding an aero bike/helmet/skin suit there is no advantage. It's not the arrow. It's the Indian.

[Burnette]

Sorry, no, it wasn't the bikes.
Post race, Cav says that out of the twenty in the break, only ten riders were doing the work at the front while Cav and the rest stayed sheltered out of the wind till the end. Aero means way less in pack team racing.
Cav contest mosts sprints because of his body, not for that stupid handlebar or an aero shaped downtube. You see the same names in sprints because they do the training have the genetics. They would whip you on a ten year old bike.
One more thing since the Tour is on. In future stages, look at the wheels of riders in the breaks. Some will be on deep aero wheels, others will be on shallower rims, the outcome will be determined by the body mind and heart of the winner, wheels be damned. Seen it time and agian.
Aero is a better argument for TTs, once you add riding in a group, aero isn't such a huge factor.
Post race, Greiple says Cav and Sagan started too early, that he timed it right. Greiple is a Pro cyclist, his legs and timing won that race, not his bike.
Did Cancellara loose second place because he didn't have an aero helmet on? No, heart body and mind trump that in group racing.

[MattTuck]

I'd have to watch it again, but I don't think that Cancellara even got out of the saddle for that sprint.

Crazy stage, that's for sure. I love any non-mountain stage where GC gaps happen. This is actual bike racing. Strategy, team tactics, wind, etc. Glad to see GC gaps formed by more than differences in power to weight ratio.

[bcroslin]

Windy stages are always the best. Remember a few years ago when Jens split the peloton in 2 on one of the windy stages? It was amazing to watch one person cause so much carnage by simply dragging everyone over to the side of the road and force them to ride in the wind.

[velomonkey]

Post race, Greiple says Cav and Sagan started too early, that he timed it right. Greiple is a Pro cyclist, his legs and timing won that race, not his bike.


FYI, I know - it's just all the talk about Aero and, well, check out what the man did and Cav getting 4th ;)

[Elefantino]

It was odd to see EQS with so many guys royally botch the lead out......
You need to watch more classics. That team is great at royally effing up.

[Elefantino]

Cvndsh: whny btch.

Someone has to say it, with or without vowels.

[herb5998]

Agreed, they have messed it up badly in the classics. Just figured with Martin, kwiatkowski and Renshaw, they could have set that up better


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[Tharmor]

First thought that came to my mind after they crossed the finish line was that the new venge and Madone had just lost to a more standard tube shape Ridley.

[velomonkey]

First thought that came to my mind after they crossed the finish line was that the new venge and Madone had just lost to a more standard tube shape Ridley.

I like the cut of your jib, sailor. I thought the exact same thing, plus he had not many team mates.

Cav not keeping it up for Tony Martin - whaddddaaaaa Deeeeeiiiiiiiicccckkkkk. Bet dinner is gonna be kinda odd at the Quickstep team.

[oldpotatoe]

I like the cut of your jib, sailor. I thought the exact same thing, plus he had not many team mates.

Cav not keeping it up for Tony Martin - whaddddaaaaa Deeeeeiiiiiiiicccckkkkk. Bet dinner is gonna be kinda odd at the Quickstep team.

Bet it is a lot.

[Burnette]

Wow, Tony Martin surely did his pulls today in the break. He has turned himself inside out many times for the team. His pacing for a team mate in last years tour (that team mate couldn't pull it out the stage win in the end) was a tremendous show of power from Tony, just awesome legs.
According to the announcers it looked like Cav sat up early, Cav says he didn't. Looked to me like he did too.
From Cav, post race from cycling news:
"Look at this photo," Cavendish stated pointedly on Twitter, posting a shot of the sprint finish. "If I could hang on for third, I could hang on for the win... Some imbeciles think cycling is a computer game. Problem is, social media & TV are platforms for them to be heard. Gutted for Tony Martin. Congratulations Andre Greipel."
Were is a video of the finish to look at again?

[ginsued]

1st - A Ridley kinda sorta but not really an aero frame

2nd - Venge, Venge, Venge (and to be fair the dude did get caught out 15k with a flat and got back on, but he did have his team there, too)

3rd - A Trek Madone Aero

4th - A Specialized 5minutes of Aero every 40k (and the dude had the largest team in the break) - Hey, buddy, if you took a peddle stroke or 2 more your team mate who slaved himself would have gotten yellow

Pretty sure Cancellara was still riding his traditional Domane and not a new Madone.

[velomonkey]

Pretty sure Cancellara was still riding his traditional Domane and not a new Madone.

Was he? Maybe? Possibly. Here is what I saw: non aero winning (look at that damn front exposed caliper- and Deda 35mm are you kidding!!!!!!) - loser - loser with raised bars.

Both 2nd or and 3rd place losers had 'aero' bikes that are supposed to get someone/anyone 5 minutes over 40k.

[ginsued]

Was he? Maybe? Possibly. Here is what I saw: non aero winning (look at that damn front exposed caliper- and Deda 35mm are you kidding!!!!!!) - loser - loser with raised bars.

Both 2nd or and 3rd place losers had 'aero' bikes that are supposed to get someone/anyone 5 minutes over 40k.

Ya.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/fabian-cancellaras-tour-de-france-trek-domane

[Spdntrxi]

Fabio was on his domane

[r_mutt]

aero means nothing. just look at all those track sprinters and their disregard for aero equipment. :confused:

if someone told me i could lower my CDA with a change in frame shape and i was a competitive sprinter who's contract size was directly proportional to win rate i'd change to the aero frame in a heartbeat.

here's a question - in a hypothetical race, the same rider was cloned and got the same nutrition and rest and was essentially the same exact rider. after riding for 4 hours in the bunch they both launch for the line with 200 meters to go. 1 rider has an aero frame, wheels, helmet, skinsuit and the other doesn't. who wins?

Was he? Maybe? Possibly. Here is what I saw: non aero winning (look at that damn front exposed caliper- and Deda 35mm are you kidding!!!!!!) - loser - loser with raised bars.

Both 2nd or and 3rd place losers had 'aero' bikes that are supposed to get someone/anyone 5 minutes over 40k.

btw - Greipel was on a Ridley Noah- their aero frame.

[rustychisel]

... 1 rider has an aero frame, wheels, helmet, skinsuit and the other doesn't. who wins?



btw - Greipel was on a Ridley Noah- their aero frame.


Well, there's your answer, obviously. :bike:

It has nothing to do with the fact that Greipel is bigger, more muscled, better able to withstand the wind, and knows how to win (9 wins this year, I believe, counting yesterday) and Cavendish was clearly not at peak.

It doesn't happen, but I believe in a straight line drag the winner would always be Kittel or Greipel, everyone else would just be there for the ride*.

* if the teams didn't play a part, without leadout trains, Kittel not at the TDF notwithstanding, and all riders being on form.

[weisan]

Snipped:
>I believe in a straight line drag the winner would always be Kittel or Greipel,

Well, if it's a drag-out race with tongues waggin'...it would be Kristoff.

[oldpotatoe]

Was he? Maybe? Possibly. Here is what I saw: non aero winning (look at that damn front exposed caliper- and Deda 35mm are you kidding!!!!!!) - loser - loser with raised bars.

Both 2nd or and 3rd place losers had 'aero' bikes that are supposed to get someone/anyone 5 minutes over 40k.

Wonder how many frames 'the Gorilla' goes thru in a year?

[Davist]

Isn't it kinda funny, that if you read the ad copy only the highest level racers would see the difference, then the highest level racers run what they're told and win / lose regardless?

[Gummee]

Since he doesn't pay for em, I doubt he cares.

Me on the other hand...

M

[Climb01742]

Greipel's quads are the least aero thing out there.;):):rolleyes: He is a beast.

[r_mutt]

It has nothing to do with the fact that Greipel is bigger, more muscled, better able to withstand the wind, and knows how to win (9 wins this year, I believe, counting yesterday) and Cavendish was clearly not at peak.




did you just imply that Cav doesn't know how to win?

i don't think it's so cut and dried. IMHO, in a drag race, the winner depends on the length of the race. perhaps Cav would be faster in a 100m race but Greipel would win in a 200m. then there's sagan who is not nearly as large but came within 2 inches of coming around the larger, stronger, Greipel (who did absolutely no work in the group).

[tiretrax]

Forget the bikes. All that aero stuff only applies when everything is equal, including the riders.

Could it be that Cav's loss was due to him leading out at 200-250m and Griepel et al coming around him at 50m? I can't imagine that he'd beat Sagan or Griepel in a drag race from 200m. It would be interesting to see how many stages Cav lost when his lead out delivered him at 100-150m.