OT: Another car question -- Any Passat experience?

[Nooch]

Folks,

Of the collective wisdom here, does anyone have any experience with the B5.5 Passat/Passat Wagon? A friend is selling one, 2003 GLS wagon, 1.8T, with 123k miles. Car was owned by his parents and then him, so all known history and no major issues. Two CEL's ever, one for a coil pack (recalled), and another for the coolant taking too long to heat up (new thermostat installed).

The 123k miles worry me, as well as typical questionable VW reliability. Right now my '99 CR-V is the little engine that might, with just shy of 180k miles on the clock, but she's seen better days. Debating if this is worth the smallish investment (costs about the same as a Specialized Tarmac Expert) for a potential 4-6 years of life (or more?) or if I'm going to end up with headaches down the line. It's had brakes done at the dealer, control arms, everything it's needed.. Will need a timing belt at 150k following the 75k mile interval.

I've owned plenty of VW's and am perfectly competent working on them myself, but never a 1.8t. I've had the 2.5L 5-cyl, the 2.0 4-cyl (times two), the 1.8 16v... but never had the turbo.

So tell me what I need to know, please!

[rnhood]

Look for a late model Toyota Corolla, Mazda, etc with lower milage. You won't have the "down the road headaches" and the investment will be low. No turbo that will need expensive repairs either. Or you could spend a little on your CRV and it will be good for another 100k miles. That's probably the approach I would take as the CRV is a good vehicle and its easy to get a bike in the back.

[Nooch]

I should mention, my major gripe with the CR-V is the lack of LATCH. On the rare occasion that I've put the kid's (two car seats) in it, I've gotta go through the hassle of running the belt through, and getting it to lock, etc... it's never been confidence inspiring. LATCH makes it so simple, tight, secure...

I've gotten my money's worth out of the CR-V -- and would even consider just keeping it at my office in the event that I rode in and had an emergency, but my commute has increased to 5x more daily than I was driving, the transmission seems to be slipping in 2nd to 3rd upshifts,

[Spdntrxi]

I have 220k plus in my 2001 b5

[David Kirk]

I owned a 1998 and my parents had a 2000 with the 1.8T.

I had two real troubles with mine - the turbo went out at about 80,000 miles and it cost about $1600 as I recall to replace it. Next the timing belt broke and it bent most of the valves and required a complete upper end rebuild.

I think the turbo thing was bad luck but the timing belt thing really pissed me off. I'd visited the dealer here when the car had about 80,000 miles and I asked when the timing belt needed replacing and the service manager couldn't be sure. I pressed him hard and finally he told me that it was 'as needed'. I searched online and couldn't find any info so I wrote to VW USA and asked them and got no response.

15,000 miles later the belt broke to the tune of $3500.

If not for the timing belt my time with this car would have been great. Good mileage, lots of room, plenty of power, great seats. I sold the car a few years back with 160,000 miles and the new owner has had good luck with it.

My parents 2000 model still only has 60,000 miles and they've had no real troubles with it.

dave

[staggerwing]

Having owned several VW's, including our current JSW, I find little appeal in a 12yo, 123k example, regardless of model or engine. That is well below average mileage, but similar to the kind of mileage that my wife and i put on cars. That suggests the wagon either sat for extended periods, or had frequent low mileage trips, neither of which are great.

However, if cheap enough, you could 'roll the dice.' How would you feel if you paid say $2k and got 12 months/20k miles out of it?

[45K10]

Has the timing belt been changed?
If so and the price is right go for it.
I think the timing belt replacement runs around $1300.

[tiretrax]

I owned a 1998 and my parents had a 2000 with the 1.8T.

I had two real troubles with mine - the turbo went out at about 80,000 miles and it cost about $1600 as I recall to replace it. Next the timing belt broke and it bent most of the valves and required a complete upper end rebuild.

I think the turbo thing was bad luck but the timing belt thing really pissed me off. I'd visited the dealer here when the car had about 80,000 miles and I asked when the timing belt needed replacing and the service manager couldn't be sure. I pressed him hard and finally he told me that it was 'as needed'. I searched online and couldn't find any info so I wrote to VW USA and asked them and got no response.

15,000 miles later the belt broke to the tune of $3500.

If not for the timing belt my time with this car would have been great. Good mileage, lots of room, plenty of power, great seats. I sold the car a few years back with 160,000 miles and the new owner has had good luck with it.

My parents 2000 model still only has 60,000 miles and they've had no real troubles with it.

dave


That's too bad. As a general rule, timing belt (water pump, roller, tensioners, etc.) should be changed no later than every 100k miles.

[mschol17]

(Timing belt and upper control arms are the things you definitely should ask about. The control arms are basically consumables- I've replaced mine twice.)
Nevermind on this point, I read more closely and saw those two issues were taken care of.

The 1.8T also had a sludge issue if the user didn't use the correct euro-spec oil. There was a recall, so it should have been taken care of if that car had that problem.

[tele]

I had a similar experience as Mr. Kirk...owned a '99 B5 and I loved the 1.8t and car in general until the coil recall and the whole timing belt fiasco. My local dealer couldn't figure out the timing belt procedure either, really frustrating. In general the car was good on fuel, fun to drive and like a snowmobile with snow tires.

I traded the car in right before 100k miles because we had a 2nd kid and we wanted more room.

[Spdntrxi]

B5 has a timing chain .. Should not be breaking that often

[Elefantino]

The only Passat I have experience with is this one.

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l84/gmmtwo/Passat_zps5cabb16c.jpg

Weak back windows. And the back seats are uncomfortable when entered from the rear.

[shovelhd]

You do like wrecking stuff, don't you. :)

[Nooch]

We're looking at about $4000 plus a $135 plane ticket. Following are some responses from my friend regarding the ins and outs of the car, since he's in Maine. It's been in his family since new, his parents owned it prior to him, so he knows the entire history, and is another big VW nut.. also has ipod connection and upgraded to HID's. He's selling to take advantage of a sick lease deal on a new Jetta, otherwise he'd be happy keeping it a few more years.

'03. has lots of life left. Won't need anything major until 150k mi (timing belt will be due then, if you go on a 75k mi change.) have an appointment on the 27th to fix what little is wrong with it, already got the parts. (front pads/rotors driver side upper control arms, A/C belt(squeaking))

Tires have under 10k on them bought them last spring and we use snows(those will fit the new jetta sorry)

A/C works well, as does the heat, drivers heated seat works perfect, passenger side needs a new switch. radio works perfect.... key fobs both have crap range, drivers door open switch thinks the door is aways closed (and has been that way since 2007)

couple chips on the hood. ummm new windshield last year (ice chunk) also got new rear brakes, Axle and exhaust flex pipe last year.

Oh right. hood strut is worn out too. that was a new one yesterday, checking the oil(still full no leaks or burning woot). passat hoods are heavy.

Always had MANN/Maile(sp?) big oil filters with shell Rotilla T6 oil

[Elefantino]

<snip>as well as typical questionable VW reliability<snip>
My wife's 2007 Beetle with 80k miles on it runs as well as when it was new. The only issue we had was a sunroof seal that was a repair under warranty. Other than that, butter. I'd get another VW in a heartbeat.

[thwart]

Had a 2000 A4 quattro with the 1.8T.

When I went looking for my TDI, the salesperson told me about the somewhat unusual 80K timing belt service required for that particular engine. I assumed 100K. Car had 81K at the time. :help:

Yes, I did disclose that to the buyer, who said he was a mechanic. FWIW, sold it on CL (in one day, and actually had another buyer I had to turn away) two yrs ago for $4K.

And for some reason, I didn't drive it much in between...

[mschol17]

B5 has a timing chain .. Should not be breaking that often

Wrong. It's a timing belt.

[R3awak3n]

I had a B5 and it was pretty great until about 90k miles then all sorts of things went wrong with it. I think the B5.5 is better and had less issues. I used to be in a passat forum back in the day and people seemed to be happy with the 5.5.

However with 123k miles I would probably stay away unless its a really good deal. I am not sure $4k is a good deal or not for that but seems high with all that mileage but I could be wrong. Its a fun car the 1.8t though, I then moved to a saab 2.0T and I liked the saab better

[Spdntrxi]

Wrong. It's a timing belt.


Guess I'm thinking of the tensioner

[paredown]

I like the B5/5.5 Passats--although the only one I drove for an extended period was a diesel.

The biggest thing in this car's favor is the service history--assuming they took care of it (as it sounds like they did). Buying high mileage without the info is a crap shoot (as me how I know:help:).

You've done the 1.8 16v--you are already broken in on the VW thing. So get the Bentley manual, hang with the folks on Passat World, and you will turn over 200k easy--so long as you keep the plugs fresh, change the oil religiously (and use good oil), let the turbo cool a little before shutting off the engine--and change the timing belt/water pump/tensioner in 30,000 miles or so...

[GParkes]

As Dave K. noted, could have some problems due to motor being an interference fit. Recommended timing belt/water pump replacement is 75-80K mileage range. If that was done, you can typically count on another 75-80K miles before needing to do it again. Turbo can be an issue if engine runs too hot. These cars had Audi drive trains and ran great, but repairs are not cheap. Had '04 sedan with 1.8T for six years, ran great, handled great, would get 30+ mpg on highway. I had to replace turbo as well, but it's kinda the price you have to pay for the performance. Interestingly, despite living in wonderful upstate NY, it did not have a flake of rust on it. Go figure.

[oldpotatoe]

My wife's 2007 Beetle with 80k miles on it runs as well as when it was new. The only issue we had was a sunroof seal that was a repair under warranty. Other than that, butter. I'd get another VW in a heartbeat.

I have a 2000 Beetle with 125,000 miles on it and the only things that has gone wrong are the headlights, have replaced both twice and the driver side window motor went south. Changed the oil every 5k, timing belts at 60k intervals. Great little car, gonna give it to my grand daughter(in 12 years).

[Nooch]

I think I sold my '04 Golf at around 125k miles, 2.0liter 8v. My jetta 2.0 was heavily modded and i rebuilt the hell out of that thing..

The '06 2.5 Jetta was sold to pay off some debt when my first daughter was born, and it coincided with the purchase of the CR-V from my sister's boyfriend.

For whatever reason I'm more comfortable with the high mileage on the honda than the 1.8t, although it would seem that's a bit unfounded, even by my own experience with the cars. As I mentioned, I was a diehard VW guy, so would love to get back into one, but the late 90's early 2000's were somewhat troublesome and a bit luck of the draw with em. I've got a VW 'Racer Found' tattoo on my bicep and two Rabbit's on my chest, so I'm sure I'll love it if I go for it, just weighing out the pro's and con's I suppose!

[grawk]

The biggest concern with the passat is that the ECU is under the passenger floor carpet. So if you get rain in your car, it goes bonkers. I had a w8 wagon, and made that mistake, and it was a nightmare. I loved that car, too.

[pjmsj21]

So guys....: reading this thread makes me more than a bit concerned about my wife's wish to but a Golf TDI wagon. Do the reliability issues of VW remain?

[shovelhd]

It's a first year vehicle, so all caveats apply. I have a 2014, no issues.

[pjmsj21]

It's a first year vehicle, so all caveats apply. I have a 2014, no issues.

I want to enjoy all of the fun parts of owning a VW car but am concerned about the after 100k miles part of their lives.

[shovelhd]

Nobody wants problems, but many cars have them. It comes down to the risks you are willing to take. First year vehicles have a higher level of risk than mature vehicles. That said, I had a 2006 Honda Ridgeline that I bought in April of 2005, one of the first off of the line. I had three small issues that were covered by warranty and would later be fixed on the line. 143k. There are plenty of people who have driven MkV/VI Jetta Sportwagen TDI's well past 100k miles with no major issues, then there are those that have had them. It's a mixed bag. For the MkVII, nobody knows at this point.

[likebikes]

moving from your crv to a passat is a lateral move, at best.

[Nooch]

to update you all -- I got the price down another couple hundred, and bought it. Going to pick it up next Tuesday.

The service history and a few long conversations with friends with high mileage 1.8t's finally sold me.

[jh_on_the_cape]

The biggest concern with the passat is that the ECU is under the passenger floor carpet. So if you get rain in your car, it goes bonkers. I had a w8 wagon, and made that mistake, and it was a nightmare. I loved that car, too.

That is the auto trans cPu. We have a 2003 passat wagon and the sunroof leaked and flooded the car numerous times before we figured it out. Ours is manual transmission so did not have that problem you mention.

It's a nice car. Use $$ oil and gas and it's hard to change the bigger oil filter they chose afterwards to allow more oil. Timing belt was $$ compared to our volvo. Headlight bulbs are a pain to replace. We have done the water pump. Thermostat. Cv axles to raxles.Coil pack which was super cheap and easy. It's a nice car if you are after a vw. Sounds like you know VW and I have heard that a chip and suspension would make this car faster. We have the latch system but remember your kids will not be in car seats forever.

[aramis]

to update you all -- I got the price down another couple hundred, and bought it. Going to pick it up next Tuesday.

The service history and a few long conversations with friends with high mileage 1.8t's finally sold me.

Keep your Honda as a backup.

[jh_on_the_cape]

You realize that you have to post pictures now right?

[Nooch]

Keep your Honda as a backup.

As tempting as this is, it's just not practical to keep it, and there's still equity to be had in it.

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/357/19346020172_d49d1125d7_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/vtxpMW)Untitled (https://flic.kr/p/vtxpMW) by TrickImaging (https://www.flickr.com/photos/54300653@N02/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/488/19164511038_12832b6fb6_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/vcv8s7) (https://flic.kr/p/vcv8s7) by TrickImaging (https://www.flickr.com/photos/54300653@N02/), on Flickr

https://c2.staticflickr.com/4/3914/18729585914_378b506dd4_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/ux52n5) (https://flic.kr/p/ux52n5) by TrickImaging (https://www.flickr.com/photos/54300653@N02/), on Flickr

oooh, bolsters

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/524/19165944099_c94132dd81_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/vcCts4) (https://flic.kr/p/vcCts4) by TrickImaging (https://www.flickr.com/photos/54300653@N02/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/360/18731472503_da2ddf522f_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/uxeGbt) (https://flic.kr/p/uxeGbt) by TrickImaging (https://www.flickr.com/photos/54300653@N02/), on Flickr

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/304/19165942969_5fdb587351_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/vcCt7z) (https://flic.kr/p/vcCt7z) by TrickImaging (https://www.flickr.com/photos/54300653@N02/), on Flickr

Euro switch

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/369/19346016852_8773161894_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/vtxoNG) (https://flic.kr/p/vtxoNG) by TrickImaging (https://www.flickr.com/photos/54300653@N02/), on Flickr

One blemish, and HID's
https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/337/19164510888_e490384c6b_z.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/vcv8pw) (https://flic.kr/p/vcv8pw) by TrickImaging (https://www.flickr.com/photos/54300653@N02/), on Flickr

[4Rings6Stars]

Nice!

I looked at a couple of those when I was in the market last summer and came close to getting one. I ended up with an A4 wagon from a forum member and love it. (1.8t, quattro, 6 speed). The 1.8t motor has been great to me in the ~7k miles I have put on it since last July. Will likely have the timing belt job done soon, I was quoted around $650 which doesn't seem too bad at all.

http://i733.photobucket.com/albums/ww335/telepciaka/Cars/th_65846F92-DB98-4697-81ED-0F97C4DA6445_zpsqbfwbyrw.jpg (http://s733.photobucket.com/user/telepciaka/media/Cars/65846F92-DB98-4697-81ED-0F97C4DA6445_zpsqbfwbyrw.jpg.html)

[Nooch]

Nice!

I looked at a couple of those when I was in the market last summer and came close to getting one. I ended up with an A4 wagon from a forum member and love it. (1.8t, quattro, 6 speed). The 1.8t motor has been great to me in the ~7k miles I have put on it since last July. Will likely have the timing belt job done soon, I was quoted around $650 which doesn't seem too bad at all.

http://i733.photobucket.com/albums/ww335/telepciaka/Cars/th_65846F92-DB98-4697-81ED-0F97C4DA6445_zpsqbfwbyrw.jpg (http://s733.photobucket.com/user/telepciaka/media/Cars/65846F92-DB98-4697-81ED-0F97C4DA6445_zpsqbfwbyrw.jpg.html)

See, that's always been one of my dream cars, but this is close. And I don't think I'd have been able to get the same deal on an audi :)

[aaron 1804]

Gotta love a Wagen.

[Nooch]

Picked it up yesterday and have about 450 miles in it so far, and God I love it. Showed me how much I missed 1) driving stick and 2) driving VW's. Fingers crossed and knocking on wood that proper maintenance will get me past 200k miles.

Paint was a bit rougher than described, so I'll be touching it up a bit, but otherwise it's a huge improvement on the cr-v!

[Avincent52]

Congrats on the car. I love station wagons with sticks--I've owned two BMW 325iTs and an Audi A4 all with manual trans.

My suggestion? Get on a Volkswagen forum and get a sense of what the "real world" maintenance issues are.

On an e46 BMW, it's the cooling system (leaves you stranded, kills the car) and the fuel pump (leaves you stranded, but cheap and easy to fix.)

Get those things done or better yet DIY them and you'll be way ahead of the game. There's a difference between a high maintenance car and one that's unreliable and while your VW might be need a little more TLC than a Honda, it should be a reliable car if you keep up with these items.

[goonster]

See, that's always been one of my dream cars, but this is close. And I don't think I'd have been able to get the same deal on an audi :)

The KING of the B5 wagons is the W8, AWD, stick shift. Rare as hen's teeth, but they are out there.

I'm not made of money though, so I have an S4. ;)

[jh_on_the_cape]

My wife has almost the exact same car.
I love euro wagons stick shift but they are getting harder to find.
Our CEL is always on due to some evap system pump. And our windshield fluid reservoir cracked (our fault) so the low fluid light is always on.
Great car but more of a hobby than an appliance.

[Ken Robb]

My wife has almost the exact same car.
I love euro wagons stick shift but they are getting harder to find.
Our CEL is always on due to some evap system pump. And our windshield fluid reservoir cracked (our fault) so the low fluid light is always on.
Great car but more of a hobby than an appliance.

I guess you don't need washer fluid or you would have replaced the reservoir and the light would be out. Is there a sensor float that you can tape in the "UP" position to turn off the warning?