PT vs Crank/pedal PowerMeter

[Splash]

I have the Campy SR EPS 11 speed groupset with a CK45R rear rub and enve 6.7sms whilst on my Bianchi Oltre XR.

What is the better PM to install without compromising too mush on my existing bike components?

SRM, Stages and all pedal PM's are out of consideration.

Power2Max with a Rotor 3D+ crankset maybe?

Just racking my brains over this thought form the previous 4 weeks and need to flush it out!





THoughts?


Splash

[Blown Reek]

Rebuild your rear wheel with a PowerTap hub, or get a Power2Max crank. One will run you about $900 and the other will run you about $1800.

[Splash]

Thanks.

what compromise in bearing performance/reliability/stiffness and weight woudl I be incurring if i got the GS3C PT hub over my CH45R hub on this wheelset?


SPlash

[deechee]

Get the Power2max. I`m a longtime PT user, and have had two SLs, and recently picked up a used G3. Besides the first one which went back for warranty repair, they`ve been bulletproof. That said, having to rebuild a wheel is a pain, and I prefer having a 32 spoke training wheelset vs a low spoke race wheel.

I set up the p2max classic on my p2c tri bike with enve 6.7s and they work as advertised. Sync`d in two secs with my Garmin watch & 500, and have not had any signal dropout. Its nice to be able to change wheels when you don`t want to ride such expensive wheels. For the 600$ price, I`d get them. Dunno why anyone said they were 900$. 100$ for the Praxis rings which seem stiff enough, but I`m shifting old school with barcons since its a tri bike.

A good friend of mine who rides a lot more than I do has had his p2max classic for a year and was happy enough with his that he bought a new s-type earlier this year. He`s less tech-inclined so he`s been very happy with not having to fuss with it at all.

[Splash]

Many thanks!

Why the much higher spoke count for your training wheels?

Why is a lower spoke count (like 24) better suited for races?

How are your 6.7's going - loving them? Tips and traps for other users (like me)?


splash

[Blown Reek]

Thanks.

what compromise in bearing performance/reliability/stiffness and weight woudl I be incurring if i got the GS3C PT hub over my CH45R hub on this wheelset?


SPlash

Nothing. It might be little heavier due to the PowerTap, but it's central hub weight, and we're not talking about a lot.

Sure, you can spend $900 (of $600) on a Power2Max , but it's not going to match the aesthetic of your bike. Fork out the extra $700 to get the Power2Max Campagnolo crank (2014 style) or $200 more than that for the 2015 4-arm crankset. If you've got an Oltre with Super Record, anything other than the Campy crank looks like crap. And if you get the Campy crank, you can transfer your rings and not have to worry about 3rd party drivetrain compatibility.

[deechee]

Why the much higher spoke count for your training wheels?

Why is a lower spoke count (like 24) better suited for races?

How are your 6.7's going - loving them? Tips and traps for other users (like me)?

splash

-Higher spoke count/traditional build up so that a)if a spoke snaps, I can still ride home (I've been with friends who had to get a lift because their Ksyriums wouldn't spin without rubbing too much after a broken spoke) and b)I feel less bad about damages. Last year I guess I hit something with my front tire and it bounced into my rear rim, putting a huge dent and cutting my tire. My ex accidentally slipped into a manhole cover and totally taco'd her wheel once. Knowing me, crap will happen. I tend to not get things too nice since I'm a bit reckless. I'm always amazed how incredibly pristine people keep their bikes on the forum. My bikes are covered in scratches and paint chips.

-Lower spoke is supposed to be more aero, save some weight, blah blah. I don't care too much, I picked up the Enves used so not like I had anything in mind. I had some Shimano low spoke wheels once, found them really harsh - but that could've been the bike I was on, the bad fit and my general newness to road biking.

-The 6.7's have been nice. I have to admit, I haven't ridden deep wheels in a long time, and certainly never anything that deep. That said, I find them light and fast (was flying at 45km/h@250w the other day). They catch the wind a bit, but I'm starting to get used to them in crosswinds on flats and descents. Relaxing really helps when the wind hits. The Enve brakepads are great. Not sure how they handle on a road bike if you have a higher center of gravity. I've met a guy who found them squirrely downhill but he's lot taller and older than I am. (but really fast, I think he has a cp20 around 320) Maybe I'll love them if I post an amazing bike time during my 1/2Ironman next weekend :eek:

I'm curious what you're worried about between the PT and P2Max? I can say I've had good service from both companies, and P2Max ships from Vancouver so that was a big plus for me since I'm in Canada. Both are rated on dcrainmaker as "they just work". My reason for getting PTs in the past were because they were much cheaper and I had ridden one for a certain time. (I rented one when I was working with a local coach. ) Now, the P2Max is very close in price, and since I was getting back into tri I decided I wanted something to work with race wheels. I'm not so concerned with weight, as I realize the p2Max classic is a bit on the heavy side. I'm so loaded up on the bike anyway with food and drinks it doesn't matter.

One downside I can think of is if you have other bikes that you might want to move the crank to, they'll have to be the same BB30 as your Bianchi. This used to be easier when all BBs were the same... The wheel might be a bit more portable, but its all about your goals.

I believe both systems' batteries last about 1/2year with my usage. (10-15hrs/week). The battery is a PITA to change on the PT. The G3 is easier to change than the SL but initially its battery life was horrible, like a month or two? I haven't ran the firmware update that supposedly improved things. The P2max classic battery is VERY easy to change. Three screws, pop in the new one, check the LED and you're good.

For me, the ability to build any rear wheel is a nice plus. Oh, and I HATE the freehub noise of the Powertap SL. I think the G3 is a bit more muted but I haven't ridden that wheel in a while since a friend borrowed it. (Yes, its funny I lent my newer, lighter hub and I kept my hands on my workhorse SL which I've had for years and never had a problem with. That says a lot about me - I'd rather have functional and reliability over aesthetics and weight.) Being able to build a bike with Shimano hubs, priceless :)

Have you read this post on dcrainmaker (http://www.dcrainmaker.com/2014/09/buyers-guide2014-edition.html)?

[old fat man]

If you are really happy with the current hubs and the cranks, why wouldn't you want to go with a pedal option?

Garmin, or the upcoming powertap pedal option.

[shovelhd]

I run a SRAM Red 22 SRM with 9070 DI2. Works great. I'd rather have a DA9000 SRM but I can't afford it. Aesthetics are secondary. This is a race bike.

[Uncle Jam's Army]

I have a Pioneer on one bike and a Power2Max on another. The Pioneer is my favorite because it gives true left/right power. The Pioneer's numbers also track well with the Stages power meter I used to have.

The Power2Max (Type S), however, grossly understates power at anything under 300 watts by 30-40 watts. Above 300 watts, it seems to track well with every other power meter I've used. When I contacted Power2Max and notified them of my problem, their response was essentially that their power meters are perfect, perfectly calibrated, and any problem is with me and my other power meters. I can't say I can recommend Power2Max given my experience with both the unit and the arrogance of their "customer service."

[shovelhd]

Wow, that's an unacceptable variance. Hopefully yours was an anomaly.

[Splash]

Thanks Guys. Appreciated.

Deechee - do you find the enve 6.7's retain rolling speed well over undulating terrain and in flat terrain? In my experience they do it well and they are fast downhill - scarily fast sometimes ( I did 80km/hr once and had to brake because i was scared).

Old Fat man - yes, I will consider the P1 pedals...


Splash

[Uncle Jam's Army]

Wow, that's an unacceptable variance.

Tell me about it. Ever since my main bike went down with a cracked chainstay, I've been using my backup bike with the Power2Max power meter. We had to do a new FTP test to get a new baseline and then reset all the training zones lower to adjust for the Power2Max readings.

Can't wait to get my main bike back and my extra 30-40 watts.:)

[deechee]

Deechee - do you find the enve 6.7's retain rolling speed well over undulating terrain and in flat terrain? In my experience they do it well and they are fast downhill - scarily fast sometimes ( I did 80km/hr once and had to brake because i was scared).

Splash

Yeah, I guess they do. That said, they felt slow this weekend because I blew up 3 hours into a 4 hour workout. haha. Any decisions on your powermeter?

[ik2280]

Just out of curiousity, why are SRM power meters excluded from your search?

They seem like the cream of the crop when it comes to power meters - and, not to be presumptuous, but the price probably isn't prohibitive for you, given your bike / wheels.

[Splash]

thanks guys.

i am still performing my background research into these things, coupled with an appropriate trainer...

SRM is nice - but just cannot justify as I would still need a trainer onto of any PM I buy...

Splash

[shovelhd]

I paid a grand for my one season old SRM. I rode it for a season, swapped the rings to 11 speed, sent it to Colorado for new batteries, calibration and a better decal, and $120 later I have a functionally new SRM with three seasons of battery life left.

I paid $120 for my KK trainer off Craigslist five years ago. KK replaced the old style J bolt that stripped out on me for free.

[Splash]

Wow

You got lucky😜

Well done.

I would buy one (s r m) at that price tomorrow!

Actually some dude here in Oz is selling a barely used Dura Ace S R M crankset for a reasonable price but I switched off because it was not campy.

Should I reconsider and pursue this now ?

And, why the non erg k k trainer (and not an erg trainer)?