Hydration and feeding not recommended?

[stephenmarklay]

I have played with around with what to eat and drink over the last month. Honestly I rarely think about it but a couple of weeks ago I did a fast(er) dirt fond o and wanted to fuel. For that I ate a couple of bars with some carbs and drank diluted coconut water with salt added. That was about 4-5 bottles for 4 hours.

I think that worked ok.

My last few rides of lengths 95, 65 and 50 however I played with it. On the 95 I ate one bar and drank about 1 1/2 bottles of water and the shorter rides I ate and drank nothing.

As far as drinking I road this morning at about 55-60 degrees and was not really sweating a lot so my need to drink is less.

I honestly don’t really notice a difference ether way.

I think in hot weather it would be bad but its interesting to me that I really don’t NEED to drink and eat so much.

[rnhood]

A lot depends on how hard you ride, or how hot it is. If you are lolly-gagging on a local metric or century event, well I don't know that you need much - especially in cooler areas of the country. Your body will go after fat as its fuel of choice, you drink depending on the heat and when thirsty, then top off your protein and calories with the post ride meal.

But if you are riding hard, you will need some additional calories in addition to fat stores since once in zone 4 or 5, your body prefers calories over exhausting glycogen stores. And in hot weather like Florida in particular, you need to pay special attention to staying hydrated. Your body can withstand quite a bit of stress but, its not a good idea to subject it to this stress. The old saying about urine color is a good metric and indicator. It needs to be clear or light yellow. Not dark yellow when the finished riding.

Having said this and to your point, when you're eating healthy meals before and after its probably not necessary to be stuffing down energy bars and gels. One bar or two at the most is probably more than sufficient.

[OtayBW]

On the 95 I ate one bar and drank about 1 1/2 bottles of water and the shorter rides I ate and drank nothing.
Not enough, IMO. Even on the shorter rides, you likely depleted or nearly depleted your muscle glycogen and you're riding more or less on blood sugar. On the longer rides, not eating - or eating only 1 bar (~120+/- cal) - is not enough for best performance. If it didn't get you these times, it will eventually. Just a matter of time before you bonk or cramp. Fuel your ride. Again, my opinion....

[cinema]

a lot of this also depends on your nutrition off the bike. the way you eat regulates your metabolism to an extent, and how your body makes energy available to you. for most of us it is in the form of carbohydrates then once those are depleted it's easiest to siphon energy from muscles then you're really in trouble

[nate2351]

FWIW

I can ride 3 hours with no food and just water, but, if I eat 250 cals every hour and drink accordingly I will average around 30 higher watts, 750-1000 more Kjs, and the average speed will be 1.5-2 mph higher all at the same HR. FWIW.

[SoCalSteve]

If you've ever bonked...you will be eating more food. It's not fun!

[numbskull]

FWIW

I can ride 3 hours with no food and just water, but, if I eat 250 cals every hour and drink accordingly I will average around 30 higher watts, 750-1000 more Kjs, and the average speed will be 1.5-2 mph higher all at the same HR. FWIW.

Very helpful, thanks.

[stephenmarklay]

FWIW

I can ride 3 hours with no food and just water, but, if I eat 250 cals every hour and drink accordingly I will average around 30 higher watts, 750-1000 more Kjs, and the average speed will be 1.5-2 mph higher all at the same HR. FWIW.

I suspect there is truth to that for me. I have somewhat trained myself to be fat adapted which is the trendy thing to do. Its interesting what you say about your power. I have a power meter but I am not serious enough to care. Having said that I may experiment.

[stephenmarklay]

If you've ever bonked...you will be eating more food. It's not fun!


Oh trust me I have. Having said that I am much more bonk proof, in my opinion, eating less and depending on fat as fuel. I am no doubt limiting high end performance however. The more I train this way the fast I get however.

I guess I also forgot to mention that I normally leave the house at around 5:30 after a couple of cups of coffee and a square or two of bitter chocolate (baking variety) to wake up.

[stephenmarklay]

a lot of this also depends on your nutrition off the bike. the way you eat regulates your metabolism to an extent, and how your body makes energy available to you. for most of us it is in the form of carbohydrates then once those are depleted it's easiest to siphon energy from muscles then you're really in trouble

Yes totally agree.

[stephenmarklay]

I posted it as it is mostly just interesting. The food part is really as stated above in large part what you do day in and day out and then to some extent how you train.

Since I normally train fasted I am getting better at doing that. I used to eat low carbs but now I eat a bit more since I think it has positive effects, for me, on performance. Having said that I like to eat them after a ride or in the evening.

As far as the hydration, it was just interesting that not drinking during a 3 hour ride was not only no issue, I felt good. I did drink coffee and one glass of water before I left and that seems to be plenty for the cooler weather and moderate pace (today included about 10 miles if very hilly gravel roads so it was not “easy”.

One thing that was interesting was that after the first 1.5 hours my legs were tired. The gravel roads, hills etc coupled with the workout late in the evening yesterday (heavy squats) took a toll. But then i felt great again and could have easily gone longer but I had chores to do.

Its all just food for thought :) I guess its on the extreme end in the other direction. I think most people are made to believe that they need a lot more on the bike food etc than they really do.

[Ralph]

http://drmirkin.com/public/ezine072609.html

Dr Mirkin says to take in sugar (in some form) when training. You go faster longer, and does not hinder your body's ability to exercise with no sugar.

[stephenmarklay]

http://drmirkin.com/public/ezine072609.html

Dr Mirkin says to take in sugar (in some form) when training. You go faster longer, and does not hinder your body's ability to exercise with no sugar.

First, let me say there is zero doubt that athletes training on high carbs and eating a lot of carbs during exercises can and do perform at the highest levels of all sports period.

There is however, newer studies of athletes getting faster and faster training on much lower carbohydrate diets and on the go fueling. The real benefit of this is that you just won’t need AS MUCH carbs to keep going. That can be a good thing especially on long hard days when stomach distress becomes an issue.

For me, I prefer not to eat a lot of extra junk on or off the bike. Pro cyclists are famous for drinking coke and eating “junk” foods. It does not make me want to do it however.

[AngryScientist]

Pro cyclists are famous for drinking coke and eating “junk” foods. It does not make me want to do it however.

if it's hot out and i'm feeling particularly low, an ice cold bottle of coke is like liquid gold. i never drink soda off the bike, but every now and then a gas station snickers and can of coke are just what the doctor ordered to bring it home.

[stephenmarklay]

if it's hot out and i'm feeling particularly low, an ice cold bottle of coke is like liquid gold. i never drink soda off the bike, but every now and then a gas station snickers and can of coke are just what the doctor ordered to bring it home.

Well your in good company as that is a Chris Horner buffet :)

[stephenmarklay]

BTW I am certainly not passing judgment. Up until about 8 years ago I refueled on ice cream. It worked great.

[cv1966]

if it's hot out and i'm feeling particularly low, an ice cold bottle of coke is like liquid gold. i never drink soda off the bike, but every now and then a gas station snickers and can of coke are just what the doctor ordered to bring it home.

Yes, coke on a hot day is rocket fuel, especially the real sugar kind. I've found that the better shape I'm in, I need a lot less calories during a ride. Hydration doesn't seem to change as much, however.