Road Rage: Idiot hiptster on tall bike throws U-lock at car

[kevinvc]

Story Here (http://www.oregonlive.com/commuting/index.ssf/2015/05/portland_bicyclist_photographe.html#incart_2box_)

Ah, Portland. Way to go above and beyond anything Portlandia can think up. I've already had a couple of acquaintances e-mail me this story and tell me how this is the reason they don't like cyclists.

So, when an idiot in a car does something stupid and actually hurts or kills a cyclist, at best most people will (rightfully) blame the individual driver or, at worst, somehow imply the cyclist was at fault. When an idiot on a bike does something stupid that doesn't actually cause any injury, many of these same people will conflate that action to cyclists as a whole. I get so sick and tired of this crap.

And, as if it needed mentioning, don't read the comments to the story unless you want to think even less of humanity.

[JeffS]

Your acquaintances are liars, though I suspect you knew that.

They hate bikes because they hate bikes. Red lights, group rides, U-lock reprisals, etc just keep them from having to admit it.


No doubt in my mind that the road rage started with the driver and/or passenger. Nobody picks a fight with a car for the hell of it.

[Louis]

Nobody picks a fight with a car for the hell of it.

5 lb lock vs 3000 lb car - that's a fair fight.

[firerescuefin]

Your acquaintances are liars, though I suspect you knew that.

They hate bikes because they hate bikes. Red lights, group rides, U-lock reprisals, etc just keep them from having to admit it.


No doubt in my mind that the road rage started with the driver and/or passenger. Nobody picks a fight with a car for the hell of it.

Her account seems very believable...and I've seen plenty of cyclist antagonize cars. Either you're really trolling, or need to get out a little more.

[Cicli]

Who the hell locks up a stupid looking bike like that? That bike has anti theft styling. The only way that would get stolen around here is if you left it too close to the curb the night before trash day.

[Louis]

Who knows what really happened, but I don't think drivers have exclusive rights to being d!cks. Plenty of cyclists are too.

[dcama5]

Who the hell locks up a stupid looking bike like that? That bike has anti theft styling. The only way that would get stolen around here is if you left it too close to the curb the night before trash day.

Funny, but true.

[Tony]

I've seen plenty of cyclist antagonize cars.

Agree, seen my share of angry cyclist wanting to take it to another level.

[Seramount]

uhhh, in addition to douchey guy on stupidbike doing something highly hostile, wingman guy has one green sock, one orange sock...

I'm gonna side with the motorist on this one.

[bcroslin]

Couple of people being a-holes. Take note and move on. There's no reason to make sweeping statements about cyclists or drivers from that stupid interaction.

[ultraman6970]

Honestly? both should have had let this thing go, because now nobody knows who started it.

[velomonkey]

There's no reason to make sweeping statements about cyclists or drivers from that stupid interaction.

However, I think it's fair to say - wicked ultra hipsters on tall bikes - basically all of them are total idiot asphats.

[gdw]

Judging from the pictures I'd bet the guy on the tall bike was at fault. He and his buddy are taking up the whole lane and any man who kicks a women or has to "put out his foot" to protect himself is a coward. Bet he and his pal wouldn't be so brave if there were two guys in the car instead of a mother with her teenage daughter.

[velomonkey]

Bet he and his pal wouldn't be so brave if there were two guys in the car instead of a mother with her teenage daughter.

Trust me, the dude would back down from 2 twelve year olds on big wheels.

When your schtict is a tall bike . . . you need to look for a new schtict.

[unterhausen]

My guess is the motorist pulled some dangerous stunt without even thinking it was dangerous, and was upset when the cyclist took offense.

[bcroslin]

However, I think it's fair to say - wicked ultra hipsters on tall bikes - basically all of them are total idiot asphats.

Not fair and a very silly thing to think. Tall bikes might not be your thing and they're certainly not mine but one of the nicest people I've ever met who also happens to be the current SSCX champ in TN occasionally rides a tall bike.

The world is full of a-holes and this story happens to document 3 in Portland.

[bart998]

Just going by the photo.... you can see BOTH riders are in the center of the lane, riding side by side, nowhere near the right hand edge... safe to say she was being truthful about the riders blocking the road so she couldn't pass AND throwing the U-lock which probably made a nice dent. The riders are jackasses... I don't know about Oregon, but in California throwing objects at a moving vehicle is a felony.

[Fivethumbs]

Thank goodness I only ride a regular bike and not a tall bike. I was thinking about getting a tall bike but not now. This story is going to cause a lot of ill will towards tall bike riders which I fortunately am not. None of us regular bike riders will suffer any repercussions, only tall bike riders will.

[JAllen]

However, I think it's fair to say - wicked ultra hipsters on tall bikes - basically all of them are total idiot asphats.
That's not true at all. What are basing this blanketed statement on? I've known plenty of tall bike riders. They are cyclists just like anyone. They just happen to like something that may be a little out there to you. I can't speak to theses people who did something foolish, but don't condemn everyone who rides tall bikes based on this. Isn't this the very prejudice we are trying to combat everyday from ignorant motorists???

Not fair and a very silly thing to think. Tall bikes might not be your thing and they're certainly not mine but one of the nicest people I've ever met who also happens to be the current SSCX champ in TN occasionally rides a tall bike.

The world is full of a-holes and this story happens to document 3 in Portland.

This. Thank you.

[Louis]

That's not true at all. What are basing this blanketed statement on?

I have to believe that VM was not being serious.

[rustychisel]

I have to believe that VM was not being serious.

Then why make the statement? If in jest, show jest.

The story seems to indicate all concerned were 'in the wrong' and even that is conjecture.

[paredown]

In the comments (yes, I read some of them:help:) the irate motorists repeat the canard that cyclists don't "deserve" to be on the road because they don't pay for them, and that "we" (the motorists) do with gas taxes and registration.

In short, cyclists are freeloaders and deserve no respect. This gets repeated every time I look at comments for one of these incidents.

It made me want to check for some recent numbers--and nationally, it seems that direct motorists fees and taxes pay for a tad over 50% of the costs of roads:
Nationwide in 2011, highway user fees and user taxes made up just 50.4 percent of state and local expenses on roads. State and local governments spent $153.0 billion on highway, road, and street expenses but raised only $77.1 billion in user fees and user taxes ($12.7 billion in tolls and user fees, $41.2 billion in fuel taxes, and $23.2 billion in vehicle license taxes).[3] The rest was funded by $30 billion in general state and local revenues and $46 billion in federal aid (approximately $28 billion derived from the federal gasoline tax and $18 billion from general federal revenues or deficit financed).

So next time this claim gets repeated, let's just tell them we are riding on the half we have paid for with our taxes--and they are welcome to the rest.

Study here:
http://taxfoundation.org/article/gasoline-taxes-and-user-fees-pay-only-half-state-local-road-spending

[merlinmurph]

FWIW, in the limited info we have, I don't see anything that warrants throwing a u-lock at someone's car and damaging the car. Lots of a-hole behavior all around, but things would have to go pretty far for me to see that as acceptable. Yelling at each other doesn't cut it.

That's my 2 cents.

[velomonkey]

I have to believe that VM was not being serious.


Thank you - does anyone really think that my life is occupied, at all, with hated of tall bikes and their riders?






I save my hated for dual unicycle riding jugglers - freaking show offs. . . . .

[velomonkey]

Then why make the statement? If in jest, show jest.


Jest.

[oldpotatoe]

Thank you - does anyone really think that my life is occupied, at all, with hated of tall bikes and their riders?






I save my hated for unicycle riders - Freaking show offs. . . . .

This guy was on a tall bike wasn't he?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3nMnr8ZirI

:eek:

[holliscx]

Riding two abreast in the middle of the street can you type asshat here?

[rwsaunders]

Throwing a 4# piece of metal at two women in a car? I bet that they wouldn't try the same move with two guys in a pick-up truck. Just take the plate number down if you believe that you're being hassled.

I did figure out the socks...starboard (left) for the green and port (right) for the orange/red. I bet that he has another pair just like them. :cool:

[JAllen]

Thank you - does anyone really think that my life is occupied, at all, with hated of tall bikes and their riders?






I save my hated for dual unicycle riding jugglers - freaking show offs. . . . .
That's something we can agree on. :) sorry to jump.

[oldpotatoe]

Throwing a 4# piece of metal at two women in a car? I bet that they wouldn't try the same move with two guys in a pick-up truck. Just take the plate number down if you believe that you're being hassled.

I did figure out the socks...starboard (left) for the green and port (right) for the orange/red. I bet that he has another pair just like them. :cool:

Does he follow..'red/right/returning' and 'even red nuns have odd black cans'...??

http://www.marine-movers.com/AidsToNavigationExplained.htm

[unterhausen]

I can't believe the cyclist hating cyclists on this thread. You don't have to read the article very far to figure out the so-called victim was the aggressor here.

To recap: the passenger/mother of the driver got upset that the cyclist was blocking a jerk that was losing their s--- because the cyclist wouldn't move out of the way and let them make an illegal right turn. She walked into an already ongoing road rage situation and sided with the person in the wrong. Then they followed behind the cyclists blaring their horn even though they could pass. Yeah, I'm feeling really sorry for their mistreatment.

I'm always amazed at motorists that cant pass when the road is empty other than a cyclist. The picture of the bike lock clearly shows this to be the case. If the cyclists were moving slowly, as alleged, that makes the pass even easier.

Most road rage incidents happen because someone wants to be the junior deputy and enforce their notion of correct road usage on others. This is clearly the case here, and the police should drop it or charge the two women. Their own admissions to illegal behavior are no doubt covered by road rage statutes.

[unterhausen]

Let's ignore for a second that a cyclist was involved. The situation was that this guy was being picked on by a road-rager through no fault of his own, and then another person started their own road rage incident as a result and started harassing him all over again. I know I'm a little prone to reacting badly to road rage, but you would have to be a zen master not to react to that in some inappropriate way

[FastforaSlowGuy]

I can't believe the cyclist hating cyclists on this thread. You don't have to read the article very far to figure out the so-called victim was the aggressor here.

To recap: the passenger/mother of the driver got upset that the cyclist was blocking a jerk that was losing their s--- because the cyclist wouldn't move out of the way and let them make an illegal right turn. She walked into an already ongoing road rage situation and sided with the person in the wrong. Then they followed behind the cyclists blaring their horn even though they could pass. Yeah, I'm feeling really sorry for their mistreatment.

I'm always amazed at motorists that cant pass when the road is empty other than a cyclist. The picture of the bike lock clearly shows this to be the case. If the cyclists were moving slowly, as alleged, that makes the pass even easier.

Most road rage incidents happen because someone wants to be the junior deputy and enforce their notion of correct road usage on others. This is clearly the case here, and the police should drop it or charge the two women. Their own admissions to illegal behavior are no doubt covered by road rage statutes.


Even if this is the case, you don't get to toss a hunk of metal at people, even if those people are in a car. In many states that's assault, and "they were honking at me" just isn't a defense. Sorry, not trying to hate on cyclists, but I'm going to come out against physical altercations between bikes and cars.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[malcolm]

Sometimes it's as simple as an ass is an ass even if he/she happens to be on a bicycle.

[djg21]

It's pretty funny seeing all the bias at play here, and some on this board seem to bend over backwards to justify entirely inappropriate and unlawful behavior on the part of the "cyclist."

No one here knows exactly what transpired between the motorist, the motorist's daughter, and the two cyclists before the photos were taken. We have multiple stories that differ on key points, and the truth undoubtedly lies somewhere in between. What we do know from the photos is that the "cyclists" were blocking traffic and one threw a U-lock at the trailing auto.

Frankly, I don't care what the motorist said or did. It is crystal clear that by the time the photo was taken any confrontation had ended, or to the extent continuing could have been averted had the "cyclists" simply allowed the vehicle to pass and then went on their own way. There is no justification here for using the U-lock as a weapon. The "cyclist" should be charged with assault.

[BobbyJones]

First:

"She said it was as grating as a motorist constantly honking his horn at someone in anger."

Then:

"When Lee's daughter honked at them, the tall-bike rider tossed the lock, which hit the front of the car, Lee said."

Cracks me up.

[unterhausen]

I
No one here knows exactly what transpired between the motorist, the motorist's daughter, and the two cyclists before the photos were taken. We have multiple stories that differ on key points, and the truth undoubtedly lies somewhere in between. What we do know from the photos is that the "cyclists" were blocking traffic and one threw a U-lock at the trailing auto.


I disagree, the motorist's own admission would support a charge of menacing, and you don't even have to extrapolate. And go ahead and charge the cyclist.
Since the motorist is no doubt minimizing their own bad behavior, I'm going to stretch things and say it was actually like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFM5QiAd3QA

[verticaldoug]

I don't have time to look it up, but pretty sure most states have a throwing a deadly missile statute at moving vehicles. (where a missle can be a rock, or other hard object which can cause harm). It sounds silly but there have been cases where people in cars are injured from wiseguys throwing stuff off overpasses etc. The cyclist should be arrested.

[zap]

Throwing the u-lock…….big :no:

[oldpotatoe]

It's pretty funny seeing all the bias at play here, and some on this board seem to bend over backwards to justify entirely inappropriate and unlawful behavior on the part of the "cyclist."

No one here knows exactly what transpired between the motorist, the motorist's daughter, and the two cyclists before the photos were taken. We have multiple stories that differ on key points, and the truth undoubtedly lies somewhere in between. What we do know from the photos is that the "cyclists" were blocking traffic and one threw a U-lock at the trailing auto.

Frankly, I don't care what the motorist said or did. It is crystal clear that by the time the photo was taken any confrontation had ended, or to the extent continuing could have been averted had the "cyclists" simply allowed the vehicle to pass and then went on their own way. There is no justification here for using the U-lock as a weapon. The "cyclist" should be charged with assault.

Agree.....yell and scream all you want but no touching/throwing/hitting...I agree with the other poster too, if the following car had been 2 guys in a P/U truck, I doubt the tall bike knucklehead would have thrown anything at anybody.

[Tony]

I disagree, the motorist's own admission would support a charge of menacing, and you don't even have to extrapolate. And go ahead and charge the cyclist.
Since the motorist is no doubt minimizing their own bad behavior, I'm going to stretch things and say it was actually like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFM5QiAd3QA

Watching that video makes me want to throw a U lock. However, I can't and wont. Anyone that doesn't see a problem with throwing a four pound projectile at a car for honking is part of the problem.

[fuzzalow]

A tempest in a teapot. Much ado about nothing. Two wrongs don't make a right.

Driving a car, not much to be done other than what you can control and what is a legal driving maneuver to perform. In this photo, couldn't care less about two hipsters riding slowly, blocking the lane. The centerline in the road is dotted yellow so I would just pass on the left and go my merry way. These two cyclists get not one iota of added thought or bother to me.

FWIW, even if the centerline in the road were double solid I would not hesitate to pass on the left if the road were quiet and safe to do so, even if technically illegal. The reason is when you come up behind cyclists that are riding as these two hipsters seem to be doing, they are obviously looking to make a point and perhaps wish to escalate to a confrontation. As a driver, you time your closing rate behind these two riders with the gap to the opposite traffic flow, if necessary, and flow right past them on the left like water running off a duck's back.

I'd expect if this were done while violating a double yellow, the hipsters would yell at me as I went past for "breaking" the law in furtherance of their political agenda. Correctomundo! But I would not have done the maneuver in front of a LEO anymore than they would have blocked the road riding two abreast in front of a LEO.

There is no shortage of insignificant nobodies who want to be noticed. Ha! Don't GAS and wouldn't give you the time of day.

[gdw]

"I can't believe the cyclist hating cyclists on this thread."

I can't believe a cyclist or anyone would try to rational the behavior of the asshat on the tall bike. He should have pulled over and let the car pass and ended the confrontation.

PS - Hate is one of the most overused words in the English language and should be used sparingly by adults. Using it to label people who write or say things that you disagree with is pretty lame.

[djg21]

I disagree, the motorist's own admission would support a charge of menacing, and you don't even have to extrapolate. And go ahead and charge the cyclist.

Since the motorist is no doubt minimizing their own bad behavior, I'm going to stretch things and say it was actually like this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFM5QiAd3QA



Maybe we should credit the motorist's statement that she is a cyclist, and confronted the tall bike clown only to express her concern that by acting like a jerk, he was reflecting poorly on all cyclists. Interestingly, I recall seeing posts on this forum suggesting that "conscientious" cyclists do this very thing. You should not cherry pick only the parts of the motorist's statement that conform to your preconceived notions and "pro-cyclist" biases.

[SpokeValley]

Who the hell locks up a stupid looking bike like that? That bike has anti theft styling. The only way that would get stolen around here is if you left it too close to the curb the night before trash day.

:)

[Seramount]

I can't believe the cyclist hating cyclists on this thread.

not every person who uses a two-wheeled, pedal-powered conveyance is my 'brother' or in my 'tribe'...

and simply owning a bike doesn't exclude someone from being criticized for being a jerk.

without the lock-throwing part of the story, I wouldn't have even commented on this incident. it's just some random people being cranky with each other over some right-of-way issue...

[unterhausen]

Maybe we should credit the motorist's statement that she is a cyclist, and confronted the tall bike clown only to express her concern that by acting like a jerk, he was reflecting poorly on all cyclists.
This is just the thing. She isn't really a cyclist. She rode her bike downtown once. When was the last time she rode downtown? Never. She never actually rode her bike downtown. It's really common to hear this from road ragers that bother to engage, it's their justification for their bad behavior. "I'm a cyclist too." Doesn't alter the fact that she was the aggressor in this situation, by her own admission. Everybody has ridden a bicycle at least a little, but it doesn't mean they have the right to expound on their own interpretation of the rules and threaten a cyclist with their car. If someone starts a road rage incident, they can expect a reaction, and it's not likely to be a good one.

It's really too bad the cyclists couldn't get both sets of road ragers in trouble with the law instead of throwing the lock. My own experience is I get over incidents like this a lot better if I don't act out. In fact, I pretend like the person is being nice to me. Usually. I just think that the escalation of the situation by the two ladies led to an entirely predictable outcome, and no reasonable justice system would hold the cyclist at fault here.

[gdw]

"She rode her bike downtown once. When was the last time she rode downtown? Never. She never actually rode her bike downtown."

Did you bother to read the article?

"Lee, who sometimes commutes by bicycle to her downtown job, said she was a "little embarrassed" by her behavior during the confrontation."

You're not being objective. Regardless of who started it there is absolutely no excuse for the tall riders action. As to charging the driver with Menacing, no way. The guy on the clown bike would have yielded the lane and not thrown the lock if he was afraid of being injured.

[Shortsocks]

Just GIVE Lance back all of this TOUR WINS and lets be done with it....Wait. Sorry wrong Thread. (Mods please Erase this and throw a U-Lock at my Macbook) :eek:

[velomonkey]

Just GIVE Lance back all of this TOUR WINS and lets be done with it....Wait. Sorry wrong Thread. (Mods please Erase this and throw a U-Lock at my Macbook) :eek:


If you meant it in jest, then show a little jest. . . . (I got you, though, that was wicked funny)

[djg21]

This is just the thing. She isn't really a cyclist. She rode her bike downtown once.

What makes the "hipster" any more of a cyclist than the motorist? Maybe he just lost his driver's license after being convicted of a DUI? Is the gang-banger who rides a bike while engaging in a drive-by shooting also a "cyclist" entitled to special solicitude in your view? http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=735_1427441672

It's really too bad the cyclists couldn't get both sets of road ragers in trouble with the law instead of throwing the lock. . . . I just think that the escalation of the situation by the two ladies led to an entirely predictable outcome, and no reasonable justice system would hold the cyclist at fault here.

Again, you are presuming facts to support your world view, based on your "experience."

Interestingly, I read the statements and articles to suggest that after the driver initially confronted the "cyclist" (after the cyclist had confronted yet another driver about a perceived driving infraction), the cyclist escalated the conflict. Then, after the conflict had de-escalated, the two cyclists followed (stalked?) the driver so that they intentionally could re-engage her. The cyclist(s) apparently were out looking for a confrontation.

Maybe the driver was a jerk. But the cyclist was a bigger jerk, and the fact that he was on a bike made him no less so.

[Shortsocks]

If you meant it in jest, then show a little jest. . . . (I got you, though, that was wicked funny)


VeloM!! My Man.

So I didnt realize this. But there is an actual term for a Hipster throwing a U-Lock at a car. Been around for a while. So I guess she had it coming to her...

Its called : U-lock Justice

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=U-lock+Justice

"U-lock Justice

Using a 2-5 pound piece of steel, originally intended to lock a bike, to do cosmetic damage to a 2,000-10,000 pound piece of steel originally intended to transport human beings used to purposefully do physical, possibly lethal damage to a human being on a bicycle.

After being repeatedly honked at and passed very closely at high speeds I enacted U-Lock justice. The driver now might think twice before purposefully endangering the life of another human being."

[djg21]

VeloM!! My Man.

So I didnt realize this. But there is an actual term for a Hipster throwing a U-Lock at a car.

I thought it was "felon."

[djg21]

VeloM!! My Man.

So I didnt realize this. But there is an actual term for a Hipster throwing a U-Lock at a car. Been around for a while. So I guess she had it coming to her...

Its called : U-lock Justice

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=U-lock+Justice

"U-lock Justice

Using a 2-5 pound piece of steel, originally intended to lock a bike, to do cosmetic damage to a 2,000-10,000 pound piece of steel originally intended to transport human beings used to purposefully do physical, possibly lethal damage to a human being on a bicycle.

After being repeatedly honked at and passed very closely at high speeds I enacted U-Lock justice. The driver now might think twice before purposefully endangering the life of another human being."

http://bikesnobnyc.blogspot.com/2009/07/highlighting-inadequacy-casting-first-u.html

[Shortsocks]

http://bikesnobnyc.blogspot.com/2009/07/highlighting-inadequacy-casting-first-u.html

Wow, This is nuts. Ive never carried a U-Lock with me anywhere while riding. I must really be out of the loop. Even when Commuting, We had a Locker or office to put our rigs in. Mind Boggling to me. Those things are heavy. I have climber's arms. If I tried to throw one of those I would give myself Carpal Tunnel.

[fuzzalow]

This isn't worth belaboring because it is a altercation which is the result of misplaced priorities, perceived entitlements and a lack of driving skill. I'm putting it in this post rather than adding it to my other one here.

There is a pissing match going on here because the driver pulls up behind these likely militant bicyclists and fully expects them to part the waves and let her through. And the fact that she didn't just go around these "vehicles" in a public roadway tells me this driver's judgement is faulty and possibly her skill to complete a simple overtake on a dotted line divided roadway is nonexistent. So because her driving is incompetent, it forces her to impose on everyone else in the public roadway to do something different to make up for what she cannot do.

Kinda like the stupidity in suburban life of people that would put a sign in their rear window or a bumper sticker that said "CAUTION! Baby on Board!". The parents in this vehicle, like the daughter driving in this incident, cannot and should not expect any special treatment on the roadway above what the law allows everyone on the roadway to exercise as safe use of the road. But the fact that they gotta tell you their baby is in their car or a driver comes up behind something in the roadway and lays into the horn tells me they think they are special and worthy of privileged accommodation. Golly, aren't that special!

Somebody wants the roadway to themselves they should get themselves elected president and then the Secret Service and local PD will clear to road to anywhere they need to go.

Sure, the bicyclists were jerks. But they can't finish what the daughter didn't start if she had not demanded the right of way in a roadway and instead just passed them legally as the roadway allowed her to do.

Those bicyclists as militant fools is another topic altogether.

[velomonkey]

VeloM!! My Man.

So I didnt realize this. But there is an actual term for a Hipster throwing a U-Lock at a car. Been around for a while. So I guess she had it coming to her...

Its called : U-lock Justice

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=U-lock+Justice


Back in college I guy I worked with at the shop did some time for throwing a U Lock through a DC city bus (we called them kryptonite locks back then). Thing was, that wasn't the worst thing he ever did with a lock. Some security guard was given him grief for locking up his bike on the fence of a building - he locked the guy to the fence by putting the U lock around his neck.

Kid was loco. BTW, go check out "hot pocket" on urban dictionary - laugh for two days, but then go check your pullout sofa.

[mister]

i can't believe you guys are getting so hot and heavy about this
they are both a-holes

yeah dude shouldn't have thrown a lock at the ladies expensive BMW

the lady also shouldn't teach her daughter that it's ok to tail cyclists and honk at them for no reason other than to act like their mom

also that looks like a very calm and unoccupied street in that pic, if she wanted to pass she very easily could have passed them. she didn't want to though. she wanted to teach them a lesson...and she probably went out of her way to follow them.

[FastforaSlowGuy]

I thought it was "felon."


Haha! But very true. People here would be singing a different tune if a motorist chucked a roofing hammer at a cyclist. Either way, it takes things waaay beyond being a a-hole and goes right on into criminal activity.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Shortsocks]

Haha! But very true. People here would be singing a different tune if a motorist chucked a roofing hammer at a cyclist. Either way, it takes things waaay beyond being a a-hole and goes right on into criminal activity.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Lol. Sorry, that's a really good & hilarious point.

[JAllen]

This isn't worth belaboring because it is a altercation which is the result of misplaced priorities, perceived entitlements and a lack of driving skill. I'm putting it in this post rather than adding it to my other one here.

There is a pissing match going on here because the driver pulls up behind these likely militant bicyclists and fully expects them to part the waves and let her through. And the fact that she didn't just go around these "vehicles" in a public roadway tells me this driver's judgement is faulty and possibly her skill to complete a simple overtake on a dotted line divided roadway is nonexistent. So because her driving is incompetent, it forces her to impose on everyone else in the public roadway to do something different to make up for what she cannot do.

Kinda like the stupidity in suburban life of people that would put a sign in their rear window or a bumper sticker that said "CAUTION! Baby on Board!". The parents in this vehicle, like the daughter driving in this incident, cannot and should not expect any special treatment on the roadway above what the law allows everyone on the roadway to exercise as safe use of the road. But the fact that they gotta tell you their baby is in their car or a driver comes up behind something in the roadway and lays into the horn tells me they think they are special and worthy of privileged accommodation. Golly, aren't that special!

Somebody wants the roadway to themselves they should get themselves elected president and then the Secret Service and local PD will clear to road to anywhere they need to go.

Sure, the bicyclists were jerks. But they can't finish what the daughter didn't start if she had not demanded the right of way in a roadway and instead just passed them legally as the roadway allowed her to do.

Those bicyclists as militant fools is another topic altogether.
You is wise Mr. Fuzz.

[oldpotatoe]

"I can't believe the cyclist hating cyclists on this thread."

I can't believe a cyclist or anyone would try to rational the behavior of the asshat on the tall bike. He should have pulled over and let the car pass and ended the confrontation.

PS - Hate is one of the most overused words in the English language and should be used sparingly by adults. Using it to label people who write or say things that you disagree with is pretty lame.

Agree..hate is a really big word and I doubt few of us actually 'hate' anybody.

I hate sram tho....:eek:

[DHallerman]

Who the hell locks up a stupid looking bike like that? That bike has anti theft styling. The only way that would get stolen around here is if you left it too close to the curb the night before trash day.

Well, obviously this fellow doesn't need to lock up his bike, since he was so clearly ready to throw the lock away.

[fuzzalow]

Daughter/Mother drove a Bimmer? Hadn't noticed.

That bicyclist should not have tossed a u-lock but then again, that is one gritty aspect of street justice that is a part of the hipster's world and NOT remotely any part of the inward looking, indulgent isolation of car culture or middle-class consumerism.

I can almost side with the hipsters on this only because I have such a vehement disdain and disgust for the revolting combination of bad driving and self-preoccupation. Imbecile behind the wheel forgot what the DMV driving manual said about what a dotted line means in a roadway. That entire confrontation was unnecessary.

The world is a crowded and an increasingly less civil place, not a good idea to think that a person doesn't bother anyone else because they were just minding their own business. Stupid, oblivious people fall prey to behavior like that but it doesn't work because there is always somebody near by. Mostly. Plus it is just a reasonable thing as to not be a dick with and around other people. An idea long lost to them is that simple common courtesy goes a long way towards keeping the peace. But turn it into a turf war and nobody will want to give up anything.

This obliviousness is partly the price we pay as an indulged consumer society. There are strata across society and you can limit interactions to those you prefer to be around only to some degree. But on a public roadway is no place to feel especially entitled - case in point Middle Class Bimmer v.s. Hipster Street Justice. RTFM.

Incidents like this will get lots of traction with the general public and will only serve to outrage the general public against bicyclists.

[Grant McLean]

Incidents like this will get lots of traction with the general public and will only serve to outrage the general public against bicyclists.

They also reinforce false categories like "drivers" and "cyclists".
About 90% of the adult age population holds a drivers licence,
at some point, these kinds of headlines should just read:
"Two idiots have altercation in public".

Most of the irate reaction to stereotypes is the textbook definition
of prejudice; evaluation of another person based on their membership of a group.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prejudice

[fuzzalow]

They also reinforce false categories like "drivers" and "cyclists".
About 90% of the adult age population holds a drivers licence,
at some point, these kinds of headlines should just read:
"Two idiots have altercation in public".

Most of the irate reaction to stereotypes is the textbook definition
of prejudice; evaluation of another person based on their membership of a group.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prejudice

Agree but sadly it is not likely to ever happen. North America will never be the Netherlands.

I honestly think that as ridiculous as these "two idiots" in this incident happen to be, the driver was the instigator of this entire mess and the fallout in the form of the reaction from the hipster was the unfortunate result.

We, as cyclists, in the eyes of the general public, get lumped together with that hipster moron and his actions. Even though I think hipster moron was pushed into his actions by the inadvertently stupid driving of daughter driver.

Inadvertently used here in the sense that daughter driver did not purposely bait and intend to irritate hipster moron by honking her horn or tailgating him or whatever she might have done leading up to hipster moron throwing a u-lock at her car. Daughter driver just didn't know how else to handle the situation which makes her an imbecile because laws and procedure governing public road use are spelled out in the DMV Driver Manual she is presumed to have read and understood prior to receiving her operator's license. As she had her mother sitting next to her and not correctly advising her to go around the bicyclists to pass, mother passenger is an imbecile too.

These are conditions that can be a convincing half truth that plays well against the bicyclists and bodes well for the incompetent, error-laden daughter driver: she will honestly claim she doesn't understand why this happened as she honestly and truly had done no wrong. Being oblivious, ignorant and incompetent can be very convincing in the court of public opinion with other drivers that are as clueless as she. That does not mean that she was correct or operated her vehicle properly.

We, as cyclists, have to be on good behaviour all the time, because we will not catch a break in a public relations war with the general public. Motor vehicle operators are every bit as stupid as we are as cyclists. But we have an uphill to climb as far as acceptance and they don't and our mistakes are more costly to our image.

[JAllen]

Agree but sadly it is not likely to ever happen. North America will never be the Netherlands.

I honestly think that as ridiculous as these "two idiots" in this incident happen to be, the driver was the instigator of this entire mess and the fallout in the form of the reaction from the hipster was the unfortunate result.

We, as cyclists, in the eyes of the general public, get lumped together with that hipster moron and his actions. Even though I think hipster moron was pushed into his actions by the inadvertently stupid driving of daughter driver.

Inadvertently used here in the sense that daughter driver did not purposely bait and intend to irritate hipster moron by honking her horn or tailgating him or whatever she might have done leading up to hipster moron throwing a u-lock at her car. Daughter driver just didn't know how else to handle the situation which makes her an imbecile because laws and procedure governing public road use are spelled out in the DMV Driver Manual she is presumed to have read and understood prior to receiving her operator's license. As she had her mother sitting next to her and not correctly advising her to go around the bicyclists to pass, mother passenger is an imbecile too.

These are conditions that can be a convincing half truth that plays well against the bicyclists and bodes well for the incompetent, error-laden daughter driver: she will honestly claim she doesn't understand why this happened as she honestly and truly had done no wrong. Being oblivious, ignorant and incompetent can be very convincing in the court of public opinion with other drivers that are as clueless as she. That does not mean that she was correct or operated her vehicle properly.

We, as cyclists, have to be on good behaviour all the time, because we will not catch a break in a public relations war with the general public. Motor vehicle operators are every bit as stupid as we are as cyclists. But we have an uphill to climb as far as acceptance and they don't and our mistakes are more costly to our image.
Again you've nailed it. There is hardly any legal punishment for people being clueless. Like you said, the jury is probably just as clueless. Sadly, but I think it'll take a few drivers being completely crucified for people to take the education process seriously.

[Grant McLean]

I honestly think that as ridiculous as these "two idiots" in this incident happen to be, the driver was the instigator of this entire mess and the fallout in the form of the reaction from the hipster was the unfortunate result.


A smarter person than me once said,
"Life isn't about what happens to you, but how you react to it"

An instigator requires a instigated. Personally, I just stop on the side
of the road and let whatever is bugging me disappear out of sight.
But it probably took me 25 years of riding to realize this.

-g

[fuzzalow]

A smarter person than me once said,
"Life isn't about what happens to you, but how you react to it"

Point taken and reasonable within the realm of the (mostly) rational found on this forum. Not sure it applies to the outward manner in which these two hipsters seem to simultaneously ride their bikes and parade their politics.

An instigator requires a instigated. Personally, I just stop on the side
of the road and let whatever is bugging me disappear out of sight.
But it probably took me 25 years of riding to realize this.

Not for these two. Acquiescence is antithetical to militancy.

BTW: I am surprised no one has noticed this. Because you know that for all the contrived insouciant cool these hipsters try to pass off, behind it goes sometimes some degree of thought and some imagination.

Hipster biker on the right has two different color socks on. His take on navigation lighting with green sock to denote passing on the left and red sock to denote no passing on the right. Clever.

John Lennon called it right for me in writing "Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans."

Nice talking to you.

[JeffS]

We, as cyclists, in the eyes of the general public, get lumped together with that hipster moron and his actions. Even though I think hipster moron was pushed into his actions by the inadvertently stupid driving of daughter driver.

Really?

"hipster moron" - adds what to the conversation?

And why were the motorists actions inadvertent? Female? Young? Mother's narrative?

The baseless assumptions throughout this thread only serve to expose the prejudices of the speaker. We already knew this was largely a forum of bicycle owning motorists. I suspect a loud mouthed wife, or a clueless daughter in a BMW hits closer to home for most than transportational city cycling.

---

We hear much from cyclists bemoaning others "reflecting negatively" on them. Typically from those pissing off motorists with their pacelines, complaining about urban riders running lights.

Question though... is this girl more or less likely to repeat her behavior (intentional or inadvertent) the next time?

Some people are incapable of good behavior without the fear of consequences. Motorists have no such fear. They can harass, injure and kill with impunity, and frequently do.

[JAllen]

Some people are incapable of good behavior without the fear of consequences. Motorists have no such fear. They can harass, injure and kill with impunity, and frequently do.

I think this is exactly what motivates bad driving behavior. Among, as Fuzz pointed out, complete cluelessness (maybe some are willfully ignorant too) by drivers, and a system of education and enforcement that breeds a status quo of complacency.

Sure, there has been prejudice throughout this thread, but I feel that we should ask why there is that prejudice in the first place. I think it sprouts from a certain level of truth that is experienced by a person that leads them to the further generalizing judgements. Unfortunately, little is done by folks to repent that behavior or mindset that leads others to prejudice. Not to justify prejudice either, but when you break it down it's easy to see why we come to that.

[fuzzalow]

Really?

Yes really! C'mon, lighten up, we're just takin' here.

"hipster moron" - adds what to the conversation?

A nickname playfully given to identify a character in a sad story. "Hipster" because the rider fit the genotype appearance and "moron" because he threw a u-lock, arguably provoked, at a stranger in a roadway. I actually side with this guy in this ridiculous tale.:eek:

And why were the motorists actions inadvertent? Female? Young? Mother's narrative?

HaHa! Fourth paragraph in the post, yeah the one that starts with "Inadvertently used here in the sense that daughter driver did not purposely bait..." etc etc. Where are you going with this?:confused:

The baseless assumptions throughout this thread only serve to expose the prejudices of the speaker. We already knew this was largely a forum of bicycle owning motorists. I suspect a loud mouthed wife, or a clueless daughter in a BMW hits closer to home for most than transportational city cycling.

---

We hear much from cyclists bemoaning others "reflecting negatively" on them. Typically from those pissing off motorists with their pacelines, complaining about urban riders running lights.

Question though... is this girl more or less likely to repeat her behavior (intentional or inadvertent) the next time?

Answer here: Likely to continue unless someone points out otherwise to her to do differently. Not gonna come from her mother! Conjecture on my part, yes but I had given my reasoning why. See paragraph four. Again, where are you going with this?:confused:

Some people are incapable of good behavior without the fear of consequences. Motorists have no such fear. They can harass, injure and kill with impunity, and frequently do.

I'd agree that most motorists are resistant to learning, largely because in their ego & ignorance that think they are more skillful than they are. I do not agree that they can harass, injure & kill with impunity. The deck is stacked against bicyclists but there are still laws enforced.

Dunno what you are whinging about here other than the manner of my post. That is all I can guess is the point of your post because you do not raise a point of your own that we can toss around. No problem for me as long as it was good for you!:beer:

[velomonkey]

"Hipster bike rider" - "BMW Driver" lot of labeling going on here. . . .

I present you my car keys.

BMW car key on a Chrome key chain - Chrome being a brand most associated with urban hipster bike riders - BMW being associated with ASSHAT drivers.

I find the mold and I break it.

I appreciate my firefly bike, my chrome bags and my BMW car because they all share a significant trait - well designed, long-lasting, good-looking craftsmanship.

[bobswire]

"Hipster bike rider" - "BMW Driver" lot of labeling going on here. . . .

I present you my car keys.

BMW car key on a Chrome key chain - Chrome being a brand most associated with urban hipster bike riders - BMW being associated with ASSHAT drivers.

I find the mold and I break it.

I appreciate my firefly bike, my chrome bags and my BMW car because they all share a significant trait - well designed, long-lasting, good-looking craftsmanship.

Now if I was a mod I'd let this be the last word.

[JAllen]

"Hipster bike rider" - "BMW Driver" lot of labeling going on here. . . .

I present you my car keys.

BMW car key on a Chrome key chain - Chrome being a brand most associated with urban hipster bike riders - BMW being associated with ASSHAT drivers.

I find the mold and I break it.

I appreciate my firefly bike, my chrome bags and my BMW car because they all share a significant trait - well designed, long-lasting, good-looking craftsmanship.
Or you're the most hated person on earth! Jest. :)

[Louis]

So now we know for sure - Velomonkey is a Yuppie Hipster.

[xjoex]

Back in college I guy I worked with at the shop did some time for throwing a U Lock through a DC city bus (we called them kryptonite locks back then). Thing was, that wasn't the worst thing he ever did with a lock. Some security guard was given him grief for locking up his bike on the fence of a building - he locked the guy to the fence by putting the U lock around his neck.

Kid was loco.

I was acquaintances with a guy in DC who U-locked his neck to a fur store door. He was under house arrest for a while for that. Wonder if it was the same guy. Had "vegan" on his collarbone. Which was outrages in the early 90s.

-Joe

[xjoex]

All of this could be avoided by the bike riders pulling over and letting someone pass.

Does this feel good? No.
Does it change the world? No
Does it keep you out of the hospital and newspaper for throwing U-locks? Yes

Seriously, engaging in this type of fight is just a waste of time. You aren't going to change anyones mind and they have a 4000 pound car that can seriously injury you.

-Joe

[JAllen]

I was acquaintances with a guy in DC who U-locked his neck to a fur store door. He was under house arrest for a while for that. Wonder if it was the same guy. Had "vegan" on his collarbone. Which was outrages in the early 90s.

-Joe
Though it would undermine the point of the protest, he could have passed the blame to get out of it... "it was some butt head on a tall bike riding to his BMW getaway car!"

[velomonkey]

I was acquaintances with a guy in DC who U-locked his neck to a fur store door. He was under house arrest for a while for that. Wonder if it was the same guy. Had "vegan" on his collarbone. Which was outrages in the early 90s.

-Joe

This dude was named Pete (I'm like 95% sure, it's been a long time). He was nuts, a women came in the shop and he asked if she needed help, she said yea, he said "well I don't know anything about dishwashing machines" - didn't go over well. We went out night riding one time and then to pizza at Maggies the local college hole and he got me a date with a waitress by asking her if she thought I was attractive - dude set the whole thing up, I never, ever could have done it without him. I don't recall the vegan tat, though.