One to one gear for Campagnolo 11 Mt Washington

[50Lombardy]

Climbing Mt Washington soon. I have a compact front (34) crank that I don't want to change. But need a hack for a 34 rear cog with Campy 11. I have a long cage rear derailleur I may be able to make work. Any thoughts on cassette options? Do I go to an 11 speed Shimano MTB cog set to make it work? Thank you for ideas.

[oldpotatoe]

Climbing Mt Washington soon. I have a compact front (34) crank that I don't want to change. But need a hack for a 34 rear cog with Campy 11. I have a long cage rear derailleur I may be able to make work. Any thoughts on cassette options? Do I go to an 11 speed Shimano MTB cog set to make it work? Thank you for ideas.

Yup, shimano or (horrors) spam 11s in 11-34...Probably longer chain.

[donevwil]

Assuming you don't have a wheel with a Shimano freehub, IRD make a wide range 11-32 Campy 11 compatible cassette, but no 34. I use the IRD Campy 10 11-34 and it's perfectly functional.

[Climb01742]

While a 1:1 ratio is great insurance, both physically and psychologically, I rode much more of MW in my 34-30. Can Campy get you to that gearing?

[oldpotatoe]

While a 1:1 ratio is great insurance, both physically and psychologically, I rode much more of MW in my 34-30. Can Campy get you to that gearing?

No, not 11s..12-29...

[jdp211]

Along these lines, what rear mech are you planning on using to take up that much chain? A 50/34 with a 12-30(or bigger) would need a long cage right?


Sent from my spacephone

[Ralph]

Along these lines, what rear mech are you planning on using to take up that much chain? A 50/34 with a 12-30(or bigger) would need a long cage right?


Sent from my spacephone

Current Campagnolo 11 Short Cage RD will handle a 34-50 and 12-29 (that's all they make for double).

However for a 10 speed and old RD and a 12-30, I think a Med cage does that best, but OP has experience making a short cage work for that also. Has a lot to do with the derailleur, how clever you are setting it up, etc.

For 11-34 and a 34-50 11's, you will probably need the Athena long cage from the triple (no med cage available for 11's). I have a friend who also thinks a IRD for Campy 11 is functional. He just said it worked OK.

[old fat man]

Current Campagnolo 11 Short Cage RD will handle a 34-50 and 12-29 (that's all they make for double).

However for a 10 speed and old RD and a 12-30, I think a Med cage does that best, but OP has experience making a short cage work for that also. Has a lot to do with the derailleur, how clever you are setting it up, etc.

For 11-34 and a 34-50 11's, you will probably need the Athena long cage from the triple (no med cage available for 11's). I have a friend who also thinks a IRD for Campy 11 is functional. He just said it worked OK.

You don't need to accommodate the 50 tooth for this ride. Single ring up front and as big as you can go in back. Short cage will be fine if you ignore the 50

[Ralph]

You don't need to accommodate the 50 tooth for this ride. Single ring up front and as big as you can go in back. Short cage will be fine if you ignore the 50

Well....there you have it. Just make the chain short enough to pull the upper pulley back out of the way of the huge 34 cog with a short cage. Forget wrapping the 50. I think I would disconnect the front cable just to be safe.

[AngryScientist]

with the athena-11 RD, all things are possible. good stuff.

http://www.jejamescycles.co.uk/item-images-large/campagnolo-athena-11x-triple-rear-mech-220818.jpg

[Louis]

Given how consistent the grade appears to be (except for the last killer section), I think the OP should be the stud who does it on a single-speed.

(Or if he wants to be a real hero, he could always go fixed...)

http://www.northeastcycling.com/Hillclimb_Races_files/wash_gr.jpg

[AngryScientist]

(Or if he wants to be a real hero, he could always go fixed...)


i'm not familiar with this climb, but if the day is truly just up the mtn, low geared fixed is actually not a bad idea at all.

[christian]

Climbing is actually a little easier on a fix, I find. Your momentum powers you over the dead spot in the pedal stroke just a tiny bit or something.

[Louis]

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b289/DDYTDY/IMG_4532.jpg

[Ken Robb]

Climbing is actually a little easier on a fix, I find. Your momentum powers you over the dead spot in the pedal stroke just a tiny bit or something.

I can imagine the possibility of some wildly thrashing legs trying to control a fixie on the way down. :)

[572cv]

Done this climb, in the annual race, way back in time..... This is a tricky climb, in that there is no respite. If you go anaerobic, you are done, no recovery point. So you settle into a gear you can handle and cruise up. There is a flat stretch right at the start, but after that, it's all hill. So, in a sense, a fixed gear could work if it were low enough. A lot of guys in my flight went by me at the start, but I passed all by the end with the careful and steady approach. And, you did not ride down in the race, as either your brakes would be toast, or your tires would explode. When I did it I was on tubulars.
It is a great ride, chapeau to you for your success!

[merckx]

I've done the race three times. The challenge of using a fixed gear will be the potential to experience extreme weather conditions. You may determine the perfect single gear to use for the average grade in ideal weather conditions, but ideal weather rarely exists on the mountain. I've encountered 30+ mph head wind on the 18 % cinder stretch and wished I had a lower gear. You just never know what you will encounter. Choose some stupid low gears that you will never use because you will need them.

[NHAero]

I rode it fixed in 1975 and single speed in 1976. Fixed I had a 20T front and rear - made the front cog from a Sturmey Archer 3 speed cog. Single speed I went down to 18T in the rear but had worse weather and rode 11 minutes slower than the year before, 1:24:15 vs 1:13:30. This was on the bike that I built as an engineering bachelor's thesis in college.

The tubing label was a gift at the time from Sheldon Brown.

[fiamme red]

http://blayleys.blogspot.com/2013/07/mt-washington-demands-respect.html

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-1bLdcic5aY4/Ueg1cP5w8VI/AAAAAAAAScY/-lAJahFS7Dg/s400/R0014037.jpg

[m_sasso]

You want silly, Mount Washington on a Citibike!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfneUUh_1ko

[Louis]

You want silly, Mount Washington on a Citibike!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfneUUh_1ko

That's insane!

[50Lombardy]

Thanks for all the great advice. I have a Campy 10 shifter and a medium cage derailleur, so it looks like it might be best to go with the IRD cog set and change out the front lever and see how that works. The fixie for my second trip up!

[gfk_velo]

with the athena-11 RD, all things are possible. good stuff.

http://www.jejamescycles.co.uk/item-images-large/campagnolo-athena-11x-triple-rear-mech-220818.jpg

You have to remember that maximum sprocket size is not influenced by cage length. Cage length is about the total tooth differences of chainset and cassette added together.

A Campagnolo triple RD doesn't allow a larger biggest sprocket than a double - it does allow you to run a triple front (bigger total tooth difference ...)

On some frames with a longer rear hanger, it is technically possible to run a bigger sprocket than 29 with correct wraparound on the bigger sprockets but shifting at the other end of the cassette may be compromised as the amount of free chain between the upper jockey and the sprocket will be increased over the normal spec.

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd
Campagnolo Main UK Technical and Service Centre

[oldpotatoe]

You have to remember that maximum sprocket size is not influenced by cage length. Cage length is about the total tooth differences of chainset and cassette added together.

A Campagnolo triple RD doesn't allow a larger biggest sprocket than a double - it does allow you to run a triple front (bigger total tooth difference ...)

On some frames with a longer rear hanger, it is technically possible to run a bigger sprocket than 29 but shifting at the other end of the cassette may be compromised.

HTH
Graeme
Velotech Cycling Ltd
Campagnoloo Main UK Technical and Service Centre

It DOES, however, allow to you to have enough chain length, on a double and MTB type cogset, to be able to go big-big w/o breaking a chain and small-small w/o a droopy chain. Remember Campagnolo itself recommended a 'medium' cage for 13-28 and doubles(9s) and 13-29(10s), from the outset.

I have 'modified' many bikes, with a double or triple crank up front, Campagnolo 10s, and then a long cage rear der, and a 9s MTB cogset on a shimano wheel. Like a 11-34...for tourists. OR a double, and MTB cogsets for shimano, like a XT 9s rear der...same principal.

Sometimes ya gotta just try it to see...like a 2015 front der on 2014 or older ERGO...OOOOPs, works great.

[AngryScientist]

A Campagnolo triple RD doesn't allow a larger biggest sprocket than a double - it does allow you to run a triple front (bigger total tooth difference ...)



i'm not sure how those things are necessarily mutually exclusive. i DO know that with a triple 11-sp RD, i can run a compact crankset (50/34) and an 11-32 in the rear and access all gear ratios, no problemo.

[oldpotatoe]

i'm not sure how those things are necessarily mutually exclusive. i DO know that with a triple 11-sp RD, i can run a compact crankset (50/34) and an 11-32 in the rear and access all gear ratios, no problemo.

Cuz Campagnolo only makes a 29t lowest gear for 11s and 30t for 10s.

Yup, shimano 11s rear wheel, long cage Athena rear der, 11-32/4, works great.

[mistermo]

I've been trying to figure out the same: a viable Campy 1:1 option, or at least close to it. I emailed IRD asking for confirmation that the "regular" cage Campy 11 derailleurs would work with their 11-32 cassettes and this is the response I got:

"According to the experts at large, the reason that these 11 speed cassettes will work with the short cage, is that the short cage does not exist. Everything is now the functional equivalent of a medium cage.

Eliminating, the need for the Mid cage designation.

So, the 11-30 and 12-30, of course will work just fine, as will the 11-32 and 12-32. You will have to trim that angle screw all the way in to get clearance for the larger cassettes...."

Narrowing the gap further, TA Specialites makes a 33t 110 chainring.

Last year, for a similar ride, I used a Campy triple with a 30t inner ring, mated to a 11-30 cassette. It worked great, but I was going down too, along with the climbs.

I've also used a 10s Campy shifter with a 10s med derailleur on a 32t IRD cog and it's been fine.

YMMV

From the suggestions here, it sounds like a single ring up front is the ticket, but I thought I'd share my experience.

[benb]

I've done this twice and I've done Ascutney more than once as well as Equinox and a few others.

What kind of shape are you in and what kind of time are you going for?

First time I did it was my 2nd year cycling, I was in no way ready for it, and I attempted it with a 39x27.. I finished in like 1:45 or something and had to walk a few places.. way too tall on the gearing. But at the time I didn't even really know how to build a bike so I wasn't in a position to figure out how to modify the bike myself.

2nd time I did it I put a compact crank on and set up with my MTB derailleur + cassette so I had 34x34. I finished in 1:23 and did a ton better. But that gearing was actually probably too easy.. I had more in the tank and would have gotten in under the magic 1:20 figure if I had forced myself not to use the 34x34. If I did it again and dieted down to the same weight I would go with 34x30.

But for a few of the other races what I did was put my triple front cranks on from the MTB and ran without a front derailleur or the 2 big rings at all.. then I ran a 12-25 in the back with the normal road derailleur. This was the best setup. I had a 22x25 or something. This has the extra benefit that you don't have to worry about all the incompatibilities between road and MTB gear these days.

So if you have access to a MTB crank go do that and you don't have to worry about any compatibility issues at all.

I would agree with what someone else said, be prepared for weather on Mt. Washington, both times I did it I had to "dab" due to the wind blowing me off the road. You need to choose your gearing with that in mind.

[Likes2ridefar]

my friend won it last year using a standard crankset and 28T rear cassette. :eek:

I tried to convince him a few times before the race to at least use a compact but he refused. I was pretty surprised when I saw him first up the mountain being already convinced he would go anaerobic due to the tall gearing and never recover.

[Rusty Luggs]

Having a 1:1 gearing option is a reasonable starting point for Mt. Washington, IMHO.
If you want to test and see if you have a low enough gear, Ascutney (VT) is a decent place to do that – you can ride the park summit road for a couple bucks. Again, IMO, if your gear is too tough for Ascutney, it will be too tough for Mt. Washington as well.

[sc53]

You want silly, Mount Washington on a Citibike!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfneUUh_1ko

Thanks for posting this! That is what I wanted to post too--I watched this a few months ago and thought I'd puke. INSANE doesn't even begin to describe this feat.

[Mark McM]

Question:

Why don't you want to change the crank? Frequently converting a drivetrain to "Mt. Washington specific" is easier by simply using a crank that has a smaller chainring (such as triple road crank or an MTB crank), and possibly shortening the chain. This is a very common configuration.

For my Mt. Washington gearing, I keep my standard road cassette and road derailleur, and replace the road crank with an MTB crank. The variation in grade on the climb are small enought that the middle and large chainrings are not required, so they are removed along with the front derailleur.The two large chainrings are removed, leaving just the small chainring. This simplifies shifting and reduces weight. This picture isn't my bike, but it looks very similar to my configuration (except I remove the front derailler):

http://photos.scottosphere.org/2010/mtwashington-practiceride/IMG2447/955673339_CBHNM-S.jpg

[Climb01742]

One other MW tip: practice remounting your bike while going across, not up, a very narrow road. One year we faced 60+ mph winds and I got blown off twice. Remounting on a severe incline, pushing a tiny gear, while not falling off a mountain, is not a skill you need every day but one that could mean you don't gotta walk on MW.;)

[Cornfed]

You want silly, Mount Washington on a Citibike!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfneUUh_1ko

Supremely disappointed we didn't get to see him ride it back down. ;)