Can someone please explain the Slowtwitch Classifieds to me?

[Shortsocks]

Hey folks.

This is NOT meant to a flame against Slowtwitch or Triathletes.

So I've bought and sold here many time on the classifieds section. And I've had nothing but positive experiences. In fact I've given many parts away, clothes on cold days, or just overall help to fellow cyclists in need. But overall I've had a wonderful time here on Pace.

I do go to other sites too. WW, VeloSal, Slowtwitch and I've sold and bought on all of them. But SlowTwitch is odd to me. And maybe it's just me but can someone explain the mentality over there, specifically at the classifieds section?

Last week I sold something there. Actually 9 days ago, and Immediately after my transaction was complete I wrote a review on the buyer, actually he was local too. Today I checked ST and no one has written ONE review. Not one after me. I know for sure people have bought and sold there in the last past 9 days. I find that really odd because here there are at least a dozen reviews every day, at least.

But there are things I notice there which I also find odd.

-Why do people make open NON private offers publicly on the sale thread?
-Why do people there seem to think they can get msrp or full price on used items?

Is it a triathlete mentality? I just don't know, but maybe I've been spoiled here by the extremely friendly group of folks. But I don't find it particularly fun or laid back.

Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of very helpful and considerate people. But what is it about that place? Has anyone else noticed this or have anything to add?

* this IS NOT meant to flame triathletes or ST. Just an open thoughts/conversation.

[Uncle Jam's Army]

Pikers . . . . there's no explanation for them. :p










Just kidding!

[John H.]

I wouldn't say that ST is any better or worse than selling here.
Different crowd but same behavior.
Lots of tire kickers.

[bcroslin]

Hey folks.

Is it a triathlete mentality?

The last thing you want to do is try to understand triathletes.

[Gummee]

I've bought and sold a bit of stuff over there. Its a different crowd, that's for sure.

All I can say is 'different sites work differently.'

M

[Hank Scorpio]

So young upwardly mobile would be golfers pay top dollar for the latest doo dad only to discover they are as slow or slower than they were before and sell up before 200 miles. Tire kickers galore over there too. Ask for 10 million pictures of every square millimeter of whatever the hell you are selling then disappear when it is time to pay up.

Do you have a minute? I will tell you how I really feel.

[KonaSS]

OK - I will probably get bashed for this. This is admittedly a stereotype and over generalization. But I have bought a couple things on slowtwitch and had a couple bad experiences, so I don't visit there much anymore.

One, yes I think they tend to overprice/overpay for used items. But mostly my stereotype and bad experience is that triathletes don't tend to take very good care of their gear. It always has excessive wear and tear, and is dirty, greasy and not maintained. Maybe they are too busy taking care of their running, swimming gear and bike gear to take care of everything properly.

[charliedid]

Go ask on Slowtwitch...

[ergott]

All you need to know is they pee on their bikes.

[Gummee]

OK - I will probably get bashed for this. This is admittedly a stereotype and over generalization. But I have bought a couple things on slowtwitch and had a couple bad experiences, so I don't visit there much anymore.

One, yes I think they tend to overprice/overpay for used items. But mostly my stereotype and bad experience is that triathletes don't tend to take very good care of their gear. It always has excessive wear and tear, and is dirty, greasy and not maintained. Maybe they are too busy taking care of their running, swimming gear and bike gear to take care of everything properly.

I've heard 'I'm too busy' or other such lame excuses, but ultimately it boils down to (typically) triathletes are runners or swimmers that have to ride, not cyclists that run and swim.

They don't have the same 'mechanical sympathy' as the enthusiast cyclist would for their bike.

Its something they *have* to do rather than something they *want* to do

My $.02 on triathletes

M

[Highpowernut]

As a Tri guy.
I bike cuz it's fun, not cuz I have too. Running sucks, swimming is what I do to get to my bike.

All that aside , slow twitch is a weird place. I've been burnt there twice and will not go back.
I read a lot of the general forum and post occasionally. Really think this is a good group and peer moderation is as good as any rules put in place. Bad people get flamed here and leave accordingly.

Honor is what you do when when no one is looking

[batman1425]

I've bought and sold a few things on ST - no terrible experiences - but a lot more window shopping, tire-kicking, and backing out last minute for no good reason stuff.

The public offers often come from folks that haven't met the minimum posting limits for PMs so they publicly post their offer or give an email address to contact them outside of the site.

I know this is stereotyping, but generally speaking, I don't see Tri folks making a connection to the sport and their equipment in the way that people here do. They don't talk about their new custom metal frame, or the hand built wheels they had made for the type of riding or racing they like to do, or pictures from the latest ride they did. They talk about wind tunnel data from the latest rim/frame/aerobar that debuted, power transfer, FTP, and bricks. Their focus is training, competition. The gear becomes a tool, not much more, and as a result the stuff often gets ridden hard and put away wet.

There are plenty of cyclists that have that same perspective, but Paceline doesn't select for that type of cyclist. As such, the people here tend to be the lifers that see their bikes as a way to express themselves and what they like about riding - including taking pride in maintaining it.

[jmoore]

The last thing you want to do is try to understand triathletes.

^this. LOL.



I mean tri-guys wear socks that are below their ankle or, gasp, no socks when they ride! That's just crazy-town

[Highpowernut]

All you need to know is they pee on their bikes.


That's funny as hell, cuz it's true

[BdaGhisallo]

I've heard 'I'm too busy' or other such lame excuses, but ultimately it boils down to (typically) triathletes are runners or swimmers that have to ride, not cyclists that run and swim.

They don't have the same 'mechanical sympathy' as the enthusiast cyclist would for their bike.

Its something they *have* to do rather than something they *want* to do

My $.02 on triathletes

M


Exactly. Folks who frequent this site are cyclists. They know and love the sport and care about all aspects of it and the equipment they use to engage in it.

Triathletes are usually athletes who ride bikes. There is a big difference.

[Cicli]

Anyone who has ever spent any time behind the service counter at a bike shop knows that tri bikes are usually filthy and trashed. That's just how those people roll. I dont know how they get sports drink and Gu on everything but they do.

[ultraman6970]

Easy... they do what they think is right :D like the guy using the helmet backwards :P

[charliedid]

Actually, the difference is that Triathlete's are competitors and need to ride in order to compete. And believe it or not, there are loads of Tri folks who are good bike handlers who like and have nice bikes. They are constantly looking for more speed and an edge.

That is very different from this place, where most people seem to cherish their precious bikes out of the belief that they are showing it respect that no Triathlete could understand.

Triathletes buy stuff to help them win, cyclists buy stuff to feel good and some buy stuff to show off.

Don't confuse cyclists with "bike racers" because most of them are the same as triathletes.

I'm a cyclist.

[Shortsocks]

Okay. So some of these explanations solidify my initial impressions some views I didn't actually think of. But I actually agree with them as well.

One thing I do like about ST is how I see new parts that I didn't even know existed and if I did they sometimes find amazing ways to integrate them to their rigs and help them get an edge.....which isn't always a good thing but sometimes is I suppose.

A couple of things I have noticed that some others brought up though is the Classifieds section at ST, is more of a place JUST to buy and sell. That's it. Here on Pace it is more of a community, where people seem to give each other hands, advice and occasional "Dancing Banana". As seen on the reviews, this place seems to bring people toghther and that's just what maybe brings a community together.

But the thing about Tri people, I forgot is that they are "Athletes" and not all of them care much about keeping a bike clean, or maintained in a OCD manner. Cyclists, hopefully including myself, take our rigs to a friendship level.

I do wish ST was a little more organized though, because I'm always more hesitant there to buy things.

[shovelhd]

I've bought and sold in both forums extensively, all for personal use so condition matters. I haven't found any difference in this regard. There are lots of CX racers here selling equipment and CX can be very hard on it, yet I don't see the angst in that direction. As always buyer beware. Ask all the right questions up front.

There are no bro deals on ST nor is there any expectation for them. There are good deals though. Unlike here, if items are offered at a fair price they simply sell. There's not a lot of haggling. ST is not inundated with flippers. It's more of a classic classified space.

[CunegoFan]

Triathletes buy stuff to help them win, cyclists buy stuff to feel good and some buy stuff to show off.


Triathletes are people having a mid-life crisis who buy stuff to place 23rd in their age group rather than 24th and they think that really really matters even though they are killing it in their actual profession.

[bcroslin]

There are lots of CX racers here selling equipment and CX can be very hard on it, yet I don't see the angst in that direction.

I beg your pardon sir. I would never piss on my CX rig.

(but I would ride it through shin-high mud for 45 mins and then wonder why the BB is trashed)

[Shortsocks]

There are no bro deals on ST nor is there any expectation for them. There are good deals though. Unlike here, if items are offered at a fair price they simply sell. There's not a lot of haggling.

That's a VERY good point. Here when I sell something, I always price it WELL below ebay and even then I price it to a point where it's senseless to haggle but I know that a cyclist here will use it, and appreciate the price. It's not worth it to me, the 5 or 10 extra bucks, that I could charge for an item to have it just sit here while I BUMP......Bump.....bump...just sell it, help out a Paceliner and then in turn spend the money here 20 mins later buying someone else's part. It's pretty easy.

[cderalow]

I've heard 'I'm too busy' or other such lame excuses, but ultimately it boils down to (typically) triathletes are runners or swimmers that have to ride, not cyclists that run and swim.

They don't have the same 'mechanical sympathy' as the enthusiast cyclist would for their bike.

Its something they *have* to do rather than something they *want* to do

My $.02 on triathletes

M

The triathletes I know are like this. None of them are cyclists at heart. They're swimmers or runners (or both) who see the bike as an extension of their sport.

none of them seem to maintain their equipment (routine clean & lube are foreign concepts to them). so much so that one of them (a female friend) had cables on her bike that were so frayed they broke off in the middle of her frame (how they didn't snap at the pinch bolt first is beyond me)

^this. LOL.



I mean tri-guys wear socks that are below their ankle or, gasp, no socks when they ride! That's just crazy-town

I wear ankle length or below angle length socks as a cyclist. how else am I supposed to show off the gnarly chain ring scar

[odin99]

another stereotype is that cyclists like hating on triathletes... I'm seeing some of that here. lets all just get along. we share the same roads and that unites us in a way.

[Shortsocks]

I wear ankle length or below angle length socks as a cyclist. how else am I supposed to show off the gnarly chain ring scar

I also wear below the ankle "Shortsocks" hence the name. I can't stand long socks. They bug the hell out of me. I looked moronic as it is with my chicken legs...I look even more moronic with a horrible sock Tan. That, and I have sexy ass ankles. What can I say?

[shovelhd]

another stereotype is that cyclists like hating on triathletes... I'm seeing some of that here. lets all just get along. we share the same roads and that unites us in a way.

Another misconception is that ST is exclusively triathlon. It's not.

[charliedid]

Triathletes are people having a mid-life crisis who buy stuff to place 23rd in their age group rather than 24th and they think that really really matters even though they are killing it in their actual profession.

Just like every other amature athlete the world over.

[deechee]

Sigh. ST has over 75k users, Paceline has 16k? I think its normal for a larger variety of people on the board. You're going to meet more bad/different apples from a larger pool.

The ST forums isn't the same as it was 10 years ago, and I can say the same about this board. It was a tighter community. I've met passionate people in both groups, and seen the less desirable behavior you describe here as well.

Regarding MSRP, ever take a look at classified ads for bikes in Canada? You're probably going to think we're a bunch of weirdos too.

I've never felt the need to put reviews on purchases on this forum or ST. Partly because the search function is terrible here (do you actually search through the pages for a person?) but also I can get a decent idea from the person's previous posts and history/activity level.

[cderalow]

I also wear below the ankle "Shortsocks" hence the name. I can't stand long socks. They bug the hell out of me. I looked moronic as it is with my chicken legs...I look even more moronic with a horrible sock Tan. That, and I have sexy ass ankles. What can I say?

don't get me started on the feeling of something covering my ankle when my shoe doesn't.

i tolerate socks above my ankle wearing boots or skates because the boots or skates cover the area too... but I can't wear things over my ankles otherwise.

Gets me some funny looks wearing dress shoes.

[jmoore]

Short socks are for cheerleaders, not cyclists. Mid crew length is where its at. Embrace your tan lines.

[Shortsocks]

Short socks are for cheerleaders, not cyclists. Mid crew length is where its at. Embrace your tan lines.

Jerk. :banana:

[Cicli]

Short socks are for cheerleaders, not cyclists. Mid crew length is where its at. Embrace your tan lines.

We are talking about tri people here. Lets talk "Tankinis". :banana:

[tjk23]

I'm a member of both forums, haven't purchased from either yet. The thing I have noticed is that ST is slightly higher priced. the other thing that is difficult for me is the forum set up, for some reason it's just confusing. I don't think it is updated as well when items are sold.

[charliedid]

I have to admit, I ride without socks on occasion.

Crazy, I know.

[jmoore]

Lets talk "Tankinis". :banana:

let's not ;)

[CunegoFan]

let's not ;)

Too late.

http://www.slowtwitch.com/articles/images/2/9512-medium_FarisRegensburg10.jpg

[rugbysecondrow]

It is a different culture there, I don't care for it, and I like triathlons.

Just like Velocipede has a different vibe, so too does ST. I like the Paceline, more like a lounge where people chill, have a few drinks, talk about their day.

I think some cyclists have a problem at ST because they are intimidated by interacting with around real athletes; people who can not only out ride them, but also swim and run. I mean, anybody can ride a bike, but to swim RIDE and run too, well that is a different story. Most cyclists couldn't run to the bathroom. :D

[Shortsocks]

It must be a very different mentality there. But something is great about riding out in the countryside with a group of folks during a 65 mile spring day, and then at the end of the day stopping at a mom & pop joint to get a sandwich.....and then finding that you just ate the best sandwich ever. That happened go me last Saturday. Wowsers.

That's how I feel about this place. It's like a Hidden sandwich joint, that you find in the middle of nowhere, during a great ride, and it just hits the spot....and you keep on coming back.

[Uncle Jam's Army]

Alright, which one of you took my ham sandwich?

[shovelhd]

I don't know. There are a lot of pro tris over there at ST but there are plenty of legit bike racers here. The difference is that over there racers are generally accepted equally amongst participants no matter what the category. Over here if you race CX you are, but there is a subset of participants that denigrate road racers, in particular Masters racers, using terms like "hobby racing". Believe me, if you successfully race amateur at the national level, it's a hell of a lot more than a hobby. You won't see those comments on ST or other bike racing forums.

[jmoore]

Too late.

http://www.slowtwitch.com/articles/images/2/9512-medium_FarisRegensburg10.jpg

:no:

[bironi]

I don't know. There are a lot of pro tris over there at ST but there are plenty of legit bike racers here. The difference is that over there racers are generally accepted equally amongst participants no matter what the category. Over here if you race CX you are, but there is a subset of participants that denigrate road racers, in particular Masters racers, using terms like "hobby racing". Believe me, if you successfully race amateur at the national level, it's a hell of a lot more than a hobby. You won't see those comments on ST or other bike racing forums.

Well I've been here several years and have not taken note of this so called, "hobby racing". Maybe I've just missed that vibe.

I will say that I rode with a guy a couple years older than myself. He was training for an Ironman in Alberta, CA. I was probably in the best shape of my life cycling, but he could out climb me. He had good cycling skills as well, but he trained on a road bike not a tt bike.

[JeffS]

So, you're going to come on the forum with one of the least moderated classified forums on the internet and ask about etiquette?

That's funny.

[velotrack]

So, you're going to come on the forum with one of the least moderated classified forums on the internet and ask about etiquette?

That's funny.

You must be real fun at parties.

[GParkes]

We've thrown this around quite a bit, but I'm in the process of training for three tri's, so here goes. Life time roadie that decided to change things up for a few reasons. I've been training with a very good age group woman who is also coaching me. She's a strong cyclist. Very interested in her bike and the repairs I do on it, but doesn't aim to do her own work, yet very eager to understand. Probably consistent with most women cyclists here. My observations of her and some fellow tri-geeks over last 6-7 months: bike leg is only 1/3 of their sport vs 100% of ours - so it doesn't get as much attention; they spend significant time on trainers and really don't think the bike is "dirty" - the salt from the sweat is as bad as dirt and road grime, they just don't know it; they are interested in bike tech because it is easier to acquire speed on the bike than in the pool or running. All that said, they like bikes, cycling technology, and going fast, they just don't live for their bikes like true cyclists. They're different - what normal person gets excited about swimming 5000 yards, riding 75K, then running 15K?

[endosch2]

We've thrown this around quite a bit, but I'm in the process of training for three tri's, so here goes. Life time roadie that decided to change things up for a few reasons. I've been training with a very good age group woman who is also coaching me. She's a strong cyclist. Very interested in her bike and the repairs I do on it, but doesn't aim to do her own work, yet very eager to understand. Probably consistent with most women cyclists here. My observations of her and some fellow tri-geeks over last 6-7 months: bike leg is only 1/3 of their sport vs 100% of ours - so it doesn't get as much attention; they spend significant time on trainers and really don't think the bike is "dirty" - the salt from the sweat is as bad as dirt and road grime, they just don't know it; they are interested in bike tech because it is easier to acquire speed on the bike than in the pool or running. All that said, they like bikes, cycling technology, and going fast, they just don't live for their bikes like true cyclists. They're different - what normal person gets excited about swimming 5000 yards, riding 75K, then running 15K?

I was a dedicated cyclist for 15 years including road and mtn racingand for the last 5 or so I have been doing triathlons. I find that it gives you more to work on and also is great as you age. The swimming is all technique, not fitness, and the run is a different kind of pain. Triathletes know they are mediocre at all three but the good ones know that for training you need to swim with the swimmers, run with the runners, and ride with the cyclists.

Overall slowtwitch is a much more honest and harsh forum, people thee dont mind calling each other out for being fat, slow, whatever. This forum is more focused on esthetics and having the right gear, right esthetic for your bike, than all out training and getting better. My sense is this forum is a much older crowd with a sprinkling of hipsters. Slowtwitch is many of the pro triathletes and more of a competitive crowd.

Not that there is anything wrong with either.

[deechee]

My observations of her and some fellow tri-geeks over last 6-7 months: bike leg is only 1/3 of their sport vs 100% of ours - so it doesn't get as much attention;

I have to disagree, especially for longer course athletes, time wise, the bike course is close to 1/2 your time, and the added efficiency gains help your run because you're less wasted from the bike portion. Its much easier to increase your endurance riding at 75% FTP for 3 hrs vs a tempo run for the same amount of time and being able to workout the next day. Most of my friends who do IM spend a lot of time on the bike and they take care of them.

[unterhausen]

the triathletes took over the local bike club, and there are some amazing cyclists in the group. I know I can't keep up

as far as the classifieds over there, I think there are just some classifieds where people don't put realistic prices on things. The local craigslist is like that in certain sections, lots of beat up stuff at crazy high prices. I see other people talking about the deals they got on tools on their local CL, around here there is nothing that is worth buying

[ANAO]

Lack of community?

[54ny77]

triathlon is brutal.

i'll just say kudos to anyone who even attempts it, let alone finishes, at any level.

i used to train with a guy who was pretty hardcore about it (and did well), and we'd go & do a very hard ride of, say, 60 or so miles. after finishing, while i'd be home napping and wiped out for rest of day, he'd go shower, have lunch, then run for 10 miles. oh and maybe follow up in the eve. with some light weightlifting or swimming laps. :eek: