DHL, duty, and euro bike parts.

[stackie]

So, I recently ordered a couple items from Wiggle. (flame away) Nothing I'm going to find in LBS anyway. They sent it via DHL.

A few weeks after getting product, I get invoice from DHL, for $19 for duty and $7 dollars for "payment deferral". That seems just a little excessive so I call them.

I tell their CSR that "I never asked you to pay the duty for me, so how can you charge me a fee for a service that I never requested. Can you waive the fee or reduce to something a little more in line with the duty paid.? Their CSR says "You don't have to pay it. It's your right as an American to refuse payment." pause... "But, I have to warn you that if you do not pay it, we will turn you over to collections". Whoa, that escalated pretty fast. We are 30 seconds into this call and you are threatening me with collections? I'm just calling to see if we can have a more reasonable "payment deferral" fee. Not 30+% for 15 days. I get nowhere with her. I ask to speak to supervisor. Same statement, "You don't have to pay".... "But, if you don't we will turn you over to collections." If I operated like that in my business, I'd be out of a job in no time flat. I ask to speak to his supervisor. "She's not available." Great, let me have her voicemail. "No, I'll send her your number, she'll call you."

I finally ended call with statement that I will now annotate any online order I make with instructions not to use DHL. Also, if DHL makes shipment to my house, I will refuse delivery. I will also recommend to all of my friends to never use DHL. Consider yourself warned.

Jon

[45K10]

DHL sucks that is for sure. I always got hit with duty fees when i lived in Canada, not so since I have moved back to the US. Royal Post is the way to go when ordering from the UK


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[Gsinill]

http://forums.thepaceline.net/showthread.php?p=1520347

[stackie]

Thanks for that.

After reading that thread, I went and checked duty rates on the various items I ordered ( a saddle and a set of lights ) 4.7% and 2.7% respectively. The duty as I calculate it is actually $9.21 vs the $19.91 they charged me.

I looked at the below site.

http://www.dutycalculator.com/popular-import-items/import-duty-and-taxes-for-bicycle-frame/

I think I'm going to mess with them over this.

What a scam. :mad::mad::mad:

Any lawyers here that want to comment? Anyone else just refuse to pay? I"m guessing they won't pursue over less than $30, especially knowing that the collections agent would take half.

I'm still a bit concerned that they are threatening to turn me over to collections. Not that I should care about my credit rating. My mortgage is set, buy cars with cash, and have long enough history with CC that I don't think they will take any adverse action against me.

Jon

[unterhausen]

my experience is that they will happily send you to collections. I used to get harrassed when I lived in Utah because there was some moron that couldn't balance his checkbook with the same first and last names as me. Unfortunately, I was the only one with that name in the phone book. He used to get sent to collections for $10 or $15 dollar checks. I have also been sent to collections for $15 by Fedex because of some mixup -- that was the first bill I got.

UPS does this same b.s. with duty, they send the bill later after it's too late.

Pay it, and complain to your state attorney general consumer protection division

[zmudshark]

Anytime the UK package is handed off to a courier, other than the USPS, you can expect duty plus 'brokerage fees'.

I got dinged from Ribble for the first time in 10 years. The 'duty' was way more than the actual duty. Good luck fighting it.

[Lanternrouge]

Anyone else just refuse to pay? I"m guessing they won't pursue over less than $30, especially knowing that the collections agent would take half.

I'm still a bit concerned that they are threatening to turn me over to collections. Not that I should care about my credit rating. My mortgage is set, buy cars with cash, and have long enough history with CC that I don't think they will take any adverse action against me.

Jon

Still, half is better than nothing and I don't think it costs much for them to ding your credit and a ding to your credit will probably somehow end up costing you more in the long run. Unfortunately, this is how people end up getting forced to pay money they may not owe in order to avoid the ding. You could potentially pay and then sue in small claims court to recover what you paid, though, that will likely prove to be more trouble than it is worth. Again, that's how consumers can get the shaft, as most such things take so much time and energy to fight that people give up and they have little recourse unless they can rely on consumer protect laws that permit statutory penalties, etc.

[kgreene10]

Isn't a situation like this ripe for a massive class action? Couldn't an enterprising lawyer make bank here? Every once in a while I get a letter re some class action where it turns out I was overcharged some fraction of a dollar for a repeated service. Multiply that by millions of transactions and voila! Bank.

[Cicli]

Did you save more than 30 bucks or whatever on your purchase? If you did, pay the bill and write it off. You are still money ahead.

[unterhausen]

Isn't a situation like this ripe for a massive class action? Couldn't an enterprising lawyer make bank here? Every once in a while I get a letter re some class action where it turns out I was overcharged some fraction of a dollar for a repeated service. Multiply that by millions of transactions and voila! Bank.

there probably is grounds for a class action suit here, but unless you're the class action lawyer involved, it probably doesn't involve money for you. Assuming you're in a state with a responsive AG, the best way is to make a complaint to consumer affairs. This clearly isn't right

[kgreene10]

Even if there's no reimbursement through a class action for individuals who have been shafted in the past, it could stop the practice for the future.

[oldpotatoe]

Did you save more than 30 bucks or whatever on your purchase? If you did, pay the bill and write it off. You are still money ahead.

Glad somebody said it....life's too short, imho

Somebody above said, "clearly this isn't right"...paying duty or 'payment referral'? What clearly isn't right?

[FlashUNC]

No different than UPS or FedEx on international shipping.

Nature of the beast if you're buying overseas.

[sjauch2]

I ordered wheels from Wiggle and they were shipped via DHL. I got an email from DHL that payment was due prior to the shipment being delivered. It was for $91.00.

I exchanged some emails and provided them with the correct tariff codes and the amount due was about $31. Much better and the code was more accurate for the product shipped. They seemed to use a more general code that resulted in a higher percentage.

The woman from DHL called me and said she had released my shipment and a bill would be mailed out.

I think everything turned out fine for me even though I had to do a little leg work. The amount saved from getting the wheels from the UK was well worth it.

[jemoryl]

No different than UPS or FedEx on international shipping.

Nature of the beast if you're buying overseas.

Just because this is the way DHL, UPS and FedEx operate does not make it something we should accept. It is BS to have someone deliver a package (say I am not home and my neighbor signs?) and then later get a bill, which can be sent to collections. If they want their money, then they should not give you the parcel until paid. This would drive home the existence of their silly extra charges. Yet another reason to support the USPS.

[FlashUNC]

Just because this is the way DHL, UPS and FedEx operate does not make it something we should accept. It is BS to have someone deliver a package (say I am not home and my neighbor signs?) and then later get a bill, which can be sent to collections. If they want their money, then they should not give you the parcel until paid. This would drive home the existence of their silly extra charges. Yet another reason to support the USPS.

Its not a silly extra charge. Its the private shipping company footing the bill for your customs duties for importing goods from overseas. They do that to expedite shipping the product to you.

And the answer is laughably simple. Don't like these fees? Buy from your LBS.

[alancw3]

Its not a silly extra charge. Its the private shipping company footing the bill for your customs duties for importing goods from overseas. They do that to expedite shipping the product to you.

And the answer is laughably simple. Don't like these fees? Buy from your LBS.

+1. this is why at the very least i try to find a sourse in the usa. i think the shipping company's charges are reasonable under the circumstances.

[jemoryl]

Its not a silly extra charge. Its the private shipping company footing the bill for your customs duties for importing goods from overseas. They do that to expedite shipping the product to you.

And the answer is laughably simple. Don't like these fees? Buy from your LBS.

No, I won't buy from my LBS. They have very little that I want and extortionate pricing. Sorry. I've bought a lot of stuff from Ribble and others, Royal Mail/Parcel Force to USPS and never a charge.

[Gsinill]

Its not a silly extra charge. Its the private shipping company footing the bill for your customs duties for importing goods from overseas. They do that to expedite shipping the product to you.

And the answer is laughably simple. Don't like these fees? Buy from your LBS.

I wouldn't complain about the charge per se, the problem is that there is literally no viable way to fight those companies in case they overcharge (willingly or by mistake) in a completely non-transparent process.

I had it happen twice that the shipping company screwed up and basically got the same "just sue us" treatment as the OP when I called to get things straightened out.

[oldpotatoe]

Just because this is the way DHL, UPS and FedEx operate does not make it something we should accept. It is BS to have someone deliver a package (say I am not home and my neighbor signs?) and then later get a bill, which can be sent to collections. If they want their money, then they should not give you the parcel until paid. This would drive home the existence of their silly extra charges. Yet another reason to support the USPS.

'Not accept'? Ok like you mentioned, USPS or local. You can get a lawyer and try suing them for $20, good luck with that.

[LJohnny]

IMO, they always come up with a tax code that will result in import duty. Even if the item is tax exempt as many bike parts are. So, you can look up on the code book whether your item is subject to taxation.

Personally, I just take it as MO of buying overseas. You can get a bill from USPS as well, but is not certain. With DHL, ups, or fedex, it's always certain you'll get a bill for import duties 'and' processing fees. Usually with USPS it's only the duty.

If you do not have strong evidence that your item should not have been subject to duty, I wouldn't waste my time, I'd just pay and move forward...


Sent from my brain

[stackie]

Just for follow up... I wound up calling DHL and disputing the charges based on the fact that they charged me a flat 10% duty.., and a bicycle saddle and lights both come in at 4.7%. Just got an email saying they removed the charges from my account.

Probably not worth the time, but makes me feel better. Worth it on that level.

Jon

[Hermes_Alex]

Yeah, if you find the USITC code for what you're actually bringing in, they'll happily adjust your duty accordingly.

[OtayBW]

I also won a dispute with DHL on a misclassified tarriff from a crankset that I purchased in the UK. I pointed out the correct tarriff number with some documentation and they agreed and reversed the $75.00 charge. Took a while, but I was pretty surprised that it worked out.

[jemoryl]

So these firms are charging a processing fee on top of the duty, but they still need the customer to point out to them what the correct duty is? What a scam.

[brando]

So these firms are charging a processing fee on top of the duty, but they still need the customer to point out to them what the correct duty is? What a scam.

and someday will have a class-action settlement. Managers likely know and just kick it down the road. It's how BP decided it was more cost-effective to be fined thousands of times than be safe... until the giant spill in the gulf. Seems like the way of the corp. world nowadays.

[jimoots]

I finally ended call with statement that I will now annotate any online order I make with instructions not to use DHL.


lol. let me know how you go with that. lol.

the more i think about it the more i lol.

like a big organisation like wiggle will give two hoots that you annotate you don't want DHL to ship. lol.

and then how you are going to have to chase them to get your money back. that's going to happen heaps quick. lol.

you're just making life hard for seven bucks. lol.

thanks for the lols.

Its not a silly extra charge. Its the private shipping company footing the bill for your customs duties for importing goods from overseas. They do that to expedite shipping the product to you.

And the answer is laughably simple. Don't like these fees? Buy from your LBS.

+infinity

[DCilliams]

Dammit! I just ordered something from Germany. Guy said it's shipping DHL. Had no idea there were extra expenses. I ordered a frame from Italy last year and had no issues.

Better sell some blood or a kidney :eek:

[LJohnny]

There is still hope. I have ordered from Germany and DHL have transferred the. Parcel to USPS. Within Germany DHL is also their main postal system, thus transfer to USPS is still feasible. DHL express international is another matter and the one you are thinking of. Good luck!


Sent from my brain

[donn12]

I have ordered a bunch of stuff from ribble and never had an issue. I love my LBS but they can't touch ribble on campy stuff. If I went to collections over $20 I would laugh. that bill would go straight into the trash

[Bruce K]

This ought to be interesting. I have a $250 item (not bike parts but parts for another piece of sports equipment) shipping from Germany in a week.

It will be interesting to see what comes of this....

BK