Never go full Roadie!!!!!

[velomonkey]

Ian Stannard puts the ball in ballin' (I can't take credit for this, it's drunkcyclist)

But, yea, that's the race winner. Is that the race winning move? No. But the dude crossed over the grass, hit the cobbles and put the hurt on!!!!!

This is why we love the classics.

[sw3759]

great pic...its if hes channeling his inner Muzzin...

"enough of this sunday stroll..lets hurt a little...."

[velomonkey]

^^^^^^^ Word my man.

The other thing I noticed, no aero helmet. Count me as a big Ian fan now.

[bcroslin]

total badass. I love that Stoddart looks like someone who might turn up on the local training ride.

[dustyrider]

That face says it all! "What cobbles?"

[eBAUMANN]

even styby didn't pull that one haha

[Cat3roadracer]

Why wait behind all the other clowns, dude saw a line and took it.

[bobswire]

Yep, photo says it all.

[Black Dog]

He rode to make the race as did the others who stood on the podium. This is true racing. Also, no race radio's. Just guts, legs, and brains.

[Schmed]

The new Jens Voigt?

[FlashUNC]

The new Jens Voigt?

Stannard actually wins things. Unlike Jens.

Here's the image from Omloop I really like. From last year's race.
http://i.telegraph.co.uk/multimedia/archive/02838/Ian_Stannard_2838767b.jpg

[BumbleBeeDave]

Stannard actually wins things. Unlike Jens.

I must have missed something here. Or you have. :rolleyes:

From Wikipedia:

Jens Voigt

1994
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Peace Race
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Niedersachsen-Rundfahrt
1996
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Sachsen-Tour
1997
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Niedersachsen-Rundfahrt

1st Stage 5B

1st Prologue Sachsen Tour
2nd Overall Tour de Langkawi
3rd Overall Peace Race
1998
1st Stage 5A Tour of the Basque Country
1st Jersey green.svg Points classification Prudential Tour
Tour de France

Held Jersey polkadot.svg after Stage 9

1999
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Critérium International
1st Breitling Grand Prix
1st Stage 3 Route du Sud
1st Duo Normand (with Chris Boardman)
2000
1st Grand Prix Cholet
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Bayern-Rundfahrt
2001
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Bayern-Rundfahrt

1st Stage 2 Tour de France
1st Stages 4 (TTT) & 16
Held Jersey yellow.svg after Stage 7

1st Grand Prix des Nations
1st Tour de Poitou
1st Duo Normand (with Jonathan Vaughters)
Tour of Poland

1st Stage 6
1st Jersey green.svg Points classification

1st Stage 7 Critérium du Dauphiné Libéré
1st Stage 1 Route du Sud
2002
Critérium International
1st Stage 3
1st Jersey green.svg Points classification

2003
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Tour de Poitou
1st Stage 4
1st Paris–Bourges
1st Stage 3 Critérium International
2004
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Critérium International
1st Stages 2 & 3
1st Overall Bayern-Rundfahrt
1st LuK Challenge
1st Stage 4 Danmark Rundt
1st Stage 5 Tour of the Basque Country
2nd Overall Deutschland Tour
2005
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Tour Méditerranéen
1st Stages 1 & 3
1st LuK Challenge Chrono Bühl
1st Stage 3 Étoile de Bessèges
1st Prologue Paris–Nice
1st Stage 5 Tour of the Basque Country
1st Stage 4 Bayern-Rundfahrt
2nd Liège–Bastogne–Liège
Tour de France

Held Jersey yellow.svg after Stage 9

2006
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Deutschland Tour
1st Stages 2, 6 & 7 (ITT)
1st Rund um die Hainleite
1st Giro Bochum
1st Stage 13 Tour de France
1st Stage 4 Ster Elektrotoer
2007
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Critérium International
1st Stage 2
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Deutschland Tour
1st Stage 8
1st Stage 4 Tour of the Basque Country
2nd Overall Tour of California
1st Stage 3
2nd Overall 3-Länder-Tour
3rd Overall Bayern-Rundfahrt
2008
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Tour de Pologne
1st Stage 6
1st Jersey polkadot.svg Mountains classification
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Critérium International
1st Stage 18 Giro d'Italia
2009
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Critérium International
1st Stage 2
4th Overall Tour of California
6th Overall Paris – Nice
2010
1st Stage 4 Volta a Catalunya
4th Overall Vuelta a Andalucia
5th Overall Paris–Nice
6th Overall Tour of California
2012
USA Pro Cycling Challenge
1st Stage 4
1st Jersey polkadot.svg Mountains classification
2013
1st Stage 5 Tour of California
2014
Tour de France
Jersey red number.svg Combativity award Stage 1
Held Jersey polkadot.svg after Stage 1
USA Pro Cycling Challenge
1st Orange Jersey Most aggressive rider classification[85]
Most aggressive rider Stages 4[86] and 7[85]
Arc en ciel.svg World Hour record: 51.110 km[87]

[john903]

Yes that is why we like the Classics. It almost looks like he has a slight smile, like yea lets do this. Also he looks big and powerful not like a lithe svelte climber.
Fun

[FlashUNC]

I must have missed something here. Or you have. :rolleyes:

From Wikipedia:

Jens Voigt

1994
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Peace Race
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Niedersachsen-Rundfahrt
1996
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Sachsen-Tour
1997
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Niedersachsen-Rundfahrt

1st Stage 5B

1st Prologue Sachsen Tour
2nd Overall Tour de Langkawi
3rd Overall Peace Race
1998
1st Stage 5A Tour of the Basque Country
1st Jersey green.svg Points classification Prudential Tour
Tour de France

Held Jersey polkadot.svg after Stage 9

1999
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Critérium International
1st Breitling Grand Prix
1st Stage 3 Route du Sud
1st Duo Normand (with Chris Boardman)
2000
1st Grand Prix Cholet
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Bayern-Rundfahrt
2001
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Bayern-Rundfahrt

1st Stage 2 Tour de France
1st Stages 4 (TTT) & 16
Held Jersey yellow.svg after Stage 7

1st Grand Prix des Nations
1st Tour de Poitou
1st Duo Normand (with Jonathan Vaughters)
Tour of Poland

1st Stage 6
1st Jersey green.svg Points classification

1st Stage 7 Critérium du Dauphiné Libéré
1st Stage 1 Route du Sud
2002
Critérium International
1st Stage 3
1st Jersey green.svg Points classification

2003
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Tour de Poitou
1st Stage 4
1st Paris–Bourges
1st Stage 3 Critérium International
2004
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Critérium International
1st Stages 2 & 3
1st Overall Bayern-Rundfahrt
1st LuK Challenge
1st Stage 4 Danmark Rundt
1st Stage 5 Tour of the Basque Country
2nd Overall Deutschland Tour
2005
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Tour Méditerranéen
1st Stages 1 & 3
1st LuK Challenge Chrono Bühl
1st Stage 3 Étoile de Bessèges
1st Prologue Paris–Nice
1st Stage 5 Tour of the Basque Country
1st Stage 4 Bayern-Rundfahrt
2nd Liège–Bastogne–Liège
Tour de France

Held Jersey yellow.svg after Stage 9

2006
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Deutschland Tour
1st Stages 2, 6 & 7 (ITT)
1st Rund um die Hainleite
1st Giro Bochum
1st Stage 13 Tour de France
1st Stage 4 Ster Elektrotoer
2007
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Critérium International
1st Stage 2
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Deutschland Tour
1st Stage 8
1st Stage 4 Tour of the Basque Country
2nd Overall Tour of California
1st Stage 3
2nd Overall 3-Länder-Tour
3rd Overall Bayern-Rundfahrt
2008
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Tour de Pologne
1st Stage 6
1st Jersey polkadot.svg Mountains classification
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Critérium International
1st Stage 18 Giro d'Italia
2009
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Critérium International
1st Stage 2
4th Overall Tour of California
6th Overall Paris – Nice
2010
1st Stage 4 Volta a Catalunya
4th Overall Vuelta a Andalucia
5th Overall Paris–Nice
6th Overall Tour of California
2012
USA Pro Cycling Challenge
1st Stage 4
1st Jersey polkadot.svg Mountains classification
2013
1st Stage 5 Tour of California
2014
Tour de France
Jersey red number.svg Combativity award Stage 1
Held Jersey polkadot.svg after Stage 1
USA Pro Cycling Challenge
1st Orange Jersey Most aggressive rider classification[85]
Most aggressive rider Stages 4[86] and 7[85]
Arc en ciel.svg World Hour record: 51.110 km[87]

Pardon me if I don't wet myself over someone winning a Tour of California stage. Or a stage at Volta Catayluna. Or Criterium International which was last relevant about 30 years ago.

Stannard's winning semi-classics and in the mix at Monuments. That's more than Jensie ever did. Course, Ian isn't as good for a quote post-race or mugging for the cameras. Too busy trying to actually outsmart three teammates for a win.

Yeah, Jens has won stuff, but there's was nothing significant on that list past, what, a Tour stage in 2002? His palmares since the first Bush administration is full of "Man, I didn't know they still even had that race. I thought it was canceled years ago."

[BumbleBeeDave]

Tough crowd. :cool: :rolleyes:

I obviously touched a button. Sorry about that!

BBD

[MattTuck]

Going at full speed and hitting the transition from pavement to dirt is awesome, and lets me pretend I am a bad ass. I can only imagine the feeling going onto cobbles.

[FlashUNC]

Tough crowd. :cool: :rolleyes:

I obviously touched a button. Sorry about that!

BBD

No real button. I just love hatin' on Jens. I think he's an overhyped clown.

[Schmed]

No real button. I just love hatin' on Jens. I think he's an overhyped clown.

I'm not sure I've ever heard of anyone hating on Jens. I guess "overhyped" is debatable, but a clown?

[velomonkey]

I'm not sure I've ever heard of anyone hating on Jens. I guess "overhyped" is debatable, but a clown?

Way back in Credit Agricole and the very beginning of CSC I liked him. He was a strong dude that came to the front and did his job. There were others who were just as good - Jorge Jaksche for a German. Danny Pate for an American - that dude just goes to the front for like 40k and does his work.

Skibby, Sorenson - they all went to the front of crazy breakaways. Heck, Vockler is more successful than Jens.

Jens is way, way overhyped. And, I gotta admit, the accent just makes him seem like a clown.

I will say this, the time in the Giro when Jens was working for Basso and it was a mountain stage and he sat up and let Garate take the win (Garate had done all the work - Jens had done none). Well, that was total class and he did well there. Hincapie on the other hand - he did no work on the tour stage he won - another overhyped clown.

[FlashUNC]

I'm not sure I've ever heard of anyone hating on Jens. I guess "overhyped" is debatable, but a clown?

Yeah. His Sgt Schultz routine about never having seen any evidence of doping in peloton despite, yanno, coming up in the East German system, and riding on a who's who of doped teams really turned me off to him.

So either he was a moron for decades, or thinks fans are stupid enough to buy that line from him. Either way, a clown in my book.

But enough thread drift. Stannard is incredible. His MSR, what, two years ago was nearly a thing of beauty. The guy shows up for the biggest races.

[bingomck]

Yeah. His Sgt Schultz routine about never having seen any evidence of doping in peloton despite, yanno, coming up in the East German system, and riding on a who's who of doped teams really turned me off to him.

So either he was a moron for decades, or thinks fans are stupid enough to buy that line from him. Either way, a clown in my book.

But enough thread drift. Stannard is incredible. His MSR, what, two years ago was nearly a thing of beauty. The guy shows up for the biggest races.

He really is awesome. QS obviously messed up the 3v1, but this is just amazing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQRSisiaC9A&app=desktop

[wallymann]

Yes that is why we like the Classics. It almost looks like he has a slight smile, like yea lets do this. Also he looks big and powerful not like a lithe svelte climber.
Fun

I love that the final group in Het Nieuwsb was composed entirely of comfortably +6ft big-boned roleurs!

[Wesley37]

Jens is way, way overhyped. And, I gotta admit, the accent just makes him seem like a clown.


Sometimes, when one person insults another, they reveal more about themselves than the other person. Case in point.

Mocking someone in this way, for their accent in a second or third language, and then dismissing them on that basis, is beyond rude and shameful.

[b021c]

I love that the final group in Het Nieuwsb was composed entirely of comfortably +6ft big-boned roleurs!

That's a keen observation that wasn't lost on me either, being that I'm 6'3.

[Black Dog]

What? Read the list again, don't skim it actually read it. Like the guy or not that is one impressive list. Stannard would likely give a nut (left or right) for that list of wins on a bicycle. No offence to Standard but winning a semi classic twice is not the same as the stages, and stage races that Jens won, under all terrains and disciplines.

Pardon me if I don't wet myself over someone winning a Tour of California stage. Or a stage at Volta Catayluna. Or Criterium International which was last relevant about 30 years ago.

Stannard's winning semi-classics and in the mix at Monuments. That's more than Jensie ever did. Course, Ian isn't as good for a quote post-race or mugging for the cameras. Too busy trying to actually outsmart three teammates for a win.

Yeah, Jens has won stuff, but there's was nothing significant on that list past, what, a Tour stage in 2002? His palmares since the first Bush administration is full of "Man, I didn't know they still even had that race. I thought it was canceled years ago."

[Black Dog]

Jens is way, way overhyped. And, I gotta admit, the accent just makes him seem like a clown.

Yep, which accent when speaking one of the 4-5 languages that he is fluent it? So in your world is an accent a mark of low intelligence? I hope not because I am sure that when you speak in one of the many languages that you are fluent in it is completely accent free, even in english, i bet you have no regional accent. :roll eyes:

I am no big fan of the guy, there is no doubt that he was a a doper like the rest and his denial and silence at this point is weak.

[velomonkey]

Sometimes, when one person insults another, they reveal more about themselves than the other person. Case in point.

Mocking someone in this way, for their accent in a second or third language, and then dismissing them on that basis, is beyond rude and shameful.

Bro, do you even lift? OK, accents aside. The guy, as indicated prior, grew up in the east german olympic squad - he raced for CSC and for Johan - the guy has been around most of his carrier with the biggest dopers. This is a fact. And then he says he never saw any doping. EVER.

Clown - and that's putting it politely. It's the content of what comes out of his mouth that makes him a fool.

[velomonkey]

I hope not because I am sure that when you speak in one of the many languages that you are fluent in it is completely accent free, even in english, i bet you have no regional accent. :roll eyes:


I do, bro, it's of the new England dialect.

This is a wicked pissah, you know what I mean you fuuuuchah. Relax and go get yourself some dunking' donuts coffee.

We had this movie come out called "ted" everyone spoke in our dialect. We laughed.

Now back to the OP - #dontbesucharoadie

[BumbleBeeDave]

. . . or to thread drift here. I agree Stannard is showing himself to be a major talent and he contributed to that this past weekend. The guy is building a well-deserved reputation.

As for Jens, I was just trying to specifically address your comment that he never wins anything. In truth, he's won a lot. Maybe not the races you respect, but it's hard for me to see how stage victories in the grand tours can make the career of any other rider, but not him.

Like you, I also don't believe his protestations about never seeing anything. There was just provably too much going on for too long on the teams he was on for me to believe him.

But I also try to keep in mind where he came from. In East Germany in the 1980's, before reunification, my understanding is that doping on the state sports teams was part of the routine, so he may honestly have the "everybody was doing it" view but recognize it's not a good idea to be honest about that in today's climate.

The "Sgt. Schultz" routine may not come across well to us today, but for the society he was brought up in, keep your mouth shut was probably a pretty good personal strategy.

As for the accent, velomonkey, you're entitled to your opinion, but I would agree with others it's a cheap shot. Is your German accent-free?

BBD

Yeah. His Sgt Schultz routine about never having seen any evidence of doping in peloton despite, yanno, coming up in the East German system, and riding on a who's who of doped teams really turned me off to him.

So either he was a moron for decades, or thinks fans are stupid enough to buy that line from him. Either way, a clown in my book.

But enough thread drift. Stannard is incredible. His MSR, what, two years ago was nearly a thing of beauty. The guy shows up for the biggest races.

[velomonkey]

As for the accent, velomonkey, you're entitled to your opinion, but I would agree with others it's a cheap shot. Is your German accent-free?


So, wait - I now have to do 3 responses to this. Are you reading the responses.

Again, for the record: what makes him such a clown is the content of his speech - the accent is just the icing on the cake.

Johan Museeuw - one time said, in broken english that win roubaix you had "to have lucky" - it was funny. Johan also admitted he doped. You see a difference (other than a German accent and a Belgium accent). Jens was also president of the riders union at the height of omertà.

As for my German, it has a mixture of North Hessian and Thuringian dialect. I'm really trying to work on the sexy Swiss dialect, but just can't seem to nail it.

[Ti Designs]

Pardon me if I don't wet myself over someone winning a Tour of California stage.

It's times like this that I remind myself that the highlight of my racing career was winning a comforter on an 85 degree day at the Fitchburg crit in the Pro/1/2 field. I'm a little down that there's no Wikipedia page listing the results of my 15 years of racing, I'm sure y'all have long lists of race wins and podium places...

And while we're on the subject, does "never go full roadie" only hold for euro pros, or are we talking about forum members? When was the last time you took that beautiful road bike down a dirt path or over some cobbles?

There are three types of pros. There are the ones who got there by cheating - they deserve nothing. There are the ones who misrepresent themselves - they deserve to get their legs ripped off (I'm looking forward to that), and there are the R.O.U.S.es (riders of unusual substance - I don't think they exist). The riders who make it to the pro ranks without cheating do so with a level of effort and commitment that most of you can't understand.

[Lewis Moon]

So, wait - I now have to do 3 responses to this. Are you reading the responses.

Again, for the record: what makes him such a clown is the content of his speech - the accent is just the icing on the cake.

Johan Museeuw - one time said, in broken english that win roubaix you had "to have lucky" - it was funny. Johan also admitted he doped. You see a difference (other than a German accent and a Belgium accent). Jens was also president of the riders union at the height of omertà.

As for my German, it has a mixture of North Hessian and Thuringian dialect. I'm really trying to work on the sexy Swiss dialect, but just can't seem to nail it.

One man's clown is another man's goofy, fun loving, fully monitized celebrity spokesperson. A publicist's wet dream. I bet he laughs all the way to the bank...with a German accent.

[tv_vt]

I'm ready to see this thread locked. Really put off by comments made here. Not appropriate in my book.

Any Mods around?

[teleguy57]

I love that the final group in Het Nieuwsb was composed entirely of comfortably +6ft big-boned roleurs!

Back to discussing the riding itself -- YEAH! I think of these guys as I'm channeling my inner Walter Mitty on crappy stuff.

And while we're on the subject, does "never go full roadie" only hold for euro pros, or are we talking about forum members? When was the last time you took that beautiful road bike down a dirt path or over some cobbles?

Indeed, lets' have fun on our bikes and not be too serious about ourselves. Heck, with my legs/lungs/etc fun is the only thing I can do:)!

There are three types of pros. There are the ones who got there by cheating - they deserve nothing. There are the ones who misrepresent themselves - they deserve to get their legs ripped off (I'm looking forward to that), and there are the R.O.U.S.es (riders of unusual substance - I don't think they exist). The riders who make it to the pro ranks without cheating do so with a level of effort and commitment that most of you can't understand.

Solid assessment -- and great Princess Bride metaphor. One of my all-time favorite movies.

[soulspinner]

he rode to make the race as did the others who stood on the podium. This is true racing. Also, no race radio's. Just guts, legs, and brains.

+1000

[oldpotatoe]

It's times like this that I remind myself that the highlight of my racing career was winning a comforter on an 85 degree day at the Fitchburg crit in the Pro/1/2 field. I'm a little down that there's no Wikipedia page listing the results of my 15 years of racing, I'm sure y'all have long lists of race wins and podium places...

And while we're on the subject, does "never go full roadie" only hold for euro pros, or are we talking about forum members? When was the last time you took that beautiful road bike down a dirt path or over some cobbles?

There are three types of pros. There are the ones who got there by cheating - they deserve nothing. There are the ones who misrepresent themselves - they deserve to get their legs ripped off (I'm looking forward to that), and there are the R.O.U.S.es (riders of unusual substance - I don't think they exist). The riders who make it to the pro ranks without cheating do so with a level of effort and commitment that most of you can't understand.

I raced a race where the prem. was a coupon for a Burger King Whopper..didn't win it.

Lock this thread?? YGBSM, if one cares not for the posts, read not, IMHO.

But pretty tame, considering some of the others, like thanking service members and packin' heat when riding.

[Uncle Jam's Army]

Thread drift here. I was on a particularly bad ride on Saturday. A convergence of factors led to it, but I completely popped on this one hill that I normally go over in my big ring. i had to drop it down to my third easiest gear and I yelled: Shut up legs! My legs yelled back at me: You shut up . . . punk! I then dropped it to my easiest gear and limped up an over the hill.

I liked Jens' attacking style a lot. I also liked his colorful, funny comments. It's too bad he couldn't own that the sport was (is) rife with doping. Makes him look foolish. But he's not alone.

[Ti Designs]

I raced a race where the prem. was a coupon for a Burger King Whopper..didn't win it.

Did second place get two Whoppers???

John Allis would always run the sprinting skills week the first week of November so he could give away his kid's trick-or-treat candy. You could win a candy bar in a sprint, but you had to eat it before the next sprint. Training was different back then...

[pdmtong]

Thread drift here. I was on a particularly bad ride on Saturday. A convergence of factors led to it, but I completely popped on this one hill that I normally go over in my big ring. i had to drop it down to my third easiest gear and I yelled: Shut up legs! My legs yelled back at me: You shut up . . . punk! I then dropped it to my easiest gear and limped up an over the hill.

I liked Jens' attacking style a lot. I also liked his colorful, funny comments. It's too bad he couldn't own that the sport was (is) rife with doping. Makes him look foolish. But he's not alone.

The guy could take a bloody pounding like no other...

Besides the awful face plant, remember this (http://tour.bicycling.com/news/2010-tour-de-france/saying-no-sag-wagon)?

[lovethesport]

You can tell by the tone of the messages.. this winter has been a long one!
Sword fighting to the stop sign will soon be here!

[Coalfield]

. I liked Jens' attacking style a lot. I also liked his colorful, funny comments.

Ian S. is building his palmares and I especially liked how his tactics beat 3 Quick-steppers; although post race comment I heard from Boonen about their tactics was succinct - something like - 'we should have won, but some people wanted more'. Not sure if it was directed at the DS or his teammates. Sorry I can't be fished to find the exact quote.

As for Jens - one of my favorites, his comments were more original than others - esp Spanish riders who are always so 'muy tranquillo', or anything to come out of the Schlecks quotes about how they 'love the sport'. Jens, the family man, will make a wonderful commentator, he can freelance it in an entertaining way with the best of them. I think all big cyclists love Jens and Maggie Backstedt.

[Uncle Jam's Army]

The guy could take a bloody pounding like no other...

Besides the awful face plant, remember this (http://tour.bicycling.com/news/2010-tour-de-france/saying-no-sag-wagon)?

Yup, that was a ridiculously small bike. I like his interview regarding Andy Schleck's chances against Astana (Contador, Lance, Kloden, etc.) at the Tour: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WfD7lYkKqA

[FlashUNC]

. . . or to thread drift here. I agree Stannard is showing himself to be a major talent and he contributed to that this past weekend. The guy is building a well-deserved reputation.

As for Jens, I was just trying to specifically address your comment that he never wins anything. In truth, he's won a lot. Maybe not the races you respect, but it's hard for me to see how stage victories in the grand tours can make the career of any other rider, but not him.

Like you, I also don't believe his protestations about never seeing anything. There was just provably too much going on for too long on the teams he was on for me to believe him.

But I also try to keep in mind where he came from. In East Germany in the 1980's, before reunification, my understanding is that doping on the state sports teams was part of the routine, so he may honestly have the "everybody was doing it" view but recognize it's not a good idea to be honest about that in today's climate.

The "Sgt. Schultz" routine may not come across well to us today, but for the society he was brought up in, keep your mouth shut was probably a pretty good personal strategy.

As for the accent, velomonkey, you're entitled to your opinion, but I would agree with others it's a cheap shot. Is your German accent-free?

BBD

None taken at all. Arguing about pro cycling is the same as arguing about any other pro sport as far as I'm concerned. Its hot stove time and hardy take any offense to someone else's strong opinions about it. Just like I wouldn't expect anyone to take any offense at my dislike of Jens vs. my love of Stannard.

I mean, isn't that 90% of the fun of watching pro sports? Seeing cool stuff and then arguing about it afterwards with your friends?

And this is infinitely better than another Shimano/Campy/SRAM thread...

[FlashUNC]

Thread drift here. I was on a particularly bad ride on Saturday. A convergence of factors led to it, but I completely popped on this one hill that I normally go over in my big ring. i had to drop it down to my third easiest gear and I yelled: Shut up legs! My legs yelled back at me: You shut up . . . punk! I then dropped it to my easiest gear and limped up an over the hill.

I liked Jens' attacking style a lot. I also liked his colorful, funny comments. It's too bad he couldn't own that the sport was (is) rife with doping. Makes him look foolish. But he's not alone.

That's what always rubbed me wrong about Jens' silence on the matter. If he did it clean, then he's probably just the kind of rider who had money taken out of his pocket and race wins denied by guys on the jet fuel. Could he have won some Monuments with his ability if the peloton was cleaner? We'll never know.

If I were him, I'd be mad as heck about it and wouldn't take this route of silence and "doping...what doping?...I never saw doping" stance.

[Uncle Jam's Army]

That's what always rubbed me wrong about Jens' silence on the matter. If he did it clean, then he's probably just the kind of rider who had money taken out of his pocket and race wins denied by guys on the jet fuel. Could he have won some Monuments with his ability if the peloton was cleaner? We'll never know.

If I were him, I'd be mad as heck about it and wouldn't take this route of silence and "doping...what doping?...I never saw doping" stance.

Flash, not for one second do I think Jens did it clean 100% of the time. That would require too big a leap of faith that is not in me anymore. Nor, for that matter, do I think Thor did it clean, either. But for them to come out and say "I don't know about any doping" is just plain insulting to our intelligence. If they're not going to come clean, I would rather they just shut their mouth and not say anything than to treat us like idiots.

Back on topic, yes, I love Stannard's style of riding. First took notice of him in that brutally cold MSR race two or three years ago. Never knew of him before. A real hard man. Loved Saturday's finish.

[John H.]

Watch the Mont Bondone stage from the Giro where Basso was in the Maglia Rosa. 2006-
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ikn_51pmebA
Tell me Jens was clean-

Yeah. His Sgt Schultz routine about never having seen any evidence of doping in peloton despite, yanno, coming up in the East German system, and riding on a who's who of doped teams really turned me off to him.

So either he was a moron for decades, or thinks fans are stupid enough to buy that line from him. Either way, a clown in my book.

But enough thread drift. Stannard is incredible. His MSR, what, two years ago was nearly a thing of beauty. The guy shows up for the biggest races.

[John H.]

I think it was "good legs and a little bit of lucky" or luckies- I cant remember.

So, wait - I now have to do 3 responses to this. Are you reading the responses.

Again, for the record: what makes him such a clown is the content of his speech - the accent is just the icing on the cake.

Johan Museeuw - one time said, in broken english that win roubaix you had "to have lucky" - it was funny. Johan also admitted he doped. You see a difference (other than a German accent and a Belgium accent). Jens was also president of the riders union at the height of omertà.

As for my German, it has a mixture of North Hessian and Thuringian dialect. I'm really trying to work on the sexy Swiss dialect, but just can't seem to nail it.

[Jaq]

That's what always rubbed me wrong about Jens' silence on the matter. If he did it clean, then he's probably just the kind of rider who had money taken out of his pocket and race wins denied by guys on the jet fuel. Could he have won some Monuments with his ability if the peloton was cleaner? We'll never know.

If I were him, I'd be mad as heck about it and wouldn't take this route of silence and "doping...what doping?...I never saw doping" stance.

I dunno. The man grew up and came into racing in one of the most repressive political regimes (East Germany) in modern history, where the Culture of Silence was absolute. More so for athletes on state-sponsored teams; they just shut up and did what they were told, or else.

You expect him to make a clean break from that and drop a dime on every doper he ever knew? Would you? Would any of us? I doubt it.

[numbskull]

I do, bro, it's of the new England dialect.

Relax and go get yourself some dunking' donuts coffee.



Just for future reference it is dunkin donuts and the correct NE pronunciation is "dunkgin". This is important to know in case you need to find a policeman in New England.

Carry on.

[FlashUNC]

I dunno. The man grew up and came into racing in one of the most repressive political regimes (East Germany) in modern history, where the Culture of Silence was absolute. More so for athletes on state-sponsored teams; they just shut up and did what they were told, or else.

You expect him to make a clean break from that and drop a dime on every doper he ever knew? Would you? Would any of us? I doubt it.

Not necessarily. But he's still taking the I saw nothing bit as recently as the USADA Reasoned Decision for he who shall not be named. I get not standing up during the turn of the century when Bassons' professional end loomed large in the peloton for his speaking out. But by 2011-2012? Two decades after the fact?

Better take the Ullrich route and just shut up and not say anything.

[beeatnik]

Just for future reference it is dunkin donuts and the correct NE pronunciation is "dunkgin". This is important to know in case you need to find a policeman in New England.

Carry on.

They opened one in Santa Monica and the line was blocks long. Santa Monica, a city which probably has more yoga studios than Rishikesh.

Even Paradise can be boring or Is The Coffee Really That Good?
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8582/16674908716_6c85a87df5_o.jpg

These typical donut consumers will probably be back in 2017
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8675/16513259198_f745288a53_c.jpg

More Typically Santa Monica
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8623/16699819842_7319eefccc_o.jpg

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8618/16514731759_4d24b2c11b_o.jpg

https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8563/16513505300_08a11816b8_o.jpg

[b021c]

Just for future reference it is dunkin donuts and the correct NE pronunciation is "dunkgin". This is important to know in case you need to find a policeman in New England.

Carry on.
HA! Oddly, Same same in Miami!

[saab2000]

I think anyone who picks on someone who has won a bicycle race has never entered a bicycle race. Or started a bicycle race. Or finished a bicycle race. When you've done a few years of all of the above you can start to pick on those who have won bike races and you know the cream of the crop. Some are just better than others and it's just the way it is. It's not as easy as it looks. Sort of like winning the Masters or hitting a home run or running for a touchdown in the NFL. High level sports just isn't easy. If JV won a few races it was against high level competition. It just is.

I don't know of really any of the best guys I have ridden against who go on internet forums and pick on their competitors or others unless they have a good reason to do so. The first riders seem to respect the last riders because they're out there.

Talk is cheap. Sign up and pin on a number for a few seasons and then come back and talk about the value or validity of anyone's victories.

[Coalfield]

i think anyone who picks on someone who has won a bicycle race has never entered a bicycle race. Or started a bicycle race. Or finished a bicycle race. When you've done a few years of all of the above you can start to pick on those who have won bike races and you know the cream of the crop. Some are just better than others and it's just the way it is. It's not as easy as it looks. Sort of like winning the masters or hitting a home run or running for a touchdown in the nfl. High level sports just isn't easy. If jv won a few races it was against high level competition. It just is.

I don't know of really any of the best guys i have ridden against who go on internet forums and pick on their competitors or others unless they have a good reason to do so. The first riders seem to respect the last riders because they're out there.

Talk is cheap. Sign up and pin on a number for a few seasons and then come back and talk about the value or validity of anyone's victories.

+1

[firerescuefin]

I think anyone who picks on someone who has won a bicycle race has never entered a bicycle race. Or started a bicycle race. Or finished a bicycle race. When you've done a few years of all of the above you can start to pick on those who have won bike races and you know the cream of the crop. Some are just better than others and it's just the way it is. It's not as easy as it looks. Sort of like winning the Masters or hitting a home run or running for a touchdown in the NFL. High level sports just isn't easy. If JV won a few races it was against high level competition. It just is.

I don't know of really any of the best guys I have ridden against who go on internet forums and pick on their competitors or others unless they have a good reason to do so. The first riders seem to respect the last riders because they're out there.

Talk is cheap. Sign up and pin on a number for a few seasons and then come back and talk about the value or validity of anyone's victories.

The issue of JV isn't his palmares. It's his very purposeful self marketing as the awe shucks blue collar guy combined with a façade of ignorance regarding the era he competed in (at the highest level) that seems very disingenuous to many. I enjoyed watching him race. I find the other part of it very phony and distasteful.

I don't have to have pinned on a number to not like bull···· and being lied to.

[Uncle Jam's Army]

I think anyone who picks on someone who has won a bicycle race has never entered a bicycle race. Or started a bicycle race. Or finished a bicycle race. When you've done a few years of all of the above you can start to pick on those who have won bike races and you know the cream of the crop. Some are just better than others and it's just the way it is. It's not as easy as it looks. Sort of like winning the Masters or hitting a home run or running for a touchdown in the NFL. High level sports just isn't easy. If JV won a few races it was against high level competition. It just is.

I don't know of really any of the best guys I have ridden against who go on internet forums and pick on their competitors or others unless they have a good reason to do so. The first riders seem to respect the last riders because they're out there.

Talk is cheap. Sign up and pin on a number for a few seasons and then come back and talk about the value or validity of anyone's victories.

I've pinned on a number for more than a few seasons, albeit in lower categories and Masters. Do I qualify to comment?

[saab2000]

.

[oldpotatoe]

They opened one in Santa Monica and the line was blocks long. Santa Monica, a city which probably has more yoga studios than Rishikesh.

Even Paradise can be boring or Is The Coffee Really That Good?
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8582/16674908716_6c85a87df5_o.jpg



Finally opened one in the republic(old one became a coffee shop then a MJ 'dispensary'). Drive thru to boot-yummy and great coffee.

[sandyrs]

They opened one in Santa Monica and the line was blocks long. Santa Monica, a city which probably has more yoga studios than Rishikesh.

Even Paradise can be boring or Is The Coffee Really That Good?
https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8582/16674908716_6c85a87df5_o.jpg


Dunkin probably makes the worst donuts I've ever had, and I would still eat six of them if they were left in front of me. Just goes to show how wonderful donuts are.

[grawk]

Their coffee is made by folgers...

[Lewis Moon]

Their coffee is made by folgers...

I want coffee made from beans crapped out by south Asian mammals and gently ground by performance artists in skinny jeans and bespoke Rasta ponchos. I want it in cups of porcelain produced from the bones of woolly mammoths harvested from the retreating glaciers in Denali National Park. I want it in a street corner bodega in Brooklyn designed by Frank Gerry.