Who else is hungry? Pre-season cutting

[Dead Man]

Call it a misery-loves-company thread..

Who's currently cutting for the approaching season?

How much did you pack on these holidays/how much you cutting back?

What are you doing to do it?

I have been "over weight" (for a cyclist) by about 10lbs pretty much since I started riding, but for as long as I continued to make gains on my climb segment times, I didn't sweat it too much. Having felt like I finally plateaued at the end of last season, and with the addition of about 10 more lbs ( :eek: ) of extra weight this winter un-season, I'm on a mission to cut all the way back to fighting weight. I peaked at around 170 in the middle of January (pie... Like Judas, it betrays you with a kiss), started counting cals 16 days ago, and am down 7 of the desired 20lbs I want to shed by the first week of March. It's a pretty simple thing to do.... eat less, ride more. Except that after initially dropping those 7lbs in the first week and a half, I have since not had any notable weight loss. I upped my basal intake from 17 to 20 kcals because I was shedding so much weight so fast, and was horribly miserably hungry. I haven't been as hungry, with those extra 300 cals... but I finally just edited my app to take me back to 1700 cals. I guess cutting is supposed to make you feel like an anorexic 16 year old girl.

One of my biggest problems is finding low fat, low sodium sources of protein. I'm consistently short on my protein goals every day, which obviously is going to hurt my stregnth:weight if I don't figure that out.

First race is March 28-29.. 7500' over two days. Not a killer, but it's gonna separate those with an extra bike's worth of weight hanging off their mid-sections from those who don't.

[54ny77]

Mmm....cutting.....

http://www.finecooking.com/assets/uploads/posts/30501/051110093-02-how-to-slice-steak_xlg.jpg

[seanile]

ut it's gonna separate those with an extra bike's worth of weight hanging off their mid-sections from those who don't....ive never thought of it this way....geez

[carpediemracing]

I'm in the middle of losing weight. The first time I ever seriously dieted was in late 2009 - I went from about 183 (what I considered to be "in shape" at the time - I was 190-210 over the winters) to 155 or so. I've since gone up to about 181 and started this diet a couple months ago, mid November, at 179 lbs. I'm at 161 now. I hope to get down just a bit more, 155 would be great, and if I can continue my basic diet then maybe I could see even lower numbers through the season.

After the initial drop in weight I find that I plateau for a week or so at a given weight then drop suddenly. The plateaus get longer. I'm at 2 weeks at the same weight right now but it seems like it's starting to drop a touch. I hope to be at the end of this plateau.

My lean body weight is realistically about 130-135 lbs. At 161 I'm still visibly fat, realistically 20-23% body fat, based on the picture here (http://cdn.builtlean.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/body-fat-percentage-men.jpg).

First race is March 15th, I hope, if things go well with venue permissions (I'll be promoting the race as well as racing it). I'll definitely be racing Mar 29 (first confirmed race). I do all flat/flatter races but I found that the weight loss really helps in accelerating out of turns and such. I haven't done a road race in forever, I'm usually the first to get shelled. If I was 130 lbs I'd be at 3.6 w/kg, meaning if I had zero body fat I'd be at 3.6 w/kg. My FTP is dismal and it shows when the road goes up.

Initially my cal goal was 1790 or so. I got more aggressive as I was consistently at 1600. Bumped it down to 1510 after a stupid 2 days trying to hold a super aggressive 1300-something. Lost 10? lbs at 1510. Then bumped up to 1690 to let myself relax a bit. Got through a 3-4 lbs plateau.

I'm wearing my clothes from 2010 so that's a good sign. I dig out size M jerseys for the trainer and they're baggy. The super tight size M jersey I got in 2014 (a gift) fits well. My size S shorts are getting a bit wrinkly. For anyone else that'd be bad but for me it's great.

[fiamme red]

One of my biggest problems is finding low fat, low sodium sources of protein.Low-fat cottage cheese or Greek yogurt, chicken or turkey breast, egg whites, tuna?

Or you can supplement with whey. This is the kind I like: http://www.vitacost.com/biochem-sports-whey-protein-isolate-powder-chocolate.

[old fat man]

The B,

Care to share more about the tools, knowledge, processes you're following? I'm in a similar situation where mentally I know that improving my diet and shedding ~10 lbs is a key to pushing me from mid pack Cat 3 to front of the pack Cat 3.


I ask as I shove one more handful of trail mix in my mouth, swearing this time it is my last

[ceolwulf]

If by "cutting" you mean "reducing my resemblance to the Sta-Puft Marshmallow Man" then yes I suppose I am doing that.

[OtayBW]

Sugar is da debil.....

[JAGI410]

Down 8lbs from Christmas, working on another 25-30 by end of summer. It's been somewhat slow going, but if I stick to my plan (Profile by Sanford) then results come at a reasonable and motivating rate. Officially lighter than I've been in at least 18 years. I agree, high protein low sodium things are tough to find!

[berserk87]

I was keeping within spitting distance of a good winter weight for me at 197lbs. Had some injury issues that kept me off of the bike for the first 2 weeks of January and I put on 12 pounds! I ate like I was still riding heavily and enjoyed every bite, it appears.

Where was this ability to pork up when I wanted it for football as a young man?

So I am back down to 203 and falling.

I am using the "My Fitness Pal" app for the first time. Loaded it on my ancient smartphone and my phone locked up when using it for the first time. It has a web portal so I am good going through my PC. I like it so far.

I've done Weight Watchers and just plain calorie counting in the past. Both work fine. The app has an estimate rolled into it for calories burned while exercising, which is cool because I have not accounted for this in the past.

Seems like I always get within 10lbs of my goal weight and then crap out and just stay there.

I would like to get down into the 180's again. Last time I was there I felt great on the bike and had my best TT times.

[Dead Man]

The B,

Care to share more about the tools, knowledge, processes you're following? I'm in a similar situation where mentally I know that improving my diet and shedding ~10 lbs is a key to pushing me from mid pack Cat 3 to front of the pack Cat 3.


I ask as I shove one more handful of trail mix in my mouth, swearing this time it is my last

Aside from a couple health/fitness classes I took in college, I have no great wealth of knowledge. I'm just using the basic principle that if you burn more calories than you consume, you must lose weight. Taking that a step further, I'm also improving the quality of the cals I take in- fruits for sugar, not cake. Lean proteins in legumes and fresh turkey, not high-fat meats. Etc.

Once you get a week or two into a big deficit program, pretty much ANY food tastes good. So cravings for ice cream and cookies aren't even in the picture, at this point. Which is a good side-effect- 'cause ice cream and cookies are what got me here to begin with. Now, I'll settle for just about anything, if it helps curb the gnawing emptiness inside me. A glass of 1% milk is a real treat, these days, as is dried apricots and prunes. A Twix might look delicious, as I stand in line holding a basket full of celery and carrots, but I know that's 220 calories I'll be robbing myself for the day, and I'll seriously regret it later when I'm super hungry but at my limit. I'd much rather save those calories for something bulkier that'll keep the hunger at bay for longer.

As this is my first really serious go at fully tracking what I eat, I've particularly noted how much sugar there is in fruit, and have had to flip-flop my fruit:veggie ratios. Fruit is a lot better for you than candy, but it really needs to be treated like candy- if you eat a lot, you're going to exceed your sugar limit for the day by 10am. I use apples and oranges as desert now, if I even get desert.

If it really comes down to being so hungry that it's having a negative effect on my life, I can trick the body... I'll hop on the trainer for 30 minutes or go do street light sprints in the neighborhood and earn a small PB&J sandwich or something.

If you haven't already, I strongly suggest using an app to track your cals. I'm using myfitnesspal. It has some shortcomings, especially with regard to expenditure, but if you tweek it some it'll do the job you need it to. Don't trust the figures it gives you for cycling - you'll need to edit that to get closer to what you actually burn on the bike... I strongly suspect it's using figures for fat non-cyclists, not folks like us who already live on our bikes.

[Dead Man]

Sugar is da debil.....

Yea, it really is. I'm just absolutely shocked at all the sugar there is in non-sweet foods. Salt, too. The last time I tracked my nutrition in any kind of scientific way was about 10 years ago, and I do not remember this being the case. So either they've started putting more sugar and salt in foods since then, or I just didn't care back then. I don't know.

Whichever- it's really disturbing to eat something that doesn't seem like a sugar food, plug it into my app, and discover I just consumed 30g of sugar (and am now probably over my limit).

[carpediemracing]

I use MyFitnessPal. The phone feature is nice (DroidX and LG G2 seem to be problem free). I'll "preload" a meal if I know I'm going out - much easier searching on the computer (laptop) than on the phone. It also keeps me honest so I'll walk into the place knowing what I'll order.

It's a bit shocking what you find. For example we used to go to Bertuccis after the Tues night races, sometimes hitting Chilis or Olive Garden. The kicker is the rolls they give you before the meal. You can get by after that, but it's the little things that derail me big time.

Also you have to be careful with chain restaurant foods. I tend to substitute stuff if it's similar, like "4 oz angus burger" and I'll click on 4 oz angus beef patty. It's not always like that. I read somewhere that the hot dogs in Friendlys has some insane amount of salt compared to regular hot dogs, if there are such things. Someone told me that the steak at Outback tastes great because of all the butter they use to cook it. Etc. Those are hidden but extremely significant calories.

I also have preset meals. I have a typical 450 cal oatmeal breakfast that can get me 3-6 hours into the day, depending on if I rode the night before or not. I cook a batch of food (rice or pasta, some kind of meat sauce) and then divide them up into 4-6 servings, each with a known quantity of stuff and therefore calories (400-500 cal each serving, depending on what it is). I don't mind eating the same things over and over.

Finally, for me, a huge, huge thing has been eliminating sugar. I'm already borderline diabetic, according to my blood tests from the last 10 years or so ("are you sure you fasted?"). This round (versus 2009), I cut sugar out only to save the calories. I found that after 3-5 days of being dizzy with hunger etc suddenly things seemed much more stable. I'd be hungry, yes, hands get cold or whatever, but not in a bonky way. It seems that avoiding sugar helped with this a lot. Normally I have a little coffee with my sugar and half-and-half, now it's black. I usually snack on bread with jam, now it's somewhat infrequent. I would snack on little bits of sweets. Not now. It seems to make my energy levels more stable.

My goal isn't just to lose the weight, it's to keep it off. I don't want to do unsustainable things for too long because then I'll just gain back the weight when I "stop dieting".

[texbike]

I'm actually going the other direction unfortunately.

After an accidental viewing of the Team Titans "waffle" episode (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EnTdLjNUaXM ) rekindled my love of the waffle back in December, I haven't been able to kick the daily habit. I'm a little squishier around the mid-section now than I'd like to be and it's starting to show through my jersey. Uhhhh.

Gotta stop cold waffle! Perhaps this will be the month...

Texbike

[carpediemracing]

Once you get a week or two into a big deficit program, pretty much ANY food tastes good. So cravings for ice cream and cookies aren't even in the picture, at this point.

So true.

One of the things I look for is the immense satisfaction of taking the first bite of whatever food I'm eating. It could be a really plain food but I know I waited long enough to eat if that first bite is like heaven.

If it's not then I know I didn't wait long enough to eat.

I did eat a fry and some other fried stuff (can't remember what it was). So gross now. That's a nice side effect.

[Dead Man]

My goal isn't just to lose the weight, it's to keep it off. I don't want to do unsustainable things for too long because then I'll just gain back the weight when I "stop dieting".

There are some distinctions that need to be made, with this regard. When I speak of "cutting," I'm not exactly talking about making major life changes- though I myself am kind of doing a 50/50 cut/life-change kind of deal.

A cutting program is a drastic weight loss for someone who isn't necessarily overweight to begin with... it's a totally unsustainable program. Lots of misery, big losses, then you generally go back to whatever habits you had before. Since my weight has been stably 10lbs over, I'm not going to need to make huge changes in my life to stay at my cut weight. Just eat less pie, stay up on my training, and I should have no problem staying at 150.

For people who have been truly overweight for a long time, or otherwise need to lose a LOT of weight, a cutting program may or may not work at all- being that miserable and knowing you're going to need to keep it up for months, versus weeks, is just going to exceed the will power of probably 9 out of 10 brothas.

I'm not at all saying we can't discuss both here- but I wouldnt want anyone to get the idea that dropping to a 1700cal diet is a good idea, when your goals are to lose, say, 40+ lbs. I'm probably really stretching the bounds of reasonable with my 20lbs goal.

[Louis]

Yes, I have occasionally been going to bed a bit hungry, mostly because a few weeks ago I instituted a new “rule” (ie improvement to my admittedly poor diet practices) that prevents me from eating anything at all more than 12 hours after I’ve had breakfast. Its primary practical effect is to disallow a snack when I get home late from work.

[notsew]

I lost six pounds on the norovirus diet last week. Very efficient!

[Black Dog]

The bottom line is that long term weight loss should not be done a rate the exceeds 1-2 pounds per week. More than this a the body moves into famine mode and starts to catabolize muscle, and slow basil metabolic rate. Both of these mechanisms have evolved to keep our ancestors alive during famine periods. So at the end of your rapid weight loss diet you are lighter, but with less muscle mass and a slower metabolism. When you start eating again you are at risk of gaining most of the weight back even if you eat at the break even calorie point that you were at when you started the diet. Research shows that long term weight loss is done slowly and in conjunction with increased activity; this builds muscle and raises the basil metabolic rate, both of which are Calorie consumers.

A million or so years of natural selection has made us very efficient at conserving calories. We are the only primates that pack on body fat because we are the only primates that evolved in an environment with an inconsistent food supply. Fat is tomorrows survival stored during todays feast. Look at mammals like bears that have seasonal food supplies and how quickly they pack on the pounds, when food is around and live off that fat for the winter.

It is hard to fight your DNA when you have good genes that make you famine resistant. The lower your body fat gets the more your genes fight back. This is manifest in the endless thoughts of eating even when not really being hungry. It is tough. I am at about 10 pounds over my racing weight (9% body fat while racing) and it is not easy to lose that last ten pounds and even harder to keep it off. :help:

[dustyrider]

You'll hate me for saying this, but I can't seem to put weight on. I've always hovered at 185ish in the winter and 175ish in the warmer months. I'm about 6'1".
I can cut 10 pounds in a few weeks with very little effort, but I'm not good at being sedentary. In fact I'm pacing while I type this.

Running has really made the biggest impact on my diet since certain foods(or lack thereof)in my belly and intestines slows me down or causes discomfort.
In the winter I crave carbs and eat lots of them...breads and stews and creamy pastas being my favs. In the summer its so hot I tend to avoid big cooked meals(except for breakfast), and I crave lots of fruits and veggies. Been getting into juicing as a form of time savings. Drinking a salad is way faster than prep. and all that chewing.

Good luck with the quest!

[tctyres]

I don't want to get into a long discussion on evolution, as that is OT.

The fact of the matter is that I'm 20lbs over where I want to be. I keep a spreadsheet and weigh myself in the morning. Right now, I'm down about 3 lbs from the beginning of the year, but the fluctuations from water retention can add 6 lbs on the day after a long ride. Normally, I eat about the same year round, with the exception of December, when I pack on lbs from cookies. This means that my weight last July/August was the low. The graph from my spreadsheet gives a pretty nice sine wave of weight loss and gain.

I didn't realize until I read this thread that I'm eating about double the calories from fruit per day that is recommended. I will drop that and get my vegetables up. I need to cut calories.

[jlwdm]

I dedicated myself to work the last four years and did not eat well or exercise enough. I believe in personal responsibility and know that I should have been able to work as hard as I did and exercise. I use junk food as a reward when I am working every day and all day.

So I decided this year to eating better and exercising. My goal is to work less this year.

For three weeks I thought I had found the secret. I ate less and not a lot of fatty and sugary foods. I could have eaten more vegetables though. I lost the desire to eat bad foods also.

For the first 25 days of the year I rode the bike for 25 miles on average. If I did not ride on the road I had to ride an exercise bike for 2 hours inside. Life was good and I lost 15 pounds in 20 days.

Then the weather turned better and I have not ridden for 9 straight days! And back on the junk food - quickly gained 8 lbs. And I really want the junk food again.

So time to turn it on again. Very disappointing.

Jeff

[Louis]

I will drop that and get my vegetables up. I need to cut calories.

As long as you don't end up craving a bunch of other stuff, veggies are a great option because they have so few calories / serving. Two, three, even four servings of some stuff, and you'll still be less than 100 cal total.

[Seramount]

I'd like to gain about 7-8 lbs...

think I'll go fry up a panful of bacon, then maybe a milkshake or two.

y'all have fun with your diets.

[Dead Man]

...ive never thought of it this way....geez

I remember when I hit 15lbs over my desired weight, and it hit me: freaken A.... that's how much my bike weighs. I could literally be carrying a spare bike on my back on these climbs.

[carpediemracing]

There are some distinctions that need to be made, with this regard. When I speak of "cutting," I'm not exactly talking about making major life changes- though I myself am kind of doing a 50/50 cut/life-change kind of deal.

A cutting program is a drastic weight loss for someone who isn't necessarily overweight to begin with... it's a totally unsustainable program.

You know, I knew that but the difference between "cutting" and what I'm doing didn't click. My bad.

I'm no good at cutting, at least not in the traditional sense.

[carpediemracing]

I remember when I hit 15lbs over my desired weight, and it hit me: freaken A.... that's how much my bike weighs. I could literally be carrying a spare bike on my back on these climbs.

At the beginning of 2010, when I was 29 lbs lighter than the prior March, it was just incredible. I was dragging my brakes on the hill at Bethel because I didn't want people to think I was doping.

My power was similar although a touch lower - I wasn't very good about checking slope etc the prior year so I think I was basically the same. However on the hill I was using 400-500w instead of 600-800w.

At that point the dieting paid off. Until then I wasn't sure I was gaining anything as I didn't feel any faster in training.

It's sort of like any big accomplishment - saving enough money for a downpayment on a house, buying a new car, doing well on a final, earning a degree, getting certified in something. There's pain, there's a bit of demoralization, but in the end it's feels great.

Or it's all cognitive dissonance. Heh.

[BobbyJones]

To answer the OP:

Yup. Just started. Goal this year isn't just get back to race weight, but get down to single digit BF.

Going raw for 30 days has always gotten the weight off, the challenge this time around is the conscious effort on the BF ratio.

As they (the 16 year old girls) say: "Nothing tastes as good as skinny feels".

[bluesea]

My problem is I love white rice, which is the major component of my dinner.

[Louis]

Going raw for 30 days has always gotten the weight off

Just out of curiosity, what does this entail?

[Dead Man]

You'll hate me for saying this, but I can't seem to put weight on. I've always hovered at 185ish in the winter and 175ish in the warmer months. I'm about 6'1".
I can cut 10 pounds in a few weeks with very little effort, but I'm not good at being sedentary. In fact I'm pacing while I type this.

Running has really made the biggest impact on my diet since certain foods(or lack thereof)in my belly and intestines slows me down or causes discomfort.
In the winter I crave carbs and eat lots of them...breads and stews and creamy pastas being my favs. In the summer its so hot I tend to avoid big cooked meals(except for breakfast), and I crave lots of fruits and veggies. Been getting into juicing as a form of time savings. Drinking a salad is way faster than prep. and all that chewing.

Good luck with the quest!

We've got a Vitamix sitting on the kitchen counter, plugged in and ready to use... I just can't seem to muster the courage to actually try to make something for myself. Aside from my morning bowl of oatmeal or cereal, my wife makes just about everything I eat, including packed lunches every day (bless her heart). But that could be a really useful tool. You could probably even work out a pretty nutritionally complete diet just on the blender alone- get your veggies, whey protein, starches, all together in one decently tasting, super consistent liquid form. There'd be no guesswork at all- you know exactly what's going in.

I must investigate this further.

As to you not being able to keep weight on.... yea, screw you. :p

I was like that through most of my 20s. But looking back, it's obvious why: I lived on peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and milk. I would have that for three meals a day, sometimes. My daily intake probably never exceeded 2000 cals. Once I got married, the wife was pretty outspoken about how I was too skinny and needed to fatten up- she stuffed me full of delicious rich food and desert... wonderful poison. Talk about betraying with a kiss...

You know, I knew that but the difference between "cutting" and what I'm doing didn't click. My bad.

I'm no good at cutting, at least not in the traditional sense.

Sounds like your methods are pretty damn close to a cutting program, though. If you can keep up a 1600-1700 basal calorie program for months at a time, you've got serious determination.

[dustyrider]

Just out of curiosity, what does this entail?

I'd imagine no cooked or processed foods...at least that's what I understand it to mean.

[Louis]

I'd imagine no cooked or processed foods...at least that's what I understand it to mean.

Hmmmm. So tomatoes, grapes, nuts, celery and so on. That does limit things quite a bit.

Protein could come from legumes, but without cooking that makes it tough. I guess dairy would be out (I avoid that anyway) but there is such a thing as raw milk (which I think is illegal in many areas).

[Dead Man]

Hmmmm. So tomatoes, grapes, nuts, celery and so on. That does limit things quite a bit.

Protein could come from legumes, but without cooking that makes it tough. I guess dairy would be out (I avoid that anyway) but there is such a thing as raw milk (which I think is illegal in many areas).

The folks I know who have gone to raw diets have continued to eat meat..... raw.

It can be done, if you're really selective and exercise a level of caution. I mean, we eat rare steak, right? The surface of the meat is generally where contaminates are going to be found. If you get good clean meat from a butcher you trust, a washing will generally be all you need to bring your risk level down to that of rare-cooked meat.

I wouldn't do this with pork or poultry.. but beef, lamb, other herbivorous mammals... yea, I'd eat some raw meat, if done right.

[dustyrider]

PWe've got a Vitamix sitting on the kitchen counter, plugged in and ready to use... I just can't seem to muster the courage to actually try to make something for myself. Aside from my morning bowl of oatmeal or cereal, my wife makes just about everything I eat, including packed lunches every day (bless her heart). But that could be a really useful tool. You could probably even work out a pretty nutritionally complete diet just on the blender alone- get your veggies, whey protein, starches, all together in one decently tasting, super consistent liquid form. There'd be no guesswork at all- you know exactly what's going in.

I must investigate this further.

As to you not being able to keep weight on.... yea, screw you. :p

I was like that through most of my 20s. But looking back, it's obvious why: I lived on peanut butter and jelly sandwiches and milk. I would have that for three meals a day, sometimes. My daily intake probably never exceeded 2000 cals. Once I got married, the wife was pretty outspoken about how I was too skinny and needed to fatten up- she stuffed me full of delicious rich food and desert... wonderful poison. Talk about betraying with a kiss...



The idea of a completely liquid diet is great, but don't forget what goes in comes out. There is a point of balance after you get the system you want down.

I live by two rules with my diet: everything in moderation (except beer and spirits as needed) and variety is the spice of life(definitely with beer and spirits). Basically I don't just consume liquids; it may seem so in the summer. You're daily meal when you were 20 is my typical lunch minus the milk + some fruit.
I really enjoy the liquid diet in the summer since beer, spirits and water can only go so far.
If you give it a go, vegetables you'd typically eat raw or cooked are a bit different juiced. Some people don't like them without a lot of fruit which may be counter productive to dieting. But there are sweet vegetable juices like carrots or cucumber or celery for instance. It takes some time but once you get a diet and system it's pretty quick, and it's very portable.

Hey you gotta keep the wife happy...wonderful poison can't be the worse way to do that!

[dustyrider]

Hmmmm. So tomatoes, grapes, nuts, celery and so on. That does limit things quite a bit.

Protein could come from legumes, but without cooking that makes it tough. I guess dairy would be out (I avoid that anyway) but there is such a thing as raw milk (which I think is illegal in many areas).



You've got it! At least my understanding. I don't know where someone on this diet stands with nuts, but a peanut is a legume.

[dustyrider]

The folks I know who have gone to raw diets have continued to eat meat..... raw.

It can be done, if you're really selective and exercise a level of caution. I mean, we eat rare steak, right? The surface of the meat is generally where contaminates are going to be found. If you get good clean meat from a butcher you trust, a washing will generally be all you need to bring your risk level down to that of rare-cooked meat.

I wouldn't do this with pork or poultry.. but beef, lamb, other herbivorous mammals... yea, I'd eat some raw meat, if done right.

I'd eat salmon like a grizzly bear!

[Louis]

I'd eat salmon like a grizzly bear!

Time to go hunting!!!

http://a1.files.xojane.com/image/upload/c_fit,dpr_1.0,q_80,w_620/MTI0ODkxNzIzNzkxOTEwOTIy.jpg

[Dead Man]

Indeed.. Some flesh should be eaten uncooked.

:banana:

[dustyrider]

Earlier on a run we all shared the highlight of our day. I stated it would be seeing the seatpost I just picked up in front of my door(ahh Tuesdays). I could have no idea a thread about cutting weight and cravings would have me regretting speaking so soon. The paceline truly is great.

[JAGI410]

Since there's a few other MFP people here, my Myfitnesspal user name is JAGI410

Doing the raw diet thing seems like it would be effective, but raw meat would be hard to stomach with aside from sushi!

[carpediemracing]

My problem is I love white rice, which is the major component of my dinner.

I regularly have 1.5 servings of white rice (if 1/4 cup uncooked is a serving). In the rice cooker (Japanese) it's 3/4 cup per whatever cup scoop that we've lost. So I do 3/4 cup rice per "line of water". If I do 5 x 3/4 cups then I pull out 5 tupperware things. I evenly divide them among the 5, so 3/4 cup uncooked per container, then I eat 1/2 of the container with whatever.

My current method for cutting the rice/sauce, to use the term a different way, is to add a ton of green beans, mushrooms, some onion, some garlic. The sauce I usually cook with either boneless/skinless chicken stuff (thighs or breasts) with Indian sauce, or I use a ground beef with pasta sauce (and have it with the rice).

Part of the appeal of this is that it's easy to replicate a meal. I don't want to be weighing or measuring servings of rice or sauce or whatever. If I cook a batch, divide it up into known servings (the sauce I divide up into whatever works, so each serving gets x amount of chicken, y amount of sauce, etc) then it's easy. I just check the same items again and bam, I'm done logging.

For the record I'm basically not paying attention to salt. Initially (2 months) I was severely limiting fat, like 15-20g per meal. I sometimes took a multivitamin - after 2 months I was definitely lacking all sorts of stuff, my body was breaking down. It took a week of multivitamins to get anywhere near normal. Now I worry about calories, not a lot of thought regarding fat. Still trying to avoid too much sugar since eating sugary stuff makes me aggressively hungry quicker.

[Dead Man]

Not paying attention to salt would make my struggle easier in a couple of ways - but unfortunately, I've come back into a healthy blood pressure after suffering from hypertension for about a year. Doctor was really pushing the BP medication, but I looked at my diet and realized I had a pretty high sodium intake- sunflower seed addict of many years... sometimes two bags a day. Salted, of course.

Dropping the sodium has indeed brought the BP down.

[john903]

Lots of great ideas here it seems if we eat healthier be it vegetarian,vegan, or raw diet or just eating a balanced diet with an extra helping of good veggies the pounds come off. Of course it is getting that that last 10 pounds off for racing weight. The thing I found almost by accident was after I retired from the Coast Guard I lost 15 lbs (172) down to 157 then then settled out at 162. What I found I did was eat less because on the ship it was open galley so you could have a snack or meal whenever you wanted. When I noticed my weight loss I wanted to keep it off so one thing that has really helped me is not eating after 6:00 pm,eating several small meals through out the day (fruit, yogurt.) The biggest help for me is portion control I want a bowl of ice cream I put one scoop in tiny bowl so it fills the bowl, I have a PB&J for lunch I cut it in half and have the other half at lunch then the other half around 2:00 before the commute home. I get home usually around 5:00 and enjoy eating almost anything really, tonight was homemade white been soup with homemade bread in a coffee cup 16oz instead of a big bowl then I do the dishes and if I get hungry I don't want to get the dishes dirty because I just cleaned them so that helps too.
Have a great day

[fatallightning]

I just started a carb cut. I was a certified fat ass years ago at 272 lbs, atkins it downed to 175. When I'm riding more in season, I roll carbs back in. Well this off season I rolled even more carbs with even less riding, and ended up on the wrong side of the Clyde scale. Looking to drop 25 lbs in about 2 months. Plenty doable on a <20g of carbs a day diet. I've been down into the high 160s, but race best at the 175-180 mark. I want to be justtttt thin enough to not be embarrassing in a skinsuit.

[berserk87]

I'd like to gain about 7-8 lbs...

think I'll go fry up a panful of bacon, then maybe a milkshake or two.

y'all have fun with your diets.

You would so get punched in the face right now by a lot of us fat guys...

[Dead Man]

My wife brushes her teeth after dinner, and she doesn't eat after she brushes her teeth.

Little tricks like that don't ever seem to work for me, but they do for some folks.

[mtechnica]

"cutting" is dumb. If you're an athlete you need to eat enough food (and carbs) to fuel your muscles. If a reasonable diet and eating when you're hungry is making you gain weight you're either not eating the right things or not riding enough (OR both). Furthermore, if you're riding enough you can eat almost anything you want as long as you do it at the appropriate time of day. If you're hungry and feel weak you need to eat bottom line or you're gonna perform worse regardless of your weight.

[BobbyJones]

Hmmmm. So tomatoes, grapes, nuts, celery and so on. That does limit things quite a bit.

Protein could come from legumes, but without cooking that makes it tough. I guess dairy would be out (I avoid that anyway) but there is such a thing as raw milk (which I think is illegal in many areas).


My last version was no animal products, nothing cooked and nothing processed beyond chopping / blending.

Sooooo.... no beans, no dairy, no nuts, no coffee, no added salt or oils. The primary exception to this is that I did keep up with my standard vitamin supplements which include fish oil caps, vitamin C, and turmeric- all processed in some way.

I was otherwise pretty strict on the last round about my meals. I think there were maybe 4 known exceptions throughout the month. Those were silly things like blanched broccoli and pasteurized lemon juice in a salad.

Aside from the weight loss, there we're a host of other benefits, both physical and mental.

[Dead Man]

"cutting" is dumb. If you're an athlete you need to eat enough food (and carbs) to fuel your muscles. If a reasonable diet and eating when you're hungry is making you gain weight you're either not eating the right things or not riding enough (OR both). Furthermore, if you're riding enough you can eat almost anything you want as long as you do it at the appropriate time of day. If you're hungry and feel weak you need to eat bottom line or you're gonna perform worse regardless of your weight.

What question do you think you just answered?

[fatallightning]

"cutting" is dumb. If you're an athlete you need to eat enough food (and carbs) to fuel your muscles. If a reasonable diet and eating when you're hungry is making you gain weight you're either not eating the right things or not riding enough (OR both). Furthermore, if you're riding enough you can eat almost anything you want as long as you do it at the appropriate time of day. If you're hungry and feel weak you need to eat bottom line or you're gonna perform worse regardless of your weight.

I know carb cuts are still controversial, but man, does my body click with it. The first 4 days or so before your body switches over to ketosis can be brutal. I will say, I'm a crit/track racer, so I dont't quite need the deep glucose store a stage racer would. I also lift heavy to try and keep strength and muscle mass up. Enough protein to kill a bear.

[BobbyJones]

So many things wrong with this.

"cutting" is dumb. If you're an athlete you need to eat enough food (and carbs) to fuel your muscles. If a reasonable diet and eating when you're hungry is making you gain weight you're either not eating the right things or not riding enough (OR both). Furthermore, if you're riding enough you can eat almost anything you want as long as you do it at the appropriate time of day. If you're hungry and feel weak you need to eat bottom line or you're gonna perform worse regardless of your weight.

[Louis]

you're either not eating the right things or not riding enough (OR both)

1) Most folks I know (including yours truly) don't eat a perfect diet 100% of the time, whether we're talking quality or quantity.

2) At this time of year, unless you're super-motivated, it's easy to not ride enough, indoors or outdoors.

[carpediemracing]

We've got a Vitamix sitting on the kitchen counter, plugged in and ready to use...

Sounds like your methods are pretty damn close to a cutting program, though. If you can keep up a 1600-1700 basal calorie program for months at a time, you've got serious determination.

We have a Vitamix as well. A smoothie I make, it's almost like ice cream. 8 oz apple cider, 1 cup non-fat greek yogurt, 1 cup frozen fruit (whatever, anything from fresh pineapple that I froze to a frozen fruit bag kind of thing), 1/4 oatmeal, and if not on a low fat thing then 1 tbsp sliced almonds. Maybe a banana, if we have extra. If I remember I'll throw in a handful of kale - you don't notice it. I know the Missus will sneak in some something or another for joints health or something, I forget what it is.

This makes a huge cup and is 450 calories give or take. It's really satisfying although a bit cold in the winter. With the frozen fruit it's thick enough that I have to use a spoon. It's also "cleaner" in that it basically slides out of the Vitamix, not like a shake-like smoothie that coats the Vitamix.

I don't think my numbers are too extreme although when I check various foods I realize just how quickly I could rack up the calories. I remember sitting at my dad's over Christmas holiday looking at the deserts my sister-in-law had put down. I'd have normally eaten one of each of the various things, in a splurge situation (Christmas, lots of family around). It'd have ben 1800 cal just for desert, conservatively speaking, 2200 on the higher side. That didn't include the maybe 2000 cal for dinner, maybe 2500 cal. Plus all the stuff to snack on. Blah blah blah. I had (and I weighed - I even brought a scale to everyone's amusement) 180g of turkey meat. And it was really good.

I'm not a health food nut in any "Facebook" sense, no raw, no focusing on this or that. I'm sort of a working man's diet, it's like looking for a Cat 3 crit bike. Good solid frame, reliable components, and maybe some flashy wheels (which is my Cat 3 crit bike).

I eat normal foods (alum frame, Campy 10s), I just select stuff more carefully and do a few judicious adjustments (HED carbon tubulars). It's like the non-fat Greek yogurt vs regular yogurt. Or cutting off all the fat off of the skinless/boneless chicken. Or choosing a sauce mix that has 1/2 the fat of another. Etc etc.

Today I had about 1850 cal but rode 2:10, doing 1200 kJ of work according to the SRM (avg wattage for the whole ride was 154w which for me is just under race pace for an easier race or maybe a 15 mph JRA ride). Realistically that's a 800 cal net income day, maybe a little less. I'd have ridden another hour but I started 45-50 minutes later than I planned so I cut the 3 hour ride short. I'm not hungry now and will go to sleep after having just water.

[Jgrooms]

Some of my 8% tricks.

Smaller portions. Spread out cals. Shrink the stomach & it will demand less.

Base period do end pace on water till the tummy screams. It will stop & you'll be ripping the fat off. The key is steady in the zone. Best to ride alone.

Drink more water.

Grab a piece of gum.

Brush teeth.

Do AM pre work intensity ride on trainer on minimal cals. This is 6 am, so unless you ate at 4, you shouldn't have a big meal prior.

Cut the sports mixes in base. You ain't going to 'bonk'.

[Wesley37]

Won't get involved in back and forth, but FWIW, I have dropped 25lbs and kept it off, and increased my FTP by about 40 watts in the last 2 - 3 seasons.

http://www.velopress.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/RW2_96dpi_400x600_stroke.jpg

[ptourkin]

Hmmmm. So tomatoes, grapes, nuts, celery and so on. That does limit things quite a bit.

Protein could come from legumes, but without cooking that makes it tough. I guess dairy would be out (I avoid that anyway) but there is such a thing as raw milk (which I think is illegal in many areas).

This is a myth. For one, most Americans vastly overestimate their protein requirements. Two, we can get our needed protein from fruits and vegetables without any extreme measures.
Agree that there is no magic formula of ingredients for the cut - vegan, paleo (nonsense) or otherwise - it's math. Consume less than you burn and the number will come down. I have no problem gaining weight on a plant-based diet when I eat too much. Consider exercise before breakfast if you want to kickstart your day. A lot of cyclists have used this effectively.

http://www.vrg.org/nutrition/protein.php

[shovelhd]

I am always hungry.

/thread

[Dead Man]

This is a myth. For one, most Americans vastly overestimate their protein requirements. Two, we can get our needed protein from fruits and vegetables without any extreme measures.
Agree that there is no magic formula of ingredients for the cut - vegan, paleo (nonsense) or otherwise - it's math. Consume less than you burn and the number will come down. I have no problem gaining weight on a plant-based diet when I eat too much. Consider exercise before breakfast if you want to kickstart your day. A lot of cyclists have used this effectively.

http://www.vrg.org/nutrition/protein.php

You craY. We aren't herbivores. If you give it a lot of effort and utilize a large collective of information, you can live a vegetarian diet without dying.. but that crap is unnatural.

[seanile]

i just wanted to let you all know, i had a small cup of cinnamon applesauce for breakfast, so now im going to get extra meat on my burrito at chipotle.
#winning

[ptourkin]

You craY. We aren't herbivores. If you give it a lot of effort and utilize a large collective of information, you can live a vegetarian diet without dying.. but that crap is unnatural.

Are you joking? Ugh. Science and athletic performance says otherwise. Just Google vegan ultra endurance athletes. We're here and doing great. Get used to it. See you at the 508 this year?

[Uncle Jam's Army]

You guys are a bunch of jerks! I tried "cutting" yesterday and tracked everything on MyFitnessPal. I rode not once, but twice. I even refrained from drinking beer. BEER!

I lost no weight. Not a single ounce.

A pox on all your houses.

[Dead Man]

Are you joking? Ugh. Science and athletic performance says otherwise. Just Google vegan ultra endurance athletes. We're here and doing great. Get used to it. See you at the 508 this year?

No, science does not say otherwise. Absolutely not. Science is perfectly clear human beings are omnivores by nature. What I said is exactly accurate. You're picking up on my sentiment "and not die," which obviously was meant to be kind of a poke at you strange self-hating herbivorian humans, but the statement is otherwise 100% right. We're not herbivores, and living a completely vegetarian diet requires utilizing a large body of external information to do sustainably. If you just ate whatever random fruits and vegetables you happened across all day every day, you'd die inside of two months. Especially come winter.

I will fully acknowledge that many of you do it and do it well. But it's not, not, not natural. Don't even try to convince me otherwise.

[shovelhd]

No need to convince you, they'll just fart in your general direction.

[berserk87]

You guys are a bunch of jerks! I tried "cutting" yesterday and tracked everything on MyFitnessPal. I rode not once, but twice. I even refrained from drinking beer. BEER!

I lost no weight. Not a single ounce.

A pox on all your houses.

Post of the day! A check for $1 is in the mail.

Might even be a candidate for post of the month. That would be another 12 cents in your change purse.

[Zoodles]

Started using myfitnesspal out of curiosity. Even though we stay away from processed or sugary foods it's highlighted a few of the snacks in our healthy house already.

I wouldn't mind losing a conservative few pounds before race season, however, I train at night (8-10 pm) and get done wiped and hungry. Trying to get recovered and limit carbs is a challenge - as are the nacho chips I can't put down.

[Dave B]

I am built like a linebacker, lift often and love being strong. I will never be a cyclist, just a guy who digs bikes. However, being built like I am has come in handy when dealing with pricks in cars. No I don't back down and yes I am a moron.

Cutting...I could not eat for a year and still not be skinny cyclist. My smoking hot wife prefers The Rock, not The Lance.

I tried to be a cyclist and race cross and that jazz, but I am not any good, so now I am free to just be a big heavy monster.

[bikenut]

This is a myth. For one, most Americans vastly overestimate their protein requirements. Two, we can get our needed protein from fruits and vegetables without any extreme measures.
Agree that there is no magic formula of ingredients for the cut - vegan, paleo (nonsense) or otherwise - it's math. Consume less than you burn and the number will come down. I have no problem gaining weight on a plant-based diet when I eat too much. Consider exercise before breakfast if you want to kickstart your day. A lot of cyclists have used this effectively.

http://www.vrg.org/nutrition/protein.php

Would pre-breakfast weight training have the same effect as low intensity cycling for fat burning?

[Dead Man]

I am built like a linebacker, lift often and love being strong. I will never be a cyclist, just a guy who digs bikes. However, being built like I am has come in handy when dealing with pricks in cars. No I don't back down and yes I am a moron.

Cutting...I could not eat for a year and still not be skinny cyclist. My smoking hot wife prefers The Rock, not The Lance.

I tried to be a cyclist and race cross and that jazz, but I am not any good, so now I am free to just be a big heavy monster.

I'm short and light and have no problem getting off the bike. Thus far, nobody wants any of my scrawny but obviously more aggressive ass. In our society, showing teeth is going to get the other prick to back down probably fully 95% of the time, whether you're 220 or 130.

[BobbyJones]

Would pre-breakfast weight training have the same effect as low intensity cycling for fat burning?

There's alot of "newer" information out there concerning both low intensity fuels and intermittent fasting- which here in the States apparently means any time you can go a few minutes without stuffing food in your mouth.

Your question can be interpreted as pretty vague, but on a 1 to 1 duration basis you'll burn more fat with weight training AND gain different benefits not specific to cycling.

[Nooch]

I am built like a linebacker, lift often and love being strong. I will never be a cyclist, just a guy who digs bikes. However, being built like I am has come in handy when dealing with pricks in cars. No I don't back down and yes I am a moron.

Cutting...I could not eat for a year and still not be skinny cyclist. My smoking hot wife prefers The Rock, not The Lance.

I tried to be a cyclist and race cross and that jazz, but I am not any good, so now I am free to just be a big heavy monster.

This is my goal now.. I know my body well enough by now, having been at close to 300 lbs and not doing anything to racing and doing only cardio at 197 to now hanging out back at 230. Realizing that being generally strong will do more for me in life than being light and fast... I love racing, but picking things up and putting them down is pretty fun too. I'd like to find a happy median, maybe get back down to 195 or so but a lot more muscle than the last time i was there -- not that I was 'skinny' then by any sense, but I think the term 'skinny-fat' would apply to where I was sitting.

And then I can still race and not be any good at it.

[bluto]

Realizing that being generally strong will do more for me in life than being light and fast...

HAHAHAH.....this is hilarious

One must be between 195+ before overall strength really starts to "kick in"......got it..........thanks for the chuckle!

[ceolwulf]

And then I can still race and not be any good at it.


Track sprinting?

[Dead Man]

Track sprinting?

Never ceases to amaze me the beer guts that waddle out onto the track. And then again at how thoroughly they destroy me.

[oldpotatoe]

Call it a misery-loves-company thread..

Who's currently cutting for the approaching season?

How much did you pack on these holidays/how much you cutting back?

What are you doing to do it?

I have been "over weight" (for a cyclist) by about 10lbs pretty much since I started riding, but for as long as I continued to make gains on my climb segment times, I didn't sweat it too much. Having felt like I finally plateaued at the end of last season, and with the addition of about 10 more lbs ( :eek: ) of extra weight this winter un-season, I'm on a mission to cut all the way back to fighting weight. I peaked at around 170 in the middle of January (pie... Like Judas, it betrays you with a kiss), started counting cals 16 days ago, and am down 7 of the desired 20lbs I want to shed by the first week of March. It's a pretty simple thing to do.... eat less, ride more. Except that after initially dropping those 7lbs in the first week and a half, I have since not had any notable weight loss. I upped my basal intake from 17 to 20 kcals because I was shedding so much weight so fast, and was horribly miserably hungry. I haven't been as hungry, with those extra 300 cals... but I finally just edited my app to take me back to 1700 cals. I guess cutting is supposed to make you feel like an anorexic 16 year old girl.

One of my biggest problems is finding low fat, low sodium sources of protein. I'm consistently short on my protein goals every day, which obviously is going to hurt my stregnth:weight if I don't figure that out.

First race is March 28-29.. 7500' over two days. Not a killer, but it's gonna separate those with an extra bike's worth of weight hanging off their mid-sections from those who don't.

7 pounds in 10 days!!! Waterweight or ?

[Nooch]

HAHAHAH.....this is hilarious

One must be between 195+ before overall strength really starts to "kick in"......got it..........thanks for the chuckle!

I'm not sure I'm picking up on the humor... forgive me, I'm jet lagged, but would love to understand...

[Dead Man]

7 pounds in 10 days!!! Waterweight or ?

I assume it's at least partially poop and water. I did finally drop another 2lbs in the last few days, for a total of 9lbs in 17 days, which sounds much more reasonable.

[oldpotatoe]

I assume it's at least partially poop and water. I did finally drop another 2lbs in the last few days, for a total of 9lbs in 17 days, which sounds much more reasonable.

9 pounds in 17 days is a lot, IMHO. BUT good for you. I'm on a see food diet, I see it, I eat it. That and 12oz curls.

[seanile]

HAHAHAH.....this is hilarious

One must be between 195+ before overall strength really starts to "kick in"......got it..........thanks for the chuckle!

it's subjective, but you can't seriously be arguing that muscle mass and general strength doesn't come with weight gains.
given his provided context of feeling normal at 230, skinny-ish at 195, and once upon a time being 300, he knows when his overall strength is best..and that's 195+. I'm the same, my fatless body is about 170, i feel stupid weak below 185. and healthy around 195-200, but strong when im 210 and not eating ice cream twice a week.
again, it's subjective.

[Nooch]

it's subjective, but you can't seriously be arguing that muscle mass and general strength doesn't come with weight gains.
given his provided context of feeling normal at 230, skinny-ish at 195, and once upon a time being 300, he knows when his overall strength is best..and that's 195+. I'm the same, my fatless body is about 170, i feel stupid weak below 185. and healthy around 195-200, but strong when im 210 and not eating ice cream twice a week.
again, it's subjective.

I'm just going to throw this out there, because maybe I stated my initial comment a bit haphazardly (again -- jet lag is a beech).

I feel good below 200 lbs. I'm happy to get back there. My schedule hasn't allowed for much cardio, but it does allow to go to the gym and lift on my lunch break three days a week (won't do cardio on lunch -- too sweaty, not enough time). So I'm doing what I can do, and I'm happy doing it. Once it gets a bit nicer here in NJ, I'll get back on the bike and get more of my cardio, and hopefully find myself with the muscle gainz and cut the weight back down to the 195 that i was.

There's a dude who races in the city -- 165, squats 400+, ripped lean dude. I don't think I've got the time with two under two at home to get there, especially starting from behind the 8-ball where I did. (a former pack a day smoker who loves pizza, pasta, desserts, wine, gin and tonics, etc...)

When I went from nearing 300 to under 200, it was weight watchers and cardio. I didn't lift. I don't know why, but I didn't. So while I lost a ton of weight, and perhaps felt 'skinny,' I had no muscle mass (Except what I was putting on my legs from riding), and essentially, did it wrong. It was awesome to lose all the weight, but I think it was that 'skinny fat.' Now I'm focused more on losing inches and gaining strength (since I screwed up and got myself back up to 230, again, two under two really screwed up my lifestyle.) When the number on the scale starts dropping as well, I'll be especially happy -- i love numbers.

So knowing my body type (big broad shoulders even with no muscle, I'm a short, stocky, barrel chested dude), I know that becoming a 120 lb climber is not in the least bit appealing, let alone likely possible. If I can get myself down anywhere between 180-200 lbs, doing what I'm doing now, doing it the 'right' way, I'll be happy.

sorry for the derailment!!

[54ny77]

http://i.imgur.com/CEk8iYS.gif

[Dead Man]

http://i.imgur.com/CEk8iYS.gif


This is about how I feel when I'm crunch, crunch, crunch, crunch, crunch, crunching on vegetables and nuts and crap.

[superflyss]

im dying of starvation.. heh

[Dead Man]

im dying of starvation.. heh

Dying to get your stuff posted in the classifieds, methinks.

[unterhausen]

I usually try to lose a half pound a week or something like that. Going for big losses doesn't work for me. Most of us can just drop or cut back one thing and lose weight. Then there is no need for radical diet changes

[carpediemracing]

I was prepping my breakfast today and thinking about this thread. Junior is sick so he didn't wake up at his normal 6-6:30 so I had some time.

I'm a sort of Cat 3 food person. Workingman's food. I don't get into fancy things, just solid, everyday stuff. For me the Vitamix was the most exotic thing I use. My favorite cooking utensil is the microwave - I still don't understand why companies don't sell stacking microwave cabinets but they have stacking oven cabinets.

Since we only have one microwave (for a while I put another on a counter but that's a different story) I start by heating up my coffee. 1:30 or so. In a carafe and I'm not a coffee snob so it's fine for me, even black.

In that 1:30 I put my oatmeal together - oatmeal, raisins, sliced almonds, brown sugar, water. I switch the coffee for the oatmeal, 2:30.

In just over 4 minutes (it takes me, what, like 20 seconds to pour my cold coffee?), I have a full breakfast ready to eat.

If I had to cook every time I ate, meaning on the cooktop, I'd be a goner. I can cook but for me I'd rather be doing something else. I do cook some evenings and then divide up the food, have one serving for that meal, and refrigerate the rest for future meals. It takes a similar amount of time to prepare, most of the time for the microwave. Maybe a minute to get the food ready to microwave, 2-3 minutes actually nuking it.

All this makes maintaining my diet pretty easy and straightforward. It's the dieting equivalent of JRA. I train by JRA, I eat by JRA. I save my mental energy for other things. You know, Paceline and stuff :)

Maybe at some other point in my life I'll lovingly cook eggs on the cast iron skillet more regularly, or pancakes or grilled cheese or whatever (which is what I do maybe a few times a week, typically for Junior).

*edit -
Oh and yesterday was a 1430 calorie day. Junior was sick (102-104.5 fever, 100-101 after taking Tylenol; today he seems cooler but I haven't taken his temp yet), I had a lot of bike race stuff happening throughout the day (secured venue in morning dependent on contract and insurance certificate, secured significant raffle prize as well, started process to get insurance certificate, start updating sites, got portapotties for site, ordered numbers for the races as I was waiting on the second venue, had to do some graphic design stuff for the race flyer, etc), had to go for a job interview (am not taking it but it was good practice if nothing else), and then run errands. The business helped with keeping me from food. I rode pretty hard the night before so I expected to eat more but that didn't happen.

[Uncle Jam's Army]

You guys are a bunch of jerks! I tried "cutting" yesterday and tracked everything on MyFitnessPal. I rode not once, but twice. I even refrained from drinking beer. BEER!

I lost no weight. Not a single ounce.

A pox on all your houses.

Today the scale says I lost 2 pounds. 2,100 calories yesterday, 2.5 hours on the bike. I even had a beer.

All is forgiven.

[Dead Man]

I did my first decent hill ride since I started cutting, yesterday. I felt weird, with the massive deficits I've been running.. but I did feel lighter. I moved up to 3rd overall on the first and second climbs both, and re-captured a KOM I'd lost last month. I really felt horrible at the tops, but at least I got to them faster..

[tctyres]

In that 1:30 I put my oatmeal together - oatmeal, raisins, sliced almonds, brown sugar, water. I switch the coffee for the oatmeal, 2:30.

In just over 4 minutes (it takes me, what, like 20 seconds to pour my cold coffee?), I have a full breakfast ready to eat.
...

Maybe at some other point in my life I'll lovingly cook eggs on the cast iron skillet more regularly, or pancakes or grilled cheese or whatever (which is what I do maybe a few times a week, typically for Junior).


Eggs in the microwave are dead easy. This is normally what I do:
Crack two eggs in a microwaveable bowl
Add a splash of milk
Beat with a fork
Cut up about a thumb's worth of cheese and add to the mix
Throw in some spices. Right now I have a lemon pepper mill from Trader Joe's or something like that.
Beat with a fork.
Put it in the microwave for a 45-60s.
Stir when done.
Repeat microwave and stir step until happy. About 2 minutes is what is should take.

Your first time will be an experiment, and you'll likely overcook them. After that, you're good.

[oldpotatoe]

Eggs in the microwave are dead easy. This is normally what I do:
Crack two eggs in a microwaveable bowl
Add a splash of milk
Beat with a fork
Cut up about a thumb's worth of cheese and add to the mix
Throw in some spices. Right now I have a lemon pepper mill from Trader Joe's or something like that.
Beat with a fork.
Put it in the microwave for a 45-60s.
Stir when done.
Repeat microwave and stir step until happy. About 2 minutes is what is should take.

Your first time will be an experiment, and you'll likely overcook them. After that, you're good.

Then add...my problem...

[Dead Man]

I changed my myfitnesspal lifestyle mode from "active" to whatever is right below it... sort of active, I guess.. because I realized I don't actually really do that much throughout the day, most days. Some days I am on the jobsite and actually do stuff- pack material, climb ladders, climb steep roofs and stuff... but if I'm being really honest with myself, most days I just sit a lot. I definitely don't count training - that gets logged individually. And the realization was that on those days that I do actually get my hands dirty, I can log that as extra exercise also.

So doing that actually robbed me of like another 250 calories off my daily goals.. I'm down to a caloric base of 1300-something, running a 1000-cal daily deficit. Some days I can triple that, if I get a long ride in and have to pack a unit of plywood up a ladder or something. Usually I try to stay 200-300 under that 1000 base, so more lke 1200-1300. That should come out to a lbs every couple days, but the body does what it will in its own time, I guess.

That last breakthrough from 163 to 161 has stalled out. I'm hovering right around 160.5.... still have not seen the underside of 160 yet (nor have I, in about a decade), but I'm sure I will in the next two-three days, because all this hunger has to be for something. I'm still on track to drop 20, or more, in 2 months... so I'm not complaining too hard.

How's everyone else?

Edit - this morning's weigh-in (weight + breakfast - poop/pee) 160.2..... very close to being the lightest I've been since the first half of my 20s

[shovelhd]

I am about 8 pounds over race weight, but I have just started base. No long rides. No outside rides. First races in four weeks but no pressure for results. I need to be at race weight by mid April and I see no problem doing that.

[Dead Man]

Finally got that first 10 ticked. 159.8lbs this morning, post-poop. Officially te lightest I've been since my mid twenties. Only by a few lbs, but still..

Getting better at spreading out my food so I stop getting so stark-raving-ravenous by meal time, which makes you want to over-eat when you do eat. I have had to ride every day this week to be able to eat dinner, with the recent extra caloric drop... And that's not always easy, but weather has been pretty decent and it stays light till 5:30-6.

[MattTuck]

I am about 8 pounds over race weight, but I have just started base. No long rides. No outside rides. First races in four weeks but no pressure for results. I need to be at race weight by mid April and I see no problem doing that.

If I can get out on the road in 4 weeks for a regular ride, I'll be ecstatic. I'm hoping to drop 10 by April 10th, but it sure would be easier if I could get out for some nice long rides between now and then.


Finally got that first 10 ticked. 159.8lbs this morning, post-poop. Officially te lightest I've been since my mid twenties. Only by a few lbs, but still..


Congrats. That is awesome.

[old fat man]

Currently at 176 which is my usual summer weight. Watching my calorie intake via myfitnesspal has definitely kept me from reaching for the snacks as often as I usually would. Nothing drastic (about 1600-1800 calories a day) and I'm down about 4 pounds in a week and a half. Wouldn't mind losing 6 more and continuing to improve the quality of my diet.

I'm riding indoors due to the snow in New England and will not get to really test the outdoor fitness until March I'm guessing, but already, I can tell I'm ahead of where I was last year.

[Dead Man]

myfitnesspal is rad. I need to do some research into the organization (I have done zero). There have been no shortage of apps, but this one was done really well.

I ate my first bowl of ice cream in a long time last night. Got a good ride in and somehow had some extra cals, to I treated myself. I weighed out exactly two servings, or 1 cup, and was kind of shocked at how little ice cream there was in my bowl. I would have loaded up twice that and called it a "bowl" before... sometimes more. Plus chocolate syrup. Looking at my past habits, I feel better about myself as I am getting older: if I didn't still have a really good, high metabolism, I would have been a disgusting fatbody years ago. So there's that, anyway.

I do feel like my eating habits are forever changed, but we'll see what happens in a couple years... hell- we'll see what happens at the end of this race season, long after I have stopped calorie counting and am use to eating whatever I want whenever, from 200+ miles of riding a week. I had a similar experience in my early years of college (I am a perpetual student, so I can't ever really say "back in college")- I took HPE295: "Health and Fitness for Life," and it was an incredible eye-opener. I got into really good shape at that time, too, based on calorie counting and conscious physical training. That was the last time I was in really top shape, in fact. I let those habit slip, but a lot of the nutritional knowledge has hung on, and I think the reason I never really got into bad shape, even during my lazy years at the end of my 20s, is largely due to that.

I think life-fitness classes like that should be mandatory for all degrees.

[seanile]

replacing my 650 calorie bowl of shredded wheat in the morning with a greek yogurt and 1/8cup of granola has helped me a fair bit. lets me keep my dinner portions normal-ish.
switching from pb&js at lunch to soup was also a big help.
i tell ya, same filling effect, just much better quality foods.
and myfitnesspal rocks. combine that with a macros app and you can stay on top of things really easily.

[brando]

Some of my 8% tricks.

...

Base period do end pace on water till the tummy screams. It will stop & you'll be ripping the fat off. The key is steady in the zone. Best to ride alone.

...

Cut the sports mixes in base. You ain't going to 'bonk'.

It's been warm the past month and I've had time to ride so I kinda fell into doing just what you said above. Taking just water because I've asked a couple of local pros and that's what they ride with. I bring a couple of bananas and skip lunch. Riding lots alone also lets me skip the sports drinks because I'm not getting my legs ripped off trying to keep pace with some of my friends. Seems like my riding friends are all either significantly faster or slower than me. So I've been flying solo. In Oct I was probably 210+, down to 190 now, but would have lost more had I cut out beer. That is the next frontier, which is why I opened this thread.

Any more base tips?

[shovelhd]

I ate a whole pizza last night. It was delicious. #notreble

[fatallightning]

11.5 lbs in 15 days. Still aiming for 30 in 30. Lifting to keep muscle mass up, and so far power numbers aren't dropping.

[Dead Man]

11.5 lbs in 15 days. Still aiming for 30 in 30. Lifting to keep muscle mass up, and so far power numbers aren't dropping.

That would be a 3500/day deficit... I'd literally have to stop eating entirely and ride my bike for at least an hour every day to even get there...

[oldpotatoe]

I ate a whole pizza last night. It was delicious. #notreble

Huzza, all things in moderation. Just not everyday, a whole Pizza. God am I hungry. Maybe Pizza for lunch.

Wife makes a plate of cream cheese for Valentines Day, with a jar of cherry preserves on top, onto saltine crackers..yummy, ate the whole thing.

[bikenut]

I ate a whole pizza last night. It was delicious. #notreble

Had one last night for valentines Day. Junk food sure does clean the pipes.

[Dead Man]

Had one last night for valentines Day. Junk food sure does clean the pipes.

Pizza usually does the opposite for me.. Might as well eat a sandbag

[1happygirl]

Pizza usually does the opposite for me.. Might as well eat a sandbag


hahahah, so funny.

Last slice of pizza yesterday for me.

Starting cutting today. No Chocolate VD for me.
It's gonna be a bad 3 day detox of hunger. Ick

[fatallightning]

That would be a 3500/day deficit... I'd literally have to stop eating entirely and ride my bike for at least an hour every day to even get there...

No carbs. Controversial, but works for me. No calorie control at all. I eat bacon, eggs and cheese all day long.

[Dead Man]

No carbs. Controversial, but works for me. No calorie control at all. I eat bacon, eggs and cheese all day long.

Please do explain! If you can shed 30lbs of fat in 30 days, and suffer no harm to your health, AND be able to eat anything except carbs, I'm totally game.

[shovelhd]

Huzza, all things in moderation. Just not everyday, a whole Pizza. God am I hungry. Maybe Pizza for lunch.

Wife makes a plate of cream cheese for Valentines Day, with a jar of cherry preserves on top, onto saltine crackers..yummy, ate the whole thing.

Absolutely. It was a special dinner out and the other choices were loaded with fat. This was a marguerita with fresh mozzarella and basil.

Today I am 5 pounds over race weight and just started base. Right on track.

[bikenut]

No carbs. Controversial, but works for me. No calorie control at all. I eat bacon, eggs and cheese all day long.

Didn't work for me. No carbs -no energy for anything more than low intensity. I lost some wait but was worse off physically in the end.

[fatallightning]

Didn't work for me. No carbs -no energy for anything more than low intensity. I lost some wait but was worse off physically in the end.

How long were you on it? First 3-4 days you want to kill yourself until you flip into ketosis.

[bikenut]

How long were you on it? First 3-4 days you want to kill yourself until you flip into ketosis.
One year.

[Dead Man]

Everyone check out??

I weighed in at 155 on the nose, this morning... 15 of my 20 down!

I'm also already climbing a LOT harder. I've moved up dozens of positions on the biggest climbs I ride, and have nabbed a handful of KOMs I'd previously wondered if were out of my league (and were, carrying 15-20lbs of extra weight).

I'm also doing as many pullups as I ever have, which has been a surprise. I pumped out 12 without stopping this morning, which is the most I ever got up to when I was rock and alpine climbing my hardest, about 3-4 years ago. :eek:

Been a great experiment, great experience. And I didn't even think about this until yesterday - the biggest thing I've taken from it is that I can function without sugar. Sweet foods, anyway... obviously you have to have some sugar in your diet.. but normal foods have plenty already. I've previously tried to reduce sugar in my diet by just not eating sugary things, and always felt like I suffered a functionality/performance loss. I wondered if I hadn't re-wired my metabolism to need high doses of sugar to work right. But I've had to cut out all excess sugar in sugary calorie-dense foods these last 43 days just to be able to eat dinner at the end of the day - so without concertedly meaning to, I've realized that I can function just fine without a high-sugar diet. Better, in fact.

How's everyone doing?? I think most of us have our first races in about 3 weeks or so, no? First one over here's March 22nd. After getting ejected from the Gorge Roubaix, I'll be doing the Cherry Pie down in Independence Oregon instead... short and easy- only 1100' over 40 miles.. will be rolling solo, as none of my "teammates" want to race this early. Guess I'll have to make friends between the start and finish lines...

[fatallightning]

15 lbs in a month or so. Another 10 I'd be happy. Muscle mass looks good, considering the amount of protein and lifting I try and do seems to help. Still trainer season sadly, ftp looks good. Need to start doing some HIIT.

[ceolwulf]

13 lb down 14 to go. Hey I didn't realize I'm halfway there :) won't even be on the bike for another month though let alone racing.

[Dead Man]

13 lb down 14 to go. Hey I didn't realize I'm halfway there :) won't even be on the bike for another month though let alone racing.

No bike for a month?? You guys covered in glacier?

[ceolwulf]

No bike for a month?? You guys covered in glacier?


Pretty much!

[carpediemracing]

Everyone check out??
I didn't even think about this until yesterday - the biggest thing I've taken from it is that I can function without sugar. Sweet foods, anyway... obviously you have to have some sugar in your diet.. but normal foods have plenty already. I've previously tried to reduce sugar in my diet by just not eating sugary things, and always felt like I suffered a functionality/performance loss. I wondered if I hadn't re-wired my metabolism to need high doses of sugar to work right. But I've had to cut out all excess sugar in sugary calorie-dense foods these last 43 days just to be able to eat dinner at the end of the day - so without concertedly meaning to, I've realized that I can function just fine without a high-sugar diet. Better, in fact.

The sugar lesson for me hit pretty hard back when I started my not-cutting diet (heh). I've just reintroduced some sugar but not a lot, like extremely sparingly.

I'm stuck in the 160 lbs range. 18-19 lbs down but stuck nonetheless. I'd like to be in the 150-155 lbs range. At 160 lbs I'm still probably over 20% fat, and if I had to race better I'd probably force the issue to get into the 140s.

Strength is way up on the bike. Hours on the bike are massive compared to 2014 - I had a few 6 hour MONTHS in 2014, I've averaged 6.5 hours a week for the last four (according to Strava).

No intensity - my last outdoor rides were three days around Christmas - but I hope to be racing in two Sundays (at a race I promote). We'll see how it goes.

[Dead Man]

The sugar lesson for me hit pretty hard back when I started my not-cutting diet (heh). I've just reintroduced some sugar but not a lot, like extremely sparingly.

I'm stuck in the 160 lbs range. 18-19 lbs down but stuck nonetheless. I'd like to be in the 150-155 lbs range. At 160 lbs I'm still probably over 20% fat, and if I had to race better I'd probably force the issue to get into the 140s.

Strength is way up on the bike. Hours on the bike are massive compared to 2014 - I had a few 6 hour MONTHS in 2014, I've averaged 6.5 hours a week for the last four (according to Strava).

No intensity - my last outdoor rides were three days around Christmas - but I hope to be racing in two Sundays (at a race I promote). We'll see how it goes.

Are you logging trainer rides as trainer rides on Strava?? I can't figure out how to do it... so I just manually enter "workout," punch in the time, and then label them as trainer rides.... not as useful.

[carpediemracing]

Are you logging trainer rides as trainer rides on Strava?? I can't figure out how to do it... so I just manually enter "workout," punch in the time, and then label them as trainer rides.... not as useful.

I enter them manually, label the name "3/2/2015 Trainer ride - blah blah blah" then click the "edit" button (pencil icon) and check "stationary trainer".

However if you look at my calendar it's pretty obvious by the name which ones are trainer rides.

https://scontent-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10502127_10153173319548824_2112070311040048324_n.j pg?oh=143c5ee29af8a5cbe69bba2f7319b204&oe=559642C1

[toastedbread]

Probably been cutting a bit too extreme for the past few weeks, ended up caving really hard tonight with some ice cream.

[Dead Man]

Probably been cutting a bit too extreme for the past few weeks, ended up caving really hard tonight with some ice cream.

Unless it was a mixing bowl full, you're probably gonna be just fine.

I've had two bowls of ice cream in the last 44 days. I could have had more, if I'd been willing to earn them.. but generally I have to hit it pretty hard just to earn dinner, and if I happen to get a good hard 3+ hour ride with several thousand feet of gain, I spend the whole return leg dreaming about all the ice cream and chocolate I'm gonna eat... but then when confronted with the fact that all the real food I want to eat will gobble up any binge calories I might have gotten, I balk.

I did have 12 Hershey's kisses the other day. Two servings. :eek:

The worst I've experienced so far, as far as running over and deviating from my frequent, small, healthy portions of food - neither were sweets, and both happened one day after the other. First day, I had lunch with my friend. I ordered a bean and cheese burrito, and was, typically, still hungry when I finished it. Instead of letting it settle in and letting the hunger fade out, I impulsively went back for a second, even more calorically dense burrito, and blew my whole day out. I was 800 calories in the hole even before dinner. So I cranked out about 2 hours on the trainer and just barely justified a bowl of cereal for dinner. THEN, the next day, I had to go to a new product demonstration/barbecue (which turned out to be grilled hamburgers and hotdogs... not what I call "barbecue," but they were damn good burgers and dogs) for a supplier that's trying to schmooze me, and, still horribly hungry from the previous days crimes, ended up having a cheeseburger AND big ass hotdog. Did it to myself again. Spent another evening on the trainer, and barely managed another bowl of cereal for dinner.

And then the hunger cycle just keeps going from there... takes days to get it balanced out again.

Almost over! 3/4ths through, anyway.

[Dead Man]

However if you look at my calendar it's pretty obvious by the name which ones are trainer rides.

https://scontent-lga.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xpf1/v/t1.0-9/10502127_10153173319548824_2112070311040048324_n.j pg?oh=143c5ee29af8a5cbe69bba2f7319b204&oe=559642C1

Well at least you get a lot of movie watching in, I imagine..

Sometimes I'll watch old pro races on youtube. I've never been able to get into the training videos - I'll need to get rollers if I'm ever gonna be able to try to simulate outside riding, inside... the static trainer kills what little imagination I have.

[carpediemracing]

Well at least you get a lot of movie watching in, I imagine..

Sometimes I'll watch old pro races on youtube. I've never been able to get into the training videos - I'll need to get rollers if I'm ever gonna be able to try to simulate outside riding, inside... the static trainer kills what little imagination I have.

I don't watch movies often. This winter not really at all, but in the past I have. I also dislike training videos because they're too structured. All my trainer rides for many years, until last night, were JRA rides.

I listen to music if I can (if I'm on watch for Junior then I can't so typically I wait to ride until Junior is asleep and the Missus is at home). Earbuds, volume not so loud that I can't hear whatever is on the TV in the background.

I usually put a race on TV in the background, or a long pro race clip from YouTube on the computer (one of those "hit record for the whole stage" kind of clips). On some rides I barely watch, on others I follow the race. Mostly I do it because a long time ago I was taught that watching people using "good form" was a good thing (relating to playing music etc).

Music is key. I rarely time things within rides but yesterday I was and I found that I could comfortably ride with my eyes closed (trainer so no balancing) for 10 minutes. I only peeked because I was trying to accomplish something, else I could have gone for a while (20 min?). I'd have to open my eyes only to skip the song or something like that.

[toastedbread]

Unless it was a mixing bowl full, you're probably gonna be just fine.

Not quite, but it may have followed a full pasta dinner and then some brisket that a friend happened to bring by. The shame spiral was in full effect.

[Dead Man]

152.8lbs today.... 2.8lbs to go to hit my primary goal of 150. I'm ahead of schedule, and will hopefully hit 150 in the next few days. Haven't gotten outside much, but I've been hitting the trainer more and more (unfortunately), and I've started strength training, which seems to be helping with fat burn quite a bit. Good timing, methinks.

It's been hard to maintain a good protein to carbs balance, but especially in the last couple weeks I've really gotten this lean/low sodium/low cholesterol protein problem sorted out. Lots of 1% cottage cheese, lots of lowfat yogurt, and I've been supplementing with soy protein powder where holes open up - I've met my protein goals well, recently. My diet, in fact, basically consists of nothing but lean protein and veggies... I can't give up (and don't think I need to or would benefit from) my morning bowl of carbs - I love a lightly sweetened cereal to get the day jumpstarted, and look forward to it each night when I go to bed.

My original plan was to hit 150, see if I'd lost any strength and then reassess for a possible secondary goal of 145. Well - I haven't lost any strength at all. In fact, quite the contrary.... so I'm going for it.

I'll try to hit 145 by day 60....!

Race season has bumped up one week.... March 22nd, now!