Fizik "flexibility" test

[velotrack]

How accurate is this, separating people into three categories (snake/chameleon/bull) and picking a saddle that way? It doesn't seem to convincing for me, personally, but I'd like to try out an aliante (and I'm relatively flexible).

Anyone have luck with this, or just marketing?

[Black Dog]

How accurate is this, separating people into three categories (snake/chameleon/bull) and picking a saddle that way? It doesn't seem to convincing for me, personally, but I'd like to try out an aliante (and I'm relatively flexible).

Anyone have luck with this, or just marketing?

Just Marketing. Seriously there are people rinding these saddles that are far from the flexibility profile. If it works for your butt then it is good.

[FlashUNC]

Marketing. All comes down to what your gooch tells you.

[jtakeda]

Marketing. I had an Arione in the past and it was horrible for me.

I took the "test" when I heard about this long ago and it recommended an Arione for me.

[abalone]

That Fizik method is really dumb. I love their Aliante saddle. It is awesome. But the idea that you should pick a saddle based on flexibility? That's absurd. There's really no logical reasoning behind this.

Case in point. Myself, I am quite flexible. I can touch my toes without bending my knees. I can even go further and grab behind my ankles when stretching. The Fizik method says that a Fikik Arione would be a good fit. I tried the Fizik Arione and I hate it. Conversely, the Fizik method says the Aliante is not for people like me. Yet, I tried the Aliante and I love it! Morale of the story - the Fizik method of saddle selection based on your flexibility is bogus.

[Louis]

I'm no expert, but I thought flexibility determines if you're upright or leaning over in an aero position, and because of the shape of your pelvis as you rotate forward that will have an effect on the saddle that works best for you.

There's some discussion of that here:

http://www.cervelo.com/en/engineering/ask-the-engineers/the-four-and-a-half-rules-of-road-saddles-.html

[Likes2ridefar]

I can ride on all their regular models and my flexibility stinks so I don't know where that leaves me.

i started on the arione but prefer the antares 00 over them all.

[tumbler]

It really makes no sense. I am incredibly flexible, but my (non-race) position on a road bike is not all that different than individuals who are much less flexible. Extending their fit system to handlebars is also ridiculous since it ignores the differences that frame dimensions, stem length/rise, etc. have on fit. Perhaps there is a tiny shred of evidence behind the thinking that flexible people may lean forward more and position their sit bones in a certain way, but it seems that the overwhelming variety in body shapes/sizes and individual rider preferences would outweigh everything else and tell us that fit is more complicated than a simple flexibility test.

[firerescuefin]

Louis nailed it.

Typically people's hip/hamstring mobility will dictate which parts of their pelvis/ass load the seat. Some people get a lot of hip flexion, some people get it out of their low back, and others you will see with pronounced thoracic flexion.

It's (Fizik's method) not a panacea, but it's a good place to start.


I'm no expert, but I thought flexibility determines if you're upright or leaning over in an aero position, and because of the shape of your pelvis as you rotate forward that will have an effect on the saddle that works best for you.

There's some discussion of that here:

http://www.cervelo.com/en/engineering/ask-the-engineers/the-four-and-a-half-rules-of-road-saddles-.html

[Mark McM]

Preferred saddle shape is clearly affected by how one sits on the saddle. And flexibility (particularly lower spine flexibility) affects how one sits on the saddle. I don't know how one can claim otherwise.

There's more to saddle selection than that of course, but it is certainly a major factor.

[MattTuck]

Everyone's anatomy is different. flexibility, pelvis anatomy, preferred type of riding, length of your rides, amount of soft tissue, etc.

The old school idea of 'ischial tuberosities' has been left behind and people are not concerned with the ramus (the narrower part where the gap in your pelvis is smaller).

Reality is, as was mentioned above, the way you sit on the saddle makes a big difference as well. Like TiDesign's (Ed) philosophy of your position being affected by the energy you're putting into the pedals, the position (aggressive or more upright) influences what type of saddle will be comfortable.

[alancw3]

my ass tells me that for several years the arione was a great saddle until i tried an alliante. wow i wish i could ride as long as that saddle supports my a**. :-) oh and for the prior 30 years i used brooks saddles. for comfort no comparison. aesthetically the brooks still looks good on old school bikes. let your a** make the decision.

[Ti Designs]

Companies making saddles have both an idea of how a cyclist sits on the saddle and a marketing department. The goal is to have the marketing department bring people's thinking around to how their company understands saddles, without insulting too many people. I'll pick three saddle makers as examples:

Selle Italia - they use a fitting method called ID Match and a series of saddles from S1 - S3 or from L1 to L3. I watched their ID Match demo, I can't make sense of it... What I dislike about Selle Italia is how many saddles they have and how often they change. The concept of finding a saddle you like and sticking to it doesn't work with them, 'cept maybe the original Flite. They've tried to change it 5 times now...

Specialized - they make the generalization that people sit on their sit bones, so anyone can sit on the ass-o-meter, get the width Specialized saddle they need and be done with it. The Toupe, while an unfortunate name, it a wonderful example of support at the sit bones, with everything else cut away. I'll get back to specialized after I explain Fizik.

Fizik - they make some really stupid generalizations about flexibility because they either don't think you'll get the real reason, or they don't want to insult anyone by saying they're not flexible. They make saddles to support riders based on angle of the pelvis. Riders with less range of motion at L4/L5 and L5/S1 but still ride in an aggressive position do so by rotating the hips forward. This means they can't sit flat on their sit bones, they position themselves on the saddle using the surface area on the sides of the flair. Look at a well worn Aliante and you'll see all the wear on the sides. The Specialized Toupe doesn't even have sides there (much like their own Antares). If you want to understand Fizik saddles, ignore the marketing, picture the pelvis, then rotate it forward. At some angle it'll match the curvature of one of their saddles.

Back to Specialized: They would love to think that every cyclist sits on the saddle the same way, but their original design is a love it or hate it sort of thing, so they did a little design copying and came out with their Romin/Aura saddles

[Louis]

What I dislike about Selle Italia is how many saddles they have and how often they change.

+ a gazillion on this.

They used to make the 100% perfect saddle for me. Then they stopped. So now I'm at about a 95% comfort level on a Regal.

[saf-t]

I'm happily riding Aliantes, and can get my fingers flat on the floor.

[mtechnica]

reality is, as was mentioned above, the way you sit on the saddle makes a big difference as well. Like tidesign's (ed) philosophy of your position being affected by the energy you're putting into the pedals, the position (aggressive or more upright) influences what type of saddle will be comfortable.

+1

[CSKeller]

I have good flexibility and can easily touch the floor. Both Aliante and Antares fit well. I think I prefer the Antares slight more than the other.

It's a bit of marketing...but try and let your butt decide!!

[velotrack]

Thanks, all. Great posts all around, really flushed it out for me. The hunt continues. I'm surprised I haven't found the "one" in all 6 or so years I've been riding...

[beeatnik]

Velotrack, it's probably not uncommon for younger riders not to find the "perfect" saddle. More than likely you've grown an inch or three in the last 6 years and you continue to gain bone mass.

Sagan rides an Aliante.

[makoti]

A friend of mine rides the Bull. I saw who it was for & I was like "Are you kidding me?" He's insanely flexible. Ride what feels good.

[commonguy001]

No idea on the tests but I have been on Ariones since they came out. I remember seeing them in the giro and bought a couple and that's that, I found my seat.
Also like the Gobi a lot

I pick them up when they're cheap and keep spares until I need them.

[Black Dog]

Thanks, all. Great posts all around, really flushed it out for me. The hunt continues. I'm surprised I haven't found the "one" in all 6 or so years I've been riding...

If the aliente does not work for you try Selle Anatomica.

[velotrack]

Velotrack, it's probably not uncommon for younger riders not to find the "perfect" saddle. More than likely you've grown an inch or three in the last 6 years and you continue to gain bone mass.

Sagan rides an Aliante.

No doubt. I've flatlined at about 5'10 for about 4 years now. We don't stop growing til our mid-20's... or so I hope?

:cool: