OT: What Antivirus package to buy for parent?

[roguedog]

Hey all,

Just bought a new laptop for my dad and thinking about putting on antivirus program. Hard to decipher from their marketing speak and even the reviews seem fishy/slanted

I will not go Norton or Macafee. Resource hogs and had an instance in the past where it was impossible to remove pieces of Symantec. Kept getting "errors" for years on my laptop.

I've used and liked Avast in the past but for my dad I think I need not only AV and good malware but phishing and spam filters so I can hopefully lower the amount of desktop support time :/

So paceliners.. what rec's do you all have? Good AV. Good malware. Good antiphishing. Good spam filter but not a total resource hog so I don't have to get called for "my computer seems to be running slow."

I'm sorta leaning towards Vipre at the moment. Maybe Bitdefender

[guido]

Microsoft Security Essentials is good and free.

[biker72]

Avast free is of course free.
Malwarebytes free for any malware problems.

[abalone]

The problem with parents is that they just don't understand. They are old. They click on ---- without ever reading stuff. When they are downloading stuff mostly harmless, somewhere along the install process they will inevitably get an offer to install some useless junk browser add-on, then they get another one of those questions, and another, and another. They just keep hitting OK without reading the damn thing. Then, one day they call you to come over and see why their computer is sooo slow and keeps popping up with all sorts of crap when they turn on their browser.

There is nothing you can do to protect your parents from their own stupidity. No amount of antivirus software will help. And the more you try, the more you have to explain how to run the antivirus software and what to do if Mcafee, or Norton, or Avast, or whatever antivirus program asks for something. Dear god! These people do not read. I swear! All those years of education go completely out the window when they are presented with a simple question on the computer like, "do you also want to install a free 30-day trial of blah blah?". Face it. Old people forget how to read, and they know two letters, and those are O and K, and that is what they select. They select OK, every single f-ing time. Guaranteed.

There are just some things and some people you just cannot help. And old people with computers is one of them.

[jlwdm]

Abalone, I hope this is a joke, but I am afraid it is not.

Jeff

[mgm777]

The problem with parents is that they just don't understand. They are old. They click on ---- without ever reading stuff. When they are downloading stuff mostly harmless, somewhere along the install process they will inevitably get an offer to install some useless junk browser add-on, then they get another one of those questions, and another, and another. They just keep hitting OK without reading the damn thing. Then, one day they call you to come over and see why their computer is sooo slow and keeps popping up with all sorts of crap when they turn on their browser.

There is nothing you can do to protect your parents from their own stupidity. No amount of antivirus software will help. And the more you try, the more you have to explain how to run the antivirus software and what to do if Mcafee, or Norton, or Avast, or whatever antivirus program asks for something. Dear god! These people do not read. I swear! All those years of education go completely out the window when they are presented with a simple question on the computer like, "do you also want to install a free 30-day trial of blah blah?". Face it. Old people forget how to read, and they know two letters, and those are O and K, and that is what they select. They select OK, every single f-ing time. Guaranteed.

There are just some things and some people you just cannot help. And old people with computers is one of them.

An unbelievably terrible and inappropriate post. Classless.

[ceolwulf]

When I still used Windows I always had good luck with NOD32. Very lightweight, doesn't slow the machine at all that I could ever tell.

At the office we use Vipre, not very impressed with it. The couple occasions it was called upon to clean something off a machine it couldn't do it.

[Peter P.]

I hate to say it, but I have to side with abalone.

He may have delivered the truth to ya'll too bluntly, but nevertheless, the truth it is.

[dave thompson]

AVG makes both a free and for a fee anti-virus program. Our computers have been running AVG for several years with great success.

[Steelman]

Don't forget the firewall. Free from Online Armor. That should be your first step.

Good free stuff:

Spybot Search & Destroy (provides immunization)
Spyware Blaster (enables protection against harmful sites)
Malware Bytes (But you have to pay for realtime protection)

I had no trouble downloading this stuff from the Major Geeks website.

[abalone]

I hate to say it, but I have to side with abalone.

He may have delivered the truth to ya'll too bluntly, but nevertheless, the truth it is.



That post I made was definitely 100% true in the case of my parents, and I love them very much. Other people's parents may be different, but not mine. All the college degrees, doctoral degrees even, all those years of education goes completely out the window when some email phishing scam or some stupid thing on the computer comes up asking for stuff.

And the parents answer is always, "ok, just keep hitting the OK button.".... To literally every little pop-up box or email redirect or anything that comes up on the computer. And then if something goes wrong happens, call up son or daughter to spend the next two days trying to backup all the old XMas photos, birthday photos, word docs, etc., etc., etc., and then reinstall Windows. Happens at least 2 times a year at my parents house. There must be others out there with parents like this.

[holliscx]

I wish he had bought a Mac.
-Dad

[MattTuck]

So, I'm not an expert, and my dad is in the computer business, so thankfully I don't have to worry about this yet.

That said, if I did have to worry about it, I'd go get a book on virtual machines and consider that as a potential avenue. My understanding on the basic concept is that the software sets up a 'fake machine' that is basically a software machine, but acts like a normal computer. You can download stuff, install stuff, change settings, etc. But if there's ever a problem, malicious software, slow, etc. you can just kill that virtual machine and start a fresh one. I don't know enough about the topic to make specific recommendations, but it is something I'd explore if I were in your shoes.

Also, I'd suggest setting him up with an account that is a standard user account, not an administrator. And don't let him have the password to the administrator. That way, he won't be able to install any software.

I've seen good recent reviews about malwarebytes and bitdefender. I personally use the free version of avast.

[biker72]

The problem with parents is that they just don't understand. They are old. They click on ---- without ever reading stuff. When they are downloading stuff mostly harmless, somewhere along the install process they will inevitably get an offer to install some useless junk browser add-on, then they get another one of those questions, and another, and another. They just keep hitting OK without reading the damn thing. Then, one day they call you to come over and see why their computer is sooo slow and keeps popping up with all sorts of crap when they turn on their browser.

There is nothing you can do to protect your parents from their own stupidity. No amount of antivirus software will help. And the more you try, the more you have to explain how to run the antivirus software and what to do if Mcafee, or Norton, or Avast, or whatever antivirus program asks for something. Dear god! These people do not read. I swear! All those years of education go completely out the window when they are presented with a simple question on the computer like, "do you also want to install a free 30-day trial of blah blah?". Face it. Old people forget how to read, and they know two letters, and those are O and K, and that is what they select. They select OK, every single f-ing time. Guaranteed.

There are just some things and some people you just cannot help. And old people with computers is one of them.

I'm 76. I have to fix my kids computer problems. I finally bought my daughter Malwarebytes with real time protection.

[Ralph]

The problem with parents is that they just don't understand. They are old. They click on ---- without ever reading stuff. When they are downloading stuff mostly harmless, somewhere along the install process they will inevitably get an offer to install some useless junk browser add-on, then they get another one of those questions, and another, and another. They just keep hitting OK without reading the damn thing. Then, one day they call you to come over and see why their computer is sooo slow and keeps popping up with all sorts of crap when they turn on their browser.

There is nothing you can do to protect your parents from their own stupidity. No amount of antivirus software will help. And the more you try, the more you have to explain how to run the antivirus software and what to do if Mcafee, or Norton, or Avast, or whatever antivirus program asks for something. Dear god! These people do not read. I swear! All those years of education go completely out the window when they are presented with a simple question on the computer like, "do you also want to install a free 30-day trial of blah blah?". Face it. Old people forget how to read, and they know two letters, and those are O and K, and that is what they select. They select OK, every single f-ing time. Guaranteed.

There are just some things and some people you just cannot help. And old people with computers is one of them.

Well....I'm old, and I'm a parent. And not overly computer literate, but I get by. But....I don't click on much, and won't download much, and anything I don't understand or recognize gets deleted ASAP. So sorry if I delete a message from you. But hey....I've got a kid in IT as a back up. Rarely call on him. I would suggest you just pull the plug on your parents if they are that bad. Microsoft Essential Solutions works for me also.

[MattTuck]

Oh, one other thing. I read that recently MS Security Essentials has not been performing well. I'll try to track down the source of that info. but it is one data point to consider.

[IJWS]

Abalone has been making a lot of friends on this forum lately. That said, Security essentials is great, free, and easy to use.

Aside from that, RE:

You know parents are the same no matter time nor place
They don't understand that us kids are gonna make some mistakes
So to you, all the kids all across the land
There's no need to argue, parents just don't understand

I remember one year
My mom took me school shopping
It was me, my brother, my mom, oh, my pop, and my little sister
All hopped in the car
We headed downtown to the Gallery Mall
MY mom started bugging with the clothes she chose
I didn't say nothing at first
I just turned up my nose
She said, "What's wrong? This shirt cost $20"
I said, "Mom, this shirt is plaid with a butterfly collar!"
The next half hour was the same old thing
My mother buying me clothes from 1963
And then she lost her mind and did the ultimate
I asked her for Adidas and she bought me Zips!
I said, "Mom, what are you doing, you're ruining my rep"
She said, "You're only sixteen, you don't have a rep yet"
I said, "Mom, let's put these clothes back, please"
She said "no, you go to school to learn not for a fashion show"
I said, "This isn't Sha Na Na, come on Mom, I'm not Bowzer
Mom, please put back the bell-bottom Brady Bunch trousers
But if you don't want to I can live with that but
You gotta put back the double-knit reversible slacks"
She wasn't moved - everything stayed the same
Inevitably the first day of school came
I thought I could get over, I tried to play sick
But my mom said, "No, no way, uh-uh, forget it"
There was nothing I could do, I tried to relax
I got dressed up in those ancient artifacts
And when I walked into school, it was just as I thought
The kids were cracking up laughing at the clothes Mom bought
And those who weren't laughing still had a ball
Because they were pointing and whispering
As I walked down the hall
I got home and told my Mom how my day went
She said, "If they were laughing you don't need them,
Cause they're not good friends"
For the next six hours I tried to explain to my Mom
That I was gonna have to go through this about 200 more times
So to you all the kids all across the land
There's no need to argue
Parents just don't understand

Oh-kay, here's the situation
My parents went away on a week's vacation and
They left the keys to the brand new Porsche
Would they mind?
Umm, well, of course not
I'll just take it for a little spin
And maybe show it off to a couple of friends
I'll just cruise it around the neighborhood
Well, maybe I shouldn't
Yeah, of course I should
Pay attention, here's the thick of the plot
I pulled up to the corner at the end of my block
That's when I saw this beautiful girlie girl walking
I picked up my car phone to perpetrate like I was talking
You should've seen this girl's bodily dimensions
I honked my horn just to get her attention
She said, "Was that for me?"
I said, "Yeah"
She said, "Why?"
I said, "Come on and take a ride with a helluva guy"
She said, "How do I know you're not sick?
You could be some deranged lunatic"
I said, "C'mon toots - my name is the Prince =
Beside, would a lunatic have a Porsche like this?"
She agreed and we were on our way
She was looking very good and so was I, I must say - word
We hit McDonald's, pulled into the drive
We ordered two Big Macs and two large fries with Cokes
She kicked her shoes off onto the floor
She said, "Drive fast, speed turns me on"
She put her hand on my knee, I put my foot on the gas
We almost got whiplash, I took off so fast
The sun roof was open , the music was high
And this girl's hand was steadily moving up my thigh
She had opened up three buttons on her shirt so far
I guess that's why I didn't notice that police car
We're doing ninety in my Mom's new Porsche
And to make this long story short - short
When the cop pulled me over I was scared as hell
I said, "I don't have a license but I drive very well, officer"
I almost had a heart attack that day
Come to find out the girl was a twelve-year-old runaway
I was arrested, the car was impounded
There was no way for me to avoid being grounded
My parents had to come off from vacation to get me
I'd rather be in jail than to have my father hit me
My parents walked in
I got my grip, I said, "Ah, Mom, Dad, how was your trip?"
They didn't speak - I said, "I want to plead my case"
But my father just shoved me in the car by my face
That was a hard ride home, I don't know how I survived
They took turns - one would beat me while the other was driving
I can't believe it, I just made a mistake
Well parents are the same no matter time nor place
So to you all the kids all across the land
Take it from me, parents just don't understand

[gasman]

The problem with parents is that they just don't understand. They are old. They click on ---- without ever reading stuff. When they are downloading stuff mostly harmless, somewhere along the install process they will inevitably get an offer to install some useless junk browser add-on, then they get another one of those questions, and another, and another. They just keep hitting OK without reading the damn thing. Then, one day they call you to come over and see why their computer is sooo slow and keeps popping up with all sorts of crap when they turn on their browser.

There is nothing you can do to protect your parents from their own stupidity. No amount of antivirus software will help. And the more you try, the more you have to explain how to run the antivirus software and what to do if Mcafee, or Norton, or Avast, or whatever antivirus program asks for something. Dear god! These people do not read. I swear! All those years of education go completely out the window when they are presented with a simple question on the computer like, "do you also want to install a free 30-day trial of blah blah?". Face it. Old people forget how to read, and they know two letters, and those are O and K, and that is what they select. They select OK, every single f-ing time. Guaranteed.

There are just some things and some people you just cannot help. And old people with computers is one of them.


A bit over the top. Your frustration with your parents should not be universal.

[abalone]

To all the old geezers out there. Sorry. You guys aren't dumb. Many of you could run rings around me and prolly are even more technically savvy than me. I'm not some computer genius. My parents are so dumb when it comes to computers. And they do the dumbest things. I love them still. I'm sure there are other people out there that have hopeless parents like myself. The message is to love them, even through all their vices and oopsie I clicked it again moments. To all the parents like mine that felt so offended and don't like what I wrote, well sorry about that. Try not to take what I say so personally. I'm just whinging in general, however cringefully awful you think it is. It certainly isn't personal.

[Seramount]

To all the old geezers out there... It certainly isn't personal.

hard to believe your apologies are sincere when you word them in a way that simply exacerbates the problem your posts create in the first place.

try to develop some tact, you'll likely find it quite useful for things other than bike forums.

[54ny77]

http://static.betazeta.com/www.chw.net/up/2011/06/computer-condom.jpg

[abalone]

hard to believe your apologies are sincere when you word them in a way that simply exacerbates the problem your posts create in the first place.

try to develop some tact, you'll likely find it quite useful for things other than bike forums.



I honestly couldn't care less what you believe. If you want to continue to dog on me, there's nothing anyone can do to change that. I said my piece. And if you are still so offended by my words, maybe you should just take a breather and understand that not everybody is going to share the same opinion as you.

Some people are just plain old dumb. My parents are really, really dumb when it comes to technology. So what?! I'm going to call it like I see it. I'm really, really dumb when it comes to motorcycles and anything automotive, which are my Dad's biggest passions. I am a klutz mechanic-wise at changing the oil. I'm dumb at that. You're dumb at something else. I'm not directly insulting anyone, and my gross generalizations that parents don't understand are just me whinging, but it's nothing personal. I love my parents. If you are still so slighted, so be it.

[gdw]

You just keep digging the hole deeper. Why don't you take a break from the keyboard and go for a ride.

[bigbill]

I put the paid version of Malwarebytes on my son's computer. He's a teenager and an online gamer. He's eventually going to click on something. I've got it on my laptop too, one price covers three computers.

[Llewellyn]

I honestly couldn't care less what you believe. If you want to continue to dog on me, there's nothing anyone can do to change that. I said my piece. And if you are still so offended by my words, maybe you should just take a breather and understand that not everybody is going to share the same opinion as you.

Some people are just plain old dumb. My parents are really, really dumb when it comes to technology. So what?! I'm going to call it like I see it. I'm really, really dumb when it comes to motorcycles and anything automotive, which are my Dad's biggest passions. I am a klutz mechanic-wise at changing the oil. I'm dumb at that. You're dumb at something else. I'm not directly insulting anyone, and my gross generalizations that parents don't understand are just me whinging, but it's nothing personal. I love my parents. If you are still so slighted, so be it.

Wow, someone needs a hug :)

[abalone]

You just keep digging the hole deeper. Why don't you take a break from the keyboard and go for a ride.


So, if you were to directly quote me on this thread, you would say that I am digging a deep hole by saying what? That I said my parents are dumb? That I said that some older folks are as dumb as my parents? That I said that I was dumb at certain aspects of mechanics? Please quote what you don't like about me.

[fuzzalow]

abalone is not completely off the mark about how certain people use/misuse computers. And I'd expand the range to include not just age, as in the case of senior citizens, but also as to inclination - some folks are just not into computers for anything but the basic rudiments with the expectation of it functionally as a digital toaster.

You toss the word dumb around as a feigned insult to incite & provoke. No problem, I don't take exception to that but it does sound you out as puerile. You could have simply made an insightful remark without screwing up the delivery trying so hard for a reaction. If this overreach was a product of your youth then you are entitled but Paceline has an adult crowd so please try in the future to act like one also.

[abalone]

Sorry. The bottom line is this. Some people are just flat out dumb, just dumber than dumb, dumb and dumber, and me included. And that is perfectly ok. It's more than ok. It's the truth. And parents don't understand. To those parents out there, I'm not saying that you are dumb. You might be. I don't know. My parents are. And I love them anyway. The bottom line is that there is absolutely, positively nothing personal directed at any one of you guys specifically no matter how dumb you are, and I'm not saying that you are or not. Just that it's nothing personal.

[Ralph]

Sorry. The bottom line is this. Some people are just flat out dumb, just dumber than dumb, dumb and dumber, and me included. And that is perfectly ok. It's more than ok. It's the truth. And parents don't understand. To those parents out there, I'm not saying that you are dumb. You might be. I don't know. My parents are. And I love them anyway. The bottom line is that there is absolutely, positively nothing personal directed at any one of you guys specifically no matter how dumb you are, and I'm not saying that you are or not. Just that it's nothing personal.

I accept that. It's cool.

[eddief]

I am thinking some language inflames some folks. It did me. It did in Paris. It does here too. Seems many of us would have been more subtle than abaloney. Oh well. My parents are dead, but I don't think I ever called them stupid in front of the spew of the internet.

"Something that's derogatory is insulting or disrespectful. If you make derogatory comments, that means you say things that are unflattering, unkind, or demeaning.

Derogatory means about the same as insulting. Derogatory language is meant to hurt, and it usually does. If you feel offended or insulted by what someone says, the person probably said something derogatory. Racial, sexist, and homophobic slurs are all derogatory. Insults that mean someone is stupid or crazy are derogatory. Making a joke about someone's mother is derogatory."

[abalone]

I am thinking some language inflames some folks. It did me. It did in Paris. It does here too. Seems many of us would have been more subtle than abaloney. Oh well. My parents are dead, but I don't think I ever called them stupid in front of the spew of the internet.

"Something that's derogatory is insulting or disrespectful. If you make derogatory comments, that means you say things that are unflattering, unkind, or demeaning.

Derogatory means about the same as insulting. Derogatory language is meant to hurt, and it usually does. If you feel offended or insulted by what someone says, the person probably said something derogatory. Racial, sexist, and homophobic slurs are all derogatory. Insults that mean someone is stupid or crazy are derogatory. Making a joke about someone's mother is derogatory."


WTH?! You're saying that I am now saying derogatory, insulting things about my parents and equating my words to those of those radical extremists in France?! Come on! This is absurd.

[eddief]

Just sayin many would consider what you said derogatory. That's why you are catching flak. Words piss people off and we have choices. You chose. So be it.


WTH?! You're saying that I am now saying derogatory, insulting things about my parents and equating my words to those of those radical extremists in France?! Come on! This is absurd.

[abalone]

Just sayin many would consider what you said derogatory. That's why you are catching flak. Words piss people off and we have choices. You chose. So be it.



Well IMHO, that's just wrong. If anything is inflammatory it's your analogies comparing my words to those of radical extremists in Paris.

There was nothing personal directed, and nothing derogatory directed, at anyone. At all from me. I wish someone would outright quote what it is that they think so so derogatory. "Parents don't understand" or "my parents are dumb" or "some old folks are dumb", etc.. If you think that is derogatory, then I would be highly disagreeable to that point. It's completely weak, IMO, to state that those words are highly inflammatory. No wever, I concede that my interpretation is different than yours. And if that is your interpretation, I further clarify that there is completely the opposite and there was nothing personal or derogatory intended.

[eddief]

was not comparing your words to anyone's. I was just saying words have power. And choosing to call your parents dumb or stupid seems mean spirited to some in your audience.

It was not the radical extremists in Paris who used any words in particular...it was cartoonists who used words that caused the extremists to kill. The cartoonists have choices too.

I am not trying to be more right than you, I am trying to point out some subtleties you may be missing in your analysis of the reaction to what you said.

Well IMHO, that's just wrong. If anything is inflammatory it's your analogies comparing my words to those of radical extremists in Paris.

There was nothing personal directed, and nothing derogatory directed, at anyone. At all from me. I wish someone would outright quote what it is that they think so so derogatory. "Parents don't understand" or "my parents are dumb" or "some old folks are dumb", etc.. If you think that is derogatory, then I would be highly disagreeable to that point. It's completely weak, IMO, to state that those words are highly inflammatory. No wever, I concede that my interpretation is different than yours. And if that is your interpretation, I further clarify that there is completely the opposite and there was nothing personal or derogatory intended.

[abalone]

was not comparing your words to anyone's. I was just saying words have power. And choosing to call your parents dumb or stupid seems mean spirited to some in your audience.

It was not the radical extremists in Paris who used any words in particular...it was cartoonists who used words that caused the extremists to kill. The cartoonists have choices too.

I am not trying to be more right than you, I am trying to point out some subtleties you may be missing in your analysis of the reaction to what you said.



I don't agree with you at all. Not 1%. And you now say about the French editorialists in France that "it was cartoonists who used words that caused the extremists to kill.

No man. No way. Those cartoonists did not "cause" the terrorists to kill. I have no respect for what you are saying at all about this. Those people in France, including the cartoonists, who were killed are victims. They didn't cause anything. The terrorists want to interpret satire as an offense against Islam and use that as a construct to kill people.

Regarding anything that I said. It's completely absurd that you would even draw a parallel, an analogy, that my words incited anything. That just BS. There was absolutely nothing disrespectful aimed at anyone with my comments. Zero. If your interpretation is different. That is all on your own interpretation, not my intention. And that interpretation is clearly coming more from your own belief and not my writings.

[eddief]

thanks

I don't agree with you at all. Not 1%. And you now say about the French editorialists in France that "it was cartoonists who used words that caused the extremists to kill.

No man. No way. Those cartoonists did not "cause" the terrorists to kill. I have no respect for what you are saying at all about this. Those people in France, including the cartoonists, who were killed are victims. They didn't cause anything. The terrorists want to interpret satire as an offense against Islam and use that as a construct to kill people.

Regarding anything that I said. It's completely absurd that you would even draw a parallel, an analogy, that my words incited anything. That just BS. There was absolutely nothing disrespectful aimed at anyone with my comments. Zero. If your interpretation is different. That is all on your own interpretation, not my intention. And that interpretation is clearly coming more from your own belief and not my writings.

[djg21]

I've had good luck with ZoneAlarm for both AV and firewall. It's not a resource hog like Norton or McAffee, an unlike Norton, plays well with software made by othe companies. I also have a MalwareBytes on my PCs.

[tbike4]

I believe it is certainly true that some people will never understand computers. No matter how many times you explain a simple task or what NOT to do they either can't learn it or use the piece of hardware/software so seldom they forget. I tell these "users" at my job how to do xyzq and they will forget a week later. So they will get a virus or a browser hijacker or some piece of malware.

Last summer a guy in the office opened something he should not have. If he had acted immediately it may not have been an issue. He did not. He also did not have a backup of his files. Every file on his PC was encrypted by the intrusion. He had "ransomware". He had to get $600 in bitcoin so the payment was not traceable to get the key to unlock his files. Some serious
Sh¢£.

People can't help themselves. MS security essentials. Malwarebytes. Get a Mac.

[R3awak3n]

I have seen it go from rapha to how crappy sram is but from Antivirus recommendation to the killings in Paris, wow. :eek:


Anyways, the best antivirus I found for my parents was buying them a Mac. They had a windows computer and I put norton on it, came back for vacation one day and there was crap all over the computer. Upgraded them to a mac and its been awesome. They love it, I love it.

I don't run antivirus on my PCs either but you know to know what you are doing. I do run the antivirus that comes with windows 8 every now a then, I read somewhere that its actually decent.

[DreaminJohn]

To get back on topic, check with your ISP. I know Cablevision and Comcast both offer free software but I can't attest to its quality.

[roguedog]

Wow. Step away from the computer for a few hours... Um.. who knew asking about AV could be so inflammatory?

I like Malwarebytes but always thought they were malware only. I'll have to look into their AV product more. On my computers I use Malwarebytes and Avast together. Sounds like I'll compare MB with Avast. Avast has been fine for me. Was just wondering if there was something newer, better for his needs.

Thanks for the tip on Vipre. Good to know.

Too late on the Mac part already got the Windows lappie. It's what he's used to and it's not as pricey as Macs.

Thanks all. Can we all go ride now?

[Joachim]

The problem with parents is that they just don't understand. They are old. They click on ---- without ever reading stuff. When they are downloading stuff mostly harmless, somewhere along the install process they will inevitably get an offer to install some useless junk browser add-on, then they get another one of those questions, and another, and another. They just keep hitting OK without reading the damn thing. Then, one day they call you to come over and see why their computer is sooo slow and keeps popping up with all sorts of crap when they turn on their browser.

There is nothing you can do to protect your parents from their own stupidity. No amount of antivirus software will help. And the more you try, the more you have to explain how to run the antivirus software and what to do if Mcafee, or Norton, or Avast, or whatever antivirus program asks for something. Dear god! These people do not read. I swear! All those years of education go completely out the window when they are presented with a simple question on the computer like, "do you also want to install a free 30-day trial of blah blah?". Face it. Old people forget how to read, and they know two letters, and those are O and K, and that is what they select. They select OK, every single f-ing time. Guaranteed.

There are just some things and some people you just cannot help. And old people with computers is one of them.

Swoop is back! And he is a sea snail!

[oldpotatoe]

That post I made was definitely 100% true in the case of my parents, and I love them very much. Other people's parents may be different, but not mine. All the college degrees, doctoral degrees even, all those years of education goes completely out the window when some email phishing scam or some stupid thing on the computer comes up asking for stuff.

And the parents answer is always, "ok, just keep hitting the OK button.".... To literally every little pop-up box or email redirect or anything that comes up on the computer. And then if something goes wrong happens, call up son or daughter to spend the next two days trying to backup all the old XMas photos, birthday photos, word docs, etc., etc., etc., and then reinstall Windows. Happens at least 2 times a year at my parents house. There must be others out there with parents like this.

Maybe you should have said that up front, instead of painting all of us 'old farts/parents' with such a broad brush on your really piss poor way of saying your parents, in your mind, are stupid.

[oldpotatoe]

To all the old geezers out there. Sorry. You guys aren't dumb. Many of you could run rings around me and prolly are even more technically savvy than me. I'm not some computer genius. My parents are so dumb when it comes to computers. And they do the dumbest things. I love them still. I'm sure there are other people out there that have hopeless parents like myself. The message is to love them, even through all their vices and oopsie I clicked it again moments. To all the parents like mine that felt so offended and don't like what I wrote, well sorry about that. Try not to take what I say so personally. I'm just whinging in general, however cringefully awful you think it is. It certainly isn't personal.

how old are you?

[shovelhd]

So, I'm not an expert, and my dad is in the computer business, so thankfully I don't have to worry about this yet.

That said, if I did have to worry about it, I'd go get a book on virtual machines and consider that as a potential avenue. My understanding on the basic concept is that the software sets up a 'fake machine' that is basically a software machine, but acts like a normal computer. You can download stuff, install stuff, change settings, etc. But if there's ever a problem, malicious software, slow, etc. you can just kill that virtual machine and start a fresh one. I don't know enough about the topic to make specific recommendations, but it is something I'd explore if I were in your shoes.

Also, I'd suggest setting him up with an account that is a standard user account, not an administrator. And don't let him have the password to the administrator. That way, he won't be able to install any software.

I've seen good recent reviews about malwarebytes and bitdefender. I personally use the free version of avast.

When you flush the VM and replace it, any data on that VM goes away as well. There are ways to avoid this, like remote mounts, NAS drives, and backup/snapshot schemes, but I can't see how they would be less complex than the question at hand for the subjects we are considering.

The problem with a non-admin account is that someone has to be the admin, and in this case, it will be the OP. He may not want that.

OP, my suggestion is this. Set up their computer with whatever antivirus/antimalware product that you know and understand. They all are good, and they all have issues, so use the one you know. Then set up their machine for remote desktop access through whatever means you prefer, with whatever security level you prefer. You need to teach them how to let you take control of their machine to diagnose and resolve issues remotely, unless you want family visits to be burdened with work.

[Schmed]

Abalone's post struck a chord with me.

My parents are quite intelligent, successful, informed, and street smart.

But.... why on EARTH would someone click 'YES' on that box that popped up? Why would they forward that email that says "forward this to 10 friends and...." Why would they reply to that email about the Nigerian business man...

They are in the Always-Click-OK-Box crowd.

I've concluded that we are pre-wired to understand computers and tech or not. No amount of training or discussion fixes this. And, I worry that they'll get some credit info stolen, or maybe something worse.

And for that, we got them Macs. And I hope that somehow helps.

Because I hate Avast and AVG and the others. Most of them seem to put Google or Yahoo Toolbar or something on your computer if you don't uncheck that box, and those programs seem to slow everything down to a grinding halt.

[oldpotatoe]

Abalone's post struck a chord with me.

My parents are quite intelligent, successful, informed, and street smart.

But.... why on EARTH would someone click 'YES' on that box that popped up? Why would they forward that email that says "forward this to 10 friends and...." Why would they reply to that email about the Nigerian business man...

They are in the Always-Click-OK-Box crowd.

I've concluded that we are pre-wired to understand computers and tech or not. No amount of training or discussion fixes this. And, I worry that they'll get some credit info stolen, or maybe something worse.

And for that, we got them Macs. And I hope that somehow helps.

Because I hate Avast and AVG and the others. Most of them seem to put Google or Yahoo Toolbar or something on your computer if you don't uncheck that box, and those programs seem to slow everything down to a grinding halt.

Glad somebody said it. Yup, I am an old(64) parent, but not stupid. I think I can recognize phishing and the like, and know what to do with it BUT, being a Apple family helps a lot, IMHO.

I am convinced that many of these antivirus companies actually create malware/virus' to keep their product viable and in the news.

[jlwdm]

When my mother tuned 91 I got her an iPad in place of her laptop. It does everything she needs and is easy to use while sitting in a chair watching tv.

Jeff

[nm87710]

Good Luck

[gemship]

I believe it is certainly true that some people will never understand computers. No matter how many times you explain a simple task or what NOT to do they either can't learn it or use the piece of hardware/software so seldom they forget. I tell these "users" at my job how to do xyzq and they will forget a week later. So they will get a virus or a browser hijacker or some piece of malware.

Last summer a guy in the office opened something he should not have. If he had acted immediately it may not have been an issue. He did not. He also did not have a backup of his files. Every file on his PC was encrypted by the intrusion. He had "ransomware". He had to get $600 in bitcoin so the payment was not traceable to get the key to unlock his files. Some serious
Sh¢£.

People can't help themselves. MS security essentials. Malwarebytes. Get a Mac.

This is funny and relatable. My parents are the kind of folks that will probably just never really learn how to use a computer for simple stuff. In fact they inherited one from my late grandparents. So I showed them how to open and close the browser and surf the net. I showed them how to send an email. The funny thing is it's a PC and I'm more of a mac person. So even I struggled with unfamiliarity. Heck I even struggled to get it into the wireless network at my home before bringing it over to their home. In the end the computer got put back in a box now collecting dust. What my folks and I learned thru a discussion is the net just doesn't fit with in their lifestyle and they really have no use for a computer at all in their life and they are only 61/63 years old respectively. Imagine that?

[Tony T]

This is funny and relatable. My parents are the kind of folks that will probably just never really learn how to use a computer for simple stuff.

They may find it easier with an iPad.

[Tony T]

This is funny and relatable. My parents are the kind of folks that will probably just never really learn how to use a computer for simple stuff.

They may find it easier with an iPad.
There really isn't a need anymore for a computer for basic tasks.

[gemship]

When my mother tuned 91 I got her an iPad in place of her laptop. It does everything she needs and is easy to use while sitting in a chair watching tv.

Jeff

That's awesome! Ipads like all Apple products are the closet thing we consumers have to a truly intuitive digital experience keeping up with technology in the computer age. Until we all can get microchipped. :p

It's interesting how Microsoft got so big yet they/their product still kind sucks and most of the computers/tablets out there support it.

[gemship]

They may find it easier with an iPad.
There really isn't a need anymore for a computer for basic tasks.

Perhaps...at the moment my folks work with their hands. Mom is a mailman and looking forward to retirement. Stepfather is self employed at landscaping and commercial clamming...incidentally I commercial clam too. My computer needs are strictly for entertainment and only exacerbated by the fact that I live alone,single with no kids. My folks like me live a simple homebody type of life and have a happy marriage. They like to watch tv, do some reading and watch movies on dvd. They also garden and make some art. For them browsing the internet is kind of a waste of time. Which rings so true, even I feel like a loser if all I am doing is looking at people on Facebook etc. Email has become a one dimensional, slow form of communication and for them there is literally no one to really have to talk to. They just use a phone and a home phone at that because they don't have cellphones or care for them. I actually envy my parents...a simple drama free life.

Just an ex. So I'm single and I join POF dating site...it's hard to even chat with women on there let alone get a coffee date and I really can't stand hanging around cafes or bars. My folks on the other hand are happily married...they met the old fashion way. I'm 40 and resigned to believe that way doesn't work anymore. I also believe most women my age are burnt out with baggage and literally do not age well so I am stuck...envying a simpler life lived by you older folks. LOL. Actually I just wish I could travel back in time but not too far. Like to be my age the year I was born in 74' so long as I lived to tell a tale or stayed the heck out of a war all together.

I think the real obstacle for them is justifying Comcast fee's. They are the only ISP in my neighborhood and expensive. It's a luxury to have a computer but someday my mom may get an Ipad for her birthday when she retires and has more free time.

[gemship]

Abalone's post struck a chord with me.

My parents are quite intelligent, successful, informed, and street smart.

But.... why on EARTH would someone click 'YES' on that box that popped up? Why would they forward that email that says "forward this to 10 friends and...." Why would they reply to that email about the Nigerian business man...

They are in the Always-Click-OK-Box crowd.

I've concluded that we are pre-wired to understand computers and tech or not. No amount of training or discussion fixes this. And, I worry that they'll get some credit info stolen, or maybe something worse.

And for that, we got them Macs. And I hope that somehow helps.

Because I hate Avast and AVG and the others. Most of them seem to put Google or Yahoo Toolbar or something on your computer if you don't uncheck that box, and those programs seem to slow everything down to a grinding halt.

The reason why folks click the "yes" box is simple because they are not familiar with computers...as these sophisticated machines simply aren't very intuitive. People live life in real time and real time is still faster than a computer's processing speed at times mind you. It's just a hell of a lot easier to click on the icons with out reading the fine print. Even a mac will producing a spinning ball and freeze up if you click on too many things at once:p

[fuzzalow]

They just use a phone and a home phone at that because they don't have cellphones or care for them. I actually envy my parents...a simple drama free life.

I am firmly convinced that everybody takes on the amount of daily complication into their personal lives as they either really want to have or get roped into doing by their own inability to say "no". Warren Buffet has said one of the crucial behaviors learned by successful people is the ability to say "no".

Time management is a relative thing and everybody does it to the level that satisfies their own psychic requirements. You can see this manifest most often by suburban Moms in tony zip codes that transfer their sublimated Type A career drive into as hectic a daily routine as possible. Some people in professional environments also seek out a similar thing. I kinda see it as a silly form of vanity.

Take control of your own time. Even in the medical, finance and media professions there is an off-switch, used at the appropriate times, of course. Nobody runs 100% all the time and if they did they'd be worthless because then they'd never have a moment to think.

[roguedog]

Thanks, Shovelhd.

Yes I'd thought about installing a remote desktop app on there. Will take a look at the MS native Remote Desktop and how easy it is to use. You have other suggestions?

I'm going to give ESET Smart Security a trial and see how that goes.

Between its results from AV Comparatives and West Cost Labs seems to score well. I found this link (http://chart.av-comparatives.org/chart1.php) really helpful. I like it's zero day vs Avast's download updates. We'll see how it does. Like you say, most of these are comparable but I don't usually use the suite products myself so was just looking for guidance on performance and features.

Thanks again.


When you flush the VM and replace it, any data on that VM goes away as well. There are ways to avoid this, like remote mounts, NAS drives, and backup/snapshot schemes, but I can't see how they would be less complex than the question at hand for the subjects we are considering.

The problem with a non-admin account is that someone has to be the admin, and in this case, it will be the OP. He may not want that.

OP, my suggestion is this. Set up their computer with whatever antivirus/antimalware product that you know and understand. They all are good, and they all have issues, so use the one you know. Then set up their machine for remote desktop access through whatever means you prefer, with whatever security level you prefer. You need to teach them how to let you take control of their machine to diagnose and resolve issues remotely, unless you want family visits to be burdened with work.

[Schmed]

Great idea! Remote Desktop software will certainly help troubleshoot things if they go awry.

[roguedog]

BTW, @ gempship, this part of why I didn't get a Mac. I am not as familiar with Macs so if I do have to do support I myself will have get on the learning curve. Had a Mac many moons ago but the OS has changed so much I'm kinda lost on what went where and how to find things.

If I used them I'm sure I'd figure it out but since I use MS @ work it's just easier.

To others, I like the idea of a tablet but he still wants to occasionally create documents so still needs access to Word and Excel. I didn't want to have to teach him about Drive and Google Docs. It's just easier and more familiar for everyone.

I'd even purposely downgraded OS back to Win7 so it'd be familiar and honestly, I'm not too happy with Win8 myself. I'm thinking of downgrading my laptop back to Win7 until the next hotness comes out. I'll keep giving it a go but it drives me a bit crazy that that stupid swipe keeps bring up last app or the stupid charms menu.

[tbike4]

Thanks, Shovelhd.

Yes I'd thought about installing a remote desktop app on there. Will take a look at the MS native Remote Desktop and how easy it is to use. You have other suggestions?

https://www.join.me/pricing

http://www.teamviewer.com/en/index.aspx

https://www.realvnc.com/products/vnc/licensing/?gclid=CKGo__G-jMMCFcqVfgodbDMAmA

Free for individual use. I use team viewer quite a bit with my Dad. He's almost 81 and pretty sharp.

[sg8357]

Abalone, I hope this is a joke, but I am afraid it is not.

Jeff

More a comment on the truly lousy interfaces on current computers.
Having to click thru 6 different warnings about old java versions to
run the current Oracle Financials (the people who own Java) will make
you hate on computers. I feel for old people or any else who has to
use the piss poor excuses for systems these days.

[93legendti]

...

It was not the radical extremists in Paris who used any words in particular...it was cartoonists who used words that caused the extremists to kill. The cartoonists have choices too...

Wow. Way to blame the victims, excuse the murders and be an apologist for terrorism all in 2 sentences.

Insults are not a civil or criminal justification for murder in any civilized country.

The terrorists could have made a choice not to murder....you're not really one of those who thinks all that terrorism training they went thru would have gone to waste but for an opportune insult by a media outlet, are you? You think they would have stayed home, collecting their French welfare checks and leading peaceful lives, but for the insults? Really? The terrorist training was what, a bucket list item for them? This year murder, next year Everest?

Shame on you.

[BumbleBeeDave]

Can we PLEASE keep this even vaguely associated with the realm of simply giving suggested useful answers to the OP's question that reference his own particular situation?

Thank. You. From. The. Mods.

BBD

[eddief]

still just focused on the power of words. the cartoonists pissed off the terrorists with their words. the anger and whackoness of the terrorists is what caused them to kill. but the words were at the center. it simply makes sense to consider choosing words carefully since they seem to have consequences. i try, but apparently not always successful.

Wow. Way to blame the victims, excuse the murders and be an apologist for terrorism all in 2 sentences.

Insults are not a civil or criminal justification for murder in any civilized country.

Shame on you.

[93legendti]

still just focused on the power of words. the cartoonists pissed off the terrorists with their words. the anger and whackoness of the terrorists is what caused them to kill. but the words were at the center. it simply makes sense to consider choosing words carefully since they seem to have consequences.

Words don't drive people to murder. I don't see any any "old folks" rushing out to shoot up 7-11's because of perceived insults in this thread.


"Originally Posted by eddief
...

It was not the radical extremists in Paris who used any words in particular...it was cartoonists who used words that caused the extremists to kill. The cartoonists have choices too..."

[1centaur]

I will pre-guess that there is a strong consensus on this board that the cartoonists did not cause their own death and that the poster was using a poor analogy focusing less on Paris realities than his reaction to abalone. It happens. Let's not thread drift from the AV topic.

But until then, I'd like to say that a good way to go through life is to understand that nobody makes anybody do anything because the reactor had an emotional reaction that led to the reaction. It's all on the reactor, every time.

On AV, malwarebytes is used at my work and at my home, and while I had problems when on McAfee I have had no problems on Websense, which is excellent at low latency, unlike McAfee..

[54ny77]

What kind of computer does Lance use?

[hoonjr]

I second TeamViewer for remote access.

[paredown]

Thanks, Shovelhd.

Yes I'd thought about installing a remote desktop app on there. Will take a look at the MS native Remote Desktop and how easy it is to use. You have other suggestions?

I'm going to give ESET Smart Security a trial and see how that goes.

Between its results from AV Comparatives and West Cost Labs seems to score well. I found this link (http://chart.av-comparatives.org/chart1.php) really helpful. I like it's zero day vs Avast's download updates. We'll see how it does. Like you say, most of these are comparable but I don't usually use the suite products myself so was just looking for guidance on performance and features.

Thanks again.

My mother-in-law has on occasion clicked stuff that she shouldn't--but in defense of old-timers (of which I am probably one), the malware is getting more sophisticated, and there are definitely a lot of harmful sites out there, with stuff that can infect your computer with out you clicking (Java exploits and other crap). I have used Avast + Security Essentials for some time (fairly light footprint).

It is one of the reasons that IT work got so ugly around the time I quit--we were spending a huge percentage of our time cleaning up infections and locking down servers. It is a nasty world out there, even if you are paying attention.

For remote software, I have also just started using Team Viewer (http://www.teamviewer.com/en/index.aspx)--free for non-commercial use--and it is the best I have ever used. With a good connection on both sides, I can do everything I need to to get her back up and running.

And for a glass half full view--I am happy to keep her online at 75+--she is more active and informed than some 40 year olds I know--with her sampler patterns that she finds online and stitches up, and the Washington Post that she reads online every day.

[jamesau]

I use team viewer quite a bit with my Dad. He's almost 81 and pretty sharp.

That Teamviewer looks good.

I'll use the 'share desktop' feature of Skype to coach my Dad with solving PC problems on his end. (This lets me see what he's seeing while we speak via Skype). I figure he'll learn by participating; he also feels some gratification from being part of the solution.

[Gsinill]

+1 on getting a Mac

No virus issues and screen sharing/remote control comes built in with the Messages.app.
Supporting my Mom's Mac that way across the pond.