2015 Pro Team component sponsors

[oldpotatoe]

I know it means a whole lot of nothing considering these teams have a legion of wrenches and truck full of spares BUT

http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/12/bikes-and-tech/2015-sponsor-round-up-whos-riding-what_35605

shimano has the $(yen?) to sponsor most teams, Campagnolo, altho teeny in comparison to sram or shimano, continues to sponsor many more pro teams than sram.

I'd love to be a fly on the wall when the sram sponsor department decides who gets what and why. 8 UCI Pro teams in 2012 to one in 2015(Ag2R).I know in the past, frame makers who want to sell bikes with certain components, 'insisted' on certain builds(Cannondale-sram last few years, for instance) for their sponsored teams. Doesn't seem the case. Spec-ed with shimano and Campagnolo, for instance.

More grass root, smaller teams, local sponsorship?

Have a foothold, no need to do the 'win on sunday, sell on monday' type gig?

Prime market is the USA, who don't flood to road races like they do in Europe?

Lotsa $ to cross, even tho cross is starting to be dominated by shimano, like the road scene..and short season?

Just interesting to me along with wheel sponsorship. 3 component group makes, a slew of wheel makers, like Roval(Spec-ed), Vision(FSA).

[KonaSS]

I am sure $ has a lot to do with it, with Shimano willing to spend the most, but some difference may also be individual strategies on how to market. Maybe Pro teams are not the best spend in their eyes.

I would like to think that I am immune to all the marketing, but I think pro team use of frames makes a much greater impression on me than pro team use of components. I can name frame sponsors for most pro tour teams, but couldn't really name any of their component sponsors (maybe Giant Shimano:))

I think the reason that the frame marketing works to some extent is because I don't get a chance to ride or even see in the flesh many of the frames on the market if my local shops don't carry or if they are not popular in my area. But I still may be interested in a brand if I see a pro team riding one.

Components are different. With only 3 players and individual preference, I could test ride and get firsthand feedback from trusted friends on each group by this afternoon if I wanted to. That means more to me that what Wanty-Group are riding this year.

[oldpotatoe]

I am sure $ has a lot to do with it, with Shimano willing to spend the most, but some difference may also be individual strategies on how to market. Maybe Pro teams are not the best spend in their eyes.

I would like to think that I am immune to all the marketing, but I think pro team use of frames makes a much greater impression on me than pro team use of components. I can name frame sponsors for most pro tour teams, but couldn't really name any of their component sponsors (maybe Giant Shimano:))

I think the reason that the frame marketing works to some extent is because I don't get a chance to ride or even see in the flesh many of the frames on the market if my local shops don't carry or if they are not popular in my area. But I still may be interested in a brand if I see a pro team riding one.

Components are different. With only 3 players and individual preference, I could test ride and get firsthand feedback from trusted friends on each group by this afternoon if I wanted to. That means more to me that what Wanty-Group are riding this year.

Agree. Frame/fork is the heart of the bike. Frames have a big effect on the ride 'quality' and 'feel', whereas shifters, etc, really don't as long as they work.

Spec-ed is huge these days, trek, not so much. Which I think is interesting and very similar to sram situation......maybe, who knows.

[carpediemracing]

I read somewhere that roadies tend to follow what the pros use, mtb tend to follow what their local stars use. Road stuff tends to be more universal - a paved road is a paved road, a climb is a climb. Mtb is more region specific - stuff people use around here (roots, rocks, mud) wouldn't be ideal for out west (the thorn things, super hard packed sand, dry).

I asked elsewhere somewhat rhetorically if pro road sponsorship affects the consumer - at the time I'd read that there were no SRAM sponsorships happening (a short time later the AG2R thing popped up). Around here there are a lot of people on SRAM. For me it's nice when something I have works for the pros but I'm so many generations behind in all but wheels that pro sponsorship is irrelevant to me (I'm running Campy 10s, frame tech was cutting edge in 1998, etc).

On the other hand I initially discarded the idea of super tall wheels for me, someone that does only crits. In the past I haven't been afraid of trying things out - I ran TriSpokes/HED3s for years in crits after seeing them in use in the 1988 Olympic RR as well as by the National Team on the road in that era. After watching Cav use big wheels in the Tour, after watching some local Cat 1s do the same, I decided to give it a shot. Now my favorite wheels are my 75/90mm F/R wheels.

[John H.]

Since the advent of the 1st SRAM Red group SRAM employed the sponsorship strategy of "buy market share". Sponsor as many high profile teams as possible, sponsor low profile teams with a purchase deal that was too good to pass up.
I recall being able to buy what amounts to a complete SRAM Red group for about $400. Force was probably more like $250.
Hard to beat that for bikes that will live a hard life.
SRAM also had fortunate timing- this was towards the end of 7800 and into 7900 in terms of time line.
Also Shimano has been very tight on road sponsorship in the USA. Same for Campy. Road sponsorship is pretty much non-existent in the USA for Campy.
Right now SRAM is cutting back on sponsorship- both road and mtb (at least in USA).
My guess is that they reached target saturation and are cutting back because the "buy market share" strategy is not sustainable for more than a few years.

I know it means a whole lot of nothing considering these teams have a legion of wrenches and truck full of spares BUT

http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/12/bikes-and-tech/2015-sponsor-round-up-whos-riding-what_35605

shimano has the $(yen?) to sponsor most teams, Campagnolo, altho teeny in comparison to sram or shimano, continues to sponsor many more pro teams than sram.

I'd love to be a fly on the wall when the sram sponsor department decides who gets what and why. 8 UCI Pro teams in 2012 to one in 2015(Ag2R).I know in the past, frame makers who want to sell bikes with certain components, 'insisted' on certain builds(Cannondale-sram last few years, for instance) for their sponsored teams. Doesn't seem the case. Spec-ed with shimano and Campagnolo, for instance.

More grass root, smaller teams, local sponsorship?

Have a foothold, no need to do the 'win on sunday, sell on monday' type gig?

Prime market is the USA, who don't flood to road races like they do in Europe?

Lotsa $ to cross, even tho cross is starting to be dominated by shimano, like the road scene..and short season?

Just interesting to me along with wheel sponsorship. 3 component group makes, a slew of wheel makers, like Roval(Spec-ed), Vision(FSA).

[Ti Designs]

I'm more interested in how many Campy tattoos there are vs. Sram or Shimano...

[fogrider]

When you walk in s shop to test ride a bike, what are your choices? Its pretty much shimano or SRAM. Not many if any OEM campy bikes from the bigs. The sponsorships payoff for the frames, not the component manufacturer. Most folks buy an entry level bike with 105 and then step up to ulterga or dura ace in few years. But some make the jump to SRAM. I'm old school and love campy, just don't know how campy gets net customers.

[oldpotatoe]

When you walk in s shop to test ride a bike, what are your choices? Its pretty much shimano or SRAM. Not many if any OEM campy bikes from the bigs. The sponsorships payoff for the frames, not the component manufacturer. Most folks buy an entry level bike with 105 and then step up to ulterga or dura ace in few years. But some make the jump to SRAM. I'm old school and love campy, just don't know how campy gets net customers.

Read somewhere that if the bike started as a frame at the LBS or in the hands of a consumer, a fairly large percentage opt for Campagnolo. Yup, Valentino, in spite of his ramblings, does little OEM. Some in Europe but just not much. His ideas that he wants most of his stuff made in Europe makes it difficult(altho Fulcrum and some other stuff is make where the frames are made-asia).

I think sram has lost a BIG chunk of OEM to shimano, both road and MTB. 2014/2015 and a look at shops around here for the 'big 3', trekspecializedgiant, shows that. I know at least one OEM maker, Pinarello, small, I know, dumped all sram equipped bikes for 2014. Didn't see any for 2015.

But like Toyota and NASCAR, I think sram is focusing on where they think their biggest possibilities are-the USA. BUT shimano is the gorilla in the room. They are the big boys, who retire as much debt each year as Campagnolo gross'.

I have predicted it for a while, hasn't happened-Fulcrum labeled group made in Asia, to go onto OEM bikes, there.

[Rebel_Biker]

Read somewhere that if the bike started as a frame at the LBS or in the hands of a consumer, a fairly large percentage opt for Campagnolo. Yup, Valentino, in spite of his ramblings, does little OEM. Some in Europe but just not much. His ideas that he wants most of his stuff made in Europe makes it difficult(altho Fulcrum and some other stuff is make where the frames are made-asia).

I think sram has lost a BIG chunk of OEM to shimano, both road and MTB. 2014/2015 and a look at shops around here for the 'big 3', trekspecializedgiant, shows that. I know at least one OEM maker, Pinarello, small, I know, dumped all sram equipped bikes for 2014. Didn't see any for 2015.

But like Toyota and NASCAR, I think sram is focusing on where they think their biggest possibilities are-the USA. BUT shimano is the gorilla in the room. They are the big boys, who retire as much debt each year as Campagnolo gross'.

I have predicted it for a while, hasn't happened-Fulcrum labeled group made in Asia, to go onto OEM bikes, there.

I think this is exactly where Campy want to be. Shimano may have much higher gross revenue, but they have lower gross margins. Their OEM pricing provides really slim margins. Campy does not play the cost cutting game. They have a perceived value and a loyal customer base that will pay a premium, and that increases their gross margin. I don't think they want the OEM business at the cost of margin. It may limit growth, but growing to lower profitability is usually a bad idea. Ferrari sells every car they make. They don't want to compete in mass markets. Campagnolo is similar.

[fogrider]

Yeah compare the numbers of OEM bikes sold to frames is really no comparison. And campy really missed the boat with electronic shifting. Ultgera is really good and priced right. And all campy electronic systems have an exposed battery, really?! I gotta think between electronic shifting and SRAM red being crazy light, campy has a tough road ahead.

[Elefantino]

In three years SRAM goes from 8 pro teams to 1.

That says something.

[oldpotatoe]

I think this is exactly where Campy want to be. Shimano may have much higher gross revenue, but they have lower gross margins. Their OEM pricing provides really slim margins. Campy does not play the cost cutting game. They have a perceived value and a loyal customer base that will pay a premium, and that increases their gross margin. I don't think they want the OEM business at the cost of margin. It may limit growth, but growing to lower profitability is usually a bad idea. Ferrari sells every car they make. They don't want to compete in mass markets. Campagnolo is similar.

Agree. Rolex, Ferrari, Porsche, others, premium brands. But I still think Valentino would like some OE, not at the expense of margin but made at lower cost-Fulcrum in Asia. I also think Campagnolo is very content at the position they occupy. They are happy to let shimano-Sram slug it out.

[oldpotatoe]

Yeah compare the numbers of OEM bikes sold to frames is really no comparison. And campy really missed the boat with electronic shifting. Ultgera is really good and priced right. And all campy electronic systems have an exposed battery, really?! I gotta think between electronic shifting and SRAM red being crazy light, campy has a tough road ahead.

Missed the boat? EPS had many features shimano adopted after EPS was introduced(multiple shifts, for example). Making a cheap electronic isn't any answer, IMHO. Kinda like a digital Rolex. Deep discount grey market does not the market make. Compare MSRP, even if not sold at that. Ultegra Di2 about same $ as DA mechanical. Chorus EPS about the same as Super Record mechanical

V2 battery, been around since last year-internal or external EPS battery, something that shimano does not offer.

[1centaur]

SRAM seems to sponsor for specific short-term effect rather than long-term theoretical benefits. They sponsored heavily when they wanted to be perceived as a credible third choice on the road and they are now firmly entrenched in that role. I suspect they would also sponsor if they had a major new product to sell, but right now they just have iterations of old product. They are very ROI-oriented compared to Shimano or especially Campy, it seems to me.

if they were to choose to spend more money regaining credibility with the OEMs post disc brake recalls or on cash plus group sets for a middling UCI team, my impression of their character is that they would take the former.

They seem to be doing well on the mountain side of the business. I bet we will see them back on the road side with sponsorships picking up on their next major step in road products.

[Rebel_Biker]

Here is a great article. And Oldpotato is quoted in it.

I don't think Campy is in trouble. They are not trying to be Shimano. They are a private company and are loyal to their stakeholders, who unlike US corporations, as not shareholders. One of their major stakeholders are their employees.


http://www.bicycling.com/news/featured-stories/italian-job

[JonB]

In three years SRAM goes from 8 pro teams to 1.

That says something.

Perhaps SRAM is still (financially) licking their wounds from the hydraulic brake debacle. I woudn't be surprised to see them back to more teams in 2016.

[oldpotatoe]

Perhaps SRAM is still (financially) licking their wounds from the hydraulic brake debacle. I woudn't be surprised to see them back to more teams in 2016.

Unless........ok I won't say it.

[fogrider]

I haven't kept up. Good to know that the v2! I know campy had the electronic system for years but did feel ready to release it...so sure shimano copied many of the features and sells it for hundreds less...you may think that's not the answer but when guys say they will never go back, and shimano is so domain...I say campy missed the boat.

[Rebel_Biker]

Campagnolo was also on team bikes that won 2 of the grand tours last year. Did Movistar and Astana go with different components for this year?

[wildboar]

Dear Europcar, please don't go changing...

http://cyclingtips.com.au/2014/07/bikes-of-le-tour-europcars-colnago-arsenal/

[Cicli]

Dear Europcar, please don't go changing...

http://cyclingtips.com.au/2014/07/bikes-of-le-tour-europcars-colnago-arsenal/

Not a fan of carbon bikes. Those are very nice.

[Rebel_Biker]

Dear Europcar, please don't go changing...

http://cyclingtips.com.au/2014/07/bikes-of-le-tour-europcars-colnago-arsenal/

That's why I root for Thomas Voeckler. He is also a fun cyclist to watch. It would be great if they could get Nibali on that team. A Sicilian should wear Italian cloths.

[ColnagoFan]

Read somewhere that if the bike started as a frame at the LBS or in the hands of a consumer, a fairly large percentage opt for Campagnolo. Yup, Valentino, in spite of his ramblings, does little OEM. Some in Europe but just not much. His ideas that he wants most of his stuff made in Europe makes it difficult(altho Fulcrum and some other stuff is make where the frames are made-asia).

I think sram has lost a BIG chunk of OEM to shimano, both road and MTB. 2014/2015 and a look at shops around here for the 'big 3', trekspecializedgiant, shows that. I know at least one OEM maker, Pinarello, small, I know, dumped all sram equipped bikes for 2014. Didn't see any for 2015.

But like Toyota and NASCAR, I think sram is focusing on where they think their biggest possibilities are-the USA. BUT shimano is the gorilla in the room. They are the big boys, who retire as much debt each year as Campagnolo gross'.

I have predicted it for a while, hasn't happened-Fulcrum labeled group made in Asia, to go onto OEM bikes, there.
European roadies don't want SRAM, that's a major, major issue for them. It's hard for a company to do two hikes, one Shimano spec for Europe, and a SRAM bike for the U.S. Why not just do one?

[oldpotatoe]

I haven't kept up. Good to know that the v2! I know campy had the electronic system for years but did feel ready to release it...so sure shimano copied many of the features and sells it for hundreds less...you may think that's not the answer but when guys say they will never go back, and shimano is so domain...I say campy missed the boat.

Making an electronic group with less expensive steel and aluminum small bits on their stuff is easy. I don't understand why a 6800 crank and big chainring is so expensive. $150 for a big ring? There is a reason why shimano 6800 and 5800 GROUPS are selling for what a SR rear derailleur sells for. And somebody is still making money. The race to the bottom is easy.

Campagnolo hasn't had a negative year in sales since about 1989/90. They aren't getting huge but they sell everything they make.

They are teeny compared to the others but as has been mentioned, I think they are fine with that. So is Rolex and Ducati. People's Porsche, Baby Benz, electronic Rolex..all have been tried.

Just my view.

[rain dogs]

I don't understand why a 6800 crank and big chainring is so expensive. $150 for a big ring?

I don't ride Shimano so I have limited knowledge but I thought the 6800/9000 etc. big ring itself was hollow? Isn't that why it's so costly? Maybe I heard wrong though.

[r1lee]

lets not compare Ferrari to campy. Ferrari is still owned by fiat, a high volume low margin automaker.

Porsche and all the other high end brands in the Volkswagen group, is solely based on Volkswagen sales, which are low margin, high volume.

Let's not pretend that luxury items would exist on their own without the other end of the scale. Campy might be different, but the question is, is there a reason for Shimano or SRAM to be interested in Campy?

[oldpotatoe]

lets not compare Ferrari to campy. Ferrari is still owned by fiat, a high volume low margin automaker.

Porsche and all the other high end brands in the Volkswagen group, is solely based on Volkswagen sales, which are low margin, high volume.

Let's not pretend that luxury items would exist on their own without the other end of the scale. Campy might be different, but the question is, is there a reason for Shimano or SRAM to be interested in Campy?

Don't know if they would or not, exist on their own. Buggati? Maybe on their own, I don't know. There are very high end brands that stand on their own. In cars, watches, guitars, skis, aircraft.


I don't think shimano is interested in anything but shimano. sram envies the market share of shimano and the brand loyalty of Campagnolo.

[jr59]

Let's not pretend that luxury items would exist on their own without the other end of the scale. Campy might be different, but the question is, is there a reason for Shimano or SRAM to be interested in Campy?

REALLY?????

Would you please tell me where the other end of the scale is with Rolex?
Or Richemont, who owns Dunhill, Cartier, Jaeger-LeCoultre, Montblanc, and Van Cleef & Arpels.
Or a host of others I could name.

[shovelhd]

I don't ride Shimano so I have limited knowledge but I thought the 6800/9000 etc. big ring itself was hollow? Isn't that why it's so costly? Maybe I heard wrong though.

I don't know about the 6800 but the 9000 is a hollow ring. Definitely the lightest and stiffest ring available.

[sitzmark]

I don't know about the 6800 but the 9000 is a hollow ring. Definitely the lightest and stiffest ring available.

Yes - 6800 outer CR is also hollow.

[Rebel_Biker]

lets not compare Ferrari to campy. Ferrari is still owned by fiat, a high volume low margin automaker.

Porsche and all the other high end brands in the Volkswagen group, is solely based on Volkswagen sales, which are low margin, high volume.

Let's not pretend that luxury items would exist on their own without the other end of the scale. Campy might be different, but the question is, is there a reason for Shimano or SRAM to be interested in Campy?

Ferrari does not need Fiat and Porsche does not need Volkswagen. Both of them were given a price they could not refuse. Fiat and VW paid ridiculous valuations for those brands. How they will get value is yet to be seen. Have you seen lots of adds for Ferrari? No. Every car they make is already sold. Ferrari has a waiting list longer than Richard Sachs. And they have increased production every year.

I wrote a research paper on Porsche in business school and their margins were only second to Ferrari. Almost twice Toyota. They are a bit more volume than Ferrari, since they introduced the lower priced boxter and their SUV line. I would still compare Ferrari to Campy, as Ferrari is low volume, high cost of production and high price.

[Andrevich4]

I think it's just economics. Campy makes parts in the EU and most euro frames are "finished" here so they probably save on exporting them by putting them together and selling in the eurozone.

I think to compete in the American market Campy would have to open a factory in Ohio. Then it might make sense to sponsor teams with an eye towards getting a return/increasing market share.

Who was the last American team to ride campy? Rock Racing?

[Andrevich4]

BTW... I'm living in Europe right now and can't believe how much less Campagnolo is here than in the states. It's cheaper for me to get a Super Record FD in Italy than a Chorus FD in the states. Weird.

Plus there are more entry-level bikes coming equipped with Campy. Mostly Athena.

[OtayBW]

I think it's just economics. Campy makes parts in the EU and most euro frames are "finished" here so they probably save on exporting them by putting them together and selling in the eurozone.

I think to compete in the American market Campy would have to open a factory in Ohio. Then it might make sense to sponsor teams with an eye towards getting a return/increasing market share.

Who was the last American team to ride campy? Rock Racing?
Where is Shimano made?

[Andrevich4]

Malaysia. Less expensive labor and good trade relations with just about everyone but still not cheap enough to help Shimano's margins, apparently.

Silca's already done the Italy to U.S. move and they're sponsoring a CX team.

[bcroslin]

Threads like this are why I love pace line. The piece on campy published by Bicycling was fantastic and a few posts later the link to cycling tips contained a Colnago I never knew existed and now I think I can't live without. How come no one ever told me about the m10?!

[r1lee]

Ferrari does not need Fiat and Porsche does not need Volkswagen. Both of them were given a price they could not refuse. Fiat and VW paid ridiculous valuations for those brands. How they will get value is yet to be seen. Have you seen lots of adds for Ferrari? No. Every car they make is already sold. Ferrari has a waiting list longer than Richard Sachs. And they have increased production every year.

I wrote a research paper on Porsche in business school and their margins were only second to Ferrari. Almost twice Toyota. They are a bit more volume than Ferrari, since they introduced the lower priced boxter and their SUV line. I would still compare Ferrari to Campy, as Ferrari is low volume, high cost of production and high price.

Ferrari does not need fiat now, let's be straight here. They needed fiat a while back and thanks to fiat, they were able to keep on racing. The point of the matter is, Ferrari is not a company that didn't rely on funds to keep it afloat.

Margins mean nothing when you're on the brink of bankruptcy. Porsche is still in trouble.

Let's move on, this isn't about cars.

Campy is special, they have found a niche, they are a private company and no one knows how much money they actually do make.

[Rebel_Biker]

Ferrari does not need fiat now, let's be straight here. They needed fiat a while back and thanks to fiat, they were able to keep on racing. The point of the matter is, Ferrari is not a company that didn't rely on funds to keep it afloat.

Margins mean nothing when you're on the brink of bankruptcy. Porsche is still in trouble.

Let's move on, this isn't about cars.

Campy is special, they have found a niche, they are a private company and no one knows how much money they actually do make.

It was a good discussion. Sports cars and road bikes are very similar in how they are marketed and sold. As it has been stated by many journalist, the big difference is that we can own and ride the same machines that the pro's ride. Car nuts can get awesome production sports cars but they cannot purchase F1 automobiles.

[oldpotatoe]

I think it's just economics. Campy makes parts in the EU and most euro frames are "finished" here so they probably save on exporting them by putting them together and selling in the eurozone.

I think to compete in the American market Campy would have to open a factory in Ohio. Then it might make sense to sponsor teams with an eye towards getting a return/increasing market share.

Who was the last American team to ride campy? Rock Racing?

How many shimano or spam factories are in the usa? Where the frames are made need to be matched to where components are made(Asia).